Slashdot Mirror


The Industry's Opinion: The 360 Launch

Gamasutra's ever-interesting question of the week queried individuals in the games industry for their opinions on the launch of the Xbox 360. There were opinions from both sides of the issue, with folks in between as well. From the article: "In my opinion, Microsoft did a superb job of establishing Xbox 360 as the premier next-gen gaming platform. However, it suffered a huge setback when it failed to get enough machines to the market for the Christmas holiday. While coordinating a console launch across multiple continents is truly a massive undertaking, a company as massive as Microsoft has no excuse for being so grossly unprepared. -Coray Seifert, Large Animal Games"

36 comments

  1. This of it as this... by Comatosis · · Score: 0

    Microsoft is a dying breed, they tend to mess up more and more, just wait for Vista.

    --
    When expecting to find intelligence in a person, do not look at their age but instead look at their IQ and maturity firs
    1. Re:This of it as this... by heinousjay · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Yeah, they're dying all right. They're barely making more money than most people can comprehend.

      --
      Slashdot - where whining about luck is the new way to make the world you want.
  2. Sold Out = Successful. by MrCopilot · · Score: 1
    Maybe they should have been as prepared as say SEGA with the DreamCast Launch.

    No I think emptying stock from store shelves long before christmas is a good thing. Especially if you can fill them back up before Xmas morn. Even if it was carefully calculated to give the appearance of a shortage it was well played.

    The Only thing I can fault them for is not covering ALL pre-Orders.

    My Local WalMart said they had 20 that lasted the for about an hour that first Night.

    Everybody I've talked to (if they had no power supply issue and most of them) wanted to get off the phone and get back to the console.

    --
    OSGGFG - Open Source Gamers Guide to Free Games
    1. Re:Sold Out = Successful. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ridiclous. The shortage is extremely short term and will be over by early next year. It will have absolutely zero effect on development plans going forward. New console has a small installed base, news at 11!

    2. Re:Sold Out = Successful. by MrCopilot · · Score: 4, Insightful
      If you were a 3rd party looking to develop games for the 360, then a sell out is not what you're looking for. What you want to see is everyone who wants an X-Box gets one as soon as possible, so your game has more people to sell to. A shortage means people who might have bought your game won't, as they have nothing to play it on

      Well I don't know about that, I think if I were a 3rd party developer, I'd rather have people lined up waiting to get thier hands on the platform than see a stack of PSP's at Best Buy. If they are selling out, you know you have at least that many potentially game-starved customers. And if it creates a rush on the consoles by Xmas then you get the rush too. You see.

      Or You could have a pile of your software sitting next to the stack of unsold PSPs.

      Sooner or Later (Read Decemer 21) MS will get XBox 360s to every single person who has the want and cash, don't let there be any doubt about that. Almost every new Console purchase brings at least one game purchase. And thats a much better place to be if you are a 3rd party developer.

      There are advantages to being a MS only title, mainly the boat load of cash, but MS has to want you not the other way around. If you're lucky you trade in your 3rd party uniform for a 1st. Ship 1 or 2 games and quit to start a new 3rd party dev house.

      --
      OSGGFG - Open Source Gamers Guide to Free Games
    3. Re:Sold Out = Successful. by 2nd+Post! · · Score: 1

      Okay, there's a threshold where sold out is successful and where sold out is poor planning.

      Apple sells out of iPods regularly, but has them restocked with the next week's shipment; supply is mostly matched by demand, and that is good.

      Microsoft sells out of XBoxes, but doesn't have any in stock for three weeks, and with no indication of any more coming back in stock until after Christmas? That is stupid.

      So IF Microsoft can get more in stock before Christmas and can consistently keep stock levels up to meet demand, they will have done well. Otherwise Microsoft will be competing with al the game consoles that ARE in stock:
      Redesigned GBA
      New GBA Micro
      Nintendo DS
      Sony PSP
      Sony PS2-slim
      Nintendo Gamecube

      If your 8 year old wants an XBox 360 and they aren't any in stock, and time's running out, won't you instead get them a cheaper PS2 and a Nintendo DS, rather than waiting till, say, February, for their Christmas present?

    4. Re:Sold Out = Successful. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The Xbox 360 has had one of the most supply starved launches ever. I'd rather create a game on a platform that people actually have. For one of the first times in history, the actual launch month of a major console had underwhelming sales compared to the previous year. Isn't this suppose to be a revolutionary next generation console launch? Those game developers that invested so much more into developing these HD games aren't seeing their return on investment that they want. Certainly game publishers aren't liking the situation.

      It is silly to think that just because you bought a new console that you're more willing to buy crappy games. It is also silly to think that by having a limited audience, your sales will be greater than developing for audiences that are 2, 10, or 100 times the Xbox 360 owners. It is like saying, you'll develop for Intel Macs whenever they first come out and exclusively Intel Macs (compared to both PowerPC and Intel Macs). You're missing out on the market.

    5. Re:Sold Out = Successful. by Deliveranc3 · · Score: 1

      Not if you're releasing a must have game... If you have the best game then your game will sell systems...

      You can print an unlimited quantity and you want every person who NEEDS your game to be able to play it, if they have to buy a console to do so so much the better.

  3. Price of being the first. by imstanny · · Score: 2, Insightful
    While coordinating a console launch across multiple continents is truly a massive undertaking, a company as massive as Microsoft has no excuse for being so grossly unprepared.

    ??. Microsoft did get the xbox to market 6 months before PS3 is even slated to appear, and the Revolution to be debuted. This is a company that faces the realities of production vs time, and consequently it is excusable. There's a price to pay for launching the same type of technology 6 months ahead of your competitors; saying it's inexcusable is at best childish and at worst ignorant. Mind you, Microsoft is launching the console Worldwide!

    Even with the shortages, I'm impressed.

    1. Re:Price of being the first. by bleaknik · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      I fail to be impressed. Hardware is a commodity. I don't care what anyone says, the 360 is essentially a very specialized power mac. There's nothing amazing or unparalleled about the production of this console--six months early or not.

      Now I will be impressed with the release of the PS3. Why? Because the cell processor is a completely new technology, and as far as I know, there is no other mass produced computer or appliance that utilizes the tech.

      But even then. Will I be impressed with the system? Probably about as impressed as I am with the Xbox 360--Which equates to about nada. Wake me up when either of these consoles has the killer app; the game to own. (and I'm not talking about Halo 3 or GTA4.)

      But... then again, this generation doesn't look like it'll have any innovative experiences on either of these two systems. Microsoft and Sony are both throwing down more of the same. Yay. Let's hear it for sequels and copy-cats!

      --
      Deja Vu
      n. 1. The sensation that you've read this very article before.
    2. Re:Price of being the first. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Other than the PPC instruction set, the machine is entirely different than a PowerMac. Quit trying to sound smart and totally failing at it.

    3. Re:Price of being the first. by 2nd+Post! · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You know, when Apple released the nano to such popular acclaim that they suffered SHORTAGES, they delayed the worldwide release by a couple months to make sure the customers that were waiting were able to acquire a nano in a timely manner.

      Microsoft had options they didn't take; however I wouldn't be impressed. If they are facing shortages, I really do think Microsoft underpriced their console and essentially cheated themselves out of extra profit. They could have set $399 and $499 price points and still have sold out, and probably $499 and $599 pricepoints and have a comfortable amount on shelves for all buyers.

    4. Re:Price of being the first. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There's a price to pay for launching the same type of technology 6 months ahead of your competitors

      The same type? It's neither as innovative as the Revolution nor as powerful as the PS3, so how exactly is it the same type of technology?

      saying it's inexcusable is at best childish and at worst ignorant. Mind you, Microsoft is launching the console Worldwide!

      Even with the shortages, I'm impressed.


      With the rushed launch, faulty hardware and poor games, saying it's impressive isn't only childish, it's stupid.

    5. Re:Price of being the first. by BloodAngel_Au · · Score: 1

      Microsoft is launching the console Worldwide!

      So they launch in N America, and sell out compleatly, befoer they release it to the rest of the world ? I'd just call it pigheadedness to get out first.

      XB360 will not be for sale in Australia until late Feb/March, and just avalible now in Europe & Japan.

      I wouldn't call that a fast worldwide release. Just plain stupidity & greed to get 360 out for xmas.

      P.S. I'm not buying one until they hack them and get XBMC running H.234 videos running smoothly in at least SD on it.

    6. Re:Price of being the first. by ClamIAm · · Score: 1

      OMG! Slightly better graphics and 1st-gen tech demos! That totally makes MS blameless. Thanks for pointing this out.

    7. Re:Price of being the first. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  4. xbox start is a failure by NoSuchGuy · · Score: 1

    Look at amazon.com:
    Availability: This item is currently not available.
    ("used" xbox 360 are for USD 900!)

    look at amazon.de:
    Gewöhnlich versandfertig bei Amazon in 2 bis 4 Monaten.
    (Ready to ship in 2 to 4 months)
    ("used" xbox 360 are for 600++ Euro)

    Today I heard a conversation like this:

    Father: Do you have any xbox 360?
    Salesperson: No, and we don't expect any large shipments until february or march.
    Son (14years): In spring there will be the the PS3. It's far superior to the xbox. If I have to wait, I take the PS3 in 2006.
    Salesperson: There is no release date for the PS3 in Germany.
    Son: I want the PS3

    MS created a hype around the xbox 360. But in my opinion the hype backfired.
    People wanted to buy the xbox, no xbox available people buy other console.

    --
    Grundgesetz * 23. Mai 1949 - 30. November 2007 - http://www.vorratsdatenspeicherung.de/
    1. Re:xbox start is a failure by Malor · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I haven't been paying attention for a couple of months, but as far as I know, Sony doesn't even have a finalized hardware spec... and they're supposed to launch in 90 days.

      I don't see it. My guess is, a Japan launch for Christmas and a US launch in March of 2007. And the console will not make bread, do the dishes, and fold your laundry. It'll probably be quite good, but this is, after all, Sony. You know, DRM Sony? They're both braindead and known for overpromising and underdelivering(see: PS2 and 'real time Toy Story', hah).

      I'm sure I'll buy one, just like I have all the other consoles. But I very strongly suspect it won't be that much better than the 360, if it's better at all, and I REALLY doubt we're going to see it in the US before 2007.

      I wonder if the Cell processor will go down with Itanium in the 'hideously expensive boondoggles' category. That thing looks monstrously tough to program. They're gonna have to sell an awful lot of difficult-to-develop-for chips to pay for all those billions they spent on design.

    2. Re:xbox start is a failure by TheoB · · Score: 1

      The "Real-Time Toy Story on the PS2" bit is a little myth that no one ever seems to be able to find documented evidence of Sony stating.

      That said: yeah, your PS3 won't be a "wireless hub," almost certainly isn't going to include "2 HDMI outputs" and probably won't have flash memory ports for every one of the five promised formats (Hmm... Sony voluntarily giving up the lucrative memory card market... Can you say "Memory Stick DUO compatible?")

      And if the PSP is any indication, Euro-Timmy's got quite a wait ahead of him.

      Sony's doing a brilliant job of "managed fanboism": as long as they remain mum on new information (like final console specs, worldwide release schedule, and some in-game footage of a launch title), they can continue to compete in people's minds with the "here and now(ish)" 360. But since, in practice, people won't be able to pick up a 360 until Spring 2006 anyway (by which time Sony's going to HAVE to tip their hand), I wonder why they're bothering.

    3. Re:xbox start is a failure by Bongo+Bill · · Score: 1
      People wanted to buy the xbox, no xbox available people buy other console.

      There is no other console. At least, no other console that would serve as an adequate replacement.

      --
      ...but is it art?
    4. Re:xbox start is a failure by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Awww, the liddle xbox fanboy is still trying to spew the same old crap.

      Good liddle fanboy!

      Too bad playable PS3 demos are about to be show in January with the first region getting their PS3s on shelves in March 2006.

    5. Re:xbox start is a failure by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sony has already conceded on the memory card market. Their cameras are starting to support Compact Flash (while keeping their own Memory Stick format).

    6. Re:xbox start is a failure by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dont count your chickens before they are hatched.

      IMO There is no way ps3 is coming out in the USA before Q3 2006 at the earliest. Apparently, according to industry sources the dev boxes are currently very sketchy and in a none finalised state videos of ps3 games so far shown have been running on pcs on emulation software. Cell will also be hard to very difficult to to learn develop for, leading to longer dev times for first gen games. Due to the fact that most developers have little experience coding for dual processor architectures, never mind xbox360s 3 cores and ps3's pseudo 8 cores.

      I think that it would be obvious to most when ps3 finally comes they will be just as short supplied as xbox360. The cell processor is a highly complicated beast and difficulties in manufacturing, along with the difficulties of manufacturing Blue ray disc players will lead to shortfalls of ps3's (most probably).

  5. "Premier" = "only"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Microsoft did a superb job of establishing Xbox 360 as the premier next-gen gaming platform.

    Really? He's saying that it is now clear that neither PS3 nor Revolution will possibly be able to challenge Xbox 360 now?

    Or is he using "premier" in some marketroid sense that doesn't involve requiring something to actually meet or defeat any competition?

  6. Real Fun Next XMas by blueZhift · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I think the real fun begins next Christmas which is the earliest that I think we'll see the PS3 launch in the U.S.. Shortages and hardware issues are typical of major console launches, so on that note there was nothing unusual about the 360 launch. The thing that sets it apart IMHO is launching in three territories in a relatively short period of time. Kudos to Microsoft for pulling that off.

    I think that now Sony has to be careful not to pull a Saturn and push the PS3 out the door before it and key software is ready. Right now, I just don't see how they can get it out along with good games by spring. And missing XMas 2007 in the U.S. would be very bad for them too. Granted, I don't think MS is going to grab the crown from Sony this round, but spotting them not one but two Christmas seasons would not be a good idea.

    And let's not forget Nintendo! Since they have chosen not to go bleeding edge on the hardware, they may be able to launch by XMas 2007 as well. An inexpensive Revolution, Xbox 360 with a year's headstart, and the Playstation 3 likely launch should make next Christmas very interesting.

    1. Re:Real Fun Next XMas by LoverOfJoy · · Score: 1

      2007? Are you sure you don't mean 2006? I can't see either the Rev or PS3 missing 2007 Xmas. That's a given.

    2. Re:Real Fun Next XMas by ivan256 · · Score: 1

      Right now, I just don't see how they can get it out along with good games by spring.

      Most games run on multiple platforms. 80% of the games that come out for Xbox 360 between now and the PS3 launch will be PS3 launch titles. That's how.

      Also, christmas time is hugely overrated for launcing consoles. Why? Because you get a huge rush to buy the next thing whenever you launch, and then another huge rush the first christmas. If you make them both occur at the same time, you're shooting yourself in the foot because you only get hype once. This is especially true if you can't provide enough supply to meet the demand.

      Either way, look at the past dates that Sony and Nintendo have launched, and you should expect that both of them will release well before christmas.

  7. Totally Botched by MBCook · · Score: 1, Interesting
    I see the launch as totally botched.

    First there are no great games? Where is the Halo? Where is the Mario? Where is the must have? It is sports and FPSes, and that's about it. I want to play PGR3, and Kameo looks interesting (although opinions on it vary wildly). But past that is is all sports and FPSes (Call of Duty 2 is nice, but it isn't original, it was on PC first). Even a copy of Burnout Revenge or SSX: Tricky or something like that with updated graphics would be nice (Sorry, not an Amped fan). There is no game worth the $470 it would cost me to play it right now (game + system). When I bought an X-Box (a few months after the launch) there was Halo, Jet Set Radio Future (AMAZING game), and a few others.

    Second is launch problems. Like people in the article said, a world-wide launch is nice, but only if it works. They only had 400k systems for the US and that is a joke. This part was a DISASTER. Why not launch in the US and Japan only (Europe and other countries later)? Why not launch in the US only and then other countries? You don't want to be over stocked, but you don't want this problem of no-one able to buy your system for the next 2 months. Add in the crashing issues (very small, but got tons of press and thus bad) and things are not good.

    Core System is by far the biggest mistake of the launch. "Our console is $300!" is not a good message when the $300 version is crippled. The built-in HDD was easily one of the best things of the original XBox. It could be used for caching and such (helps kill load times). It made saving fast (as opposed to the sometimes glacial pace of memory cards). Dropping it was a HUGE mistake. And in the future you will either put games on the HDD or on many DVDs (see next point). So selling without it is a mistake. I think the whole "Core System" thing was just terribly confusing to the public (when something like 20% of people see "In HD where available" at the bottom of a TV show and think they are watching HD on their old 10 year old TV, you can't expect them to get "Core" vs "Full"). And why does a 20 gig HDD cost $100? That's insane. Make the drive a 3.5" instead of 2.5" and sell us 60 gigs for that $100 and still make a nice profit.

    HD? Buy our system and you can play games in HD. All you need is a $1500 TV. Yeah, RIGHT. Most games that are out now are not that much better looking than a XBox or 'Cube when you are on an SDTV. The storage issues worries me (I think they will need to move to multi-disk games VERY soon because of all the high-rez content. And anyways, can you really tell me that Resident Evil 4 on the 'Cube doesn't look good enough? What about Gran Turismo 4? Every previous console generation has brought massively improved graphics. 2600->NES was a huge jump. NES->SNES was too. SNES->PS bought us into 3D. PS->PS2 brought higher poly counts so people weren't blocks anymore. PS2->360 brings us... slightly less jaggies. This jump is the first time the graphics are not obviously improved by a large amount. Maybe things will look better in later titles (they always do) but it's not there now (maybe on HDTV, but that is not many people).

    I'll probably buy one later, but I don't think they did a very good job with the launch. The massive shortages were easily the biggest problem. Why didn't they wait until December 14th or something like that so they'd have an extra 2 weeks of production to sell? I know they talked about almost holding the launch, and I think they would have been better off if they did (especially in the games arena when they could have had DOA 4 and other big titles).

    Now they did some things right, don't get me wrong. The aesthetics of the unit are better, the controller is better, the XBox Live Arcade is ingenious (I can't wait to play Smash TV and such, but I'm not pay $410 for Smash TV). I wish they would open it up (sell a little dev-kit for $50 or $100 that you do on your PC and upload things to your 360 and you can enter competitions and such. Program it in some managed language l

    --
    Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
  8. Not sold out here by LordVader717 · · Score: 1

    How is the availibility in other areas? Particularly the Core System.

    Where I live (Germany) there doesnt seem to be that much of a shortage.
    I saw a few Core systems today in my local electronics store.

    1. Re:Not sold out here by SpeckledJim · · Score: 1
      Here in the UK there's a real shortage. Premiums are almost non-existent. Cores can be had here and there, but it's a case of a few units going to each store, and they disappear as soon as they are available.

      The situation with cores wouldn't be so bad if the hard drives were available in any decent quantity, but they're pretty rare too.

      It's hard to feel anything other than cynical about the Premium/Core situation. It's quite clear that for the early adopters, the Premium is what they want, I doubt sales of the Core system would even register were it not for the scarcity of the Premium. To me it looks like a revenue milking exercise masquerading as altruism. They make a low cost version available, with the proviso that making it up to the equivalent Premium system would cost you more, then launch with way too many Core systems compared to Premium, forcing the purchase of a lot of overpriced extras. If MS had any intention of supplying what customers wanted, they would have made almost all the initial units Premium systems, and then started selling the Core units later. As I see it, the only people enjoying the current situation are the Ebay jockeys

    2. Re:Not sold out here by triso · · Score: 1
      ...As I see it, the only people enjoying the current situation are the Ebay jockeys.
      Speaking of Ebay, how are the auction/scalping prices for the new Xbox? During the last Xbox release the going price was about 200% of retail for the first week. People stopped bidding in the second week.

  9. Agreed by imstanny · · Score: 1

    Interesting point. I overlooked it, and I agree... they definately did not compensate their pricing based on the basic concept of supply/demand.

  10. M$ wins battle, loses war! by hyperbotfly · · Score: 1

    Well, M$ wanted to create artificial shortage to create big "sell out" buzz and watch their stock tick up a couple of notches. Ok. However, they just alientated a HUGE segment of the market, who now have no choice but to buy thier loved one SOMETHING ELSE for a XMAS gift. NOW, if I were buying something for a gamer (we are assuming the recipient is a non PC gamer, since the first choice was xbox 360) and couldn't get the 360, am I just going to stiff that person out of a gift cause I couldn't be fortunate enough to get my hands on one? NOPE, I'll just buy him the next best thing, which is hmmmm....THE PSP!! WOW!! M$ JUST FORCES ALL A HUGE CHUNK OF THE MARKET INTO BUYING THEIR COMPETITORS PRODUCT!!! GOOD JOB BILLY!!!

    1. Re:M$ wins battle, loses war! by yoyhed · · Score: 1
      Wow. That comment wasn't stereotypically pathetic at ALL.

      Very original with "M$", it's like they're a large corporation whose goal is making money and you figured it out!

      You even used a very clever little acronym for Microsoft that utilizes the similarity between an "S" and a dollar sign!

      Tool.

      --
      WHO NEEDS SHIFT WHEN YOU HAVE CAPSLOCK/ DAMN1
  11. Dumfucks post replies without READING PARENT by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It seems that you have the reading comprehension skills of a todler. You see, the whole point of the post was that M$$$$$$$$$$$$ (gotta give you extra ones since you love em SO much) ACTUALLY MISSED THE OPPORTUNITY TO PROFIT. Their marketing fuckup puts their competitor Sony at an extreme advantage now. Go ahead. Reread the post. I'll sit here and wait 20 minutes for you to slowly re-read it to yourself, verbalizing every little sylable.