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When Hybrids Do (And Don't) Make Sense
prostoalex writes "Recently NPR, CNN Money and Wall Street Journal Online have all dedicated some time and space to discussing hybrid vehicle pros and cons. It seems that hybrids do not make much financial sense if (a) you're buying after getting yourself into a debt with not really good interest on a car loan, (b) your battery requires replacement after being out of warranty, (c) your daily commute is not too long, so the price markup you pay for a hybrid does not translate into long-term gas savings." From the CNN article: "They may make a social statement you're interested in, but if you want to save money because of rising gas prices, you're heading down the wrong road, at least for now."
Buy a diesel. And if it's hard or impossible in your region, petition your idiot politicians to loosen up the emissions regulations (diesel emissions, even on older diesels, are generally speaking a lot better than gas emissions, yet diesel's more highly regulated).
Better efficiency (often) than hybrids overall, it's good on highways too, and it's far more cost-effective, too.
Fuck it
Not at all. The current generation of hybrids are all running Nickel Metal Hydride "D" batteries, which are pretty safe overall. See Panasonic's disclosure. The worst chemical in them is the Potassium Hydroxide... which you should avoid contact with but which is not generally considered toxic. (Like the lead used in convential starter batteries)
You can simple toss NiMH batteries in the standard municipal waste stream, although recycling them is always a good idea.
The batteries carry an extended warrenty, 7-8 years IIRC. Accelerated testing has shown that they will probably last considerably longer and the price for replacements has already fallen to about $1500.
Buying a hybrid might be hard to justify financially (since the gas savings are unlikely to offset the price premium for a long while) but its still a good thing environmentally.
Honda's hybrids all get better gas mileage on the highway than in the city:
I've been very happy with the Honda Insight that I bought in 2001.
An interesting trend is that fuel economies tend to be set by the price of the fuel. In other words, car manufacturers only put the effort into improving efficiency when they need to, and that's when people won't take any more. US readers might not believe me on this one, but their fuel is cheap, at least when compared to European prices. And thus, lumbering goliaths (aka SUVs) are still a reasonable proposition. It astounds me when I look at the performance/economy figures for American cars. An example is the new Ford Mustang (a tasty looking car, BTW). The 4L model gets around 200bhp, and about 19/28mpg. My Fiat Coupe is comparible, but gets 260bhp from a 2L engine, and more than 50mpg outside town (I don't live in a city). Hybrids are only there to keep the PR good. Whats needed is a fundamental modernisation of US cars.
Give a man a fire, and he's warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)
I've gone through four Canadian winters with my Honda Insight, and it has fared just fine, even with temperatures below -30 degrees Celsius. The fuel economy is noticeably worse in cold weather, but the same is true of any car.
The Honda Insight in brutally cold weather is still better for fuel economy than almost any non-hybrid in ideal driving weather.
I've owned a Prius for over a year now, and I can say that even under the worst circumstances it gets better gas mileage than my last car did under the best circumstances. Gas mileage is a bit lower on the highway than in the city (electric only is only good up to 34mph), but it's not *that* bad. I consistently get 45-50mpg on the highway, and I consistently get 50-55mpg average city/highway. The lowest my weekly average has ever gotten, during the dead of winter, with the heater blasting (which makes it run the engine more - the water pump is electric but the engine has to start whenever the coolant drops below a certain temp), is 45mpg. The only way I can see to get the mileage lower than that would be to drive it like a race car. I guess if you floor it constantly and use the brakes a lot rather than let the regenerative brakes work, you could drop it below 40mpg, but I don't think I could do it without trying.
What I can't figure out is: why not make a straight diesel-electric hybrid? No transmission, just diesel-->generator-->motors + batteries. The diesel wouldn't have to be nearly as powerful as, say, a TDI, because the batteries could handle short peak loads, then recharge during cruising/coasting/braking. The diesel could run continuosly at it's peak efficiency, as long as power was demanded. The cars would cost far less to produce, without the need for a transmission. It seems to me that such a car would be cheaper, faster, more fuel efficient, and more reliable.
If you don't know where you are going, you will wind up somewhere else.
"Unless the heater in the Prius is somehow different from about every other vehicle's on the road, it cannot run on electricity. A car heater is run by blowing air over basically a small radiator (heater core) that the 190F engine coolant cycles through. If the Prius's engine shuts off, the water pump will probably stop and so will the heater. "
Err ... no.. The Prius's Heater is quite different.. (IMHO ... Far
Superior). .
Machine Design 2004 Toyota Prius
"After 1,500 miles of driving in some of the coldest January temperatures on record, I'd summarize the 2004 Toyota Prius as a quiet, roomy car that happens to have a hybrid drivetrain and an excellent heater. Quick heat is no fluke. The Prius stores some coolant in an insulated reservoir when it shuts down. Later, when restarted, the stillhot coolant circulates into the engine primarily to reduce emissions, but an additional benefit is near-instant heat. This is one of several unusual features on this car.";
One point people miss is that the designers of the Prius, at least, were pursuing low emissions with fuel economy being a nice side effect.
When the exhaust system is cold, there's a tradeoff between fuel economy and emission control. The car's software chooses emission control. Drive a Prius for 15 minutes and look at the central display's bar graph of fuel economy over time. It looks like a staicase, where each 5-minute average is much higher than the one before. Until you get the catalytic converter fully warmed up(*) you won't see the advertised mileage. In a five or ten minute commute you can even get a Prius to average less than 40 mpg.
(*) The car's software is so determined to keep the catalytic converter at its most effective temperature that it will start the gas engine even if the car is stopped and the battery is charged, just to keep the catalytic converter warm.
If all your trips are under 10-15 minutes then buy a Prius for the reliability, comfort, or low pollution -- you won't get the gas mileage.
They are the people you see constantly speeding up and down, speeding on the freeway at 80mph+, are hard on the accelerator and hard on the brakes and zipping from stoplight to stoplight.
I've yet to find a car which doesn't meet it's EPA mileage estimates when driven even only somewhat smoothly.
Tips to improve your Gas Mileage really should be tought in basic drivers ed as they would make driving a lot less stressful as well as being more fuel efficient.
It has nothing to do with how hot the brakes get, except that the heat is the direct result of the wasted energy.
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz