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Making the Case For Short Games

Gamasutra has a feature up entitled Making a Case for Short Games, in which the author argues that a good short game is far and away preferable to attempt than an epicly long game. From the article: "Which would you rather play, a computer game that takes forty hours to complete or one that lasts just a few minutes? Don't be too quick to answer. The former asks for a serious time commitment. The latter says come and go as you please. One is a ball and chain. The other is a 'Get Out of Jail Free' card. Well, it's not exactly that bad but considering all of the things you have to do today, which type of game do you really have time for? Also, isn't it peculiar that when you complete a complex or lengthy game you rarely want to replay it, yet short games are often endlessly replayable? "

20 of 123 comments (clear)

  1. What nonsense! by Dr.+GeneMachine · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Let me rephrase that:

    "Which would you rather read, a book that takes forty hours to complete or a short story that lasts just a few minutes? Don't be too quick to answer. The former asks for a serious time commitment. The latter says come and go as you please. One is a ball and chain. The other is a 'Get Out of Jail Free' card.

    I like my epic games - no one forces me to play them in one weekend. A good long game is like a story that I can read/watch/take part in - all in my own pace.

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    1. Re:What nonsense! by ikkonoishi · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Exactly.

      Would the SNES game "Zelda, Link to the past" be as good if the game ended after you saved Zelda from the dungeon?

      At the same time however tetris would have been pointless if each block took 3-4 hours to fall. (Complete with FFX-like three minute cutscene as the block locked in place.)

      It is all about balance.

    2. Re:What nonsense! by cowscows · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I think it's dumb that there's even an argument as to which one is inherently better. Doesn't it depend on what the point of the game is? Doesn't it depend on what kind of mood I'm in? Over the past 10 years or so, I've probably spent just as much time playing windows minesweeper as I spent playing through Knight of the old Republic on my Xbox over the course of a couple weeks. I enjoyed both of them a lot. I was much more emotionally invested in KOTOR while playing, but now that I'm finished with it, I'll probably never touch it again. One day, however, I'll probably be sitting around bored and fire up the ol' minesweeper and see if I'm as good at it as I was when I was younger. And I'll enjoy it then too.

      Epic games are awesome, and by definition, they need to be longer to work. They basically end when the story ends, and once the story is known, the fun stops. So there has to be all that story. There may be puzzles, and there may be combat, or whatever, but in the end, you're playing to advance and learn the story.

      Then there's games where there's absolutely no story, just the rules, and your goal is generally to learn how to be efficient at whatever the task is.

      I guess my point is that it's silly to compare these classes of games in this way. The word "game" is a little to broad to draw comparisons between anything that falls under it. Taking the analogy that you quoted; a book and a short story are very different. They both fall under the category of "writing". Asking which one is a better form of Writing is a pointless question. It depends on what the author is trying to get across to the reader.

      --

      One time I threw a brick at a duck.

    3. Re:What nonsense! by some+guy+I+know · · Score: 5, Funny
      One day, however, I'll probably be sitting around bored and fire up the ol' minesweeper and see if I'm as good at it as I was when I was younger.
      I've never understood the fascination some people have with Minesweeper.
      As long as you are careful, take your time, and carefully analyze the minefield, you can generally get a mine to blow up in only one or two moves, five tops.
      --
      Those who sacrifice security to condemn liberty deserve to repeat history or something. - Benjamin Santayana
  2. Long games... by ikkonoishi · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Long games might have more time to suck, but short games have less time to be worth the money you pay for them.

    The best balance is games that can be beaten quickly, but take long times to complete 100%.

    1. Re:Long games... by mindaktiviti · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That's why...

      - GTA: Vice City
      - Deus Ex

      were such wicked games. You could just do the main missions but there's so much more to do. Granted, those games did take a while to complete, but they took a lot longer to complete everything 100%.

  3. A quick game of Counter Strike by utahjazz · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The brilliance of CS is the combo of only having 1 life, and really quick games.

    If poeple are rushing (like they should) the game is won or lost in about 1 minute, over in no more than 2. Worst case it lasts 5.

    Just enough sitting out to make dying painful, but quick enough turnaround that you don't want to leave.

    It works way better than "die all you want" games like Unreal and Quake.

  4. The problem with many PC games is... by rokzy · · Score: 3, Interesting

    ...(talking mainly about FPSs) there's no continuing GAMEPLAY innovation.

    in comparison, I playing Resident Evil 4 on the Gamecube. I'm 20 hours in and have seen more varied gameplay styles and cool things than all the FPSs I've ever played put together.

    it's probably one of the best games ever. I think it might have a little do do with the fact that you sell a console game once. with PC games there's a lot more effort getting it out of the door due to different systems, and you know you can just release an add-on pack 6 months down the line so creating great gameplay first time round isn't so important if you know you can lure people back with your engine eye-candy anyway (Doom 3, I'm looking at you.)

  5. Length measured how? by screwballicus · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The crucial question regarding game length for me in story-based game genres (whether the game be Adventure, RPG, Tactical RPG or even Story-Driven FPS) is simply, how long is the story content? The length of time spent in front of the screen is a comparatively trivial question, in estimating the value of the story as a whole, though I'd rather the game didn't consume time in front of the screen merely for the sake of consuming it, if the story isn't progressing.

    A 100 hour game in which 90 of those hours consist of random encounters with generic enemies is ultimately a less epic story than a 30 hour game in which 25 of those hours consist of dialogue, story-telling and combat with meaningful characters.

  6. Which would you pay for? by kenneth_martens · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Which would you rather play, a computer game that takes forty hours to complete or one that lasts just a few minutes?
    That's the wrong question. The question is, which would you be more willing to pay $50 for? Game companies make games with the hope that people will buy them.

    Think about that. Would you pay $50 for Minesweeper? No, but you'd pay that much for the latest Myst adventure. It doesn't matter that you'll only play Myst once and that you'll enjoy Minesweeper several times a week for the rest of your life. You'll never be able to convince people to pay $50 a pop for short games like you will for epic games.

    The reality of the game market doesn't make the article wrong, just irrelevant. It doesn't matter which games are technically better, it matters which games sell.
    1. Re:Which would you pay for? by bluGill · · Score: 3, Interesting

      No, but then as a programmer I don't need you to pay $50 to make money on my version of MineSweeper. It is a small game that I can write in a week or less. (Assuming I already knew the APIs, I don't normally work with GUIs so it would take me a little longer) I can sell it for $5, which people are more likely to pay. Or I can sell it with a bunch of other games of similar length for $40.

      Note that I'm using MineSweeper as a generic. There is too much competition, in the MineSweeper world. (Most free and high quality) However there are other games of that type that I can write. Ideally I'd be creative enough to make something original.

  7. Making the case for short lives by dtfinch · · Score: 5, Funny

    Which would you rather have, a life that takes eighty years to complete or one that lasts just a few decades? Don't be too quick to answer. The former asks for a serious time commitment. The latter says come and go as you please. One is a ball and chain. The other is a 'Get Out of Jail Free' card. Well, it's not exactly that bad but considering all of the things you have to go through each day, which type of life will you really find worthwhile? Also, isn't it peculiar that when you near completion of a complex and lengthy life you rarely want it to dredge on any longer, yet short lives are often interesting and full of excitement, and endlessly repeatable if your religion allows?

    1. Re:Making the case for short lives by NanoGator · · Score: 4, Funny

      "There's an old Cat saying: It's better to live one hour as a Tiger than a lifetime as a worm."

      "Well there's an old human saying: Whoever head of a worm-skin rug?"

      --
      "Derp de derp."
  8. Re:Time commitment? by NanoGator · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "The whole premise is flawed as soon as you introduce the radical concept of saved games, as you can shift your "commitment" to any point in the future, or put it off indefinitely."

    It's a detail, but not a flaw in the premise. How many of you have half-played games? I have. I never finished Mafia, even though I was enjoying it. I've had San Andreas for 3 months now. (I'm stuck on a not-so-fun level.) Prepare to point and laugh, but I was FIRST in line to get Ocarina of Time and Wind Waker, they're both still half finished.

    Shifting the commitment doesn't strengthen the commitment. Either you really want to spend that much time in a game world, or you don't.

    Frankly, I think there is easily a market for both types of games, especially now that the portables war is starting to take off.

    --
    "Derp de derp."
  9. Fallout 1 & 2 by tdelaney · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Occasionally I like a short game - as short as Freecell.

    However, I've played Fallout 1 & 2 over 40 times each *to completion*. My shortest game is around 10 hours. My longest is over 100 hours.

    I *much* prefer a long game, that I can play *at my own pace*.

  10. What's the best length for a game? by theclam159 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I'd say 10-20 hours. That's long enough to have a good story and a certain amount of complexity, but it's also short enough that you can replay it several times without spending a year on it.

    I know that when I play RPGs, I sometimes feel like I'm missing out. I spend 80 hours playing a warrior, which means that I'm missing out on playing a rogue, a priest, or a mage. I don't really want to spend 320 hours playing the same RPG, so I get to play every class. If the game is only 10-20 hours long, then I can spend about 60 hours and I'll get to experience the game from several different perspectives.

    Plus, most really long games get repetitive after a while. Once you get about 15 hours into a game, you've discovered 95% of the game mechanics, so you're just going to repeat the same things for another several dozen hours.

    I often don't like small games because they have no depth. If you take some of the Popcap games, like Bejeweled, you'll see that there isn't much complexity or strategy to them. Those types of games get very repetitive; your 50th hour will have the same gameplay as your 1st hour.

    Once you get into competitive multiplayer games, however, things start to shift. 2-5 minute games can be fun, because you can play so many games in a row that you can try dozens of different strategies and situations. If you're losing, then the game will be over quickly, so you can start afresh. On the other hand, hour long games can be fun, because you can spend large amounts of time plotting methodically against your opponent, only for a game to come down to one huge climactic battle.

  11. Different games for different situations. by Temporal · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If I'm looking to waste five minutes, I'll play DDR. It's not very filling, but it's kind of a fun distraction.

    If I'm looking to waste an hour or two, I'll play a round of Warcraft. This is a little more interesting, but still mostly a distraction.

    If I'm looking to waste a weekend, I'll play an FF or other long single-player RPG. I will get much, much more out of this than playing DDR all weekend. A good RPG story makes you think, makes you laugh and cry, etc. There's something cathartic about it, and you come out feeling emotionally refreshed.

    Few people look back at 40 hours of DDR (or Counter-Strike, Warcraft, etc.) with the kind of emotional attachment that a good RPG can bring.

    This is not to say that short games don't have their place. I wouldn't trade in DDR for another RPG. I guess my point is that it's like comparing cars to airplanes and concluding that cars are always better.

  12. Nothing new here... by danbeck · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You hear this crap all the time from whiney game reviewers who get all their swag for free. They bitch and moan and write essays about how long it takes to finish games these days, all because they they have to get through it to finish their review in time for that deadline.

    Nothing is more moronic than someone like this trying to convince us that we need to shell out more and more money for shorter and shorter games.

    He obviously doesn't get reality. You know what I do with an expensive game that takes 5 hours to complete? I pirate it. (I'm looking at you Max Payne 2!) On the other hand, I'm first in line to buy a game that gives you your money's worth.

  13. I second that. by Inoshiro · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I don't mind games that take a while to complete (after all, I can still play it decently, just over a longer period, right?). What I hate are games which do the following:
    * No easy quest tracking or other goal tracking
    coupled with
    * A play granularity which is around 2 hours.

    Most of the games that are above the 10 hour completion time rating are like this; once you put them down, when you get back to them you realize you don't remember what you were doing. Few games do have a notes on what happened, and a list of what's happening next (Kotor did support this! It made it very excellent to play). Warcraft 3 is great because I can hit F9 and see the quests (hell, any Blizzard game is good for quest tracking).

    The play granularity thing is another issue. I may not have 2 or 4 hours to play a game in one stretch. I'm not a big fan of games where I can't just save and quite at any point, or games where if I do get in, it takes me a good 2 hours to get anywhere in it. Games with specific save points (Resident Evil) require premeditated play time. IE: I pick an afternoon to sit down and go ahead and get from one logical point to another. In a game like Warcraft 3, I can just save at any point, and resume later.

    There are a lot of great games, but there are fewer great games that make themselves easy to enjoy. Lower penalties for platformers (which I've noticed tend to be geared towards the younger gamers, many of whom seem to have infinite patience which I no longer have; losing an hour of 'work' is painful -- replayed game segments are not fun, generally!), better quest tracking, easy save/resume, all contribute to something I can do in my work schedule.

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  14. I fail to see the point, though by Moraelin · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Yes I have half-played some games, and I have even thrown games away after half an hour. Some games are just not fun, or get you stuck on a not-so-fun level at some point. (And yes, I won't point and laugh, I _hated_ both N64 Zeldas too. I quit Ocarina Of Time after 15 minutes.)

    It still doesn't say basically "long games are bad", which is the flawed premise of that article. In reality, some games can be long and very good, yet others can be short and awful.

    And yes, the grandparent post is right: once you have saved games, the whole premise of that article becomes flawed. Because the premise was basically "waah, but what if I have to do something later, and this game is too long to fit in? I can't commit that much time to a game." _That_ is the flawed premise.

    And with saved games that's a straw-man. I've been known, for example, to squeeze in 15-30 minutes of some game before I go to work. I've never had to think "naah, I only have half an hour, so I'll play solitaire" yet.

    No, of course it doesn't strengthen the commitment, but it makes it possible. Just because a game took me 70 hours to finish (e.g., "Persona 2: Eternal Punishment") or a whole month to finish (e.g., "The Elder Scrolls: Arena"), it doesn't mean it had to be in one go, without pause, without sleep, without doing anything else.

    Or let's take your argument about half-played games. Would it have been that much better if the game had only the first mission? Yay, you've stolen the first car (or whatever you do in GTA), the game is over. How many times would you have replayed that?

    By contrast, I can think of games which were long and had a story, but were complex enough and fun enough to be worth playing again. E.g., Fallout 2. E.g., KOTOR.

    Now I could see the author's post if he picked on the distinction between abstract games (like Solitaire, Pac Man or Tetris) vs story-driven games. Anything story-driven is inherently less replayable: you already know the story. Same as with a movie, really: you can watch a good movie again, but noone sane can see the same movie 200 times.

    But arguing that it's length that makes a game replayable or not -- or even playable the first time for that matter -- it's such a bogus straw man, it's not even funny.

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