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Answers From The Civ IV Team
My only question for Civ4 concerns the AI: Have you made it a crafty enough opponent yet that it can compete at the higher skill levels of the game without resorting to the "cheating" that we've seen in previous incarnations of the game? If so, how?
Soren Johnson:
A great deal of effort has been put into making the Civ IV AI the best yet. For the first time ever, we have received direct input from
the world's best Civ players during the game's development, via a very selective, closed beta that began very early. This feedback
allowed us to iterate on the AI's design much more quickly and effectively than ever before.
Much of the information cheating has been removed from the game (such as knowing where a resource is before it is discovered, sending off galleys with settlers to undiscovered lands, targeting cities with fewer defenders, etc.) Further, the heuristics it uses to make decisions, such as for diplomatic demands and declarations of war, are the same ones available to the player (such as from the power chart on the Demographics screen). However, as with all versions of Civ, the AI has production and research penalties at the lower levels and bonuses at the higher levels. The level of the bonuses are lower than they have ever been before; in fact, the AI never receives any bonuses whatsoever for building wonders - a far cry from the "free AI wonders" in Civ 1. Noble and Prince are the difficulty levels where the AI's rules are closest to the human's.
2. DRM in Civ IV - by Lord Ender
Civ III requires the installation CD be inserted every time you play, even though none of the content on the CD is used by the game
after installation. This annoys your customers by making them juggle CDs, unnecessarily wear out their hardware, and shorten their
battery life. Consequently, many of your customers install "No-CD Cracks" to fix this flaw in your software. How do you feel about the
existence and use of such cracks? Will you include this CD requirement in Civ IV even though it does not prevent copyright infringement
but still inconveniences your customers?
Soren Johnson:
Like our previous games, Civ IV requires the CD to be in the drive on start-up. The funding we get for all of our games, which allows us
to hire developers to work on the AI, graphics, interface, etc., is a direct reflection of how many copies our previous games have sold
in the marketplace. Thus, I hope people will understand that making sure that our games are purchased instead of stolen is very
important to us. Frankly, I do not agree that requiring the CD to be in the drive "does not prevent copyright infringement," even though
I understand that this is almost always true for the technically adept. This is a sensitive issue, but the future of game development
depends on preventing piracy, so I hope people will have patience with the basic safety measures we have used.
3. Politics - by MosesJones
How much will CiV4 use political shifts in countries as a cyclical change in approaches?
Soren Johnson:
Each of the leaders in the game has a certain political leaning that will become clear over the course of the game. Mao may pressure you
to adopt State Property while Roosevelt would encourage Universal Suffrage. Indeed, playing off these various interests is a core part
of the diplomatic game. We do not, however, have political shifts modeled - outside of the anarchy that occurs whenever the player
chooses to change Civics. Perhaps it is an idea to consider for the future.
4. Family Gaming - by carambola5
Growing up, playing games with the family meant getting out classic boardgames like Monopoly, Risk, etc. The Civilization games seem
like a prime candidate for breaking into the family-game-playing field. What, if any, steps has your team taken to bring your game(s) to
the level of "game night with the kids?" What technologies, such as display and control, need to be developed before such an environment
is realized?
Soren Johnson:
Civilization is a great game for families, especially now that true team-based play is possible. One could easily imagine a parent and
child playing together to Take Over the World. However, that situation does require a couple computers...while hot-seat is the option for
families with one computer. I am sure more could be done in this area, but the assumption of a single mouse and keyboard is certainly
the limitation. On a console, "family-night" may be more viable as multiple controllers would be available.
5. Portables - by BMonger
Is there any chance we'll get to see some of the Civ titles moved to portables? I think the game would play wonderfully on the
DS.
Soren Johnson:
We are very intrigued by the idea of Civ on a portable. Certainly, turn-based gaming has proved quite viable on that format - many of us
are big fans of Advance Wars. The fact that Civ can be put down and picked up at any time makes it a good fit. There are, however, no
official plans at this time.
6. The Civ4 AI - by freidog
Is the AI going to be as moddable and customizable as the rest of the game content? I know Mr. Caudill mentioned an 'AI SDK' for
'experienced programmers' over on the IGN Civ 4 preview to tailor the AI to their desires. But it was mentioned as a seperate entity
from the XML unit files and the basic Phython scripts. Basically I was hoping you could go into some more detail on what AI and other
more complex modding might entail.
Soren Johnson:
The AI for Civ IV is written entirely in C++. However, all the AI code (as well as game code) is compiled into a separate DLL which can
be replaced with a modified version. Essentially, the SDK release will be all of the files required to build this DLL. Thus, changing
the AI and "core" game rules (such as terrain, movement, production, etc.) is possible - one could implement a completely different
combat model, for example.
7. Alpha Centauri - by squiggleslash
I'm wondering if plans are afoot to work on Alpha Centauri, and if so, how the original will be improved upon. Some of us see AC as
the best in the whole (greater) Civilization series. Awesome game.
Soren Johnson:
There are no official plans to make a sequel for Alpha Centauri although it's certainly an idea we kick around every now and then. In
many ways, Civ IV is an attempt to incorporate many of the things which were great about SMAC into the core series. Civics obviously
derives directly from Social Engineering. Also, the promotions system can be seen as a more reward-based version of the Unit Workshop.
The increased role of leader personalities is also inspired by the diplomacy from SMAC. Thanks for the feedback...it definitely pushes us
to take a closer look at the idea of making a new version of SMAC. We'll keep you posted.
8. Python+XML vs lua - by SumDog
My questions are:
Why did you choose the language that you did (python + xml files)?
What are the advantages to this approach?
What are the disadvantages you've found using these technologies?
Soren Johnson:
We chose to use python because we wanted a well-supported scripting language that could extend our core code. Indeed, we wrote much more
code in python than we were expecting, including all in-game screens and the main interface. It was a huge win for the project because
writing code in a language with garbage collection simply goes faster than writing code in C++. The fact that users will be able to
easily mod the interface is a nice plus as well. The downside of python was that it significantly increased our build times, mostly from
linking with Boost. XML was chosen because it is a very flexible system for storing data, which is important for a game like
Civilization that is essentially "built" from numbers. Using an off-the-shelf XML editor, anyone from our designers to end users could
modify our game data. We also have a high-level file system which allows you to override any specific art, sound, python, or XML file
simply by setting a specific "mod directory" that contains only the modified files. If a specific file is not found in this directory,
the game just uses the default one.
9. Macro and Micro Management - by kenp2002
How did the Civ team address macro and micro management aspects of the game? RTS games are forced to place heavy consideration into
managing in real time units and control and the scope of an RTS prevents a snowball effect. Turned based games become burdened by
logistical considerations as a result of not having that same focus on micromanagement. Managing 55 workers in Civ3 along with 35 cities
becomes a logistical nightmare when governor AI doesn't learn from your play style. Which Direction is Civ4 taking?
Soren Johnson:
Removing unnecessary micromanagement from the game was a high-level design goal for Civ IV, one which paid off huge dividends in the
final product. We systematically looked at every piece of micromanagement from which Civ 1-3 suffered and figured out ways to remove it
without altering the underlying game dynamic. Pollution was removed in favor of a high-level health system. Beaker and hammer overflow
was introduced to end the incentive for min-maxing your citizens each and every turn. City riots were simply turned into angry citizens
to take away the need to continually check on your cities' happiness in case something went wrong. Workers now have two moves so that a
move and an order can be given on the same turn -reducing the number of times the player deals with an active worker by half. Also, some
high-level controls to allow micromanagement were added. For example, workers can be grouped together and given an infinite number of
sequential orders. Multiple cities can be selected at a time, allowing the player to change all cities on one continent to build tanks
with just two clicks.
10. Do you think 3D graphics will enhance gameplay? - by Anubis333
As a long time Civ player, I would have to say that I really didn't understand why it moved to 3D graphics. Will having the engine be
entirely 3D in Civ IV actually add to the gameplay in any way, other than have objects occlude one another? When I say 'add to the
gameplay' I mean, add to the game experience in a way 2D sprites couldn't. For example: Physics, multipls views, wind, etc.. (I have
only really seen the 3D globe, and like the idea).
Soren Johnson:
Graphics succeed in a Civilization game when they provide a good representation of the world's state. Simply put,
what-you-see-is-what-you-get is a lot easier with 3D than with 2D. Wonders and buildings now appear on the map, so the player doesn't
need to reference an advisor screen to see which city has the Pyramids. Improvements like farms and mines animate differently depending
on whether a city is working them or not. Multiple units can now be used to signify hit-points, instead of the old red/green bars. Now,
most of these ideas could have been executed in 2D, but certainly with more difficulty as everything displayed in 2D requires an
algorithmic system which must be built from scratch. From a pure design perspective, 3D provides an incredible amount of flexibility for
free.
A Mac version? Please? I know women of loose virtues with whom I could aquaint you! And gee whiz, with enough alcohol my virtues are known to flutter around a bit! Let's make a deal!
The AI for Civ IV is written entirely in C++. However, all the AI code (as well as game code) is compiled into a separate DLL which can be replaced with a modified version. Essentially, the SDK release will be all of the files required to build this DLL. Thus, changing the AI and "core" game rules (such as terrain, movement, production, etc.) is possible - one could implement a completely different combat model, for example.
It is surprising that the AI was not written in Python, which is highly integrated with this game. Indeed, Python is just the sort of language for writing such code. However, was it not done this way due to the slower execution speed of Python code, relative to C++?
Cyric Zndovzny at your service.
I'd happily fax over my receipt if Firaxis provided an executable with no-cd check. Make it so that I'd have to have the CD in the drive to patch the file. Then the file is patched and the CD can go back on the shelf.
The Civilization games seem like a prime candidate for breaking into the family-game-playing field.
Isn't Civilization loosely based on a Wargame of a similar name? i.e. Thus the use of a hex grid and all? Maybe I'm wrong on this, but I could have sworn I saw it in a list of board games a few days ago. (I'm currently learning to play Starfire, for those of you who know what that is.)
Ah, here we are. It's under 'C' on this page. The link to the website seems to be defunct (along with the company?), so I really have no way of verifying this. Anyone?
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
My girlfriend bought me a copy for Christmas and, bless her heart, had it sent directly to my house so I could play it now. That's a good woman. Even though I waste inexcusable quantities of time playing Warcraft, he buys me more video games because I like them. Plus she'd prefer me to play Civ over WoW. I can get up and walk away from Civ at any moment. Not so with WoW.
"I have never won a debate with an ignorant person." -Ali ibn Abi Talib
It is an inconvenience unless they find another way to protect their IP. What it sounds like from his response was that the investors who paid money to produce this product wanted this in as a requirement. I don't think they like it either, but if it's a decision between making the game and having some DRM or not making it at all.. i'd choose for making the game.
Hey, in modern English, all pronouns are gender-neutral! I don't want to offend anybody.
"I have never won a debate with an ignorant person." -Ali ibn Abi Talib
Thus, I hope people will understand that making sure that our games are purchased instead of stolen is very important to us. Frankly, I do not agree that requiring the CD to be in the drive "does not prevent copyright infringement," even though I understand that this is almost always true for the technically adept. This is a sensitive issue, but the future of game development depends on preventing piracy, so I hope people will have patience with the basic safety measures we have used.
I wonder how not making the game available in the UK for another week affects piracy. I see that copies are already available on P2P, yet I have to wait till Nov 4th for it to go on sale here. I've pre-ordered it (so I probably will get it even later than that), but at least I'm paying for it; if I hadn't, it'd be mighty tempting to download the cracked version instead. Hell, it's mighty tempting to get the cracked version now anyway, and just read the manual of my 'proper' copy when it turns up, so I don't have to worry about the CD check.
Remember kids, it's all fun and games until someone commits wholesale galactic genocide.
I'd like to hire you. I'm willing to pay you NOTHING, because you tell me that people do much better work when they have no financial incentive to do so. Too bad you posted AC: you're missing out on a lot of great opportunities!
"Ask not what your country can do for you." --John F. Kennedy
Damn right... most ATI video cards DO NOT WORK with Civ 4. However, no one (except the farmed out Tech support in Ireland) is admitting it and they just hang up on you with a short, automated message before saying... It'll be fixed someday. I can't believe they shipped this piece of shit.
If that's true, you'd better come up with some new ideas, because the way you are thinking now guarantees that games development has no future.
Burn a copy of the original CD and just use the burned copy when you're playing the game. That's (still) allowed under fair use.
I suspect, however, that this isn't your REAL gripe with copy protection...
"Ask not what your country can do for you." --John F. Kennedy
I have an issue where I can no longer play Civ III because my game CD cracked in the center and is no longer readable.
There's no real solution to this problem except for me to buy a whole new version of the game which is a total waste.
IF you're going to demand my CD, you should give me an easy/free way to keep on playing if something happens to my original disk.
Allow me to interrupt this Sarcasmathon with some facts. ;-) I work for Aspyr and am the lead programmer on the Mac Civ4 port.
The port isn't being done by the same people who did the PC version - it's being farmed out to a Mac developer and Mac publisher. This is the typical case with most Mac game ports. It also means that we have to wait for legal hurdles to clear, code drops to arrive, and naturally, for the Mac code to start working and stop being buggy. ;-) Now you might think that rewriting a game that depends on several third-party libraries with no Mac version and a dependence on DX9 might be trivial, but alas it is not.
The real refreshing thing about this game, is that it actually includes real documentation. Its amazing how many games, especially console games, have absolutely hideous docs. The late 80's/early 90's PC games usually came with heavy duty docs.
I hate to admit it, but I would probably be willing to accept some kind of DRM that was tied to my hardware in exchange for doing away with CD checks. The main reason is that I'm a laptop user and I quite frankly need the extra slot for a battery. Yes, I can just swap the CD drive in and out, but I generally don't carry it with me and then if I get the urge to play a game, I'm screwed. Well not really but I'm certainly not doing things the "white-hat" way.
I don't see why every media company...traditionally the most anti-computer bunch on the planet...can grudingly let go of their precious content when it's wrapped in DRM protections like Apple's FairPlay and Window's DRM...but computer game companies still dragging their feet. What if the game used FairPlay? You could install it on as many computers as you want and have two registered (I'd like five but I'm sure the bean counters would have a fit) If you wanted to play on a different computer, you would have to unregister one of your existing computers. That way I could install a game like Civ on my computer and my laptop, and those copies would only work on those devices. No crappy CD hassle, but no single authentication that can be passed around the office.
I know I'm advocating the spread of evil, but in this case, it's the lesser. It seems clear that after more than a decade, CD checks are not going way. Regardless of how painfully easy they are to bypass. I'm not even talking "techie" type easy. I'm talkind download CloneCD or install Daemon Tools type easy. I know nine-year-olds that know how to copy a game CD for their friends for crying out loud. That's not even counting the people who actually crack and release No-CD checks (which break needed game updates).
I applaud the Civ team giving an honest answer. They could have totally blown that question off. But I will bet a million imaginary dollars that there's not a single developer at the company that was swapping out CDs every time he compiled or tested the program. It's not about having patience. It's about someone telling that the emperor has no clothes so he can finally get a clue and go cover up his saggy pock-marked ass because we are tired of looking at it.
-JoeShmoe
.
-- I wonder which will go down in history as the bigger failure: the War on Drugs or the War on Filesharing
Here is a quick snap of the documentation included in the special edition.
There is a site that has cracks for all new games. They come out almost immediatly after the game, they are updated with new patches, etc. All you do is download and use them, no technical skill required. Anyone that wishes to copy the game illegally will have no problem doing so.
However for those of us that want to stay legit, it would be nice to have a legit way to do it. I don't like having CDs in my drive because I'm careless. I like to install teh game, put the orignals in their box and put the box where it won't get damaged. A CD on my desk is just asking for trouble.
You know, theres plenty of games being made without profit motives right now. The vast majority of them are horrible.
I don't understand why they don't take the path that Blizzard took with Starcraft. Have a spawn option that allows the use of installation of a multiplayer only version for use in local networks. Then you still need that one original installation with the CD. I think one thing that made Starcraft so popular was that at work you could easily create spawns to play after hours, then buy your own copy to play at home/online.
Bitter and proud of it.
This comment by Soren really caught my eye:
Also, some high-level controls to allow micromanagement were added. For example, workers can be grouped together and given an infinite number of sequential orders.
My computer only has finite memory, so I'm curious how they are able to take an infinite command sequence and compress it to fit? It seems like I could take two arbitrary commands, assign them to represent binary 1 and binary 0, and then encode any arbitrary binary sequence of infinite length within the game.
Where do they store this?
I see how they can trivially consume all available physical memory and disk space on the local host, and assume that once that is exhausted they begin uploading the data to some network storage. But even Google and the NSA combined don't have infinite storage, so then what?
How do they encode data once they have exceeded the total capacity of all mass storage ever produced by humans?
Where does the data go once they have surpassed the storage capacity of the Universe?
This "infinite command sequence" is the most amazing thing I've ever heard come out of Firaxis, I've got to know more!
Soren, please answer!
Great to hear you're working on it, Brad, you've done great work on the previous ports, and you've always been forthcoming with the community, which we appreciate immensely. While my desktop is a PC, my portable is a PowerBook, and I'm looking forward to buying the new versions, especially Civ 3 Complete. I just hope that Civ 4 will be playable on my PowerBook (12" G4 1.33Ghz, 1.25GB RAM), I picked it up yesterday for the PC, and found that huge maps simply aren't going to be an option on my PC, (2.2Ghz Pentium 4, 1GB RAM, and Radeon 9700 Pro). I played a game on a standard map through last night (on Settler difficulty), just to get a feel for the techs and building improvements without having to actually compete much, and I'm already hooked, there's just obviously a lot more going on in Civ 4, both graphically and computationally, and I think that many of us turn-based gaming fans don't have the latest CPU & GPU gear that the hard-core shooter crowd does.
When in danger or in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout. --Robert A. Heinlein
Chris Sawyer? You out there? People like it when they're trusted with changing the numbers to mod the games. Amazingly, an even stronger community develops when you try not to hide the code. More people talk about it, more people purchase your game, and heck, sometimes even the developers are surprised. Unless the ego is too high for that.
I know this sounds rantish, especially since it's his code. But a lot of potential creativity with the game engine from the first RollerCoaster Tycoon was stifled for a long time because they were trying to undo run-time RLEs and other instant-crash modifications. Somehow, I can't imagine that putting them in there benefitted him at all.
-Rob
Biblical fiscal responsibility
3) Voice your complaint so the company gets an idea of what their market base wants. Just not buying doesn't say why you don't buy the product.
4) Buy it, and crack it.
I perfer a combination 3 and 4.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Played for about 4.5 hours last night and it is very nice. Seems to have some rather large changes to the underlying systems and a distinct difference in the pacing but in a kind of nice way. I'm betting I won't really have a feel for the new systems for a few more games. I'll probably have it down better if I take the time to read through the entirety of the 215 page manual, as well.
The tech tree feels much larger and alot more open in your path to discovering specific techs.
There seems to be easily 3 times as many terrain and city improvements to build over Civ III. It also seems that each city will need a different, more focused approach to which terrain/city improvements to build and when to build them than the 3 previous versions. Religion and Civics are very cool additions and really help in defining a personalized national identity for your Civ as well as adding a good deal of flavor to diplomatic relations.
Haven't got into any extensive combat so far, but I did manage to get a few units 4 or 5 promotions. The promotion system seems like it could wind up being a very cool addition to combat.
Graphics are pretty nice, not like HL2 or Doom3 (or even B&W2, for that matter) photorealistic, but definitely a major enhancement to the experience so far. If I had to nitpick, I'd say the city improvements need to be larger in relation to the housing in the cities if they truly want the player to be able to discern all improvements a city has from the world map. Not sure if these will scale in size/distance from housing when the population of the cities gets larger (my biggest city was only up to 15 citizens). I was also a bit bummed that there doesn't appear to be a city or palace view screen as found in the earlier versions. I haven't been able to find how to access them yet anyways...
I'm a die hard civ fiend from the days of the original and all in all I'd say Civ IV stands a very good chance of becoming my favorite of the series once I get a hang of the new rules/tech tree/improvements/etc.
Firaxis has posted a fix over at Apolyton.
Time is what keeps everything from happening all at once.
Have you ever had a job that required some diplomacy? I don't think he's a mental midget. He's giving the answer he needs to give to satisfy the people who need to be satisfied-- the investors, the distributors, basically the "suits".
Read between the lines, he doesn't even acknowledge the no-cd crack issue. I'm sure he personally doesn't care, but can't say as much. I understand, it's Slashdot, let's spout firebrand politics. Unfortunately in the real world it takes capital to release a game. If he said, "Fuck you, we're not protecting this game" he's be out of a job. If the developers said it, they'd lose their backing and distribution.