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Windows Incompatibilities Frustrate D.C. Schools
capouch writes "The Washington Post reports that school administrators for the DC public school system are having an awful time getting their new administrative software to work properly." From the article: "'In my experience, the combination of an Oracle database, Windows operating system, Unix hardware and an Apache webserver is a bad combination,' Barlow wrote in the memo to Thomas M. Brady, the school system's chief business operations officer. 'In fact, through our research the last few days, we have found an advisory on the Apache website that states, 'Please note that at this time, Windows support is entirely experimental and is recommended only for experienced users.' The Apache Group does not guarantee that the software will work as documented or even at all...Barlow said officials plan to replace Windows with a different operating system."
I wonder if they will choose Linux or OS X. These seem the likely replacement choices. With linux they could use existing hardware, but damn are those Xserves sexy.
"'Please note that at this time, Windows support is entirely experimental and is recommended only for experienced users.' "
Ok...how is this a Windows issue?
Apache is not a plug and play webserver like IIS...or even other repackaged versions of Apache (which go out their way not to show they are really Apache).
Apache is not a webserver for anyone but experienced users -- at least on the administration side. Once you have it set up, its dead simple to use.
This is also one of the reasons on a lot of Windows installs, I simply use IIS and install PHP as it does everything I need for those installs. Its not like there is a big need for ModRewrite or other modules most of the time.
(note: on my own personal site, I run nothing but Apache -- I know how to configure it but it was a long and involved process to learn the ins and outs of it -- like the totally f'd up way virtual domains need to be configured -- something even veterans note is just wrong).
Posted anonymously because I know a slam to Apache generally isn't welcomed here!
Well, that's obviously their problem. They've melded their OS and HW together in some freaky Doctor Moreau experiment. Either that, or their IT guys suck. Apache works fine on Windows, if that's what you want to do.
Meria J. Carstarphen, the chief accountability officer, said that D.C. STARS has great potential and that some of the glitches are attributable to long-standing problems with the city's technology infrastructure.
I think that tells you something about the structure of the DC school district. A chief accountability officer? WTF? Is this because the other O-level folks don't have to practice accountability, or is it because they're simply used to having to defend themselves against charges of incompetence?
They've frequently had problems getting the school year to start on time. Back when I lived in DC, it was because of asbestos in the buildings, but there have been other reasons.
The city government as a whole has been a joke for as long as anyone can remember, so it's probably unfair to blame the school district alone. But somehow this late discovery that Apache really doesn't work best with Windows doesn't surprise me, given the source.
Read the EFF's Fair Use FAQ
That's government purchasing for you. Research is not part of the process. In governments that are completely corrupt, purchase decisions are purely political. In more "honest" governments, the purchasing process is a convoluted bidding system which oftentimes results in their paying a high price for something that just barely resembles the original spec. The scenario described in the article sounds quite mild in comparison with similar stories I've heard.
Apache has only limited support for Windows, but still, Apache is a bitch to configure for any platform. And ORACLE? Look, Oracle is a problem in itself. But adding Apache, Windows, UNIX hardware, and then expecting a proprietary software solution (D.C. Stars) to perform is not Windows fault.
Windows is a lot of things. It is slow, it is insecure, but it cannot be blamed for errors in an untested software solution running on a proprietary DB solution with a webserver that does not support the Windows platform.
*nix zealots - thats the truth. I use Ubuntu at home, but i can appreciate a falllacy when I see one.
"Sure there's porn and piracy on the Web but there's probably a downside too."
But why would you go all windows with the OS if you didn't intend on using IIS?
Why does using Windows necessitate IIS? If Windows and Apache is a problem, please don't tell my systems. My Windows/Apache/SOAP CGI/MSSQL have been running flawlessly for years. I'd hate to think they're incompatible.
From my experience, Apache's 'experimental' is like Google's 'beta'.
It is amazing what you can accomplish if you do not care who gets the credit. -- Harry Truman
Ah, but I COULD see Windows Server 2003 being run on an Opteron box, and Sun makes those...
You are obviously unfamiliar with DC in general, much less the public school system in particular.
That level of incompetence is barely par for the course.
Frankly I think the real function of the DC city government is sort of a sink for dangerously incompetent quasi-governmental professionals. They come there for the promise of power, and stay for whatever small fiefdom they can build up, plus the near impossibility of ever being fired.
On the bright side, just think of how much damage they might be doing if they were actually running around in the real world. I'm just glad every day that they all seem to stay there and out of my company. (Not that we don't have any numbskulls, just none quite that egregious.) Think of the federal dollars as being spent on a sort of "intellectual pollution control."
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
That's ok, I work for a company that has dozens of people sharing one act database among 3 locations which I have to hand sync weekly. You'd think when you sync act databases you'd have the same number of contacts in both databases... You'd be wrong of course... The reason most places become pure Microsoft shops is because Microsoft markets to management who then says "I just sat through this greeat presentation and we should use this because everyone else does!" I was told we have to migrate our e-mail system to exchange because that's what everyone else uses. This person who makes far more per year than I do and knows nothing about computers believes that we can somehow work better with out clients if we use exchange because that's what everyone else uses... I kid you not, he said that. I guess my days of virus free e-mail systems are over. 10 years without ever having a virus outbreak. Ironically, not one of our customers that run exchange can say the same thing but hey now we'll fit right in. How ironic... You're a heretic!! I was playing Heretic II on a server earlier. Ya people still play that...
Of course, if someone insists on a Windows enviroment, you probably can use something like Citrix for the exact same thing. Don't know how much Citrix demands of the client computers, though. I think it is like that everywhere. When I was in the army, they had the same thing: A weekend of spending ammo, where we just went up into the mountains to use it all, so the budget would not be cut.
I shall go and tell the indestructible man that someone plans to murder him.
you are wrong, because I have sat in on these descicion boards.
the people that made the decisions do not know SQUAT about what they are buying. Apache and Oracle were picked because someone heard that they were good.
PHB's that know just enough to be dangerous as hell.
that sums up their laundry list of a mess, a moron that heard of a few things, said we need these and now the IT group had to fight with it because management is too stupid or their ego's are too big to ask the EXPERTS they hired in the IT department what is needed.
Exactly why you find server rooms in closets without air conditioning or some idiot buying a large number of consumer grade linksys switches and hubs for the network instead of a couple of real 48 port managed switches.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.