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Will New Apps Keep TiVo Afloat?
Dave Zatz writes "Tivo, struggling to keep customers and inch towards profitability as execs step down,
has continued to shift focus from pure PVR functionality towards digital convergence. Tivo's recently
released Home Media Engine SDK extends Tivo's capabilities as developers churn early Java apps out, including
the eBay-developed BuyItNow
and the independent Airport Express
AirTunes remote control. The recently released Tivo
To Go allows PC users to transfer shows to their computers for viewing, editing,
and burning shows. Mac users aren't entirely forgotten - a hidden feature in the
OSX Tivo Desktop 1.9 provides AAC
music playback through the television."
Download times vary widely. Most people report shows transferring a little quicker or a little slower than real time, meaning if you have a one hour show it will take about an hour to transfer. Many factors impact your throughput including file size based on recording quality and your network design. For example a show recorded in high quality will take longer to transfer than a show recorded in basic quality.
:)
I finally got my Tivo2Go system upgrade about two weeks ago (it took quite a while to come down to my unit) and I tried it out. I was absolutely dumbfounded at how slow the video file transferred over.
I intended on copying over the entire Tivo contents and then coverting them w/Dr. Divx (quite the task on my slower 2x400 Celeron machine) and then watching them on my Archos. Well, when I saw how slow the damn thing copied in the first place I figured why not just keep using the "Save to VCR" function as I have been doing?
What I would like to see is a "Save to VCR" function that will let me queue up multiple shows and save them all in one shot rather than one at a time. I could set the Archos up and let it record for a couple hours over night. Wake up and be done.
Tivo2Go sounded wonderful until I realized it was in a format that was worthless to go straight to a portable media device, it was slow as hell to bring over from the unit, and then it was slow as hell to convert with Dr. Divx.
Blah. Just do as I asked and change the "Save to VCR" function for me
I think it's too late for Tivo. They should have done this a couple years ago. Now everyone has their own PVR. I have had a "DVR" from DishNetwork for almost 2 years. With DirecTV and Comcast setting their own box out... that's the final 2 nails in the coffin...
"I cannot think of any need in childhood as strong as the need for a father's protection." -- Sigmund Freud
A company out there, whos had their market influenced by competition and innovation, trying to improve their business by means other than litigation.
I'm not one who watches much TV, therefor a Tivo was never big on my shopping list, but I have to say its refreshing to see a company try to improve their product rather than sue the compition.
Heres to you Tivo, and best of luck.
#include sig.h
I'm a loyal TiVo customer, and I simply don't get what this company is trying to do. They've basically blown it with the cable providers, so their only real hope in making some serious cash just hit the shitter. I kinda feel like the first days of Java when it was thrown out ther to "developers" who created useless applets. I have no desire to look at pictures on my TV. I can do that by plugging in my digital camera. I have no desire to share stuff with my Mac, unless I can download the videos in a normal codec (MPG) and save stuff on my computer.
What else is there to do on this thing that developers are really going to tap into to get my mom, dad, sister and in-laws to buy a TiVo?
I've said this before, but I am dead serious: they need more porn. It's always driven technology and made money. The cable companies are cashing in. The hotel chains are cashing in. The industry is cashing in. Now, that won't mak my family buy it, per se, but people WILL buy it if they see more hooters and camel toe.
This move for a "developers kit" it desperate becaue they can't think of anything else. They need a CEO like Jobs, because a visionary who can execute is the only way this company will be saved.
Fortunately, they are based on a decent OS and, by opening the platform up to the developers, can appeal directly to users.
It will take a long while for cable-companies to offer anything comparable on their proprietary boxes.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
"TiVo: TV Our Way"
sulli
RTFJ.
I'm sure companies will starting complaining about lost sales in DVDs/Ad placements
They can still place them there.
When I watch TV, I mute ads, or flip around. This does not stop the ad company from placing the ad. After all, they are not paying ME to see it, they are paying the TV show for placing it. The cost is the same whether I watch it or not.
Heck, I routinely tape (VHS) shows so I can fast-foreward through ads. Or when two shows are on in the same time slot. As far as I am concerned, there IS NO prime time. I tape when it is aired, and watch when I want to, not when some over-paid executive decides I should.
This is known as enpowernment.
All the **AA's hate this of course.....
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I am a programmer. I am paid to produce syntax not grammar. Deal with it.
Tivo, struggling to keep customers and inch towards profitability as execs step down, has continued to shift focus from pure PVR functionality towards digital convergence.
I'm not sure Digital Convergence is the model Tivo should follow. Although I suppose it'll be alright, eventually, now that their primary product has entered the realm of open-source tinkering.
Oh, you mean the failure to capitalize Digital Convergence wasn't an editorial accident? Oops.
Stressed? Me? Of course not. Stress is what a rubber band feels before it breaks, silly.
Good idea about Jobs. I think Apple should buy TiVo. It would fit perfectly into their whole home-media-centricity. If Apple bought TiVo it would instantly put them ahead of Microsoft's Media Center and give them a real wedge into the living room. And porting TiVo's application layer to OS X should be pretty straightforward if they want TiVo 3 to be a Mac for the living room.
When I watch TV, I mute ads, or flip around. This does not stop the ad company from placing the ad. After all, they are not paying ME to see it, they are paying the TV show for placing it. The cost is the same whether I watch it or not.
That may be true, but the bottom line is that companies pay TV networks to advertise there because you and millions of people like you watch the shows, and will therefore watch the advertisements. If everyone is skipping over the ads, then companies are not getting the visibility they were going for when they bought that ad, and continuing to buy ads in television media is no longer worthwhile.
As more and more people skip over ads, demand for ad space will go down, price will follow, and so will the total revenue of these networks, which operate almost entirely from revenue generated by advertisements. This is why DVR technology sucks so bad for television stations. Widespread use of DVR technology could potentially cut off their primary source of revenue, and unless people are willing to pay far more for television than they do already, TV stations are at a loss as to how to replace that revenue.
That being said, I watch shows exclusively from my DVR now. Even if I'm sitting there with nothing to do while the show is on, I'll record it and watch some other pre-recorded show, then watch the first show later, when I can skip over the ads, so I guess I'm part of the problem.
So what. Maybe 1% of users will figure out how to transcode it to remove the DRM. The instructions are out there, but let me tell you that it isn't exactly easy. You can go the GraphEdit route, which means installing the DirectX9 SDK, installing the correct codecs (which have to be paid for) and figuring out how to configure all the filters (the instructions out there aren't idiot proof). Or you can go the Nero transcoding route, but then youve got the bugs in loading the videos, Nero splitting the output into multiple files, etc. Or you can go the Sonic route, burn it to DVD, the rip it back off. I've found methods that work great for me, but it's too much trouble for the average user to figure out. Maybe one day there will be an application that makes it easy for users to do this, but right now I liken it to the warez scene...most users couldn't figure out how to get past the crap to find the real stuff.
And even before TTG was released, people figured out ways to hack the TiVo and download the video. So now you have the feature available to 100% of users, and maybe 1% will abuse it. Before, the feature was available to 0% of users, and STILL 1% abused it. Which scenario is better for TiVo?
"has continued to shift focus from pure PVR functionality towards digital convergence."
geez, I doubt the Cue Cat is going to inch them towards profitability.
This is not our problem. The media companies need to adapt or die and change their business model. Though I fear that the new business model will involve product placement, and then it will become ever harder to escape it.
In my humble, 20-20 hindsight opinion TiVo missed a big chance by not sometime earlier beginning to research TV-over-IP, in order to create something where the TiVo becomes a component in an IPTV platform that bandwidth providers-- like DSL companies-- license. This would give Tivo a clear profit model, and do so in a way that directly makes use of their products' intrinsic advantages, rather than like they do now just giving away razors and desperately trying to convince disinterested people that they want to buy blades.
Now it's probably too late for this. All the notable players are beginning to lock themselves into platforms for IPTV, and they're all choosing Microsoft's product. Yeah. Good luck getting THAT to integrate with a Tivo once it gets up and running.
Irritable, left-wing and possibly humorous bumper stickers and t-shirts
There's no reason we can't plug in a USB mouse and keyboard and run X on the thing.
You haven't use a Tivo have you? While the UI is wonderfully simple and easy to understand for just about anyone, I really don't find it "snappy" or responsive by any stretch of the imagination (nevermind since their most recent update for Tivo2Go).
I certainly wouldn't want to be using X on a machine w/such speed limitations. Welcome to 1992?
Imagine what would happen if all of these reasons were addressed. Who would want to acquire unauthorized copies then? What if it became standard for the first episode of any series to be available for download on the show's website? What if DVD releases of TV shows happened closer to when they were originally aired? What if I could pay a couple of bucks to buy download of an episode I missed? Who'd even bother with transferring files over the net then?
Then they couldn't charge $50 for single season DVDs.
And this is why this will never happen.
I don't think TIVO is going to stay afloat because it's a flawed business design. I read that TIVO is going to be forcing viewers to view pop up ads in March while they're fast forwarding. My girlfriend has Direct TV and TIVO and loves it. I have Dish Network and a PVR and I love it but hate her TIVO. I don't want an interactive recorder. I want a device that lets me record program X at time Y and then play it back at my convenience.
I think that Apple should get into the media center market, once the CableCard 2.0 standard is available, but I see no point in Apple buying TiVo. What would TiVo bring to the deal?
Name recognition? If anything, Apple's is even better.
Profits? TiVo is losing money.
User interface? Apple doesn't really need TiVo's help in user interface design, and the once-innovative TiVo interface is starting to seem a bit clunky next to things like iTunes. Apple would be better advised to come up with their own from scratch.
Two people have ever asked me to give them a copy of a show that I had recorded on TiVo. In both cases, they missed the show for some reason. I'm not set up to copy the shows off, so they were both out of luck.
Another friend set my TiVo to record their shows for them, in case they missed it at home. They can just come over at their leasure, and watch it here.
Piracy? Not really, everything's been on broadcast TV. I'm not removing the commercials, and really it makes for one extra viewer of those commercials.
If I could send the shows over to them easier, then that would still increase the viewer base of both the show and commercials.
Any argument against TiVo is the same crap that went on with the invention of the VCR. Oohh ya, that was the end of technology, wasn't it?
I don't watch the commercials on my TiVo. Fast forward, skip, or more commonly ignore them. Advertisments are a nice time to go get a drink, or something. Of course, I do find that it's interesting that I watch 1 hour shows in just about 30 minutes from most stations. It's almost to the point of having a little bit of television mixed in with all the advertisments.
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
That may be true, but the bottom line is that companies pay TV networks to advertise there because you and millions of people like you watch the shows, and will therefore watch the advertisements. If everyone is skipping over the ads, then companies are not getting the visibility they were going for when they bought that ad, and continuing to buy ads in television media is no longer worthwhile.
As more and more people skip over ads, demand for ad space will go down, price will follow, and so will the total revenue of these networks, which operate almost entirely from revenue generated by advertisements. This is why DVR technology sucks so bad for television stations. Widespread use of DVR technology could potentially cut off their primary source of revenue, and unless people are willing to pay far more for television than they do already, TV stations are at a loss as to how to replace that revenue.
That being said, I watch shows exclusively from my DVR now. Even if I'm sitting there with nothing to do while the show is on, I'll record it and watch some other pre-recorded show, then watch the first show later, when I can skip over the ads, so I guess I'm part of the problem.
Dead on. I believe Darwin called this evolution. TV Networks are becoming obsolete and they are fighting tooth and nail to survive. If they do not find a way to make money, (i.e. outlaw PVRs, pass laws against skipping commercials, find alternate revenue stream, etc.) they will die. It is certainly a bad thing for networks, but is it a bad thing for shows or for the viewer? Right now networks are a middle man with too much control - get rid of them and both the TV producers and viewers will be happy. Sell TV directly to consumer. A few decades back HBO and the like figured out a way to bypass advertizing and networks to sell (almost) directly to consumer - you pay for the channel, they are not hurt a bit by PVRs. Now someone needs to start selling content directly to PVRs over network - bypass cable company, bypass networks, etc. Sell shows, not channels.... here I go off on a rabling rant again....been saying this for at least 5 years, since I got my first Tivo...
-Em
RelevantElephants: A Somatic WebComic...
You are mistaken. There was a time when TiVo thought that cable companies were TiVo's optimal customers. Had TiVo made more deals like the DirecTV/TiVo deal, many more customers who wanted a particular cable/satellite offering but were PVR-platform-agnostic would have been introduced to TiVo.
TiVo's original marketing plan was to build something that would become the standard for set-top boxes that cable/satellite companies provide their customers.
However, early "buzz" about the very open Series 1 turned TiVo into the darling of techies and tinkerers. Only later did TiVo customers discover that the Series 1 openness was not part of the original business plan, but was merely the convergence of not-yet-mature DRM technology and very mature tinkerers.
This left TiVo with a problem. Its natural and intended market -- cable/satellite companies -- became afraid of TiVo as a device that would steal potential corporate revenues. So TiVo felt greater pressure to make cable/satellite-friendly marketing and feature decisions. Yet it could not make those decisions without destroying its "buzz" among the tech-folks who were its earliest and most vocal supporters.
In summary, TiVo is the victim of a schizophrenic and not-well-considered business plan.
I love TiVo. What it can do that no other PVR can is the Wishlist.
Example: I tell it I want anything with "Star Trek" in the subject, and I DON'T get ST episodes that I've seen 100 times, but I do get any show ABOUT Trek that airs. No Cable, Media Center, or Myth PVR can do anything like this, and this is TiVo's strength in a nutshell. Likewise, Season Passes that are smart enough to only get new episodes, or ones that it knows it hasn't gotten before.
Sadly, I agree with the posters here that TiVo is doomed. Why? Terrible (nonexistent) integration with high quality/HD signal and inputs! Sure, there's an HD DirecTiVo for $1000, but I don't use satellite, even if I was willing to spend that much. And the only connection options for the thing are Coax, composite, and S-video. I can understand no DVI, but where the hell are the component inputs?
My beloved TiVo is now the weak link in my otherwise all-digital HDTV stream. With no sign of improvement in sight.
Tivo are doomed. They were popular because they solved a problem that pisses a lot of people off: advertising. Their customers were those who were the most annoyed by the advertising, enough to pay money to do something about it. Their customers loved the fact that Tivo was "sticking it to the man" for them.
Not the case anymore. Now Tivo is about "compromise" and "innovation" and putting ads back into their customers shows and supporting Macrovision blocking of pay-per-view shows etc.
The thing they don't seem to grasp is that their customer base are made up of those who were not prepared to "compromise". These are people who said "No, I'm not prepared to compromise on this. I will not accept shit in my cornflakes. I don't care if there's less shit and it's harder to taste, I'm not giving you my money unless my cornflakes are shit-free"
Advice to Tivo: Stop looking at ways to "innovate" and get back to "fixing your customers problem"
-1 Uncomfortable Truth
It doesn't matter if only 1% of users can figure out how to remove the DRM. As Steve Jobs said when he introduced the Apply FiarPlay DRM scheme:
It only takes one person to break the DRM, and the file will instantly become available to everone.
The P2P networks mean that the work of one person (to remove the DRM protections) can be leveraged by millions with very little incremental effort.
That is why all DRM protections are ultimately useless - as long as one person can crack it, then everyone can crack it.