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Cassini Confirms New Moon of Saturn

pipcorona writes ""In a spectacular kick-off to its first season of prime ring viewing, which began last month, the Cassini spacecraft has confirmed earlier suspicions of an unseen moon hidden in a gap in Saturn's outer A ring. A new image and movie show the new moon and the waves it raises in the surrounding ring material."

46 of 207 comments (clear)

  1. "Name That Moon" Contest by TripMaster+Monkey · · Score: 4, Funny


    From TFA:



    The new body has been provisionally named S/2005 S1.



    Well, that just rolls off the tongue, doesn't it?

    Looks like it's up to us...please post your suggestions for the new moon's name below.

    --
    ____

    ~ |rip/\/\aster /\/\onkey

    1. Re:"Name That Moon" Contest by Dan+Up+Baby · · Score: 5, Funny

      S/2005 S1, as you know, was the Roman god of awkward names.

    2. Re:"Name That Moon" Contest by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      That's no moon...

    3. Re:"Name That Moon" Contest by pv2b · · Score: 3, Funny

      Britannia.

      Why, after all, it rules the waves in Saturn's belt. Britannia rule the waves. Get it?

      Besides, what more fitting tribute to the decline of the British Empire than naming an insignificant 7 kilometer wide hunk of rock(or whatever it's made of) after it. :-)

    4. Re:"Name That Moon" Contest by Meetch · · Score: 5, Funny

      Ok so consensus would have us leaning toward a really cool name like "Deathstar". Sorry for stating the obvious!

    5. Re:"Name That Moon" Contest by pv2b · · Score: 5, Funny
      goatse
      I'm sorry. We can't name it Goatse. I think that award should be reserved for the Goatse Stellar Nursery (A.K.A. NGC 604).

      You can't tell me that doesn't look like goatse. I swear! It does!
    6. Re:"Name That Moon" Contest by sik0fewl · · Score: 3, Funny

      I don't know, it's all Greek to me.

      --
      I remember when legal used to mean lawful, now it means some kind of loophole. - Leo Kessler
    7. Re:"Name That Moon" Contest by mbrewthx · · Score: 2, Funny

      With a name like s/2005 S1 I wonder if there is a Stargate on it? Probably not wrong type of naming convention.

      Let's call her Sheila.

      --
      __________ Leave me alone I'm compiling a RPG II program on my S/36...Thanks to metamucil I'm a Regular Meta Moderator
    8. Re:"Name That Moon" Contest by Brett+Buck · · Score: 2, Funny

      Another day, another proof of goatse's transcendent relevance to the physical world. Brett

    9. Re:"Name That Moon" Contest by Wizarth · · Score: 2, Funny

      Oh My... $DIETY really does have a sense of humour!

    10. Re:"Name That Moon" Contest by CheshireCatCO · · Score: 3, Informative

      No good. That name would be for a moon of Jupiter (as they're usually named for his various lovers). Saturnian moons are named for Titans or Titan-like gods from other pantheons.

  2. What's so special about a new moon? by psetzer · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I mean, really? Every time they find a new one, the things just keep getting smaller. What's next, a piece of ejecta from another moon the size and shape of a '74 Chevy Impala? Might as well start naming the debris in the rings.

    --
    "Anyone who attempts to generate random numbers by deterministic means is living in a state of sin." -- John von Neumann
    1. Re:What's so special about a new moon? by forkazoo · · Score: 5, Funny

      The impala is not recognised as a unit of measure. Please use Volkswagons, or ISO Standard Bathtubs.

      I'm not sure where the exact cutoff is. I'd assume anything in the decivolkswagon range would simply be considered as flotsam unworthy of a name, unless somebody wants to try to catalogue everything in the rings! You'd need a lot of mountain dew.

  3. So everythings a moon now? by mnmn · · Score: 4, Funny

    7km across? Compared to Saturn thats tiny. Thats like saying the ISS is a moon.

    So how do you draw a distinction between a moon, a natural satellite, asteroids and space junk? You can either say the moon Earth has an asteroid orbiting it... or that Earth has many moons orbiting it, only one of which is large enough to see.

    So if I pay the Russian space program to launch my 1kg rock in lower orbit, do I get to name my moon, or will they just name it
    S/2005 SR26GC3.14159265357?

    Which makes me wonder, have we named or numbered our own moon yet? Can I call shotgun and call it 'fp!'?

    --
    "Give orange me give eat orange me eat orange give me eat orange give me you." -Nim Chimpsky
    1. Re:So everythings a moon now? by Daedalus-Ubergeek · · Score: 5, Informative

      I do believe our own moon is named Luna, which would be where you get the word "Lunar", although you rarely ever hear anybody call the moon by its actual name.

    2. Re:So everythings a moon now? by helioquake · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I'd usually agree with your sentiment. But this finding is rather important and scientifically useful (for some, not really for me).

      The significant thing is this: this moon, how small it is, may regulate the way a gap in the A-ring evolves (or stay clear of smaller rocks),

      The effect of the moon's gravity is small, but not small enough to be ignored by the material nearby. Some smart guys can run some numerical analysis to study what the rings are made of, and how a single massive (relatively) body can perturb its surrounding smaller particles.

    3. Re:So everythings a moon now? by ag0ny · · Score: 2, Informative

      Well, at least in Spanish-speaking countries we always call it Luna.

    4. Re:So everythings a moon now? by Greyfox · · Score: 5, Funny
      Thats like saying the ISS is a moon.

      That's not a moon. It's a space station.

      --

      I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?

    5. Re:So everythings a moon now? by frakir · · Score: 2, Informative

      Cruithne is not a moon; it is not bound by Earth gravitation. It is an asteroid (number 3753).

    6. Re:So everythings a moon now? by Jugalator · · Score: 2, Interesting

      "actual name"?

      Hmm, I thought the actual name was "the Moon", and Luna a term rarely used to distinguish it from other moons whenever necessary. Why would people rarely use an actual name?

      That it's the actual name is as debatable as Sol is the actual name for the Sun, something I also can't really say, even if we have "solar".

      I guess both these names can be said to be occasionaly used to personify these celestial bodies though.

      --
      Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
    7. Re:So everythings a moon now? by metroplex · · Score: 5, Informative
      Actually, in all Romance Languages (those derived by latin), the Earth's moon is called something like "Luna".
      • Italian: Luna
      • French: Lune
      • Spanish: Luna
      • Portuguese: Lua
      • Romanian: Luna
      --
      "Words of wisdom: drop that zero and get with the hero" -- Vanilla Ice
    8. Re:So everythings a moon now? by m50d · · Score: 2, Informative

      It's an old joke, it's been posted 3 times in the thread already, and yet you still can't get the line right? That's *no* moon.

      --
      I am trolling
    9. Re:So everythings a moon now? by fo0bar · · Score: 2, Funny

      I do believe our own moon is named Luna, which would be where you get the word "Lunar", although you rarely ever hear anybody call the moon by its actual name.

      What's next? Calling the sun something stupid like "Sol"?

    10. Re:So everythings a moon now? by cbv · · Score: 2, Informative

      What's next? Calling the sun something stupid like "Sol"?

      Just in case you're not being sarcastic, as our Solar System's planets are actually named after Roman gods, the name for our Sun would be Sol just as Earth is actually called Terra.

      For a list of names, see this compilation.

    11. Re:So everythings a moon now? by antipod · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Actually I have always been tought that the actual name of our planet is Tellus. Though that is what we were tought in swedish schools 20 years ago and I know it is the latin name for the Earth and also the roman goddess of Earth so who knows who is right...?

      And as www.susning.nu says about Terra (sorry, swedish site) 'Terra is a latin noun that means land. On old maps you can see the words like terra ingocnita, which means unknown land'.

    12. Re:So everythings a moon now? by trongey · · Score: 2, Informative

      I do believe our own moon is named Luna...

      Actually, our moon doesn't technically seem to be named anything. The International Astronomical Union (IAU), which many people consider to be the authority on such matters, doesn't seem to have any documents that specify what our moon's name is. Some of their documents use the name Moon with a capital M (eg. "Report of the IAU/IAG Working Group on Cartographic Cordinates and Rotational Elements of the Planets and Satellites: 2000" http://astrogeology.usgs.gov/Projects/ISPRS/PREPRI NTS/index_preprints.html), and I've read that they recommend the use of the name Moon.

      --
      You never really know how close to the edge you can go until you fall off.
  4. Roche limit? by Gangis · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I'm no astronomer, but I remember hearing in Astronomy class about the Roche Limit, the absolute minimum distance that an orbiting body can be from a planet before it'd be disintegrated by the gravity. I also remember hearing that Saturn's rings could have been developed as a result of objects falling within the Roche Limit and disintegrating, thus adding to the ring. This object seems much larger than most of the ones in the ring structure, though. I find that really odd. But then again, IANAA. :P

    --
    "Black holes are where God divided by zero." - Steve Wright
    1. Re:Roche limit? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      The Rings are inside the Roche limit, which is the point where tidal forces will destroy a satellite. However, the Roche limit assumes a liquid body. A small solid body has enough physical strength to hold itself together even inside the Roche limit.

    2. Re:Roche limit? by imsabbel · · Score: 4, Informative

      The Roche limit only works for large bodies, when you assume that the moon is only held together by its own gravity.

      For very small, rocky moons, the tensile strenght of the rock itselv enabls them to exist nearer than the roche limit. Its nothing extremely longtime-stable, but otoh, the tidal forces on a small moon arent very large.

      Also, the roche limit is only a contant (2.xxx*R_bigplanet or so) if the bodies have the same density. If the objects is, for example, a captured iron asteroid, its roche limit can be VERY close to a not very dense saturn.

      --
      HI O WISE PRINCE. WHT TOOK U SO DAM LONG?
  5. Images! by Roland+Piguepaille · · Score: 2, Informative
    Cool images and data:
    Map and Images of Titan from Hubble Space Telescope
    Nasa Titan Photojournal
    Saturnian Satellite Fact Sheet
    Phoebe best image so far, from Voyager2 in 1981!

    --
    To confirm you're not a script, please piss in my ear.
    1. Re:Images! by darenw · · Score: 2, Interesting

      A post about non-S/2005 S1 objects seems a bit off-topic, and so probably deserves no response, but i must point out that the Phoebe image referred to is hardly the "best image so far"! We have 10000000000 times better resolution (it's too late at night to count digits... ;-) from Cassini in June 2004. Just crawl out from under fuzzy little rock where you've been living, and have a look at, for example: http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=198 or http://ciclops.lpl.arizona.edu/view.php?id=203 - the smallest craters you see are about the same order of size as football stadiums.

  6. Good use of science money by qurk · · Score: 3, Insightful

    At least this money is going to find new and useful things. Unlike my state (Kansas) which seems to think that the board of education needs to make us all a laughingstock and put their damn religion in our schools in every science textbook. Why not just require a class, like "Majority religion/philosophy-science indocrination". Look, I learned a LOT from reading Isaac Asimov essays, is there a reason I had to go the the library and check out books of essays from a science fiction author to learn about science? Ya! My state board of education is really badass, getting the job done, and is really cool!

  7. Interesting that... by vikstar · · Score: 4, Interesting

    the waves caused are asymetric, as if the moon is moving faster than the immediately surrounding debris. But thats impossible, because it would move the moon to a higher orbit, or the debris to a lower one, right? Can anyone explain this seemingly wierd phenomenon? Also notice the waves caused on the inner darker ring, what is the cause of that?

    --
    The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than the question of whether a submarine can swim.
  8. Test for grav. pertubation by helioquake · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I'm repeating myself here (see my post below)...

    This satellite is actually interesting since it may hold a key on how to retain a gap in the A-ring. It has to do with this small body of a satellite perturbing the neighboring, smaller dusts and removing them from the region effectively.

    Somelike that can be studied numerically (n-body problems) to prove the ring's composition, etc. A nice test case for n-body problem.

    [I really should be moderating today but...oh well.]

  9. Re:Not a movie! by NanoGator · · Score: 2, Funny

    "It's not a movie! Geez! It's an animated GIF image! (Score:2, Informative)"

    *Sigh*

    Remember when these debates were fun? Now I worry a chick will see me.

    --
    "Derp de derp."
  10. Re:3 Simple Suggestions for Slashdot by Fizzl · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Oh please god no!
    What are you on? That would make /. look like a gay christmas tree. All of your suggestions are horrible.
    1. If you need images, post a link. If you don't have your own webserver or atleast host space to put images on, please hand back your /. UID.
    2. Emoticons are plaque of messageboards. I want to strangle someone each time I use MSN after fresh install and haven't turned them off. What ever happened to the good old smileys?
    3. Ok, you just have to be trolling...

  11. That's not a moon! That's a... by Jugalator · · Score: 2, Insightful

    ... unsually large particle in Saturn's ring system??

    --
    Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
  12. In space no one can see your color? by cnschulz · · Score: 2, Insightful

    umm... can anyone explain why they dont send color cameras into space? every picture seems to be either black and white or post-processed into some wierd infra-something false color. give us real color! the truth is out there!

    1. Re:In space no one can see your color? by Mikey-San · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Imagine being in England for a moment. It's 3 a.m., and you're sitting on one side of the Thames River.

      Your friend Bob is perched in his chair on the other side.

      Your camera's all set up and ready to snap a picture. Just when you're about to snap, you realize that the nearest streetlight is three miles to Bob's left. Seeing that the Thames isn't a sneeze's distance across, you know that the dinky flash on your camera is pretty useless.

      You whip out your trusty imaging spectrometer camera lens and line up the shot with Bob again. Bob's giving off some good x-ray emissions, and those come across just fine.

      You could've used a really, really awesome lens and captured a bad photo of Bob--he still reflects some light, though it's a ridiculously small amount--but the IR lens gave you a more descriptive picture of Bob. Why? Mr Bob the Planet Man doesn't give off his own visible light, but he certainly emits x-rays on his own.

      This scales higher:

      In this new-but-similar scenario, you're flying over England. You're trying to take a picture of Bob and his lazy ass, but all you can see, no matter how much light you shine down onto the city below, are the lights from the buildings, bridges, and streetlamps. There's just too much noise to find ol' Bob in that galaxy of lumens.

      You've got all these lights shining on Bob, but unlike the first scenario, there's /too much/ light to see Bob; all you see are stars, so to speak, drowning out the nearby planets. Well, in x-ray mode, your camera can see that while those stars are emitting x-rays, so is Bob, just like before. You're not seeing a faint image of Bob drowned out by the only light illuminating him, you see Bob's x-ray signature approximately ten feet to the right of that cluster of streetligts.

      The universe is a dark place, but sometimes it can be TOO bright! It's a good thing I remembered a towel!

      --
      Mikey-San
      Karma: +Eleventy billion (mostly affected by watching Celebrity Jeopardy)
    2. Re:In space no one can see your color? by bcwright · · Score: 4, Informative

      Resolution. Most space cameras work by detecting light falling on a CCD (Charge-Coupled Device); if the camera was full color, then the resolution would be cut by at least 2/3 because you'd have to devote 1/3 of the CCD to each of the primary colors. (It might be even worse than that if your imaging system wasn't 100% efficient at directing the color components to the proper pels on the CCD). You can obtain the effect of a color camera by using different lens filters and taking multiple pictures and then composing them into a single image - this is what's usually done when a color photograph is desired. By doing that you can produce an image that's exactly what you could obtain with a color camera, but at a higher resolution and without having to use a higher resolution CCD. Also, that way your pictures aren't limited to using a selection of color components that are compatible with those the human eye sees - you can use the filters to "see" parts of the spectrum outside the range that's visible to the human eye.

    3. Re:In space no one can see your color? by CheshireCatCO · · Score: 2, Informative

      People have already more or less addressed this, but I'll speak up anyway.

      They DO send color cameras into space. After a fashion. You have surely seen the color images taken by Cassini's ISS instrument already, so you know that it is possible. To do this, they put various filters in place and expose the CCD to take the image. The colors are then combined (with extreme love and care to get accurate color, in many cases) to make a color image. However, this clearly takes at least three times the exposure time that a single black and white image through a clear filter does. (Actually, more than that. Each filter blocks a lot of the light, so you tend to expose for longer than you would for a simple clear filter in order to get your signal to noise down.) So for a lot of science, when color isn't expected to be very important anyway (like for discovering a moon), you just use the clear filter.

  13. The name by jlebrech · · Score: 2, Funny

    Hey they even called the planet after the Sega Saturn, why not called this new moon Dreamcast.

  14. Sphere of Fear by Shivetya · · Score: 4, Funny

    Planet Death?
    The Killing Ball?
    Death Moon?
    Giant Hurt Ball?
    The Deathdicle?

    --
    * Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
  15. Re:You're off topic, and stupid. too by meadowsp · · Score: 2, Insightful

    How about making you really THINK about the implausable idea that the earth is flat or the unlikely explanation that its round.

  16. Re:Why asymetric? by CheshireCatCO · · Score: 3, Informative

    You nailed it. The ring material inside the S/2005 S1's position is moving faster than the moon, so the waves that the moon excites appear ahead of the moon's present position. (That material just had a close encounter.) The other edge of the gap is orbiting more slowly, so the moon PASSES it, so the waves appear behind the moon.

    I'd avoid the word "turning" because it suggests a solid object. The rings are anything but solid.

    There are other ways to make asymmetries in these wakes. If the moon isn't well-centered in the gap (although it isn't clear why it wouldn't be) or has a significant orbital eccentricity, you'll get asymmetry as well.

  17. Re:Not a movie! by Captain+Irreverence · · Score: 2, Funny

    *Sigh* Remember when these debates were fun? Now I worry a chick will see me.

    This is Slashdot. No danger of that.