Korea Plans to Choose Linux City, University

thefirelane wrote to mention an ambitious plan in the works by the South Korean government. Work is underway to choose a city, which will become a place where open-source software will become the mainstream operating system. From the article: "The selected government and university will be required to install open-source software as a main operating infrastructure, for which the MIC will support with funds and technologies. In the long run, they will have to migrate most of their desktop and notebook computers away from the Windows program of Microsoft, the world's biggest maker of software. 'The test beds will prompt other cities and universities to follow suit through the showcasing of Linux as the major operating system without any technical glitches and security issues,' Lee said. "

Comments

Universities and schools

[pubjames]

Personally I don't understand why universities and schools all over the world aren't switching all their desktops to Linux. How many billions of taxpayers money is being spent on Microsoft software that could be better spent elsewhere?

Re:Universities and schools

[flacco]

Personally I don't understand why universities and schools all over the world aren't switching all their desktops to Linux.

because they get enormous discounts to keep them on windows. at our university, microsoft charges us about 10% of list price. a year or two ago, every employee at our university was given free upgrade to the latest version of windows (i believe that was not only for their university systems but their home systems as well).

microsoft knows that universities with a computer science or engineering school could go linux if they wanted to, so they accept huge cuts to make the cost of software a non-argument.

Re:Universities and schools

[Bert64]

But training is the purpose of a university...
Surely you want people at university to be trained and to learn new skills, it worked fine a few years ago when university systems were all unix or dos based. I know lots of people who read their mail using pine at university, it may not have looked very pretty but it worked very well and was problem free.

Re:Universities and schools

[elrous0]

I don't understand why universities and schools all over the world aren't switching all their desktops to Linux

I used to work IT in research center at a major university here in the U.S. and I can tell you many reasons why *I* stuck with Windows. First and foremost is the practical matter of professors coming to you saying "I need this particular piece of software installed on my computer." Telling them "Sorry, there is no Linux version of that available" simply was NOT an option, and would likely have gotten me pink-slipped pretty damn fast.

Hell, we used to upgrade professors to new computers just to run a *single* piece of software they wanted (often software that wasn't even related to their work). They weren't particularly interested in the why-and-why-nots of why they couldn't get something that they wanted, only that they couldn't get it. Many of the profs I worked with had the emotional mentality of 3-year-olds wanting a piece of candy.

-Eric

Re:Universities and schools

[stunt_penguin]

Because out in the *real* world of work and the office, microsoft unfortunately rules the roost. You can't just create a little linux based utopian world inside schools and release people into the big bad world of M$ software. I can't imagine employers taking somone very seriously if they'd never used Microsoft Office plus outlook, never used windows explorer, set up a windows network, used a windows based printer driver, never used Sage- and those are basic office functions without any specialisation, such as Autocad & Archicad for architecture and manufacturing, plus Photoshop, Dreamweaver, Illustrator, Premiere, Director and Flash for multimedia production....

Linux is ok for openoffice, internet, mail and programming, but if you actually want to *do* something with the computer that isn't programming there's no wealth of professional grade software out there for professionals who are reliant on computer technology.

The only real-world usable alternative to the scourge of M$ might be OSX and its Apple-made successors. It's easy to use, has a large library of *real* software written for it and doesn't cost the earth.

Re:Universities and schools

[level_headed_midwest]

A lot don't spend much money on software licenses. The district I went to school in used (and is *still* using) Windows 98 on its machines. They paid for the license once and are using it until the AMD Duron 700 computers it runs on die. Most of those computers don't have MS Office or anything like that on them. Some have Word 6 on them, but most are just the W98 OS, a Web browser, and some specific apps (a reading-level test, library card-catalog search function, etc.) that the school really uses the computers for in the first place.

My university used W2K Pro until MS announced that it was moving into extended support phase (last year), upon which they moved to XP. I bet they stay with XP until 2011, when XP Pro gets its mainstream support dropped my MSFT. The Windows OSes have not changed that much since about W2K, so lots of businesses have CFOs that don't buy the Fisher-Price GUI as an improvement and thus hang onto older OSes until they no longer get patched.

Re:Universities and schools

[nursegirl]

I think Korea is looking at this as more significant than just a "we can save money on MS licenses" project. From TFA:

``In order to become a genuine software powerhouse, Korea has no choice but to secure source technologies. We cannot achieve the goal under the command of dominant closed-source programs,'' said Ko Hyun-jin, president at the state-backed agency.

They are hoping to get more people using, developing, perhaps even vending OSS programs. Exciting potential partnerships for OSS developers in the rest of the world.

Re:Universities and schools

[1u3hr]

Because out in the *real* world of work and the office, microsoft unfortunately rules the roost. You can't just create a little linux based utopian world inside schools

We're talking about universities, not evening schools. If you need to learn MS software, there are plenty of "For Dummies" books you can read over a weekend -- don't waste your probably one and only shot at higher education learning how to operate a black box that will be obsolete in two years.

Re:Universities and schools

[drinkypoo]

because they get enormous discounts to keep them on windows. at our university, microsoft charges us about 10% of list price. a year or two ago, every employee at our university was given free upgrade to the latest version of windows (i believe that was not only for their university systems but their home systems as well).

If list price is $500, and you get it at 10%, then it's still $50 more than linux.

The only thing keeping Microsoft going is momentum. That's it. They're not the best at anything except leveraging their monopoly through the use of anti-competitive business processes, and escaping being smacked down for it by the U.S. government, probably through some sort of not-explicitly-illegal funds transfer or something.

Schools in particular are not going to linux because educators are fucking lame. I am not making this up. These people can barely handle using Windows. If you change things so that certain items are in different menus, they will never ever find them. The really sad part is that pretty much every college specifies skills with Microsoft Office (For example) in the job description, yet they will hire people without any skills in this area whatsoever. But wait, it gets ten times better. These are schools we're talking about. They tend to have classes in this stuff. Do they require their staff to take the classes, and become educated? Fuck no.

When I've been in IT anywhere, I've always taken any chance to bring linux in as a server platform, pushing out NT at the slightest provocation. When I can, I support open standards, open source, and free software, because I think they're better for everyone (except billy G and the chair throwin' posse) and because I simply despise everything about Microsoft, especially their inability to produce a secure, reliable product.

But anyway, it has nothing to do with cost. If you could just get the users to buy into it you could eliminate the hours and hours of headaches from virii and worms, and you'd start saving money from the moment you converted the first machine (you'd start with whatever machines were stunk up with malware and having issues...)

UNIX used to be the norm

[TheRealDamion]

It's only the past few years that Windows has started to take over UNIX use in universities, certainly from my experience in the UK. Linux was used by many during this when it arrived over a decade ago, along with many who stuck with all the other UNIX flavours, I can't believe people who are new to this (7years experience with Linux) don't spot the same trends. Actions like this are far too little too late, the war was won a long time and ago and what's needed is a cleverly crafted resistance movement not pretending Linux is new and starting to make inroads.

Kudos to South Korea!

[Rob T Firefly]

That's quite a big step, and seeing it actually taken (by politicians of all people!) warms this old jaded heart. Assuming all goes well, this is going to serve as one hell of a shining example for the OSS community.

Now, cue the distro wars...

Is that the way to go about it?

[mytec]

The selected government and university will be required to install open-source software as a main operating infrastructure

Since when is forcing adoption the right thing to do? Is this forced switch really in the best interest of the students? What applications might they have to give up that don't have the equivelent in the open source world.

That is no better than MS forcing their software upon anyone they can. Not because it's necessarily better but because they can.

Right Tool for the Job?

[mosel-saar-ruwer]

The selected government and university will be required to install open-source software as a main operating infrastructure, for which the MIC will support with funds and technologies.

I thought the spirit of FOSS [or at least of /.] was supposed to be: USE THE RIGHT TOOL FOR THE JOB!!!

So what if M$FT Windows and M$FT Office ARE the right tools for the job? [Gasp! Horrors!! Oh the Humanity!!!]

How then would it be helping people to shove the wrong tool down their throats?

Yeah, yeah, bring it on: -1 Troll/Flamebait blah blah blah...

Not the right way...

[winchester]

It should be all about choice, about what tool is the best for the job. Not about mandatory use of certain operating systems for perhaps totally unsuitable tasks.

Doesn't smell like freedom though

[Doodens]

"The selected government and university will be required to install open-source software" I think OSS world should make it's way by it's values, not by force. Rough approach. At least not for universities.

Re:Doesn't smell like freedom though

[nursegirl]

I know it's unfashionable to RTFA, but it says that they will be accepting applications from municipalities and universities that are interested in being the project test sites, and that a lot of people have shown interest. So, yes, if they put in an application to be the test site for open-source software, and are chosen, they will be forced to live up to their commitments. Actually, sounds pretty congruent with OSS values to me.

it is volontary!

[js_sebastian]

institutions volontarily sign up for this program, no one is forcing them (of course they do get a bunch of funding for it)

From TFA (yes, I actually read it!):

``We will start to receive applications next week. After screening candidate cities and universities, the test beds are likely to be decided by late March, MIC director Lee Do-kyu said.

Re:Why universities and schools are not Linux

[cosmotron]

Exactly, at my university, students who are Computer Science majors are taught how to use Linux in the first few weeks of our Introduction to Computer Science I course. It's not like Linux == Rocket Science...

Whoa!

[mkswap-notwar]

The test beds will prompt other cities and universities to follow suit through the showcasing of Linux as the major operating system without any technical glitches and security issues.

Waaiiiit a minute. Be careful S. Korea. While some would say Linux is "better" than Windows, nobody said it was perfect. No techinical glitches and no security issues, IMPOSSIBLE.

That Windows program

[Random BedHead Ed]

they will have to migrate most of their desktop and notebook computers away from the Windows program of Microsoft, the world's biggest maker of software

Calling Windows a "program" is a bit of an understatement. Remind me again how many gigabytes a minimal install of that program requires, and what OS it runs on. :)

Re:In Corea...

[Ekarderif]

That's because everybody is also play Starcraft.

Excellent choice for us all not just south korea

[blackest_k]

when you see uk goverment wants a backdoor into windows ( the US goverment probably has one already)
http://www.theregister.co.uk/1999/09/05/microsoft_ collaborating_with_us_spymasters/
(not an ideal link)
It sure makes sense for korea to prefer to use something which is secure from foreign prying eyes.

South Korea is taking an obvious first step in removing a dependence on Microsofts operating systems. Why should they not want to reduce the flow of money out of their country by developing a free workable alternative. Linux isn't a perfect windows replacement yet however if the south koreans address the issues as it finds them. It seems reasonable they will develop a fully rounded version of linux that can go onto remove microsofts grip on south korea's infrastructure.

The really good news is if it works for them then it could work for the rest of the world too.
If you look at trusted computing microsoft is being trusted and why should anyone expect that between microsoft and the US goverment they can be trusted with the IP of another competing nation.

I am not being anti US here if you gave the keys to the worlds collective IP to any nation its a foregone conclusion that nation will use it to its own advantage.

That's not good enough.

[twitter]

enormous discounts to keep them on windows. at our university, microsoft charges us about 10% of list price. a year or two ago, every employee at our university was given free upgrade to the latest version of windows

As the Softies are quick to point out, purchase costs are small parts of TCO. All the free beer in the world won't make up for time wasted on daily anti-virus runs, difficult place keeping due to short run times and an inadequate GUI. Even with co-operation of other M$ partners, the environment is hardly "abundant" and the complexities of non-free licensing take their toll. Microsoft, as much as they try, can not be all things to all people so everyone has half a dozen "third party" applications that have to be acquired, licensed and installed. Those installs, even when they don't disable other required programs, are notorious for their complexity and fragility. Just when you think you have what you need, the upgrade train or a worm comes along and wipes it all out. All of the above sucks life in a way that free software never will and the difference in costs and hassle will only grow as free software continues to improve. So, free beer is no longer good enough.

The only thing Microsoft has going for it is an aging, irrational fan base. They created that base with gifts and propaganda, but no propaganda will make up for their performance short falls. The free software model has proved itself again and again. The word is getting out.

Re:Performance is Relative.

[daBass]

There is a difference between a glitch and an all out crash! Though I

This also wasn't meant as a competition between Windows and Linux; I prefer OS X on the desktop. All the power of a unix (great for development) with a good looking gui that is more stable than Windows and more managable than all the Linux desktops I tried. ("things just work" isn't just a marketing slogan, I can testify) The only thing affecting my uptime there are updates that require a restart. (one every month, maybe)

But it is a premium over a dirt cheap Dell or home built box running Linux, for sure.