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Genetic Research In The Heart of Amish Country
FrenchyinOntario writes "Insular, inbred communities like the Ashkenazi Jews and Indian tribes can be a bonanza of genetic information for researchers, and the Amish & Mennonite communities in the United States are proving to be fertile ground as well for scientists who want to better understand the nature of genetic diseases and how rare illnesses occur more frequently in such closed-off communities. The Amish, famous for their renunciation of a lot of technology, are embracing a lab that has been built in the centre of their community because their faith teaches them to "help their fellow man", recognizing that helping scientists better understand the genetic causes of diabetes, mental retardation, and some of the rarer diseases in their families, helps themselves as well as others. For a better understanding of the Amish and their approach to technology, Wired magazine ran an excellent story a few years back better illustrating why they are not just mindless kneejerk technophobes."
One of the women who works there lives a couple doors down from me in CT. A bunch of years ago some of the Amish came over to her house to do build an addition, and they basically did it barn-raising style. Cool stuff. This has definitely been going on for 10+ years though.
First of all, the root Amish are not part of the United States; they are seperate, having capacity in positive-law jural societies in the original estate; Patroons. When I speak of the original estate, I mean pre-Revolutionary War era. The United States existed before the "Revolutionary War", and not everyone was member after that war concluded. A prominent handful of people returned to their landing at their isolated countrymen. This is not any matter of criticism to the the People of the United States, but to assert that there are conditions on this continent that have existed long before. I am researching various forms of citizenship that predate that of the united States of America and am finding them applicable today in light of the Treaty of Paris. There are Americans, some of them are citizens of the United States, and then there are many Citizens of a local city. I've come across some people that retained their allegiance to the sovereignty of the Queen throughout all this time. The Amish are not a fringe group, but just choosing their participation with loving precision; not to participate in pursuits that give no more security than a peace-loving living will, or to impugn the efforts of others to force their will of relentless searches and seizures for an enemy of the Congress that implies it is everywhere outside of Washington city, District of Columbia.
without prejudice
Not to ruin a perfectly good joke, but for whatever reason, the Amish seem pretty gung-ho for biotechnology and what not (at least in their embrace of GM crops and what not). Another reason may be the fact that the Amish also all descended from a few hundred Swiss Germans (who did and continue to marry within themselves) so they suffer from the founder effect.
According to the wikipedia article on the Amish, there was a 60 Minutes piece some time ago about a clinic the Amish themselves set up in Ohio in order to investigate Amish-only genetic diseases (including one that caused severe mental retardation and various other maladies).
Just a little guy, y'know?
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I know this might be slightly offtopic. But your reference to your grandfather's high regard for education brought this up.
I guess valuing education very highly is a trait shared by the Brahmins of India. I come from a brahmin family and I assure you they're fanitical about education. Nothing's valued higher - not even money (although with globalisation that's changing). You could be rich as hell, but a pauper who's well educated will be respected much more than you.
Over the years, the brahmins have been much maligned by being accused as being the sole perpetrators of the caste system. That wasn't completely true. There were three higher castes and one lower caste. The higher castes were the Brahmins, the Kshatriyas (warriors and administrators) and the Vaishyas (Merchants). The lower caste was that of the Shudras (menial labourers). While all three upper castes enjoyed the privileges of the caste system (which was not all negative - it had plenty of advantages too), it was the brahmins who have borne the brunt of the backlash post independence.
-Shaunak
I've lived in Amish country now for some 17 years. When I was younger, I wondered about their community and what the deal was with their shunning of technology. After talking to a lot of my co-workers about it (many of whom were Old Order), the local bishop showed up on a lunch hour to help 'get me straight'.
According to the bishop, the primary reason for avoiding technology had to do with 'idle hands'. Anything that takes them away from the community or their families is considered 'not good' and there really didn't have to be a specific reason for a bishop to disallow something.
BUT... As much as the Amish outwardly show compliance, the truth is that many of them push the boundries with things like cell phones, solar cell recharging units (some roof-sized panels used to recharge batteries for electicity at night), and even computers. Clearly the letter of the law and the spirit of it are two different things.
In later years I worked for a small computer store in Ephrata. We catered to the Amish and Mennonite communities as they are often VERY wealthy and shrewd business people (uneducated does not mean stupid), and if the technology is considered necessary, they will not hesitate using it. In most instances, we would end up selling a computer to a farmer who used it for their milking machines or keeping track of finances, or in one instance, an egg counting machine that ran Windows NT!
One fine day however, we had a rather nervous looking young man come by on his bike and purchased (in cash) a brand new, top of the line, Acer laptop. Upon leaving he put the laptop in the cardboard box on the back of his bike, covered it up, and rode off.
A few days later a buggy pulls up and its this poor fellow and his bishop. The bishop appologized for his parishner's mistake and asked politely if he could get a refund. All this, and the purchaser never looked up once. Of course we gave him one - our relations with the local community demanded that, but I sure felt sorry for that kid.
"...Well, there's egg and bacon; egg sausage and bacon; egg and spam; egg bacon and spam; egg bacon sausage and spam..."
Seastead this.
Culturally, that part of the country is quite different whether you've grown up in the Amish community or not. My parents both come from the Lancaster/Lebanon county region in Pennsylvania, my mom's parents move to Florida when she was in highschool, leaving her older married siblings in PA. It's interesting to look at the part of the family who spent their whole life in one of those two counties as compared to the ones who moved away. The pace of life moves at a much slower tempo, the idea of buying your meat and produce at the weekly farm market is still alive and well, and in general their outlook on life hearkens back to an earlier time in American society.
However, the Amish aren't so entirely isolated as you may think, you can't really escape the outside world, at least not anymore. They even retire to Florida like every other person in this country over a certain age does, there's a pretty large Amish community in Sarasota, Florida (not all retirees), a lot of the men work in construction jobs, which pay really well if you're a skilled craftsman. Incidentally, two of the people who went on Amish In The City had ties to Sarasota, one girl used to live there, another guy has been living there for a number of years, and given the quotes his friends gave the Sarasota paper, he definitely didn't have trouble adapting to life outside of the community (one friend was quoted as saying her first question to him when he got back was "who did you hook up with?")--that happens to be why I think the show was a joke, they pretended that the Amish on the show had never seen a city or seen the beach, but then they cast people who were living in a city right on the Gulf Coast of Florida, with beaches that people travel all the way from Europe just to visit.
Eagles may soar, but weasles don't get sucked into jet engines...
if people are allowed to leave, are people allowed to join?
a search on google gave me this:
http://www.800padutch.com/atafaq.shtml#join
"Can an outsider join the Amish church/community?"
"A local Amishman recently remarked, "You do not need to move here to adopt a lifestyle of simplicity and discipleship. You can begin wherever you are." Yes, it is possible for outsiders, through conversion and convincement, to join the Amish community, but we must quickly add that it seldom happens. First, the Amish do not evangelize and seek to add outsiders to their church. Second, outsiders would need to live among the Amish and demonstrate a genuine conversion experience and faith that results in a changed lifestyle. Third, it is extremely difficult for anyone who has not been raised without electricity, automobiles, and other modern conveniences to adjust to the austere lifestyle of the Amish. And to truly be a part of the Amish community one would need to learn the Pennsylvania Dutch dialect."
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When I was growing up, one of my relatives was a physician in eastern Ohio, and had some amish patients. He was pediatrician and a strong christian, which was something the amish greatly appreciated. As a result, many members of their community brought their children to see him.
He mentioned in passing to one of them that he was thinking of remodeling his kitchen. The amish man immediately stated "we could do that for you."
I was there when they came to redo the place... it was one of the most amazing things I've ever seen. Two truckloads of people, men and women, and they worked from sunup to sundown, breaking only briefly for lunch. The workmanship was incredible... everything fit perfectly. They also put in all kinds of clever little gadgets; sliding racks for table leaves, concealed hangers for towels, pivoting shelves and rack for dishes and pots... I've been in million-dollar homes that didn't have a kitchen as nice.
Whatever criticism are leveled at the amish, there's definitely nothing wrong their work ethic.
Even if a man chops off your hand with a sword, you still have two nice, sharp bones to stick in his eyes.
The above statement means little. Creationists of belief X usually consider Creationists of belief Y (where Y != X) to be lost sheep, damned, etc.
A Google search for "are mormons christians" leads to some interesting reading. They seem to consider themselves to be Christians but the bigger kids on the block would rather not invite them to play.
Rich And Stupid is not so bad as Working For Rich And Stupid.
Good point, but I believe it's even more broad that that.
Within the Anabaptist groups, both Amish and Mennonite, there are a number a distinct sub groups. While the Mennonites are generally the more liberal of the two, the polar end of Amish can appear like Mennonite to an outsider.
There are even Anabaptist groups that are much more modern than basic Mennonites, but outsiders often assume they are typical Mennonite and don't understand where the lines are. Unless you're part of the community, you'd never really know, anyway.
Research in the "heart of Pennsylvania", that's Lancaster County. Used to be a nice quiet place were Amish and non Amish farmers lived peacefully together. Now it's a tourist trap. They bus people in, there are outlet stores and stores full of plastic crap selling authentic Pennsylvania Dutch drek. Amish are, quietly and systematically, fleeing this area in droves.
Note, many posters assume the Amish is the base orthodoxy, with Mennonite being the relaxed offshoot. Curiously, it's slightly backwards from that. Menno Simons, an extremely early German protestant formed the group later called Mennonites. Jakob Ammann, a Mennonite, later branched off to form the Amish. He didn't think his group was being strict enough.
The ability of people to write about a "community" without looking at women's lives is amazing (Do a count in any issue of National Geographic). Presumably half the Amish are female, but what do we learn of their experience of technology in these stories? Browsing around more widely, it certainly doesn't look like their invisibility is because they enjoy the same type of lives as the men.
It would shed a great deal of light on the Amish if we were told what modern technology is considered acceptable for household chores, and how often men use it!
The article tells of systematic rape and abuse with no punishment, and with generations of incest producing an inbred and backwards society, condoned by the american govt. giving them the legal right to police themselves, dealing out their own justice where they see fit.
After reading the entirety of the article, it would be hard to dismiss this as an isolated case, but if you do and still consider that they represent some noble return-to-basics society and that their rejection of technology is somehow endearing, there are other sources, and a dedicated blog that may help to change your mind.
"Those who do not want to imitate anything, produce nothing." -- Salvador Dali
Maybe I'm just playing devil's advocate now, but to me, that sounds a lot like communism. Not in the sense that the Amish society actually could be compared to communism, that is; but your description is akin to descriptions of communism in that it sounds good on paper, but leads to real problems when actually implemented that are conveniently ignored when a more theoretical description is given.
Take, for example, the young man mentioned in a comment above who bought a laptop, and whose bishop took him and the laptop back to the store a few days later to give it back and ask for a refund. Yes, there certainly is a *reason* for this - the bishop didn't just do it because he didn't like the young man and wanted to make him suffer. But still, that's what happened, essentially; the man *wanted* a laptop, but couldn't get one "legally", and when he simply bought one anyway, he lost it again.
I'm sure he wasn't too happy with that, himself. Of course, I do assume here that as an adult, he is able to determine what he really wants (no matter when it's about a laptop or community life or whatever) - one might argue that he simply didn't know or didn't think about the "greater good" of society as a whole, but I think it's necessary to accept that he was aware of what he was doing and its consequences and still reached a decision.
Where does that all put us? Certainly, society as a whole dictating certain behaviour for individuals is not all that uncommon: it's the basic idea behind democracy, after all, that the majority can make decisions, even when not *every* single individual might like them. But there's more to democracy, too - it's also about personal freedom as well as non-interference. The latter concept in particular seems to be violated here: if I do something that doesn't hurt you, then you shouldn't be able to tell me that I can't do it. I derive the basic right to do it from the fact that I have personal freedom; and from the concept of non-interference, I can conclude that if I don't interfere with *your* personal freedom, then it really is OK.
Of course, that is in stark contrast to Amish society, which - as pointed out in the Wired article, for example - does not value individuality and individuals as much as conformity and society as a whole.
And that's OK, too, to a certain extent - if that's what someone wants, that's certainly fine. But it is important to note that in this sense, the Amish can be compared to any other sect (like the Hare Krishna, for example). And like with any other sect, while you may not find someone who will openly *tell* you that they don't like it, there will be people like that - and the mechanics that keep these people in the cults essentially against their will are well-understood. In the case of the Amish, sending people to the outside world without information on the social structures, without friends and so on just serve to reinforce the belief that the "English" world is not for them - and that's essentially a powerful deterrent to keep people from leaving the community or even speaking up against it. If you honestly believe that it's all you have, then are you going to destroy it? Certainly not.
And that's really the gist of the matter. It's all about *choice*: if someone genuinely chooses to live the Amish way, then that's fine, but people also must be given a fair chance to say that they don't want to do so. And contrary to what is claimed by the Amish (and maybe even believed), they don't do that.
quidquid latine dictum sit altum videtur.
9 years ago I organised Weedstock, a 3 day benefit for NORML, and "Agricultural Educational Event" in Monroe County, Wisconsin. The rural area is heavily amish, tho our host was not.
The County authorities reluctantly acknowledged our 1st Amendment right to hold the event, but sought ways to agressively enforce the marijuana laws with "traffic' stops of those entering and leaving. They sought to use the Amish neighbors' land as staging and surveillance posts, but were refused.
I later heard from our host that he'd met with the 80 odd year old bishop, who, on hearing of our advocacy of reintroducing hemp as a fiber crop, went on a tirade against the Federal Government's ban on this useful plant, which his people had used extensively, especially for handwoven clothing.
Ben Masel: 51,282 votes for US Senate in the Wisconsin Democratic Primary