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Cameras Online? How The Shysters Work
earlylate writes "How do certain photo and electronics dealers thrive despite widely-circulated warnings by unhappy customers? According to a new investigative website "many apparently separate and competing dealers are actually jointly owned and run" and "go to great lengths to conceal their locations and management." Further, some comparison-shopping sites "are in effect marketing partners with their affiliates," the very dealers they rate. There's a contest based on the suspicious "flood of similar, glowing reviews some dealers receive," as well as links to several sources of information and advice for the careful online shopper."
Once bought a VCR some years ago. I went into one store and asked for a specific model of a VCR. I was quoted a price, then I went to another store. The clerk for the second store, after receiving my request, spoke into a walkie-talkie in his native language and then quoted me the same price. Now, perhaps it was coincidental, but both clerks appeared to be Indian. I didn't buy the VCR from either store.
A NYC lawyer blogs. http://www.chuangblog.com/
only because of the fact that there is a sucker born every minute.
I don't think that the number of scams has really increased or anything...the information deluge from the internet makes it seem like there are more scammers now than before. The fact appears to be that in place of one sucker being swindled, now you have 10 suckers being swindled simultaneously.
A fool and his money...yada yada yada.
The unfortunate side effect is that shoppers will be less likely to go to mom and pop online retailers and will stick to the conglomerates. This makes is clear that it is in the best interest of honest online retailers and all those who sell services to them that they need to make a concerted effort to combat online fraud.
http://stockmarketgarden.com/
Not so funny, I'm sure, if you fall for one of their tricks. Just buy for the good ones, seriously, B&H, Adorama, etc... (although I know tons of people have horror stories about both of those, and any other reputable camera dealer).
I heard the voicemail one of these scumbags left for someone not too long ago. I don't know about others, but I would have had the police online to file charges... These people are scary.
Luckily, they're not the most intelligent people, as the voicemail seems to show. Calling someone a "bitch" repeatedly and threatening to kill them via an easily traced means is just asking for legal trouble. They don't know how to deal with the actual bad publicity they're starting to get. (Ratings sites are not actual bad publicity, since hardly anyone uses them, and there are many different ones).
I have a feeling this sort of scam will disappear in due time. It's getting harder and harder to hide from geeks with net connections and blogs, and bad word of mouth, unlike bad "reviews," is killer for a business. Just think of how many techies you know who refuse to buy a particular brand of hard drive simply for hearing about a friend's bad experience once.
Oh, the rest is a total shameless plug, but we did a bit about this on GeekNights last Thursday.
GeekNights!
Late Night Radio for Geeks!
Digital cameras currently have a very competitive market. Every site has the same models for within a few bucks of each other, pretty close to at-cost, and make it up on supplies (batteries, chargers, SD/XD/sticks/whatever storage medium, docks, printers, straps, cases, and of course the holy grail of ripoffs, the "extended warranty").
When you see a site advertising a given model for $100 to $250 less than everyone else, well, do you really think they plan to take a loss on the camera itself? And even if they did take a small loss (such as at-cost with free shipping), they sure as hell won't sell for less than they can ever dream of making back even if you bought every overpriced accessory they offer.
Just save yourself the trouble and use a reputable dealer like Amazon or NewEgg for any electronics. They usually have close to the lowest price, and factoring in the BS as part of the cost, they almost always win without even a second thought.
I bought a tv from store 114 (DrPlasma, aka eStore of NY) They have multiple aliases. Biggest mistake of my life. They sent me a very expensive plasma tv by mistake and tried to strong arm me into paying for it. They also made an illegal charge to my credit card. Good thing my credit card was pretty full because it limited what they were able to steal when they maxed it out. I dealt with them for nearly 2 months until they finally gave up when they realized I wasn't going to just roll over on this one. Had I researched them out before I would never have bought anything from them. They have conflicting reviews though. Some say A++++++ some say scam artists. I wonder if they write their own reviews.
Two years ago I had to replace the headlight in my sedan. I eventually bought it from an Internet-based vendor but not before I realized that most of the sites I investigated were being run by a much smaller number of actual businesses.
I have no idea how many companies are doing business selling car parts on the Internet but I'm sure that it's a small fraction of the "front-ends" that appear to be doing business.
--Richard
I paid $100 for a headlight for
which the dealer quoted me $240.
Being pro-market, I see the scammers as the worst aspect of any market. In the past, it can be argued that regulations and restrictions through government was needed -- scammers were able to swindle thousands to millions of dollars before people were able to get the word out and warn each other.
As the percentage of technically-savvy individuals grows, information about a dealer or retailer can be distributed in seconds. Thousands of individuals can moderate (or rate) a seller, and sellers can moderate (or rate) buyers instantly. eBay handles these transactions with very little government involvement or force.
Scammers (such as the photo retailers) have been suckering people for DECADES. This is WITH government "protection" that many citizens believe they can rely on, yet we still see thousands of people getting swindled.
As the old generation moves out of the buying phase and the new generation becomes the big power in buying, we will see less swindling and scamming. It is already very hard to scam someone in my age range (low 30s) as most of us check online before buying a large item. Google is adapting much of their search ability to cellphones (WAP, SMS and other means). I already check items out through my wireless PDA phone when I am on the go. I've saved myself a few hundred dollars by not purchasing items with bad reviews. I found these reviews through my phone in mere moments.
The old ways of the retail industry are dying. As a retailer myself (who lost one of our stores because of a scamming employee and manager base), I know that the customer has more power than I do. When all you had was a local shop to buy from, you weren't able to negotiate for better quality, service or pricing. With next day service from thousands of online shops, the retailers are put on notice that they better offer more than just a product, or they'll go out of business.
These photo scams will end without much government involvement. If they broke a contract or agreement, I can understand calling a lawyer. Hopefully in the short run enough people will comment about their bad experiences that the companies will be punished before more people are scammed -- and I see the strength of scammers quickly weakening as information is globally available, instantly.
Anyway, I did get my camera, and you know what? It came with a high speed SD card. I wouldn't be surprised if they all ship like that, and they just do the high pressure sales thing to jack their profit margin up when they can.
When I was shopping for my EOS 20D, I purposely visited a couple of local camera stores before ordering from B&H. I was shocked by the performance of the local stores! One basically refused to show me a 20D, and tried to insist that I'd be happier with a Rebel XT. The people in the other store were quite insulting, and also tried to discourage me from getting a 20D, purely on the basis of my not being a professional photographer -- there was enough of the little sneer in the guy's voice, worthy of a cartoon character. I tried to stick around for a while, but even though there were no other customers, I had an extremely hard time getting anyone to talk to me. These weren't high-school kids in a storefront, mind you.
So I decided I was on a wild goose chase, ordered my camera and other gear from B&H and never looked back. I had about $3000 to spend on camera gear, and all I needed from the local store was basic respect. Anyway, B&H filled my order faster than either of the local stores would have done. And I'm quite happy with the camera, no regrets at all. And I haven't been to any locally owned camera stores since (!!)
-fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
Basically, never buy a digital camera online.
Are you...Are you some kind of genius?
No, ma'am, I'm just a regular Slashdot reader.
Here's a real world example of electronic store employees speaking in code.
The setup up paints it as racism, but its good ol' NY paranoia. Who do we trust? NOBODY.
/and for the record, his prices were insane
In the future, I would want to not be isolated from my friends in the Space Station.
The best way I have found to get a good deal on a digital camera is to go out to a camera shop with a bundle of crisp pound notes. Speak to a sales assistant. Handle a few cameras. Ask if the assistant has tried them {why are they working in a camera shop if they don't love taking photographs?} What do they feel like in your hand? Note the layout of the controls, and check that your fingers are not going to get in the way of the lens -- or any of the other sensors like the auto-focus or the light meter. Does your shutter finger keep finding the on-off switch by mistake? *cough*FujiFilm*cough* How long does it take to store the picture and recharge the flash? Look at some test shots, or even better take some yourself. See if you can get a discount for cash, or something chucked in {another memory card, a multi-slot reader, free prints .....} And if the store staff don't treat you like you pay their wages, then don't pay their wages.
..... NB no penguin-shaggers please, these ones only do 2MPx without the special closed-source Windows driver.
There's still no substitute for real, live shops with real, live people in them. If you don't believe me, I have some very inexpensive 8 megapixel cameras you may want to buy
Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!