Slashdot Mirror


Australian Parliament Approves Email Snooping

brindafella writes "The Sydney Morning Herald newspaper, reporting on a legislative change last week, says 'the [Australian] Government will have 12 months to access communications not only between the B-party and the suspect, but also between the B-party and anyone else. If you have unwittingly communicated with a suspect (and thereby become a B-party), the Government may be able to monitor all your conversations with family members, friends, work colleagues, your lawyer and your doctor.' The Australian Parliament's major parties combined to pass an amendment to the Telecommunications (Interception) Amendment Act 1979."

23 of 226 comments (clear)

  1. I feel safe now by McGiraf · · Score: 3, Funny

    Before I wanted to go to Australia but I was scared, now i can go there feeling safe. I'm realy glad that they passed this law.

  2. It Won't Apply To Me by Elvis77 · · Score: 5, Funny

    I'm a programmer, I don't have any friends...

    --

    The man in black fled across the desert, and the gunslinger followed (SK)
    1. Re:It Won't Apply To Me by ozmanjusri · · Score: 4, Informative
      Anyone want to read the act and give a verdict on that?

      I've been following the progress of this and similar acts and yes, in theory at least, it will give the Australian Government the right to collect information on us Aussie Slashdotters.

      From the Gilbert + Tobin Centre of Public Law:

      Second, in some circumstances, the government can use the information it collects even though that information is irrelevant to the original suspect. For example, if the government uncovers incriminating information from listening to a B-Party's conversations, this can set off a chain reaction allowing the interception of the incriminated person's communications or of anyone with whom they communicate.
      The worst of it though, is the unseemly haste the government has used to rush this through parliament. Interested parties were given only 10 days to prepare submissions on the Bill, and the Senate Committee had only two weeks to review the submissions, hear evidence and prepare a report. They really badly want to read our private correspondence.
      --
      "I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
    2. Re:It Won't Apply To Me by tqft · · Score: 3, Insightful

      "but this just seems like an overly broad license to spy."
      Not that I wouldn't put it past little johnnie and friends to go "overboard".

      But any closed loops may be of interest, don't forget the ip addresses and other data the wrappers are carrying.

      Some said you can't read it all - agreed. But some good data mining software and a Mk1 eyeball, may find patterns - time of day, closed loops, etc that supposedly may be the justification - if any of the people do become persons of interest.

      More likely it all goes into the big archive to be dredged out when thay decide to create a smear file if you rub them the wrong way.

      --
      The Singularity is closer than you think
      Quant
  3. Australian Politics Gone Mad by syousef · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Seriously these politicians have just gone plain loopy and it's all because the labour party has gone into a tailspin.

    State labour in NSW (where Sydney is and the biggest state) has been unable to fix Sydney's transport problem and keeps closing roads around new tollways stuffing up public transport...not to mention they haven't been able to improve a constantly deteriorating health care system. Federal labour can't get enough votes to put up any serious opposition and the opposing party has a majority in both houses. The young labour party has recently been in the papers for calling for conscription - a total about face on their previous postion. Recently the labour party also did an about face on their position regarding forcing ISPs to filter pornography (and are now in favour of this with all of its technical problems). What's more they have personality issues within the party (nothing new in politics but this is when a party has to band together to survive).

    I'm an Australian who feels I have zero representation. Not one politician here is even trying to make this country better...not even for the votes.

    --
    These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
  4. Typical of Australia by caitsith01 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    This is typical of the current government's attitude to privacy and telecommunications. The Telecommunications Act already allows for seizure of computers and other equipment when it is 'connected with' offences under the Spam Act, for example. There is also evidence that the government has been confiscating and destroying personal computers without a warrant when they contain 'sensitive' information.

    All of this is part of a broader lack of accountability, due process and transparency that is becoming part of the culture of Australian lawmaking. There is a good article on the subject here.

    For those from more sensible countries, supposedly democratic Australia currently has the following features:

    1. One party entirely in control of both houses of parliament
    2. No bill of rights, either legislative or constitutional
    3. Legislation allowing for the arrest, detention, and interrogation without charge of persons not suspected of any offence if they may have information that is somehow relevant to a suspected terrorist offence; the onus of proof is reversed so that the person being interrogated must prove that they do NOT have any such information.
    4. One of the highest rates of phone tapping in the world
    5. Unelected bureacrats empowered to spy on Australians with no parliamentary oversight to speak of
    6. Several semi-secret US intelligence bases operating on our soil
    7. New crimes of sedition for exercising free speech in a manner that encourages the overthrow of the government
    8. Troops in Iraq despite over 80% of the population opposing our involvement before the war
    At the moment we also have an extremely disturbing rise in racial and religious intolerance, which in my opinion is in no small part attributable to the federal government's policies and fearmongering on those issues. But of course, this doesn't stop us selling weapons-grade uranium to China because they weeeeally promise to use it for civilian purposes only.

    --
    Read Pynchon.
    1. Re:Typical of Australia by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      In the good ol' U S of A:

      1. One party entirely in control of both houses of parliament
      Check!
      2. No bill of rights, either legislative or constitutional
      Ok, you got us there
      3. Legislation allowing for the arrest, detention, and interrogation without charge of persons not suspected of any offence if they may have information that is somehow relevant to a suspected terrorist offence; the onus of proof is reversed so that the person being interrogated must prove that they do NOT have any such information.
      Pfft, legislation is for dweebs. Just ask Dubya
      4. One of the highest rates of phone tapping in the world
      Hmm, don't know enough to comment, sorry
      5. Unelected bureacrats empowered to spy on Australians with no parliamentary oversight to speak of
      Elected officials empowering agencies to spy on Americans with no oversight to speak of, check!
      6. Several semi-secret US intelligence bases operating on our soil
      Check!
      7. New crimes of sedition for exercising free speech in a manner that encourages the overthrow of the government
      Check! But really, see #3
      8. Troops in Iraq despite over 80% of the population opposing our involvement before the war
      Dunno about 80%, but sure does feel way over 50...

      At the moment we also have an extremely disturbing rise in racial and religious intolerance, which in my opinion is in no small part attributable to the federal government's policies and fearmongering on those issues. But of course, this doesn't stop us selling weapons-grade uranium to China because they weeeeally promise to use it for civilian purposes only.
      Check!

      Sadly, this looks like the state of affairs all around the world :(

  5. Links? by vk2tds · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Not sure if anyone has looked at the links to this article, but the text to the amendment to the act cited at the end of the article was approved in 2004, and is not related at all. In fact the amendment to the act was slightly changed with an 18 month period listed instead of 12 months.

    The admenment act is basically just, as far as I can tell, making some parts of the act plainer, saying that a router which buffers packets in memory is not actually storing those packets just because it needs to store them for a few milliseconds. It also clarifies that VoIP is not stored communications.

    Any citations of the actual amendment?

    Darryl

  6. A few small, tiny questions... by TheNoxx · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Why is the Australian government even doing this? Has there been any major terrorist attack on Australia? Do they really think there will be one in the future? What's the point, other than crushing freedom?

    --
    Ex nihilo nihil fit.
    1. Re:A few small, tiny questions... by lorelorn · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Actually it was claimed the arrests had stopped an attack on Australian soil. The media duly repeated this claim without comment or question, so now it has become somehow relevant.

      The fact is, a group of people from an increasingly vilified minority in Australia were arrested and are being held without formal charges being laid or evidence tendered.

      They are being held under dubious new laws that extend the amount of time someone can be held without formal charges or evidence.

      I expect they will be held for several months and then released without charge, trial, or comment in the media.

  7. Re:Big brother is watching....again..... by CRCulver · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I recall now that Winston Smith's apartment in 1984 was built in such a way that part of his room was outside the glimpse of the telescreen. This allowed him to write his diary, although as anyone who has read the book knows, this small blow for freedom didn't mean much in the end.

    But on the Internet, what spaces do we have that are truly private? What is our best bet for having a small amount of privacy to live as normal human beings? PGP? Or, as the previous Slashdot story tells, Freenet? On a system where all communication between two individual goes over a wire that Big Brother can watch with ease, finding a private nook is hard indeed.

  8. *sigh* by phreakv6 · · Score: 3, Funny

    "the Government may be able to monitor all your conversations with family members, friends, work colleagues, your lawyer and your doctor."

    ..and my SPAM too. good luck with tracing the person selling me viarga for years

    --
    fifteen jugglers, five believers
  9. Re:Use PGP/GPG by CRCulver · · Score: 3, Informative

    In other words, the CIA have been reading all my email for years now

    In the United States, monitoring communications is the mission of the National Security Agency, not the Central Intelligence Agency, which focuses on various other fields of intelligence. For a good introduction to the NSA, what they do and (as best we know) how they do it, try James Bamford's Body of Secrets , written by the foremost public expert on the agency.

  10. Re:Big brother is watching....again..... by Goth+Biker+Babe · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I foresee the rebirth of Fidonet except possibly using Wi-Fi.

  11. Chain letter by kooshvt · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Just start a chain letter to everyone you know and make sure to CC all the politicians so they will also be subject to monitoring. Let them know they have now become a B-party. If every politician becomes a B-party to every citizen they may reconsider their actions.

  12. You WISH there was no rudder by caitsith01 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    But of course there is. No-one is drunk and out of control - they know exactly what they're doing. And that is far, far more disturbing. When you actually look at all this legislation it's very apparent that it is quite tailored to meet its objectives, which generally are not quite the objectives stated to the media and the people.

    I know exactly what you mean about feeling like we're in a downward spiral here though...

    --
    Read Pynchon.
  13. Mohammed Jihad Uranium Sarin Sydney Howard by Simon+Garlick · · Score: 4, Funny

    -----BEGIN PGP MESSAGE-----
    Version: GnuPG v1.4.2.2

    hQEMAyndGpy58lMCAQf/fyLAH++iB8hQSsAEN87ihbS8R6ZSjo nlXxSrGfiB/15J
    RUN3vfTkrDDpZPQtJtXNxAlykvKJRNd+pVz5NeITD5p2janveZ /SyezJA9mvNpsH
    hq2EkpTUZx7kp/bM20j9G3pJC+sh19B4iUbjV0L9s7VJ3NzZBh /k67b2gpGJ5ypf
    DWZMgI+8hNzyi6ldF7Wcv1iAqKH89OTQK1mdnyEsWjM8iu9hdd V4gl5tKWl/iVE8
    Z8rDxQk7N3s9dp17zsT2V9NIw1FfSpEPx4RknDbBtpPcyFNkN4 WqT2TBYEAFGofN
    Pcf2EGA5nDvhKbE1Zt8oIZX/jjz2eOOqAHu7XVgJwNJTAVBE89 7A+8o+Qrj2DST4
    +IuL7ibwweSJpniElDGuhsLX/fTDycXMkYAuhhazsdZcr6/YXr 3aNZTpTRcOnqlQ
    uMlCAwvuuBDf9pLaLIKzZEzNUnU=
    =R5l2
    -----END PGP MESSAGE-----

  14. Welcome to 1984 by Alain+Williams · · Score: 4, Interesting
    Welcome to the totalitarian world.

    The excuse for all of this is "the rise in global terrorism", well if that were really the reason then the terrorists have won, they have fundamentally changed our societies.

    The reasons are deeper than that, terrorism is an excuse that is brought out as a bogey man to try to provide justification for further infringements of civil liberites. The Tony Blair, in the UK, is now pushing an act that will allow any government minister to change almost any bit of legislation without having to bother to pursuade parliament to agree.

    We will suffer for sleep walking to a state where unelected civil servants have the power to snoop on us without any real oversight. This will be abused by these civil servants for their own personal ends.

    You thought that Russia 20 years ago was bad - we will have it far worse.

    1. Re:Welcome to 1984 by pe1chl · · Score: 5, Insightful

      the terrorists have won, they have fundamentally changed our societies

      It has amazed me for a long time that major politicians fail to see this, or at least act as if they do so.
      5 years go, all "free western country" politicians were telling you that freedom was the highest goal in life, that communism was lack of freedom and so it was bad, that totalitarian governments were evil, etc.
      They were also claiming they would never negotiate with - or give in to terrorists because that would mean the end of this sacred freedom.

      And now, they are taking away all freedom at will to "combat" a problem that is mostly caused by their own behaviour. Freedom suddenly is worth nothing, now "security" is the buzzword. All other priorities and values have to give way to this.

      Wouldn't it be better to look at the reasons for terrorism and do something about that, than to always try to "fight a war" against it?
      Terrorism is a byproduct of fighting wars against defenseless minority groups, and so fighting a war against terrorism is completely counter-productive.

    2. Re:Welcome to 1984 by glesga_kiss · · Score: 4, Insightful
      The excuse for all of this is "the rise in global terrorism", well if that were really the reason then the terrorists have won, they have fundamentally changed our societies.

      ARGGHHHH! Stop it, stop it, STOP IT RIGHT THERE!!

      They do not hate our freedom. They don't want us to change our countries. They don't want you to lose unrestricted travel. While they might think your lifestyle is immoral, as long as you are on the other side of the world, they'll happilly let you reserve your place in the Islamic equivalent of hell.

      What they do hate is the policies of our governments. They hate how we have interfered in their own governments for our own ends. They hate how we overthrow their democraticly elected governments with crackpot dictators, and then give those dictatorships/monarchies the arms and financial means to survive. They hate how we used them in Afganistan to fight the soviets, then turned on them when it suited us. Al Qaida used to be our friend; the name itself was given to them by the CIA and they adopted it themselves.

      Every time someone says "the terrorists have already won", the only winner is liars such as Bush and Blair who claim it is a war on freedom. Until people start calling them out publically on these patriotic-manipulation lies, things like Austrailia's email snooping habits will be the tip of the iceberg.

  15. Six degrees of separation... by Malor · · Score: 4, Interesting

    With the six degrees of separation thing, and careful choices of 'suspects', they can probably get a 90% surveillance rate by declaring only a couple of thousand primary targets.

    In other words, as far as I can see, the Australian Parliament has just decreed that the government can read all the email it likes, whenever it likes.

    If I were in charge, and unscrupulous, the first person I'd declare a suspect would be the chief of the opposition party.

  16. I say vote Greens. by babbling · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Considering this new bill, surely even if you're not a Greens supporter, you can at least agree that having a few more Greens politicians in parliament wouldn't be a bad idea, right?

    I don't really see what you mean by "loony", though. Everything they do seems to be in the interests of the people. Yes, maybe their policies wouldn't be "the best thing for the economy", but have you ever considered that always doing what is "best for the economy" involves completely forgetting about social, ethical and moral considerations?

    Forget the economy. There are more important things in life than money.

  17. Redneck agenda.... by MickDownUnder · · Score: 5, Interesting

    This does not surprise me, as an Australian I can say that I've definitely noticed a slide into a very right wing agenda here. The current government is right wing and has an absolute majority in our parliament, meaning they can pretty much pass any law or any bill they want without the chance it might be vetoed by opposition parties.

    I've been out of Australia for quite some time, I've found there to be quite a contrast to the Australia I left more than a year ago. I arrived back here just a couple of days before the Cronulla Race Riots. Since then our leaders have been spouting racist generalisations. There has been a large police crack down, the muslim community have made many claims that they are being unfairly targeted, I can personally verify this as on two occasions I've personally witnessed police unfairly targeting muslim men. I've also noticed since the riots (where our flag was used as a symbol of racial hatred), many police cars have had Australian flags mounted to their cars. I can't help thinking this is a sign of solidarity with the rascist mob.

    I really don't even know how these riots could have occurred without police complicity. We have Racial Villification Laws here in Australia, that if they were applied that day could have been used to arrest most of the mob that day before any violence even began.

    And with all this, in the background we have our detention camps in which whole families including children have been kept in detention. There have been cases where children have basically grown up in detention.

    Unless there's a big turn around here I think the future for Australia could be something straight out of Huxely's Brave New World or 1984.