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Sun Steps Back from Linux JDS
chill writes "ZD Net UK is reporting that Sun is pulling back from their JDS desktop Linux initiative. The big question is what happened to those half-million to million-plus units that were supposed to ship in China in 2004? One hint may be that in April, Novell announced a deal with CSSC to 'cooperate to provide technology, services and marketing to optimise and promote Linux to the Chinese market.' Sun's JDS was based on SUSE Linux, now owned by Novell."
The big question is what happened to those half-million to million-plus units that were supposed to ship in China in 2004?
What about those of us here in the US who *paid* for JDS and were promised major upgrades every quarter? We saw the JDS 1.0 -> 2.0 upgrade, then it stopped while Sun worked on JDS/Solaris.
Sun needs to learn that the only way they're going to make inroads into the desktop market is if they follow through. Rome wasn't built in a day, and neither was the popularity of Java or Solaris. If Sun would take the time to listen to their customers and implement the features they are demanding, then they'd have a very good chance at success. *sigh*
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
Yeah, we'll likely see a lot of comments like "sun changing their mind ones again" and complaints. But why would they use Linux to begin with? I guess in the early days of the JDS they didn't had the Solaris x86 (current version), but once they had it why would they keep on using Linux?
Even less so when they open-source Solaris and try to gain more momentum.
Right now I think they are doing everything right. x86 Solaris, Open-Solaris, cheap x86 workstations, soon(?) to be open Java.
I'll probably install Open-Solaris on my own machine real-soon-now.
What I like about both Solaris and the BSDs are the great & easy to find documentation, the huge amount of dists in the Linux world plus the fact that they use different user-land tools doesn't help. But if you go with a larger one I suppose the documentation is decent for Linux aswell.
Why anyone would chose RedHat over Solaris for a server system is beyond me
- iptables
- proper package management (not that red hat provides that, but compared pkgadd anything seems good)
- real command line utils (GNU), ie:
- color ls
- tar with gzip, bzip support (no need for piping)
Now I don't want to give the impression I think Solaris is crap. Far from it. Obviously you wouldn't want to run Linux on a massive 64 processor server or anything. But for a small system, and for ease of use and maintenance, Linux is a lot nicer to work with.
It's amazing how much the small conveniences add up. Seriously, try going without color ls for a while. It's ridiculous, but it can be really frustrating.
Depends on the architecture - Solaris on Sparc makes sense, why anyone would choose Solaris over Linux on an x86/amd64 platform is beyond me. (I support both at work, and aim to replace as many Solaris boxes as possible with Linux.)
RedHat Enterprise Linux 4 has become the distribution of choice at work. It's not my first choice but RHEL is easy to install - and has the support pricetag (and scapegoat) to keeps management happy.
If you can't beat 'em, find something plausible to fit their preconceptions...
"Even the BSD's have made it to the desktop (MacOS) with more success than Linux. It's no surprise, look at the licensing differences."
Perhaps Sun and Microsoft's new partnership with end with a melding of Solairs kernel with some sort of Microsoft added GUI akin to Apple and FreeBSD? As much as I dislike Microsoft, this could be a great product!
It makes sense too. They have a world class Unix based OS and it made little sense for them to just abandon it and move to Linux. If they are able to generate some interest in an open source Solaris, that might be a more sensible path forward for them
All you touch and all you see is all your life will ever be
Never used Solaris, I guess?
/usr/sfw/bin - so what exactly is the problem here? With Solaris, you get a choice between the two - arguably better for the user.
In order:
* ipfilter (which does filtering and in/out NAT including packet level load balancing that is just as good as anything F4 is providing).
* the solaris package system sucks, yes - but compared to RedHat, by your own admission, is not worse. Download pkg-get from Blastwave and it does all the dependency instlalation and downloading for you anyways, providing a terribly "apt" like system. Who actually downloads Solaris packages manually anymore? Idiots.. that's who.
* Solaris has come with bash standard, a whole folder of GNU tools (/usr/sfw) and via pkg-get, access to anything and everything that Linux provides in the way of GNU command line tools.
- color ls isn't ls, per se - it's in the environment. I have color ls on my Solaris boxes. It's trivially easy to configure and is unique to Linux that it's set that way standard. Google is your friend.
- Solaris tar sucks for many reasons, the biggest of which is it's long standing problems with long filenames. Linux distributions use gtar, and Solaris comes with gtar out of the box in
Point is - if you just set your environment right (this takes 30 seconds to do when you finish installing your system), most of your arguments disappear and if you get pkg-get the rest of your arguments go with it.
As for ease of use and maintenance, Solaris 10 with pkg-get and Sun's network management tools reign -hugely- supreme over most Linux distributions. I speak purely from the standpoint of some who has to manage dozens of Solaris boxes (and at one point, dozens of Linux boxes) at the same time. The only Linux dist I've used that really holds up from a management point of view is Red Hat Enterprise - which is every bit as good as the stuff Sun is doing these days.
Yes, you have to pay for both (I think Sun is actually a little cheaper, IIRC), but it costs me way less to pay Sun/Red Hat for their network manageement services than it costs me in time and labor - one day of my time can cost more than a whole year of RHN.
As for color ls - haven't been around long, have you? Color ls is a moderate convenience.. but who actually needs it? If you can't be just as efficient without it you probably need to take a UNIX course or something.
bash-3.00$ uname -a
SunOS panda 5.10 Generic sun4u sparc SUNW,Ultra-2
Sun was never and never will be a supporter of Linux.
Anybody who thought the Java Desktop was a "real" Linux distro is nuts. Sun is a proprietary UNIX shop and never will be anything more.
They're doomed. Flee from their products (except Java which is being open-sourced whether they like it or not) like the plague.
"Open" Solaris will never develop the community Linux has, and Linux will match and exceed Solaris' capabilities within five years.
Sun is the "new" SCO. In five years, they'll be suing Linus for "copyright and patent violations".
Richard Steven Hack - This sig is TOO GODDAMN SHORT TO DO ANYTHING USEFUL WITH! MORONS!
Weakness? Solaris is their flagship, and it fits the needs of businesses better than Linux, for the most part. The hard truth for Linux is that Sun has hit a real sweet spot with the history of Solaris plus OpenSolaris under the CDDL. Program managers everywhere will eat up that the CDDL allows them to mix in proprietary code and not have to open source it, even while selling it. Everyone who can't use the GPL for pragmatic reasons has hit heaven with OpenSolaris.
Just wait until all of J2EE is released under the CDDL...imagine extending the core libraries yourself for your business' needs without worrying about the ramifications of the GPL or, worse, whatever web services nonsense is going to go into GPLv3.
Sun knows what they are doing. They now realize that with OpenSolaris they don't have to piggy-back on top of Linux any longer.
God, even device vendors will love OpenSolaris. Binary drivers? No problem! OSS drivers? Fine, too! Oh, and your drivers will work across versions of the Solaris kernel! !!!