How Palm's Treo Got Boost From BlackBerry Lawsuit

Carl Bialik from WSJ writes "Palm ramped up its marketing campaign for its Treo smartphone while rival Research in Motion was embroiled in a patent fight, the Wall Street Journal reports. 'The result: at least 1,500 new inquiries about the Treo in the past few months from corporate customers, resulting in 600 free trials, Palm says. In total, Palm says it has more than doubled its number of sales leads since October. "The doors have been opening," says Ed Colligan, Palm's chief executive. At a November staff meeting, Mr. Colligan says he told his staff to "step things up. We have to go back and knock on doors and respond as fast as we can." ... Internally, Palm executives say they believe that the Treo will outsell BlackBerrys by the end of this year.'"

Comments

Push email on the Treo?

[chaos-five]

Admittedly I've yet to own one of these --- does push email exist on the Treo? That seems to be the only thing keeping BlackBerry afloat.

Re:Push email on the Treo?

[DJPenguin]

www.chatteremail.com - push email works really well with my home machine running Dovocot IMAP server.

Re:Push email on the Treo?

[Anonymous Coward]

At least one email client, ChatterEmail (http://www.chatteremail.com/ - I am a satisfied user but otherwise have no connection) supports IMAP IDLE, which behaves about the same as blackberry-style push. Basically your Treo connects to the IMAP server and says "IDLE" which means "when anything changes, tell me about it." So new messages arriving triggers a message from the IMAP server to the client. From a user perspective, this is the same as push email -- it makes no difference to me whether the server or client technically initiates the connection. It has the advantage of being standards-based -- you are not tied to any particular server implementation.

There is also GoodLink, which I believe is more blackberry-style push where the network operator is involved -- network notices the device, tells the messaging server it's online, and then the messaging server initiates the connection and sends the data.

Re:Push email on the Treo?

[Lumpy]

no.

the biggest problem is that the treo suffers from bad design. The battery when low will cause buzzing in the phone audio and the damned things lock up and die on a regular basis.

I have yet to have a blackberry lock up to the point of useless like the 4 treo's i have had all have done.

if you like to have a reliable phone. do NOT get a treo.

Re:Push email on the Treo?

[Queer Boy]

I have a Treo 650 and I have no clue what you're talking about. Bad for my battery, I almost always use it until it dies. Lots of people use hacks on Palm devices and then complain when it crashes, most likely that's what you're talking about.

My biggest problem with it is that the speakers aren't loud enough but I use volumecare to get around that. I also like MP3 ringtones and I use Ringo for that. Between the two, I'm sure that's where I get the random crash a week, but it's never been while using the phone.

As a phone, Blackberries are HORRID, the phone function ALWAYS wants to call the last number dialed, it's a stupid "feature" that persists in the newest devices. Plus you have to dial the number and then fiddle with the scroll on the right to activate a call. DUMB. There should be hardware buttons for call and end.

I wonder

[Eightyford]

I wonder how many of those sales are for the Smartphone that runs Windows?

http://reviews.cnet.com/Palm_Treo_700w/4505-6452_7 -31473222.html

that sucks

[BewireNomali]

because i've used both, and the blackberry far eclipses the treo as a mobile email device.

the blackberry is popular because it does mobile email REALLY well. It also excels in one hand operation because of the clickable scroll wheel. It's also intuitive and easy to use - as well as significantly lighter than its bulk would indicate.

the blackberry isn't an browsing device - it's for voice and text - and it's ideally suited for the workplace.

I haven't used the windows mobile treos, but the palm treos are heavy with small keyboards. The units don't multitask well - and they CRASH. I've never hada blackberry crash - treos freeze up all the time.

maybe the windows mobile treos are better - but treos need to go a long way, from form factor onwards, to truly best the blackberry atwhat it does.

Re:that sucks

[HaydnH]

"I haven't used the windows mobile treos, but the palm treos are heavy with small keyboards. The units don't multitask well - and they CRASH. I've never hada blackberry crash - treos freeze up all the time."

FUD!! Treo's crash due to 3rd party applications (at least with up to date firmware and default applications). If you get a crash on a Treo you can dial #*377 (code is dependent on Treo type) and it will tell you what application crashed it - remove the 3rd party app that's crashing your system and your fine again! The main reason why the palm Treo's are so good is that there are loads of 3rd party apps, however a lot have been written by hobbyists or for previous versions of Palm OS - why do people keep blaming Palm for other peoples errors?

If I put a cron job on my Linux box doing an init 0 every 5 minutes does this mean Linux is unstable??

Re:that sucks

[Chris Burke]

Or how we can blame Windows 98 and older versions of Mac OS for crashing just because an application crashed.

I like PalmOS and I like my Treo 180 a lot, but I am starting to get sick of PalmOS' ancient technology. No memory protection? What century is this again?

Re:that sucks

[morgan_greywolf]

It also excels in one hand operation because of the clickable scroll wheel.

For most Slashdotters, this is, of course, the most important feature any Web-enabled mobile device. ;-)

Re:that sucks

[diamondsw]

Amen to that. My Treo has dozens of applications and even a couple of sketchy hacks, and it is still rock solid. It hasn't crashed once since I disabled TreoGuard (a third party app I was using to shut off the phone at night), and that was over 9 months ago.

The Treo is the most versatile device I've ever used, wrapped in a great, simple, and above all usable interface. A great phone, great synchronization with my computer (I use Missing Sync on Mac OS X for sync with Address Book, iCal, iTunes, iPhoto, file sync, etc), it has full internet access, multimedia capability, games, you name it. I now have a single address book that supplies my phone, PDA, e-mail, instant messaging, etc. And did I mention it wraps all of this functionality in a really, really usable easy interface?

Just try to do a *fraction* of this on a BlackBerry. On a BlackBerry you get... e-mail. Yay.

On my Treo now (off topic, but damn, it's a versatile device):

Internet
MicroVNC - not just VNC, but SSH tunnelling, TightVNC and server side scaling support - secure access to my desktop from anywhere
Directory Asistance - Great front-end interface to online yellow pages, white pages, etc
KMaps - Google Maps on my phone - excellent
pssh - SSH from anywhere
Quick News - RSS feeds on the go (you like them on the desktop? They're invaluable on the phone)

Multimedia
TCPMP - The Core Pocket Movie Player - plays anything I throw at it - MPEG-4, DiVX, etc, and plays the full-size versions, too! Incredible performance, and open source.
pTunes - A usable iTunes-ish music player with playlists, skins, and the like
Camera/RescoView/etc - don't forget the camera, video recording, or taking your photos with you

Productivity
DocsToGo - Office documents
PalmPDF - Based on xpdf, and works really well
Pocket Quicken - Manage my finances and enter Quicken data anywhere
SoundRec - Voice Recorder for quick notes

Games (of course)
Bejeweled2 (because my wife is addicted to it)
CliFrotz - Adventure, Zork, etc will never die :)
Frodo - Because running my first computer on my phone is too much fun
ScummVM - Classic games are still great

Re:that sucks

[Dr. Sp0ng]

I had a Treo 650 for about 6 months. It crashed CONSTANTLY, even with ZERO third-party software on it. PalmOS just does not have the memory protection and multitasking needed for modern applications. Now I have a BlackBerry and nothing could convince me to go back to Palm (actually I've been a Palm user since the dawn of time [ok, 1997] and the Treo debacle made me swear off their products forever). I can't use a device that I can't rely on (crashing when trying to answer an incoming call is simply unacceptable).

The Treo is the most versatile device I've ever used, wrapped in a great, simple, and above all usable interface. A great phone, great synchronization with my computer (I use Missing Sync on Mac OS X for sync with Address Book, iCal, iTunes, iPhoto, file sync, etc), it has full internet access, multimedia capability, games, you name it. I now have a single address book that supplies my phone, PDA, e-mail, instant messaging, etc. And did I mention it wraps all of this functionality in a really, really usable easy interface?

Just try to do a *fraction* of this on a BlackBerry. On a BlackBerry you get... e-mail. Yay.

Um... on my BlackBerry I have all that, minus the audio/video stuff. I have an RSS reader, I have Google Maps, I have an SSH client, I can read Office docs and PDFs, and I have a better web browser [Opera] than anything that exists on the Palm platform... and the syncing with Exchange is MILES ahead of what you can do with a Treo (make a change in Outlook, and it's there in my BlackBerry a minute later, and vice versa). All my contacts, calendars, email, notes, everything. It's all synced wirelessly and automatically. I've had this thing for 4-5 months now and it's never even been plugged into a computer (and it hasn't crashed once).

Yes, the Treo is more featureful, and there's far more 3rd party software. But when the basic (and most important) functions are unreliable, all the features and 3rd-party addons in the world don't matter. The BlackBerry is a true geek device - it has a small set of functionality, but it does it perfectly. The Treo tries to be all things to all people and ends up doing nothing well.

That said, I do have one big gripe with the BlackBerry - horrendous (HORRENDOUS!) fonts, and apparently no way to do anything about it. The Treo has horrible fonts out of the box too, but there are addons that add gorgeous, anti-aliased fonts.

I hope it works

[yog]

I am a Palm user from way back and I am dying for a Treo, but I don't want to buy one and then see Palm go under or sell out or otherwise orphan their products. I want to see lots o' new stuff coming out for Palm platform and I don't want to have to get a Windows-based handheld in a year or two. Go Palm!

That said, I wish it were happening because of free and fair competition rather than that some predatory patent holder with a team of clever lawyers screwed a great company through bogus patent suits. I hope Rim bounces back, too.

Maybe.

[LWATCDR]

The reason I didn't get a Treo was the data plan that they wanted to sell me.
I got a Samsung A900. It supports Sprints new Power Vision high speed network. I can surf to any site including slashdot, I can get my email, set appointments on my calendar. It is also super small and has a great screen. The battery only lasts for one day but I can live with that.
The current Treos that support high speed all run Windows. I have heard very mixed reviews on them and Verizon charges a lot more for the data plan for the Treo than other phones.
I will look a the the Treo when they have there new Linux based PalmOS and the Data plan costs the same as my current one. Oh and PUT SOME RAM on the bloody things!

Re:Maybe.

[Jonboy X]

Word on the rumor sites is that the 700p (for PalmOS, as opposed to 700w for Windows) should be out around late May/early June. Roughly the same hardware specs as the 700w, including Sprint's EVDO high-speed network.

You are already screwed

[soft_guy]

The Treo 700 is a Windows CE based device. The 650 will be the last Palm OS based Treo.

I own a Treo 600 and I really like it, but I too do not want a Windows CE based device, so the 600 will probably be my last Treo.

Re:You are already screwed

[HaydnH]

Actually there's a Treo 700P (palm based) which is coming out this year (perhaps may?) check the treocentral forums for more info.

Re:Ease of use or previousbad marketing?

[capecodcarl]

Having said that, perhaps the 700w (and subsequent Windows versions) will help with the learning curve for execs.

The synergy between the Windows OS and the Treo platform certainly creates an exciting new paradigm shift in the handheld market. Executives will see this as a new way to integrate wireless devices into their business processes in a way that will empower their knowledge workers while providing a solid return on investment for the company's strategic initiatives.

/BINGO!

TREO 650

[Reflex4468]

I've got a 650. It was my first Palm device, and I can now not live without it. I am a Professional Sound Tech, and now could not live without having internet and email coming to a device in my pocket. There is not an email push(yet), but it is coming. I automatically download my email every hour, which is fine for me. I currently use my treo for a movie player, mp3 player, cell phone, email reciever, computer remote control, and personal organizer. Go buy one.

Push with Cingular on Treo

[Hegemony]

I actually have used both a Blackberry and a Treo 650 simultaneously for work (BB for email, Treo for phone features). Recently I installed the Cingular "Xpress" software. It can work with corporate email that does use a redirector but is actually pushing the email to my Treo. Sent items are synched, email read on the Treo are marked as read on my desktop, Calendar is synched, I can search corporate contact lists, etc. Not too bad. I haven't picked up my Blackberry in about a month.

Lots of inquiries, not so many buyers.

[Jack Johnson]

I imagine most of the attention came from people like me. Even though my employer would have been "exempt" from a shutdown, I was tasked with investigating alternatives to BB handhelds and BES last fall when the threat against RIM appeared to be real.

The worrying is over now and we're sticking with BB/BES.

Re:Treo 600 a nightmare/Treo 650 perfect for my ne

[Lumpy]

I had 3 600's and 1 650 and all 4 of them had the buzzing in the earpiece and audio to the caller when the bettery would get down to 50% or less. also random lockups that take a reset to get it back are 100% unexcuseable on a phone. I can not have my phone lock up and not recieve calls because the hardware was not proven to be robust enough.

Palm's in general have been great. but they always failed horribly when they tried to marry them to a cellphone. I had the origional Qualcomm Palm unit and it sucked horribly in life and stability. Then I have tried off and on the treo's and all of them had a major flaw that makes them useless. The flip treos would break their hinges within days of getting it, the 600 and 650 have lockup issues and a shielding design flaw that palm refusesto fix (It's even in the 700's! I know of 2 people that have the 700w and they get the buzzing when the battery is lower than 1/3rd.

until they decide to quit making them cheap and put time into making a robust pda/phone that will last more than 12 months they are not practical.

There is a simple explanation

[Anonymous Coward]

There is so much more you can do with a Treo

Oversimplified conclusions

[moochfish]

In the quarter ended in late November, Palm sold 602,000 Treos, nearing the 645,000 new subscriber accounts that RIM signed on in the same period.

Internally, Palm executives say they believe that the Treo will outsell BlackBerrys by the end of this year.

Here's what's happened so far:

1. Company's reliability goes into question
2. Consumers look for alternatives

This is what Palm is hoping is #3:

3. Competitors overtake market

However, this is what is really happening:

3. Company's reliability no longer in question
4. Consumers stop looking for alternatives

Yeah. Maybe they would have outsold Blackberrys had the lawsuit kept on chugging or RIM lost. Unfortunately for Palm, that did not happen. Whatever edge they had during the lawsuit is now gone. How can you predict continued growth when the market changed in the past month with the conclusion of the lawsuit?