NetBeans 4.0 Release

An anonymous reader writes "Various news sources are reporting the 4.0 release of the free Java-based NetBeans IDE. You can read the anouncement, or proceed directly to the downloads. Perhaps the most significant improvement is that the IDE's native build system is the latest version of Apache Ant. I see this as a distinct advantage over its competitor Eclipse (and NetBeans is pure Java). If you create desktop applications in Java, you may wish to read up on the NetBeans 'platform' as well. Enjoy."

Comments

The horror, the horror

[Pacifix]

We're required to use NetBeans at school. I end up coding all my stuff in IntelliJ and copying and pasting. NetBeans is much too controlling in terms of all the code it generates for the UI and has always seemed very counterintuitive to me.

Re:The horror, the horror

[flumps]

Actually, netbeans tends to do things the way they are supposed to be done, not the way you think they should be.

Which is what an IDE should do, especially when you are dealing with large projects and need some fomalisation built in to the structure of the project.

IntelliJ may allow you to fudge things a little, but in 6 months time when the project ends would you rather have controlled steady development or a bundle of spaghetti code to deal with and debug?

For example, I love the way you can build a bean add it to the component panel, drag it into your app and adjust the properties on the form in the UI's properties window. It deals with the coding quite smoothly and efficiently and even allows connections to other components on the page in the correct coding methodologies.

My only gripe in the last version (I don't know about this one) is that the way the project is stored - you cannot edit it easily if your form goes "wrong". It also rebuilds the code (even if you change it in another editor) in the uneditable regions for you each time.

Something they may like to consider is to change the project file format to XML so it can be easily altered if the IDE breaks.

hideous code

[sporty]

2 points.

1. prior versions of netbeans auto-genned fugly code for the gui's you laid out.

2. Many people I know do visual coding by hand, similar to html to some degree.

Shame...

[finnw]

They haven't improved the speed of the background compilation (that is used to update the code completion database). One of my more complex files (which contains 9 inner classes) still takes about 15 seconds to rescan whenever I change anything.

And theres still no 'exclude from .WAR' option on individual files.

Re:Shame...

[flumps]

two words - system upgrade ;)

But seriously, compiling a class with 9 inner classes is definately a strange thing to do.. .. and why would you want to exclude individual files from the WAR? Surely, any none dependant files should be included/referenced from your dependant files in a separate package/directory.

You're doing something conceptually wrong on both counts!

Random netbeans story

[Free_Trial_Thinking]

I was writing a small java program in a text editor for a class project a week ago, and I got stuck conceptually at one point and so I desired to step through the code.
Now not knowing anything about the java world, netbeans came to mind as an IDE that would let me step through the code.
So I installed this netbeans thing and pasted my code in, and I got so confused, it said I needed to have a "project", I tried making a dummy project, then it said all of my class files were missing even though they were right there in the same folder. After an hour of lost time I gave up.

My point? I guess is there anything I can use to step through code that is in-offensive and won't talk back to me? Just a paste your code and go kind of deal?

And a side question, why do my class mates get mad at me when I say I don't like Java?

Re:Random netbeans story

[plumpy]

"I can't debug a language that I know nothing about" is so idiotic that it doesn't deserve a response. But I'll give you one.

Java has a lot of shortcomings, but you've demonstrated only one of them: you can't paste code into a window and expect it to run. So I guess Java programs aren't as easy to use as a short perl script. (Note that a longer perl script would be in several modules and have similar problems.)

But you know what? Not every problem can be solved with a short perl script. You're basically condemning every compiled language because you can't just paste things into a text editor an expect them to run.

Good work. Very convincing.

Re:Random netbeans story

[CaptainPinko]

just create a project and paste your old code in. slowly youll discover the features that make it a killer. here is one type sout and it will spell out "System.out.println(" for you. There are many more and you can create your own. Look for a file called shortcuts.pdf. Oh and really the debugger is bar far the greatest tool in NetBeans. Really, give it a try.

As another student I find most people hate Java (most of them only use what our M$ rep gives them) and I love it because it has a strict world view.

I personally love it when languages enforce things (unlike C for example) because the idiot to misuse a feature will always be in my group.

Re:Random netbeans story

[Gaffers]

Instead of copying and pasting the source code from one window to another, try copying the _file_ to the projects src/ directory (I'm guessing your not using packages.) Try running through some of the tutorials on how to use netbeans. I started using Netbeans almost 4 years ago when I entered college and can honestly say it's the reason I know the language as well as I do. My favorite feature is code completion so I don't have to read through 200 pages of javadoc to find what I'm looking for. Why don't your class mates like Java? Only they can answer that, but I'm guessing it's because many of them are having bad experiences in your class and therefore take that out on the language they are learning. One of my favorite strengths of the language is being able to write on my laptop, then transfer that to the Linux desktops on campus and never have to worry about making system specific changes to compile it.

Re:Random netbeans story

[batemanm]

Not every problem can be solved with a short perl script

Sometimes you have to chain several short perl scripts together :-)

Alternative

[gninja]

Actually, as far as Java IDEs go, i'm quite a fan of JCreator. NetBeans is a bit too large and slow in my opinion, though it is powerful.

Crimson

[ObsessiveMathsFreak]

Great! More NetBEANS bloat. Joy. Look, collapsing code is nice and all, but seriously, I really can't wait five minutes to spot check one app.

Just use crimson editor. Set java compile to F5, java run to F6 then '56' it! Get it! F5,F6!... Never mind. Suffice to say that Crimson Editor is the closest thing to EMACS for Windows developers.(except for EMACS obviously, but windows minds tend to melt when faced with the Meta Paradigm)

Pure Java? Ant as an advantage?

[chochos]

Is this a shameless plug of some kind? I mean, comparing NetBeans to Eclipse and saying that these two points give NetBeans an advantage, doesn't make sense to me.

Eclipse is pure java, too. Oh, unless you don't consider SWT to be pure java, and you prefer to have pure java Swing rather than the much nicer and faster SWT... so what if it's using the native OS interface instead of its own? I see that as an advantage, in any case.

Eclipse can use Ant to build a project. I don't know if it's the latest version, but for all basic purposes, the version included is good enough. I don't know if there's an Eclipse plugin that automatically updates build.xml or lets you handle it in a graphical way, but I think ant build files are meant to be hand edited, anyway. You can use XML buddy inside Eclipse to validate the XML.

And that stuff about using the NetBeans platform, sounds like the stuff Eclipse includes now with 3.0, where you can build your SWT apps using the same objects that make up the Eclipse IDE.

Killer feature: CTRL+L / CTRL+K

[fforw]

For me CTRL+L/CTRL+K was such a killer feature. It cycles forward/backward through a list of words which start with the same chars as you just typed. it's just wonderfull.. completion for any word, be it in code or comments.

Netbeans vs. Eclipse

[fforw]

Eclipse is pure java, too. Oh, unless you don't consider SWT to be pure java, [...]

SWT uses platform specific libraries/DLLs, so the pure java claim for netbeans is not only technically correct but also in its meaning "running everywhere a VM is available".

Eclipse can use Ant to build a project. I don't know if it's the latest version, but for all basic purposes, the version included is good enough. I don't know if there's an Eclipse plugin that automatically updates build.xml or lets you handle it in a graphical way, but I think ant build files are meant to be hand edited, anyway. You can use XML buddy inside Eclipse to validate the XML.

Even the old 3.6 way of supporting ant was superior to the way eclipse handles ant scripts (integrating targets into the UI etc). The new netbeans 4.0 project system is really good. Ant is the project system so netbeans projects can be build without netbeans.

There is even a wizard to import hand edited ant files as project. the ant files aren't even changed for that. beautifull.

Netbeans can not only validate ant scripts it offers element completion for ant targets etc.

And that stuff about using the NetBeans platform, sounds like the stuff Eclipse includes now with 3.0, where you can build your SWT apps using the same objects that make up the Eclipse IDE.

.. with the only difference that netbeans had the seperate platform for ages and lots of applications are already using it.