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MA Governor Wants More New Tech

turnitover writes "Cryptically stating that Asia wants the U.S. to become 'the France of the 21st century,' Massachusetts governor Mitt Romney made a public call for more innovation in technology, reports eWEEK.com. He urged more investment and development and, yes, a move to OpenDocument, as reported previously on Slashdot." From the article: "Underlining the challenge, Romney said leaders of one technology firm in Massachusetts anticipated that 90 percent of its skilled labor would be in Asia in 10 years. He also pointed to statistics that show the United States graduating only 4,400 mathematics and science PhDs each year compared with 24,900 math and science PhDs for greater Asia."

17 of 500 comments (clear)

  1. Quality not quantity by bjorniac · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Yes, the US graduates fewer PhDs in math and physics. I'm trying to be one of them. But the quality of the US PhD programs are what brought me here (I'm not USian). You can graduate a million PhDs from a degree farm somewhere but if they haven't had the same level of education they aren't going to be as influential. I'm not saying that asian universities are bad, just that there needs to be a deeper insight into this than just raw numbers.

    1. Re:Quality not quantity by SatanicPuppy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Yea, we graduate less. "Greater Asia" to me suggests India, China, Korea, and everything in between...Otherwise known as more than a third of the people in the world. Just counting China and India vs the US we get:

      2,500,000,000 / 300,000,000 = 8.3333 repeating

      So, if they have 8 times as many people, they must graduate 8 times as many engineers right?

      24,900 / 4400 = 5.66

      Hmmmmm...It would seem that they only generate 5.6 times as many engineers. Only 67% of the number that we graduate, adjusted for population. Not to say that we shouldn't be doing better...I've no doubt we generate more lawyers than that! But it's just a scare number, not a real metric.

      --
      ad logicam Claiming a proposition is false because it was presented as the conclusion of a fallacious argument.
  2. Bad Comparison by abscondment · · Score: 4, Insightful

    4,400 mathematics and science PhDs each year compared with 24,900 math and science PhDs for greater Asia

    Perhaps you should compare the base population of "greater Asia" to the base population of the US... then the figure would seem incredibly skewed towards the US.

    1. Re:Bad Comparison by Moby+Cock · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Percentages are not really important. In this case the aggregate count is the key. 24,900 engineers can design and manufacture more cool crap than 4,400 engineers can.

    2. Re:Bad Comparison by Scarblac · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Percentages are really important. That the rest of the world combined designs and manufactures more cool crap than you guys do "alone" doesn't really mean anything; if you design and manufacture much more cool crap per person you stay wealthier per person.

      --
      I believe posters are recognized by their sig. So I made one.
    3. Re:Bad Comparison by timeOday · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Yes, but short of cloning the entire population of the United States 10-fold, there's not much chance we'll increase those numbers noticably.
      That's not true. People do what their culture and economic system rewards them to do. In the US, that means becoming a lawyer.

      Maybe our market is right and theirs is wrong, and what a country really needs for long-term prosperity is lots of lawyers and real estate agents. I guess we'll find out.

  3. England of the 21st Century by bombadillo · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "Cryptically stating that Asia wants the U.S. to become 'the France of the 21st century,"

    Wouldn't a better analogy be, "the England of the 21st century". After all we do have troops in the same cities around the world (Baghdad, Kabul) as Britain at the turn of the 20th century. We did take the position of world power from the British. Much of our common law is based from British law. But hey, the sun never sets on the British Empire....

  4. Re:Educational Costs a major issue here by ObsessiveMathsFreak · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Make education possible for everyone at costs comparable to Asia/Europe/etc and you will have more PhDs.

    But will people pay the taxes to do it?

    The reality is that people simply don't want to pay for anything. They expect services from the government yes, but in the end, for a lot of things, they'd rather pay no tax than have some services.

    Even if the US slips behind and loses its position as the worlds biggest economy and/or science nation, Americans will still not reform their education system. This is because in the end, beneath all the rhetoric, all the patriotism, all the pride, all the manifest destinies, there has been only one true constant in America. The Buck.

    And more correctly "My Buck". And no american will fork it over without a danm good reason.

    --
    May the Maths Be with you!
  5. That's Not Cryptic by Doug+Dante · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Cryptically stating that Asia wants the U.S. to become 'the France of the 21st century"

    It's only cryptic if you don't understand that France is a former world power that has been permanently eclipsed economically, technologically, culturally, and militarily, and it has an almost obsessive desire to act as if it is America's nemesis, complaining almost reflexively of most of America's moves on the international stage.

    That's not to say that the French aren't nice people, nor that I wouldn't love to hang out on one of their topless beaches, nor watch Paris's nightly display of lights, but in the realpolitik world, France doesn't matter! Thus their desire for a strong, core European Union, which along with Germany, they hope to dominate, to unite Europe as a strong and meaningful entity on the global stage.

    You will know that the US is screwed when it seeks to create a transnational government with Canada and Mexico.

    --
    The world will not get better through technology. We must seek to be better people.
    1. Re:That's Not Cryptic by Moby+Cock · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Don't look now, but NAFTA was created to help beattle overseas imports from flooding the North American markets.

  6. What did you expect? by willow · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Science, math, and engineering education and professions are disrespected by the educational system (we'd rather fund our sports teams), the government (your scientific results don't support our politics), businesses (your work is critical to us but we can't pay you more than your overseas competition), and media (entertainers are cool, geeks drool).

    I doubt this will change until it's too late.

    --
    Moderation in everything, including moderation.
  7. Let me guess ... by overshoot · · Score: 3, Insightful
    ... this comes from someone who has made a career of technology?

    No? You mean that the Ruling Class isn't flocking to the sciences? How many of Governor Romney's children has he convinced to make a future in science and technology?

    Let me guess: his kids are being groomed for careers in law, finance, and government as befits their station in life and more realistic estimates of long-term prospects.

    I wonder why he's not advocating more of the Great Unwashed go after those jobs in competition with his own ...

    Oh, wait a minute!

    --
    Lacking <sarcasm> tags, /. substitutes moderation as "Troll."
  8. Please ignore Romney... by SuperBanana · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I live in MA, and Romney has been one colossal pain in the ass.

    • Countless "initiatives" and campaign platforms of his have barely seen the light of day. He immediately took a "tough guy" stance with the legislature, assuring he's been a "lame duck governor" since before he was sworn in. He claimed his business experience (he headed Bain Capital, an aquisition firm which oppertunistically bought up companies, "trimmed the fat" by firing huge numbers of employees, etc. He was infamous for his my-way-or-the-highway attitude; very much a stereotypical rich white power broker asshole.) About the only good thing to come of Romney's "tough guy" stance was that Thomas Finneran (former speaker of the house) is gone.
    • He has fought relentlessly against public opinion and the court system to ban gay marriage. Loves to talk about the sanctity of marriage between a man and a woman, but doesn't like to mention in the same discussion that he's a Mormon- a religion which used to promote treating women like cattle and marrying as many as you like.
    • He claims the US Olympics as one of his greatest victories, "turning them around"- except the only reason it worked was because of massive bailouts by the federal government. He doesn't like to talk about the stories of him going into screaming rages at teenage Olympic volunteers- in public.
    • Has spent virtually all of his time in office sucking up to conservative Republicans on a national level, clearly desperate to run for President. He's always taking trips internationally and around the country, pretty clearly trying to make himself a national/international player. Keeps dropping hints about "aspirations" but then denying them categorically. Uses his wife's chronic illnesses as an excuse for why he hasn't decided if he's running or not. More likely, he's trying to decide if the Republican party has even the slimmest chance of putting anybody in office higher than "senator", and if he should settle for that instead of trying to secure a presidential nomination.

    The man is a calculating, cold, arrogant, mean, power-brokering son of a bitch.

  9. Re:Just a few points... by jjares · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I guess the poster point was not that fundamentalist don't exist, but that there is 0 relation between them and the growing of the tech labor force.

  10. forgot to mention... by SuperBanana · · Score: 4, Insightful
    ...that he once rode the MBTA(aka the T subway) for one stop (yep, just one) to show "how safe it is", in a publicity stunt to assure Boston residents that the T was safe after the London bombings.

    Except along the way he was accosted by a bum who asked him if he was running for President or not (I'm dead serious) and was nearly attacked on one of the subway platforms by a woman who was in the news for keeping about a hundred cats in her house (a fair number of them dead, and a bunch of the dead ones in several freezers.) MBTA and State Police took care of both problems.

    Adding insult to injury, a reporter asked him how much the fare was, and he said "a buck". Except the MBTA has been $1.25 for over a year. The MBTA comissioner became enraged when reporters made something of it. "The governor can't be aware of everything". Except it was a MAJOR issue in the eastern end of the state- the rate hike affected commuter rail, bus, and subway customers.

    It pretty much proved that not only did he not give a shit about issues that affected citizens in his state, and that he could barely be bothered to take the subway for one stop- he didn't even pay for the fare himself.

  11. Re:Educational Costs a major issue here by overshoot · · Score: 4, Insightful
    I suspect that one of the main reasons that this data could possibly be true is the substantial cost of Education here in the US.

    I suspect you're wrong.

    Suspect what you like, but take it from a father with three kids in college at once: it's brutal.

    What's more, it's not even tax deductable. By the time you get to the point where you even have enough after-tax income to pay for the schooling, you have enough income to be disqualified for the tax breaks -- the ceiling doesn't go up with number of dependents.

    --
    Lacking <sarcasm> tags, /. substitutes moderation as "Troll."
  12. Re:Just a few points... by Daniel_Staal · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Just because they exist doesn't mean they aren't boogiemen. A boogieman is something you have an irrational, and unnecessary, fear of. I'd say terrorists fit that description for most Americans.

    Sure terrorists do lots different of things, but the chance of them happening to you, or even anyone you know, is fairly remote. You are much more likely, in all probablity, to get into a car accident this year.

    Should terrorists be stopped? Yes. Do they have to be mentioned in every political speach for the next 10 years? No. Did they have any real relevence in this speach? No. They were just being used for the knee-jerk fear the word evokes.

    --
    'Sensible' is a curse word.