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China To Launch 2 Into Space In September
Doug Dante writes "China Daily reports that China's space agency plans to launch two Chinese astronauts into space for a 6-day mission in September. The spacecraft includes both a re-entry and an orbital module. The article, an official publication of the Chinese government in English, also extends a plain invitation for the U.S. to partner with China on space."
Co-operation between countries in space exploration is only a good thing. Build up trust, knock down militarisation.
"The spacecraft includes both a re-entry and an orbital module."
You would hope it had some form of re-entry module if you were the astronauts!
I look forward to the day when space exploration is done by private companies with staff all over the world. Then, the competition will be between companies and not some sort of xenophobic constest between mutually distrustful national governments. The pace of progress will probably increase by an order of magnitude too.
Stick Men
"But he said the duo will be chosen from the same 14 fighter-jet pilots who were part of the first selection process...
No chinese billionaires or boy-band members going up?
On the other hand, the Chinese have (so far) been very good a keeping the operation of their space program separate from issues of national pride. They launch misions when they are ready, not in time for some politico's birthday or scheduled speech. Linking the two was one of the reasons the Russians never made it to the Moon and one of the reasons the Americans lost Challenger.
"The spacecraft includes both a re-entry and an orbital module."
How... how kind of them...
You feel sleepy. Close your eyes. The opinions stated above are yours. You cannot imagine why you ever felt otherwise.
Astronauts? Shouldn't the corrent term be Taikonaut? Anyway, it is nice to see China making progress in this field.
I demand the Cone of Silence!
Not sure how much I buy into that invitation. There is no real chance of anything substantial happening. China is trying to cooperate with a lot of countries now, but only the European Space Agency has really moved forward with chinese cooperation on Galileo. China did buy a couple Soyuz to help with their design work.
The biggest red-herring is all that stuff about tech transfer. China gets more tech transfer every day from US tech companies moving to China than anything they can get from building equipment to spec for joint space ventures. Most space work is pretty basic and is only a subset of regular industrial processes. There isn't really anything that special about it.
Once China begins to show up the USA then we have another space race, go china! The US public needs to be motivated by such competition to get interest back into space. If the US is the only nation really striving in space then the willingness to dump cash into NASA by public representives is not justified unless it means those representives wont be re-elected.
Will launching 2 men into space do this? No..But its a start to eventual competition as long as China's economy continues to grow, and doesn't bust like the former Soviet Union.
time is a perception of a being's consciousness
time is your 6th sense, the wierd ones are 7+
Judging by their reaction in the past, I wonder if the US will cooperate this time around.
It's a Bagel.
If you asked most people in Europe to rank governments in decreasing order of hostility, the US would be above China.
Phil
I guess today is a passable day to die.
I would never consider cooperating with the Chinese until China becomes a normal country (free elections, non-hostile government, etc.)
Let me guess - you're not American!
(Rigged elections; government hostile to more countries than any other government on earth.)
it's my opinion that while western countries are good at cuturally breeding innovators, the eastern countries (while they also breed innovators) are better at breeding refinment. breeding sounds very commoditized, but it is meant in its broadest sense of cutural/societal influence... yes, the chinese contribution to global innovation include paper, printing press, gun powder, military strategy, martial arts, holistic medicine, feng shui and pasta, to name a few. what other innovations have asia brought us in the 19th or 20th century? the western world, on the other hand, are responsible for a fucking butt load of innovation for quite a few centuries (3?): internal combustion, pnumatice tires, radio/tv/sattelite communications, electronic computing, internet, medical and pharmacueticals... the list could keep going. this whole innovations/refinement discussion could be it's own topic of discussion... the asian countries, on the oher hand, have been really good at taking western innovations(cars, electronics, entertainment), digesting it, and regurgitating well thought out refinements. honda element, sony ps2, ringu, these are things that are now feed back to the innovators, but in the end they are really only refinements to the original.
the chinese will be the country to watch in the next few decades. they are still one of the few communist countries in existance, they have the biggest population on the globe, and they are entering the growth and refinement stage that japan, korea, and other southeastern dragons went thru in the 19th and 20th century. they also have some of the biggest problems in the world; they have the biggest population on the globe(organization will be difficult), they are still communist(not good for innovation), and they are entering a stage i their cutural development which might require more capitalistic injection from the west.
the fact that the chinese will fly more taikonauts this year has IMHO a few big implications:
1) we have the economy to support a state run space program
2) we have the cultural drive and support of the people
3) we have the resouces to make this happen
4) the biggest one is this-we're flexing our muscles-don't fuck with us!
it's also interesting that according to the article, they are extending a welcome hand in talking about working together with nasa. this is a simple publicity move to bolster their rising technical position within the world and it basically says, "we're growing up as a country and we're not to far behind you. team up with us now, and you won't be eating our dust. don't and you might get fucked". afterall the united states government has really taken a beating in the last few years regarding space, space travel safety, and global joint projects(ISS). right now the chinese are on the upswing, they are just entering the golden area of space travel that the uinited states and ussr were going thru in the 1950-1990's(golden area in terms of economic and workforce resources as well as national support). there's really a lot of multi-facet/multi-layered pros and cons teaming up with the chinese... some are good, others could be not so good. hope this venture doesn't turn america into an obedient dog on a chinese leash...
three can keep a secret, if two are dead - benjamin franklin
I think the Chinese should say "hey, U.S. If you don't want the hubble anymore we'll take it. It is 20 year old technology so you can't be that worried about secret tech getting into our hands. We'll even give you 1 billion jiaozi for it."
Would make me happy. China would be able to get a benefit and the hubble would be able to survive. not to mention that a high publicity scientific partnership with china would help our international record.
What comes first, finding a teacher or becoming a student?
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I can't get to TFA. Did we just slashdot China?
You must think in Russian.
I'm guessing that most Chinese invitations (on matters this complex) come with something along the lines of, "...and please also pass along any and all technology or intellectual property that NASA and its privately owned contractors may have or use, so that we can better help you. Don't worry, it won't ever be used to compete against you or threaten Taiwan."
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
Morons. Read the quote from the article:
". . . there is an arrangement for astronauts to move from the spaceship's re-entry module to live and do scientific tests in the craft's orbital module."
The Chinese orbiter appears to be a modular craft, more like Apollo than Gemini. The Chinese "re-entry module" would be the capsule, with the "orbital module" being the can.
By the way, SF writers and other students of the future have noted for decades that when the Chinese take a serious interest in space, the rest of us had better get busy or get out of the way.
Have a nice war,
Mal the Elder
I just found out your numbers are not correct. I don't know if you do it intentionally. Mainland China contributed US$60 million (that number is from PRC government only. The number of donations from the public is not counted.) Considering Chinese in mainland are still extrememly poor, the number is good enough. A person who earns 100 dollars a day may find it is OK to donate just 1 dollar, but a person who earns 1 dollar a day may have difficulties to contribute even 10 cents. In terms of Taiwan, it contributed US$ 55.6 millon, and that put Taiwan as the number 8 on the list. Hong Kong (as a city) contributed 0.7 billion Hong Kong dollars that is US$ 89.7 million. That is, on an average, each person in Hong Kong contributes 100 HK$ which is about 13 US dollars. That is the world's highest record!
Unfortunately, an informed post or two on Slashdot can do little to reverse what amounts to essentially, in the case of most Slashdotters, more than a decade of cold war propaganda.
While most of us wear our tin foil hats most of the time, for some reason we are extremely reticent when it comes to admitting to ourselves that our government has been (and in fact continues) to deliberately deceive us when it comes to world politics and affairs. This is an extremely uncomfortable realization for Americans in particular, who are taught from birth that theirs is the best nation in all respects, followed by Europe (although we're quick to point out that they were a continent of fascists before we liberated them in WWII). All other nations are either wallowing in poverty or being actively repressed by dictatorial communist sympathisers.
Consider, for example, that most Americans believe that the Chinese carry around Mao's little red book, and that the Chinese people live in a world that has no concept of freedom or individualism.
This view was most true more than three decades ago, and even then was -- as any reasonable person would expect, in a country with a population like China's -- prone to rather large regional variation, and the direct result of a power struggle between Mao Zi Dong and reform-oriented members of the CCP (the Red Army and the Cultural Revolution were, by in large, a direct result of Mao attempting to solidify power by building a cult of personality.)
The moment he died, Deng Xiao Ping pretty much went ahead and set China on the path that would transform it from a Maoist (not communist -- it was never that) dictatorship into a capitalist power likely to become the economic superpower of the 21st century.
When it comes down to it, Americans would prefer not to see the China of today. It's not surprising -- it's scary. America is begining to lose its edge. We at one point benefited from the sort of manufacturing boom that the Chinese are experiencing now -- Europe moved most of its manufacturing base to the US at one time, because it was cheaper -- and look what happened to the then thought to be unending empires that sat on the old continent: they took second seat to us.
We fear the same will happen with China. It is growing at a rate that we cannot hope to match. It is not hard to imagine, when you're in China, that they will be the next United States. This is very, very frightening.
So instead, we remain ignorant, as best we can.
Only actually going there can remove that willful ignorance. Which is why most Slashdotters will never bother.
I am American; I have lived and worked in the PRC for the better part of three years now.
It's already been pointed out that your numbers aren't totally correct, but as someone who lives in China and works with Chinese, I too have noticed that, in this case at least, the Chinese aren't particularly eager to give. My company did a fundraising drive (among our employees) for donations and pretty much no one gave, which we considered to be in pretty poor form. Asking around, I was surprised to find that many of the locals here are actually not very fond of Indonesia. Apparently they have a history of mistreating (in the eyes of the people here) their substantial ethnically Chinese minority.
The Chinese consider being Chinese to be a blood thing, not a matter of legal citizenship or passport, or even connection with Chinese culture. Therefore, an ABC who has lived in California for 4 generations and knows little or nothing about China and the Chinese is considered Chinese. This extends to all overseas Chinese communities.
Anyway, my view is that this isn't a good excuse. We Americans also disagree with much of Indonesia's political activities, both past and present. Don't forget, though, that we initially pledged only 35 million USD, and are much more wealthy.
The Chinese could definitely give more (in fact, everyone could). But maybe this bit of background information explains a little bit about why the people are responding the way they are.
I can just imagine the "No Blood for Chips" marches on Washington and "Give Peace a Chance" sit-ins, while Taiwanese defenses are dismembered.
Japan will need to amend its Constitution (again) to do anything.
I too hope, the Taiwanese will prevail, but it is not certain -- and we (rightly) promised to help them.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.