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ChoicePoint Data Stolen By Imposters

swight1701 writes "Criminals posing as legitimate businesses have accessed critical personal data stored by ChoicePoint Inc., a firm that maintains databases of background information on virtually every U.S. citizen. The incident involves a wide swath of consumer data, including names, addresses, Social Security numbers, credit reports and other information. ChoicePoint notified between 30,000 and 35,000 consumers in California that their personal data may have been accessed by "unauthorized third parties." No obvious notice appears to be on their website."

23 of 381 comments (clear)

  1. Ineptness to the point of being evil by Eric+Smith · · Score: 5, Insightful
    The MSNBC article quotes the consumer notification:
    You should continue to check your credit reports frequently for the next year.
    If I get the notification, I'm going to request that ChoicePoint pay the costs for me to subscribe to unlimited credit report access from all three credit bureaus. IIRC, that costs about $100/year for each bureau. Since it's ChoicePoint's screwup, I shouldn't have to pay the costs necessary for early detection of fraud in my credit report.

    The article further quotes ChoicePoint spokesman Chuck Jones:

    But ChoicePoint has no way of knowing whether anyone's personal information actually has been accessed
    Why the hell are they allowed to keep a dossier on me if they don't have any mechanism in place to allow them to track how it is used and by whom? This is insane!

    The correct solution to this problem, IMNSHO, is for the courts to determine that personal, financial, and credit records relating to an individual are the COPYRIGHTED PROPERTY OF THAT INDIVIDUAL, and may not be provided to any other party without the owner's explicit consent. Not a blanket consent to provide the data to anyone inquiring, but specific consent to provide it to XYZ Corporation.

    1. Re:Ineptness to the point of being evil by bryce1012 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The problem with that approach, of course, is that it requires the granting of "copyright" and the associated powers to individuals, and not the ??AA. Or other money-grubbing corporations. Who's gonna support that?

    2. Re:Ineptness to the point of being evil by shanen · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Very insightful, and I agree that we need a legal principle that personal information belongs to the individual--but I think we should go farther. I think we should require that the personally-identifiable personal information only be stored on the computer of the person who owns it--and that the authorities need to show probable cause and get a search warrant before they have any acces to it. However, a lot of it should be covered under the Fifth Amendment, too.

      Probably won't happen, however. In fact, we are going in the other direction and the companies that hold your data legally "own" it in most cases.

      By the way, don't you recognize this particular company? Same one that helped BushCo purge all those voters in 2000. I think they got out of the voter purging business before 2004, but I haven't really been tracking it.

      --
      Freedom = (Meaningful - Coerced) Choice != (Speech | Beer^2), and sad sock puppets' bad mods avail them naught.
    3. Re:Ineptness to the point of being evil by LostCluster · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The correct solution to this problem, IMNSHO, is for the courts to determine that personal, financial, and credit records relating to an individual are the COPYRIGHTED PROPERTY OF THAT INDIVIDUAL, and may not be provided to any other party without the owner's explicit consent. Not a blanket consent to provide the data to anyone inquiring, but specific consent to provide it to XYZ Corporation.

      Courts aren't going to help you with that at all. The copyright on information belongs to the writer, not the subject of the piece. Just think what your copyright concept would do to the news media...

    4. Re:Ineptness to the point of being evil by yog · · Score: 5, Insightful

      This is really scary.

      The thing that bothers me is that some data is unchangeable, e.g. US social security #, date of birth, and mother's maiden name. Once it's out there, you're screwed.

      Once someone has this data they can really do a number on you because that's all most commercial sites seem to require in terms of validation. They can take out credit cards in your name, perhaps even access your bank account if they have access to your checking account number.

      I think that eventually, and unfortunately, there's gonna have to be a law. No organization except the social security administration should be allowed to store our SS #, for example. Heck, at the rate things are going, they may have to start allowing people to change their SS # to start fresh.

      A friend never allows her SS # to be used for anything. Not banks, not schools, not health insurance. They squawk and scream and threaten and she stands firm. No, she says, you can't have it. It's only for her retirement, not for generic identification purposes. So far she has successfully evaded spreading her most precious identifying information all over the internet in god knows how many incompetently coded and poorly safeguarded databases. Massachusetts also allows one to use a generated code instead of SS # on drivers licenses.

      This thing is really out of hand. Of course, it's going to cost credit card companies millions of dollars when bogus bills start bouncing, and that's probably when the powers that be finally wake up and address the problem.

      --
      it's = "it is"; its = possessive. E.g., it's flapping its wings.
    5. Re:Ineptness to the point of being evil by Riddlefox · · Score: 5, Insightful
      Very insightful, and I agree that we need a legal principle that personal information belongs to the individual--but I think we should go farther. I think we should require that the personally-identifiable personal information only be stored on the computer of the person who owns it--and that the authorities need to show probable cause and get a search warrant before they have any acces to it. However, a lot of it should be covered under the Fifth Amendment, too.

      Just out of curiousity, how do you propose that I store personally identifiable information such as my name and address on a computer owned by me when I wish to make a purchase online? How can I have my paycheck electronically deposited into my banking account if my employer can't store my personal information? How is H&R Block going to prepare my taxes for me if they can't enter any of my information on a computer that I don't own? Am I going to have to tell Netflix my name and address and credit card info every single time I want another movie?

    6. Re:Ineptness to the point of being evil by DrSkwid · · Score: 4, Insightful

      > Merchandise is shipped.

      where to? no-one knows your address

      --
      There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
  2. if i *accidentally* ... by GNUALMAFUERTE · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Run over someone with my car, i am responsable, and it's a crime. Even if i didn't mean to.

    Companys should be held responsable for the data they hold.

    --
    WTF am I doing replying to an AC at 5 A.M on a Friday night?
    1. Re:if i *accidentally* ... by ScrewMaster · · Score: 5, Insightful

      More importantly, they should be held responsible for what happens to people when that stored information is stolen or otherwise misused. And if the punishing of that company for its negligence forces it out of business ... tough. It simply isn't enough to say, "Sorry, and oh, by the way, we've implemented some new security policies so this shouldn't happen again. We hope. Once again, sorry for the inconvenience." Really, it's more akin to collecting all kinds of flammable and explosive materials and storing them in a rickety old warehouse in the middle of a populated area. You shouldn't be able to get off with an apology and a promise to do better when that warehouse explodes, flattens the nearby buildings and kills a bunch of people.

      Does that sound like an extreme example? Perhaps it is. But lives can be shattered in other ways besides being blown to bits. And I'm sure there will be a few deaths involved, as people with medical conditions suddenly find themselves without means, because some identity thief just bought himself a brand new house at their expense. No, the Information Age is proving to carry some serious risks, and those risks are largely due to cavalier treatment of personal data.

      I'm not sure what it will take before some standards are put in place, with appropriate penalties for failure to maintain them. Probably won't happen now, with "tort reform" on the way and limits being placed on class-action lawsuits. Certainly not in the corporate-friendly period we find ourselves in. Hell, the government can't even enforce quality-of-service standards on the damn phone companies anymore. But at some point, enough people (enough voters) are going to get hurt by this problem that something will have to be done. The only question is whether the cure will be worse than the disease.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    2. Re:if i *accidentally* ... by martinoforum · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I think you're missing the point here by trying to make a nice complicated story. Essentially in your example, a failure occurs. Failures should not occur in this situation. Therefore a hefty fine is entirely reasonable. If your Tibor character breached internal policies in his mission to acquire this trojan, the company can act against him after they get fined. The financial loss can be their reward for failing to ensure their internal security is properly enforced with respect to people capable of opening up sensitive data.

      If that internal security policy didn't exist, on the other hand, the company deserves everything it gets.

      It is possible to implement systems with "good enough" security, if you're willing to spend the cash on it. And it's also possible to implement internal systems with "good enough" systems of trust and physical security to prevent regular thefts of valuable materials. Banks have been doing it successfully for a long time, and where the systems fall down there are backup plans intended to deal with the fallout. I don't lose the contents of my bank account when a branch gets cleaned out. The fact that this level of thought and attention is not being paid to personal information suggests that - basically - the incentive to do it does not exist. Let's make it exist.

  3. Welcome to the downside... by ducomputergeek · · Score: 4, Insightful
    of our information driven world. Something like this was bound to happen eventually and highlights something that really needs to be brought back into the focus of public discource: just how much information should be readily available. Your credit score now is one of your most valuable assets and something you rarely heard about five or ten years ago. Now its mentioned every 30 seconds. Because of the ease of gaining this information, employers, and just about anyone can get your credit score even if legally the shouldn't be.

    Next big issue is going to be medical records online. While having such information in once location could be of great benefit to doctors and hospitals around the world, there are also dangers as well, like your HMO, employers, or if your a public figure, the media getting their hands on otherwise private medical records.

    --
    "The problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money" - Thatcher.
  4. Acceptable losses by erroneus · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Incidents such as these are actually rather rare. People abusing information collected either through neglect or in other ways is not as common as proper use.

    All those foolish people who protested the collection and sale of personal data of private citizens should be ashamed since the prosperity of this country depends greatly on the efficiency of business. And if you don't like it in this country any more go some place better! There isn't any place better you say? Then shoot yourself now because there's nothing you individuals can do to change things to your liking anyway.

    (The preceding was stated as an opposite to my actual feelings on the matter to illustrate how ridiculous I feel the opposing view might be. There are no acceptable losses when it comes to privacy and the right of everyone to keep what they have earned. Loss of privacy opens the door for unscrupulous people to do bad things and reduces an individual's ability to protect one's self.)

  5. The real problem here isn't the break-in... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They say "Criminals posing as legitimate businesses have accessed critical personal data stored by ChoicePoint Inc."

    If the data was that critical and personal, why was it available to "legitamate businesses" in the frist place?
    Are a set of articles of incorporation and a pile of money all I need to 'legitimately' access "databases of background information on virtually every U.S. citizen"?

  6. Re:So who ELSE is affected!? by LostCluster · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They're only telling the California residents because only California has a state law that requires notification... sound like a law that needs to be passed in 49 other states.

  7. No Changes Forthcoming by zentec · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The government is one of ChoicePoint's largest customers, so you can be certain that there will be zero rules and regulations imposed on ChoicePoint or similar companies. Nor will you see any changes to the Fair Credit Reporting Act, which affords no penalty to companies that report wrong information on individuals other than once proven incorrect, it is removed.

    If this incident doesn't create intense public outrage and a rash of calls to legislators demanding change, then I doubt there will ever be changes that protect individual identity and information.

    Furthermore, I would propose that every individual that finds ChoicePoint's egregious lack of security reprehensible, to draft a letter demanding a full explanation and any details relating to whether or not their information has been stolen. I don't expect this company to come clean, but just imagine the hassle of having to reply to hundreds of thousands of letters.

    Maybe having to deal with thousands of peeved off consumers will clean up their act.

  8. Re:Thats only what they are required to report by Eric+Smith · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Then let them publicly deny that any data has been stolen relating to residents of other states.

    I very much doubt that they're willing to do this. They're only providing any notification becuase they're required by law to do so; left to their own devices they would ignore it entirely.

  9. Yeah, thank goodness only AUTHORIZED third parties by loggia · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...can see your social security number, your credit report, your addresses...

    ...anytime they want...

    ...um...

    ...whew?

  10. A better solution by nasor · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Rather than taking extreme measures to ensure that social security numbers are kept private, people need to simply stop pretending that a social security number is some sort of magic password that can be used to prove that someone is who they claim to be. SSNs should be treated about the same as phone numbers; assume that everyone has one, but also assume that everyone knows it.

  11. Re:So who ELSE is affected!? by drinkypoo · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Actually, this is what happens when the system becomes too objective. The reason we make it subjective is that we are attempting to make things fair. The problem with that is that outside of a fascism it is impossible to make it so, because you cannot reliably enforce all of the laws equally and appropriately. Instead of appointing people we can trust to public offices and other positions of importance, we attempt to construct a system of law that will accurately address every situation. It does not typically believe in mitigating circumstances except in situations where it feels that everyone has done wrong.

    Anyway, this is the prison we built for ourselves, and as a result the fact that you happen to live in another state means they do have less obligation to you, as that word has any actual meaning anyway. Otherwise we'd be within our rights to march down there with torches and pitchforks and perforate 'em.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  12. Limits on personal information... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The real problem is there's no public/private key separation. Your credit card number is a secret key, but must be shared in order to do business with it. Ditto for checking account numbers which make direct deposit possible. The reason boils down to sheer laziness on the part of credit issuers. When there's a problem they can soak the merchants and/or customers, so they haven't bothered to fix the system.

    That solves your bank deposit problem. Public/private key separation would solve most of the problems.

    As far as repeatedly entering addresses--come on, that's easy. Browsers have a wallet-like feature which fills it in on demand. There's no need for the provider (netflix) to store the information, and they should refrain from doing so.

    So far as taxes are concerned--of course you have to give personal info for H&R Block to process them, but the grandparent means it should be treated as your property. You may leave valuables with a bank safety deposit box, but the bank does not own them. It is a steward. Its rights obviously don't extend to sharing information about what you've deposited with others.

  13. Will you even get a notice? by Stephen+Samuel · · Score: 4, Insightful
    35,000 Californians will get notices because California law requires it.

    The article points out that "Lee said law enforcement officials have so far advised the firm that only Californians need to be notified.", so I'm guessing that there are probably another 300,000, or so, nationwide who will not be notified by the company. A few other really high-profile types might get a notice, but I'm betting that no more than a couple dozen non-Californian SlashDot readers will get notices.

    Does anybody else want to call and ask and see if they even get an answer? (I don't live in the US, so I probably don't count, statistically speaking.)

    --
    Free Software: Like love, it grows best when given away.
    1. Re:Will you even get a notice? by akadruid · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I think it's a fair guess that 300k US citizens have had enough information stolen to make them liable to financial problems.

      Now, that data is going to worth a lot of money to someone. There are going to be individuals on that list who could have more $100k stolen each, ergo, the data is worth a multiple of that.

      But what if someone leaked it? Disgruntled employees or clients, other blackhats, cleaners, anyone? How wide would a 100MB csv spread on Kazaa? Given the precedent set by spammers, nearly all of those victims could be exploited.

      Anyone want to guess the political, economic and cultural impact of 1 in every 10 US citizens becoming bankrupt or even destitute in a matter of months? If it doesn't happen this time, its a ticking time-bomb for the future.

      A radical redesign of the modern approach to financial security is overdue.

      --
      "Those who cast the votes decide nothing; those who count the votes decide everything." (attrib. Joseph Stalin)
  14. Ultimate consumer-friendly solution by Karl+Cocknozzle · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...Is to make credit bureaus and data aggregators like Choicepoint liable for inappropriate data dissemination.

    These companies are in a position of responsibility, but they don't seem to take it very seriously. The credit bureaus have already bribed their way into legislation that makes it your responsibility to correct errors in their data, not them. If we don't act now, they'll bribe (excuse me, I mean "make campaign donations") and get a free pass on handing out your data to the Russian mafia, too. I say make them liable for monetary damages, instead.

    Institute it, and watch how fast their security improves. The attitude of: "Oh well, its not our problem" would be a thing of the past. OR somebody would sue them bankrupt. Either way, the consumer wins.

    Plus, the idea of suing these bastards into bankruptcy appeals to me because of Choicepoint's role in George W. Bush's 2000 coup.

    --
    Who did what now?