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Leaked Screenshots Show Netflix Downloads
Mike1024 writes "US DVDs-by-post company Netflix appears to be planning a service that will let users download movies over the internet. Hackingnetflix.com has some accidentally-revealed screenshots, and the Netflix jobs page includes a product manager position, saying "The Electronic Delivery Service (EDS) will augment Netflix's current DVD delivery model with high quality movies delivered to consumers' home TVs through the Internet, on a subscription basis". Apple's iTunes demonstrated many people are willing to live with some DRM and hardware/vendor lock-in."
This really shouldn't come as much of a surprise to anyone, since it was announced last fall that Tivo and Netflix had worked out some sort of agreement for downloadable movies...
I'll turn into a supernova and burn up everything. Well I'll turn into a black little hole and you'll turn into string.
I briefly subscribed to Real's movie download program...it was $14/mo, and it took about 1hr. to d/l a movie (Comcast cable modem). I don't think realtime streaming was an option when I tried it a month ago.
I unsubscribed because they didn't have anything that I wanted to watch...but it was close to acceptable as far as d/l speed goes.
http://economist.com/people/displayStory.cfm?story _id=4149765
Movielink has been doing downloadable Hollywood films for a long time now. Not sure why everyone overlooks them when talking about the iTunes Movie Store and NetFlix, but they've been in this game for a while.
Funny, Netflix seems to doing just fine with the "be happy waiting a few days" business model. Why do you think a few hours is a worse one?
I use Netflix, and the thing is they send you more than one movie at a time (depending on your subscription). I can set up the list of movies I want to watch, and I almost always have one on hand when I want to watch something. The other great thing is no more wandering around a movie store looking for something to catch my eye. Currently I've got over 100 movies in my queue - I'll probably never see them all.
I imagine any kind of download service will be the same way - I can download multiple movies, so I always have something available. After I delete the last movie I watched the next one in my queue will be downloaded. Probably a lot like their current service, just faster.
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For a full dvd disk image, its 4 gigabytes. They'll most likely use compression, but even if they didn't its still doable.
The average download speed I'm seeing on residential cable is now 6megabit. google says:
(4 gigabytes) / (6 (megabit / second)) = 1.51703704 hours
Or, roughly a little longer than it takes to watch it. Buffer for 30 minutes or so and you could stream the rest.
With FIOS and other closer to true broadband internet connections becoming much more common, it makes even more sense(FIOS's common package is 15/2):
(4 gigabytes) / (15 (megabit / second)) = 36.4088889 minutes
Most good codecs can squeeze a movie down to 1.4 gigs or so, so downloading is entirely an option. Streaming VOD as yous uggest would work just as well, but theres no reason you couldnt keep a copy.
Pain lasts, kid. Its how you know you're alive. Sometimes I think this growing up thing is just pain management-TheMaxx
The screen capture also has the name of the new device: Netflix Player.
Mikek / http://www.hackingnetflix.com/
Netflix plans were also discussed in the economists this weeks issue. Here is a link to the an excerpt of the article :
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http://www.economist.com/displaystory.cfm?story_i
I download movies from Starz Ticket on RealOne all the time. They don't have the latest or the greatest, but at any given time there are over 300 movies (plus all the extras you get on DVDs), and that's more than enough to choose from. A typical (500-600MB) movie takes about 25 minutes to download on my 10Mbps OptimumOnline connection. I play them on my PC, turn off the monitor and switch to the TV out display. Plus I can watch a live Stream of Starz (the channel) with more latest movies that aren't available on demand. I pay only $13 bucks a month for that.
So now, if Blockbuster can make it this simple for me without asking me to shell out more bucks for Tivo service, I'd jump ship... otherwise I'm happy with next day home delivery of DVDs with all those deleted scenes.
Mozilla stole tabs from NetCaptor. So what? Right?
I have used both CinemaNow and Movielink, Movielink simply downloads the whole movie, and then allows you to watch it using their software for a period of time, so there are no buffering issues at all. CinemaNow allows for some movies to be downloaded, however most of the movies you get access to with a subscription seem to be stream only. That having been said, I have never had a movie start trying to buffer on me, unless I have tried to move forward or backward to some other point in the movie. Unfortunately, CinemaNow's subscription movies are horrible for the most part. Very few are worth actually taking the time or the bandwidth to watch.
The only way the subscription could ever be worth it is if you are looking forward to digging through their adult content.
As a result I canceled my subscription with them. I wanted it to be a great service, but the DRM (I would prefer a service I could use under Linux or any other OS of my choice) and the lack of any really good movies as part of the subscription service turned me away.
A 700MB Divx/XviD version of a 2 hour movie isn't exactly DVD quality, plus you are likely to lose any type of dolby digital/DTS sound in favor if just a stereo MP3.
Hell, even here in the Detroit area we can only rely on one single video store having a good selection of odd videos, and they are still a good half hour from my house. The other problem is that people have a tendency to steal rare / out of print films making them hard to see.
Even in more metropolitan areas it's often hard to find smaller run films. Most people I know resort to buying everything because there is just no other way to rent them.
(There's nothing like going into Blockbuster, asking for Brazil, and being directed to the travel section.)
True, but it's a REALLY rare DVD that uses even 6GB of that for the main title. Other than the Superbit and other such collections, it's pretty typical for the widescreen movie, 1 AC3 soundtrack and the appropriate subtitles to take up right around 3.5-5Gb with a really large number fitting under the single layer limit or just over.
Of course, why on earth would they use straight MPEG-2 for delivery when all of the other new services (like the new DirecTV setup) are going with MPEG-4, which pulls the number down below 1GB?
The Glass is Too Big: My Take on Things
Yeah, I tried them too. I found waiting for my movie to download from Movielink was more painful/annoying then just driving to the video rental place. The price difference was negligible. The selection is MUCH better at my local Hollywood video (I won't go to the blockbuster...they suck and have a poor selection). The kicker was when I downloaded a movie and then had the DRM tweak out and tell me it was expired before I even got to watch the movie. Oh and don't forget the compression artifacts interfering with the movie picture quality.
:)
In the end movies have gotten expensive enough that I don't rent OR go to the theatre very often anymore. I either buy the DVD if I think it's really good or just don't watch. Most of it's crap these days anyway so my entertainment budget tends to go twards other things now like going to baseball games, or the local highland games this weekend (whohoo haggis!)
I'm the guy who submitted that news to hackingnetflix. I actually just scraped that HTML by copying it from my account page and pasted it into my gmail that I sent to hackingnetflix. It wasn't a screenshot at all. The save button was probably below the stuff I grabbed.
See here for more info. Or read on.
Movies to go Jul 7th 2005 From The Economist print edition
Can Netflix's Reed Hastings succeed in the battle to deliver movies online?
LATER this year, Netflix will launch a new service for downloading movies from the internet. "It will be underwhelming," promises Reed Hastings, chief executive of America's leading online DVD-rental company. Despite a recent ruling by America's Supreme Court that gives entertainment companies more ammunition to fight against illegal file-sharing, movie studios are likely to remain extremely cautious about what films they make available for a fee on the web.
For now, that suits Netflix. Mr Hastings believes that the humble DVD--and, eventually, high-definition versions of it--will remain popular for some time, not least because that is what the movie industry wants: sales of DVDs and fees from rentals are an essential source of the studios' profits from new releases. But Mr Hastings is also betting that by the time movie-download technology becomes more mature and online titles more widely available, his subscriber base for DVD rentals will be big enough to put Netflix in a strong position to prosper in the online marketplace--where he is likely to face new competitors such as Yahoo!, Microsoft, the studios themselves and, no doubt, many start-up firms offering rival download services.
Changes in technology encourage start-ups with innovative ideas to enter markets, just as Netflix did in 1999 when--having been stung with a $40 late-payment from a Blockbuster video-rental store--Mr Hastings launched its subscription service. He was already a successful entrepreneur, having built up a software company before he started Netflix. For its most popular service, Netflix charges users $17.99 a month for an unlimited number of DVD rentals. Titles are ordered via the company's website and dispatched overnight. Customers mail them back in a pre-paid envelope, which releases the next movie on a personalised list of films to see. Subscribers can have up to three DVDs out at any time. Needless to say, there are no late fees.
The Netflix business model has proved to be such a simple and highly effective combination of the online and offline worlds that it has spawned imitators in Britain, France, Germany, Australia and Japan. Netflix, which is based in Los Gatos, California, was about to launch in Britain last year when it decided it had better withdraw from going international, for now, in order to concentrate on a life-threatening war on its home front. The all-conquering retailer, Wal-Mart, and Blockbuster, the world's biggest chain of video-rental shops, both decided to offer online DVD rental at lower prices. Amazon has since started to experiment with a DVD-rental service in Britain--but has not yet launched a similar service in America, and some suspect it may instead team up with an existing competitor.
Certainly, the cost of entering the market has gone up. Netflix has slashed its own prices and launched a one DVD out at a time service for just $9.99 a month. In the past year its share price tumbled as investors saw profits being pumped into an aggressive marketing campaign (costing nearly 20% of its revenues). The company expects to make a net loss of $5m-15m this year. Nevertheless, Mr Hastings says Netflix has $175m in cash and no debt. "We can sustain this for a very long time," he adds. Indeed, Netflix is showing signs that it is getting the upper hand. In May, Wal-Mart pulled out, awarding its online DVD-rental business to Netflix. Yet, tempting as it might be, Mr Hastings declines to trumpet that Netflix beat the world's biggest retailer. Indeed, Wal-Mart's bosses say they merely took a strategic decision to focus on selling DVDs rather than renting them. Netflix and Wal-Mart will now promote each other's products.
Meanwhile, Blockbuster, which lost $1.2 billion last year, hopes
DRM only becomes a problem when it inhibits the actual use of the product. ITunes and the IPod have been wildly successful because the average person is almost totally unaware that there's DRM involved. They download music, it plays on their computer and it plays on their IPod so what do they care.
The most recent effort I saw for this was a service where you could download a movie file for a fee but could only play it within 30 days and once played it would only remain playable for like 24 hours. That's problematic. In this case though, I should think the downloads would be consistent with the NetFlix style of movie watching where you can have so many movies available at a time but for an unlimited time. If that's the case it will be far more viable.
My ideal would be if I could take a netflix downloaded rental and play it on my TiVo. If I have to hook up a computer to my TV, it's a bit more of a hassle. I haven't been a NetFlix member for a while now because I got tired of discs piling up that I never got around to watching, but if I can download a movie in a few hours I may resubscribe.
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As has been pointed out several times on /., BB doesn't censor movies themselves. Rather, when faced with a choice from the movie distribution house between an unrated or more family-friendly version of a film, they'll go for that.
Since few other movie retailers/rental outlets that go for the 'family friendly' versions of films, it often appears as though BB has their own version.
Okay, so I'm a Blockbuster apologist (to a point) because I worked there for a while...
If the movie didn't come out in the last year, they probably don't have it. This is odd, since about ten years ago they used to have just about everything.
Ten years ago, they didn't have to try to stock all thier movies in two different formats. I was assistant manager of a store while they went through this transition, and trust me, hard decisions are made. Generally, the only movies we'd get rid of were either titles that haven't rented a single time in a full year, or additional copies of movies that don't rent often (pruning them down to two usually, which is the max that will fit neatly behind a single coverbox).
I actually saved a few non-renters that I knew were out of print and that I considered to be "must-haves," and convinced her to instead get rid of some occasional renters on VHS that we also stocked in DVD...better to have it only one format that neither.
I could go on, but I might get teary-eyed when I talk about how they used to have a copy of "Evil Dead" during the loooooong period of time it was out of print, but then they got rid of it to make room for more copies of the same 5 New Releases. It's too late... I promised myself I wouldn't cry...
Generally New Releases and "Favorites" (the old movies) don't compete for shelf space, though of course sometimes older movies get bumped when movies come down off the New Release wall. Still, are you sure they got rid of it (did you ask?) More likely, it was either stolen or destroyed by other customers...I could list several OOP titles that suffered one fate or the other in my store while I worked there. Yes, if they sold it off that's pretty bad, but it would take a pretty brain-dead manager to let that one happen.
Granted, I worked at a franchise rather than corporate, and in a small town...it's likely myself and the employees there cared a little more than the average BBV.
Blockbuster is a shitty store, I won't argue too much with that one. But it's pretty difficult to make everybody happy in a video store, which is why they focus on new releases...that's a category that's pretty easy to nail (generally).
On a side note, regarding the Police Academy and Cube examples...with Police Academy I wouldn't be surprised to find out the the original was out of print but the sequel wasn't...that does happen every now and then (Cannonball Run sticks out in my mind as an example, but I could be wrong). Though another problem you run into is that at BBV the store manager often has VERY little to do with what movies get ordered/replaced...they can request, if I remember correctly, but the final say comes from outside the store. And unfortunately district managers don't care if an indidual store carries "Police Academy"...especially in a bigger city, where another location is likely to have it anyway.
This is why I enjoyed a smaller video chain I worked at...their store managers were given an allowance monthly to order movies that they felt their store needed...it could be additional copies of something that was renting strongly locally, or some older movie that had been lost or stolen. Ours generally asked for suggestions from all the employees, and more often than not followed them. Good stuff.
Anyway, to make some sort of point, there is a reason that a large, centralized online rental company can carry a MUCH better selection than a chain that is trying to keep thousands of brick-and-mortar stores stocked.