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Britain's 400 Years of Cyber Law

corbettw writes "There's a news piece in The Register this morning about a British high court ruling about email signatures, and whether they constitute binding contracts. Apparently, the 1677 Statute of Frauds dictates what constitutes a contract, so an email with a disclaimer in the sig could qualify under the language of the statute. Since the statute predates the Constitution of the U.S., a clever lawyer could argue it applies here equally. Maybe there's some truth to the Internet joke 'take off every sig for great justice!'"

39 of 225 comments (clear)

  1. I am not a lawyer... by endrue · · Score: 4, Interesting

    ... so does this mean that laws made in Britain prior to the US Constitution are binding now in the USA? I think I am confused and I have not RTA so maybe someone could enlighten me.

    - Andrew

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    1. Re:I am not a lawyer... by nomadic · · Score: 5, Informative

      There's a school of thought (Justice Scalia seems to be the most prominent member of it) that says American common law includes British common prior to 1792 (I think that's the year). It probably won't matter much here, most contract law is statutory and is done under the Uniform Commercial Code (or whatever variant of it that a state has adopted), which has specific rules regarding what constitutes a contract.

    2. Re:I am not a lawyer... by mooingyak · · Score: 2, Informative

      I'm not a lawyer either, but from what I understand, any rulings made in British courts prior to US independence can be used as legal precedents if they're not directly contradicted by either later rulings in the US or revisions to US laws.

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    3. Re:I am not a lawyer... by leonmergen · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The US inherited the British constitution. The law being talked about was in the British constition before the US inherited that constition, so it's in the US constition too.

      Now, the thing being talked about here is, if a British judge made any conclusions in relation to email about that law in their constitution (which is in the US constition too), does that also mean that the same conclusions could be assumed for the US ?

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    4. Re:I am not a lawyer... by AKAImBatman · · Score: 5, Informative

      One of the key factors in deciding a case is the precedent set by previous court cases. That is, how other judges decided in a particular situation. When a US judge comes across a case that has no precedent in the US system, he'll sometimes look to the British system (the foundation for the American system) for precedent. If the precedent for that system agrees with the US laws, it can have a major impact on the judge's decision.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_precedent

    5. Re:I am not a lawyer... by martalli · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Actually, thw Unitee Kingdom does not have a set, written constitution like the United States, India, France, and so on. According to the wikipedia, the British Constitution is an "unwritten consitution." That certainly is not to claim that constituional law in the UK is pure chaos. To quote the article:

      The lack of a central written constitutional document explaining the fundamental principles of the state and relationship between its institutions and between the people leads some constitutionalists to regard the United Kingdom as having "no (formal) constitution".
      In some countries, courts have borrowed precedents from other nations when there was no controlling precendent in their nation. I believe that the Indian Supreme Court referred to some US Supreme Court decisions early on after India's independence. Such extranational precedents surely are meant only for example's sake, rather than being used as a direct controlling law. Common law has been fleshed out pretty well in the last two hundred years, and I doubt such a slight precedent would hold in America.

      Isn't the Digital Millenium act and such meant to supersede general common law and common sense? I'm sure that its taken care of somewhere in the DCMA

    6. Re:I am not a lawyer... by Alex+P+Keaton+in+da · · Score: 4, Informative

      It is a touch more complicated than that (which is maybe why law school is 3 years...) Anyway, here is an interesting article about the UCC that includes references to British Common Law. http://library.findlaw.com/1999/Sep/1/131122.html
      I got a J.D. but never bothered to take the bar. But any intro class will explain how American and British Common law are related. It isn't worth discussing here because it will degenerate into a flame war about the war for independence...

      --
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    7. Re:I am not a lawyer... by TubeSteak · · Score: 5, Informative

      I'm pretty sure it's not just a "school of thought"

      Go read the WikiPedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_the_United_Sta tes#American_common_law

      Essentially, every country that had been colonized at some point by Britain uses British common law. In the case of the U.S., those precedents are overridden by any subsequently passed laws, but other than that BCL still stands.

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    8. Re:I am not a lawyer... by Alomex · · Score: 4, Insightful

      That is exactly what the constitution authors wanted. The consitution was written in English, using the English legal tradition and standard English meanings. When they wrote the word "judge" the meant a judge as understood in the british system. When they wrote the word trial, they meant a trial as understood in the british system.

      In other words, every unstated assumption is to be resolved using the customs, practices and semantics of the day, which were, lo-and-behold the British customs. Particularly those rights that are not explicitly stated, but not to be construed as non-existent, as per the first amendment.

    9. Re:I am not a lawyer... by Liam+Slider · · Score: 2, Informative
      I'm pretty sure that's exactly what what the Constitution's authors would have wanted. Right. Talk about bench legislation, that's absolutely ridiculous.

      Actually the Founding Fathers considered completely scrapping the British legal system and starting over from scratch....and decided that this was going a bit too far and would take way too much work, that the existing common law legal system that the States had been using worked not just fine but very well, and so incorporated the British common law system into the new government. Why replace a working legal system with an unknown?

      And so we kept the British legal traditions in this country, except in Louisiana, where they use French legal traditions at the State level.

    10. Re:I am not a lawyer... by budgenator · · Score: 2, Interesting

      If memory serves me correctly, Michigan's constitution specificaly recognises British Common Law in the order of presidence, so if there is nothing in the state's law's and contitution, the federal laws and constituion, Magna Carta, etc., British Common law applies.

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    11. Re:I am not a lawyer... by Alomex · · Score: 2, Informative

      Put it this way - show me the last time someone successfully used a British statute from the 17th century as valid case law in America.

      Easy, and very relevant to our subject: every contract signed before the declaration of independence was still considered valid the day after. How was that contract interpreted? under the British statute even after independence and the writing of the constitution.

      Hence the legal principle is there: in principle an old British statute can still have legal weight today.

      Of course, in practice the answer is: very unlikely, as almost any valid law has been rewritten many times over by congress since independence.

    12. Re:I am not a lawyer... by dajak · · Score: 2, Informative

      And so we kept the British legal traditions in this country, except in Louisiana, where they use French legal traditions at the State level.

      New York, the most important economic area of the young republic, based its legal traditions on the Roman-Dutch law of the Dutch republic. The influence of the Republic of the United Netherlands on American institutions is quite obvious, if only because of the federal structure and explicit self-delegation of legislative power in an explicit constitution. The very notion of having an explicit constitution is antithesis of British legal traditions. Even the Declaration of Independence is modeled on the Dutch Act of Abjuration of 1581 (together with the Union of Utrecht considered the constitution of the Dutch Republic), which was standard fare for legal practitioners in the US in those days.

      Only in the course of the 19th century British common law became the dominant jurisprudence, arguably for the sake of consistency in dealing with things like property, and - more importantly - because the US gradually became a monolingual country and using foreign language jurisprudence is inefficient.

  2. Confusion again by slavemowgli · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Editors, RTFA. This is not about email signatures in the sense of the things people like to put after the "-- " at the end of their emails to add a personal touch; it's about regular signatures (signing your name), and it's about the fact that the LACK of a name or signature in an email means that an email CANNOT be a valid "written offer".

    The only thing this means is that if you include your name in your signature (the email signature again, i.e., the part after the "-- "), whatever you wrote in your email can be treated the same way as something you wrote in a regular letter that you signed with your name.

    But that's neither surprising nor worrying - quite the opposite. The implicit statement in the story summary that the disclaimers some companies like to put into emails could somehow constitute a valid contract is a big, fat piece of Slash-FUD.

    Speaking of which, I propose the term "Slash-FUD" for intentional FUD in and intentionally misleading summaries and headlines of Slashdot stories - the problem seems to have grown so large in recent years that I think it deserves a special name. Death to Slash-FUD! Let that be our battle cry.

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    1. Re:Confusion again by Bogtha · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Exactly. It seems Zonk either didn't actually read the article before approving it, or read it but didn't understand one word of it.

      Pretend for a second that this comment was an email, that I was making an offer of some sort, and Bogtha was my real name. The fact that 'by Bogtha' above my comment does not mean that I've "signed" the "contract". The fact that 'Bogtha' appears at the bottom, as part of the comment and not part of the meta-data, means that I've "signed" the "contract".

      In essence, a British law defines the rules by which you can consider a document to be signed. A judge looked at a case involving an email, and decided that according to that law, a From header doesn't count, but a name at the bottom does.

      It's really not that interesting and bears little resemblance to what is described in the summary. You can read the original law here.

      --
      Bogtha Bogtha Bogtha
  3. Ahem. by Noryungi · · Score: 4, Interesting

    On the other hand, I think email is not admissible as 'proof' in a court of law, since it is too easy to forge and email and/or muck up the sender information. So, even if an email includes a clever sig and/or statement to the effect that it is a binding contract between the sender and the recipient, it is highly possible it would be thrown out of court, as it does not constitute admissible evidence.

    At least, I am almost certain that's the case in my area... Napoleonic code and all that. YMMV, IANAL, etc...

    --
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  4. Statue of Frauds definately applies in the US by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    The statute of Frauds applies in the US for sure, as it was covered externisvely at my Uni business law class so many years ago. Wikipedia covers this pretty well:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statute_of_frauds

  5. Wrong, let me clarify. by Ckwop · · Score: 4, Informative

    Since the statute predates the Constitution of the U.S., a clever lawyer could argue it applies here equally.

    The USA declared independence and is therefore independant of the British legal system. The same goes for Ireland too. do you think the 1801 Union Act still applies there because it predates their constitution? :P

    In the British legal system a contract is formed when the following are all true:

    1. There is an offer
    2. There is consideration of the offer - i.e. Goods or Services exchanged for money or other services.
    3. There is acceptance of the offer

    For example, if you exchange e-mails with your girlfriend and you promise to take your girlfriend her to the pictures if she buys you a pint tonight, and she does, then she can sue for breach of contract if you do not take her. Notice the agreement is independant of the medium it is formed in. If some new medium communications medium existed tomorrow, contract law still applies to it.

    Simon.

    1. Re:Wrong, let me clarify. by Malc · · Score: 2, Funny

      But it doesn't clearly state that if she doesn't buy you the pint after the flicks that it's a matter of sacrilege, not just civil law.

    2. Re:Wrong, let me clarify. by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The USA declared independence and is therefore independant of the British legal system. The same goes for Ireland too. do you think the 1801 Union Act still applies there because it predates their constitution? :P True enough. But ... In the British legal system a contract is formed when the following are all true: 1. There is an offer 2. There is consideration of the offer - i.e. Goods or Services exchanged for money or other services. 3. There is acceptance of the offer Wow. What an amazing coincidence! It's exactly the same in the American legal system! That's not really shocking and I am, of course, being humorous. The fact is that the a major component of the American legal system (common law) is very much based on the British Common Law. While Americans are not subject to British law due to a little scuffle we had that started about, say, 230 years ago or so this July 4, British Common Law has been used to establish legal precedence in cases involving American common law. So, a law that appers in 17th century British Common Law doesn't apply to American Common Law -- but it may if an American judge so rules based on this precedence.

  6. Re:yay! by Gulthek · · Score: 2, Insightful

    You now owe me 10% of my current debt (negative savings). I accept hard currency in mayonaise jars or under mattresses.

  7. Really? by Dread+Pirate+Skippy · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Since the statute predates the Constitution of the U.S., a clever lawyer could argue it applies here equally.

    How could a clever lawyer argue that, exactly? Didn't we have a big war a couple hundred years ago so that English laws would no longer apply in America?

  8. Re:ZIG. by soft_guy · · Score: 2, Informative

    Yes. Apparently some folks on slashdot have made jokes involving taking off every "sig" for great justice. The hilarity comes from the fact that "sig" rhymes with "zig" and they are making this pun from within their "sig". It was that joke which was a reference to the earlier joke from Zero Wing.

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  9. Slashdot sigs, too? by truthsearch · · Score: 2, Funny

    We better all prey Slashdot sigs don't count! Otherwise we're all going to have a lot of problems.

  10. Re:Why would it apply here? by Enigma_Man · · Score: 2, Funny

    We had a little bit of a scuffle about 230 years ago that made us no longer subject to British laws.

    I'm trying to remember the name of that, it had some sorta name... I think Nintendo has something to do with it.

    -Jesse
    --
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  11. A clever lawyer eh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    "Since the statute predates the Constitution of the U.S., a clever lawyer could argue it applies here equally."

    So THAT explains why whenever I order tea from Boston, I still have to send a tax to Britain.

    Thanks for clearing that up.

    (And just to be even clearer, while our legal system has its foundations in the English common law, we um, modify it with our own statutes and common law now. It's a little thing called independence.)

    IANAL, but IAALS (i am a law student). Although a grade school history class should be enough to know that the statement in the summary was way off... hmmmm...

    1. Re:A clever lawyer eh? by ZombieWomble · · Score: 2, Insightful
      A clever lawyer could argue what? That has got to be one of the dumbest things I have ever heard. It's not like the US told Britain to f*** off and we are going to make our own laws.

      And in many cases, you did. Well done and all that!

      Here's the fun part though: You didn't replace every single law. Many of the British ones were perfectly servicable, and were simply taken as granted in the new system (which was obviously based heavily on the British one), and remained in force. If there is no new American law explicitly superceding this one, then by tradition it does indeed still apply in the US - and tradition (or precedent, if you will) is a big thing in legal circles.

      Check out one of the many, many links to relevant wikipedia articles in this topic before engaging in a round of "rofl, but we pwned those british good!" back-slapping.

  12. So many things wrong with this summary.... by Mark_pdx · · Score: 4, Informative


    First of, the statute of frauds is exactly that, a statute. In the U.S. ach state has its own. So whether it applies to email could vary from state to state. The original English statute does not apply in the U.S.

    However, most states also adopt the UCC (which applies to sales of good vs. services), which has already been interpreted that signed emails satisfy the statute of frauds writing requirement.

    This isn't that big a deal, after all, even an unsigned letterhead satisfies the statute of frauds. You still need to prove offer, acceptance, and consideration to form a contract. You could still contest an email contract if there were fraudulent emails.

    1. Re:So many things wrong with this summary.... by phoey · · Score: 2, Informative

      To further elaborate on this point, the Statute of Frauds is used as a defense only. If the contract falls within the statute of frauds, then writing is required. If a contract falls out of the statute of frauds, than a writing is not required in order to have a binding contract.

      For a contract to fall within the statute of frauds (in other words, for a contract to require writing) it has to meet one of the following:

      1) Marriage contracts
      2) Contract must be able to be performed within one year
      3) Land (real estate)
      4) Sale of goods
      5) Executor (of estate)
      6) Surety

      I have not read a lot of case law regarding email communications as contracts, but I would not doubt that email communication is as valid written communication as the written letter. It would have to meet all the criteria of a contract (offer/acceptace/consideration) but assuming these elements are met, it would make sense that email could be used as evidence of writing or a basis of a contract.

      Technically, a contract could be written on a napkin or toilet paper or anything else. It is the content of the contract and the meeting of the minds that is relevant, not the medium by which this information is conveyed.

      The only issue left is the formality of the contract, whether the two parties agreed to a promise in writing. This includes a signature of the party to be charged. I would not even bring up old "Kings Bench" law from England to discuss the merits of electronic signatures as valid signatures. We already have a statute that says that electronic signatures are valid: Electronic Signature in Global and National Commerce Act (2000)

      The important section 101(a) of E-Sign provides that a signature or contract may not be denied legal effect "solely because it is in electronic form." In turn, an electronic signature is defined as any "electronic sound, symbol, or process, attached to or logically associated with a contract or other record and executed or accepted by a person with the intent to sign the record." [http://www.cfg-lawfirm.com/articles/oneclick.html ]

      So because there is federal legislation covering interstate commerce in regards to electronic signatures, an American lawyer would not need to drag up any old English common law. Now if we are discussing the exchange of goods, there may be UCC provisions directly applicable to these type of transactions, but I don't know the specifics. After I finish UCC this summer, I may be better informed of this matter :)

      Here is a link to the legislation: http://www.ffiec.gov/ffiecinfobase/resources/elect _bank/fdi-fil-72-2000_e_sign_glob_and_nat_comm_act .pdf

  13. Conclusions are backwards by metamatic · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Seems to me The Reg has drawn exactly the opposite conclusions the judge's decision supports.

    The judge ruled that the name in the header did not constitute the name required for a binding contract, because it was put their automatically as a matter of course.

    I think that similarly, a crappy e-mail signature disclaimer would be ruled completely invalid and not contractually binding, precisely because it is placed there as a matter of course, even when completely inappropriate.

    --
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  14. Re:I AM a lawyer... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    The Statute of Frauds is most definately the law in the US. It is taught in every law school in the U.S. in contracts class, and it is tested on the Bar exam (at least in California).

    Much of our law comes from British common law. It would not take a very clever attorney to get a court to consider English common law. It is done all the time where there is either no precident in the U.S., or it is such a long established rule of law (like the SOF), that it is taken as a fundamental underpinning of our system.

    Also, the SOF is codified in the UCC for the sale of goods. So, not only is it valid under the common law, it is actually codified for a narrow set of caontracts.

    BTW, this is not the point of view of some 'radical right-wingers' like Scalia, it is universally accepted by the legal community. The SOF IS the law in the U.S.

    Actually Scalia OPPOSES use of non-English common law by our courts, and has bee quite outspoken about it, to the chagrin of many left-wing white-tower types.

  15. Re:Vaffunculo by techno-vampire · · Score: 2, Informative
    This is just a special case of a general prinicple in jurisprudence: the court is always entitled to consider precedents from other countries, if appropriate, but they're not binding. That is, an Austrailian court can take into consideration what a US court has done in an Internet-related case, but doesn't have to do the same if it decides otherwise.

    In this case, of course, US law was partially derived from British common and statute law. Examining it can help a court deturmine just what the law is, and how it should apply. That doesn't mean that this centuries-old British statute is binding in the US, just that it's useful as a guide to understanding current contract law.

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  16. Stem the Tide... by Rydia · · Score: 4, Informative

    In an attempt to stem the tide of stupid comments about the revolutionary war and everything, I would like to say that I AM a lawyer and we DO use English common law in many cases.

    We try to apply newer statutory law first. If that doesn't work, we fall back on the common law. When we go to the common law, we look for cases that are similar, and we apply them, often from other English common law countries AFTER the revolution, because we assume they run the same system and want to see what they did. It works pretty well.

    The effect, then, is that some really old cases are still good law in America, and how England has adapated them has some part in it. We don't always keep the old common law rule (seisen, for instance), and often we don't follow subsequent foreign interpretation (equitable servitudes), but there's a whooole lot of contract law that is heavily influenced by what other legal systems within the common law framework are doing.

  17. Statute of Frauds by Phocas · · Score: 5, Informative

    I think from now on whenever I read a post on Slashdot that mocks people as idiots for not being techologically sophisticated I'm going to think of the posts on this story, virtually all of which are completely clueless about the law in a way comparable to someone who doesn't know what an operating system is and thinks Microsoft Windows is somehow an inherent part of every computer.

    It works like this. The statute of frauds is an ancient English statute that requires certain contracts to be in writing in order to be valid. Most contracts do not have to be in writing to be valid. However, back in the day, Parliament decided there was so much fraud based on suspicious witnesses showing up and swearing you really did promise to sell your estate for a pittance that something had to be done. What they did was enact the statute of frauds and since then, English contracts for certain things (such as the sale of land) must be in writing to be valid. The exact scope of that is actually quite complex, but that's the basic idea.

    At the time of the American revolution, much law was not in the form of statutes enacted by legislatures, but rather based on precedent, that is to say decisions previously rendered by the courts. That's part of what makes it a common law system. After the revolution, US state courts couldn't operate in a legal vacuum, so they continued to rely on English common law decisions for many years, not because they were obligated to do so, but because they had to come up with rules for dealing with situations, and English common law was a familar, readily acccessible source of such rules. Many states had reception statutes that instructed their courts to look to English common law precisely because they needed a source of law to apply and couldn't make up an entire legal system from scratch.
    Obviously today American courts don't need to look at English common law anymore except in certain very rare situations as we have over 200 years of our own cases to look at now. However, we still have an analogous situation today in which the courts of one state will sometimes look at the decisions of another state for guidance where an issue is coming up for the first time. It's not because the other state's decisions are binding, but because they might have some good ideas and good reasoning that are worth adopting.

    Today, most if not all states have enacted their own statute of frauds. The terms vary from state to state but the basic idea is the same, namely that certain contracts must be in writing to be valid. Whole books have been written on the statue of frauds. Visit the library of your local law school if you want to see more analysis than you ever imagined was possible on this issue.

  18. Misstatement by Eue · · Score: 4, Informative
    I'm sorry, but this article blatently misstates the opinion. The judge stated that an email address alone is not enough to constitute a signature for statute of frauds purposes. The judge DID NOT say that having a signature block on an email was sufficient. Here is a key passage from the actual opinion:

    As well know to anyone who uses email on a regular basis, What is relied upon is not inserted by the sender of the email in any active sense. It is inserted automatically. My knowledge of the technicalities of email is not sufficiently detailed to enable me to know whether it is inserted by the ISP with whom the sender or the recipient has his email account. However, I accept Mr Aslett's submission that as a matter of obvious inference, if it is inserted by the latter it can only be from information supplied by the former. Mr Mehta suggested that the address was inserted by his employee. I do not see how this could be so and certainly Mr Mehta was not able to give me a coherent explanation of how that might be so. It is possible that Mr Metha's employee was authorised to use Mr Metha;s email account remotely but, even if that is so, I do not see how that can impact on any of the issues I have to resolve since it is not in dispute that the email was sent on the instructions of Mr Metha and the method by which the sender address came to be inserted would not be affected even if that was the position. It is submitted on behalf of JPF that the appearance of the sender's address at the top of the document constitutes a signature either by the sender or by "... some otherperson thereunto by him lawfully authorised ... " because it is well known to all users of e mail that the recipient of the e mail will always be told the e mail address of the e mail account from which the e mail is sent in the form it appears on the e mail referred to in Paragraph 3 above. That being so, it is submitted that by authorising an agent to send an e mail using the sender's e mail account, to a third party the sender knows that his her or its e mail address will appear on the recipient's copy and that is sufficient for it to be held to be a signature for the purposes of Section 4. It was submitted by Mr Aslett that intention was irrelevant -all that was required was a document that constituted a sufficient memorandum (which, as I have held, the e mail was) and the signature somewhere on the note or memorandum of either the person to be bound or his duly authorised agent. In support of this contention, Mr Aslett relied on the decision of the House of Lords in Elpis Maritime Company Limited v. Marti Chartering Company Limited [1991] 3 WLR 330. The facts of that case were very different to the facts of this case. There was no dispute in that case that the party to be charged had signed the document. The dispute in that case concerned whether or not the fact that the party to be bound signed the relevant document as agent made any difference given that there was a clause within the document that purported to create a guarantee by the party purporting to sign only as agent. It had been contended that if such was the case then the fact the agreement contained a clause under which the signing party personally agreed to guarantee certain obligations was not relevant. It was this last argument that was rejected by the House of Lords by reference to In re Hoyle [1893] 1 Ch 84 in which A.L. Smith LJ said: "The question is not what is the intention of the person signing the memorandum but is one of fact, vis is there a note or memorandum of the promise signed by the party to be charged?". It is because this is so that in other cases the courts have accepted letters to third parties, instructions to telegraph companies signed by the sender, and affidavits in unconnected actions as being a sufficient memorandum providing they are signed by the parties to be bound. It was this that led the House of Lords to conclude that it was irrelevant in what capacity or with what intention the document there being considered was sign

  19. It's exactly what they wanted. by Kadin2048 · · Score: 5, Informative

    I think you need to reread your history. Many of the founders of this country had a great deal of respect for the English legal system: in theory at least. It was a particular government (that of King George III) that they were less-than-fond of. A great number of the principles enshrined in both the Declaration of Independence and later in the Constitution trace their lineage back to Britain (in particular to the Magna Carta, which the Founders would have been familiar with).

    The American court system in particular was essentially of British design, and most of the early judges and lawyers had read the a lot of British common law to pass the Bar. (At lower levels, the pre- and post-revolutionary court systems probably didn't change that much.) It was very common for aspiring lawyers to read Blackstone's as part of their studies until fairly recently--in my opinion, the lack of this today is really too bad. Recall also, that many of this country's Founders were lawyers who had read the Common Law and were used to thinking in its terms: Thomas Jefferson, Samuel Adams, John Dickinson, Oliver Ellsworth, Patrick Henry, and George Mason are just a few; I'm probably forgetting a lot of others. These were men whose concepts of fairness and equality, perhaps of liberty in general, owe at least some credit to their understanding of law.

    The everyday jurisprudential theories at work in the courts of England and post-revolutionary America really were about the same, on issues like torts, the definition of crime, etc. Over time there has been divergence on some issues, but there are still a lot of similarities. (More-so than between either the British or American system and a totally different theoretical foundation, like the Roman/Napoleonic Code that is the basis for the French and some other Continental systems.)

    Law changes and evolves over time; it's not something that you can easily just create anew out of whole cloth. The American legal system was built on the conceptual foundations provided by Common Law, and there is nothing wrong with referring to it if precedent is needed and nothing more recent can be found. This doesn't happen often (after all, we have 200+ years of our own precedent to go through now), but occasionally some very old Common Law case can be elucidating.

    This is not to say that a law is somehow automatically valid here, just because it was present in Britain prior to 1792 (that's an entirely separate branch of government anyway), or even that a court ruling there has an immediate and automatic effect here. It just means that in making arguments and looking for precedent, British case law prior to 1792 is fair game.

    --
    "Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
  20. that's ridiculous by penguin-collective · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If the court interprets what is known as an "email signature" as a "signature", the court is deeply confused about how signatures are added. An email signature is more like pre-printed stationery.

  21. a clever lawyer can *argue* anything... by Quadraginta · · Score: 2, Insightful

    ...the question is whether he can do so successfully. That is, whether the judge will rule in his favor.

    I don't think "common law" means at all the same thing as an explicit statute, where Congress has set down in writing what the rule is. In those cases, the court is bound to enforce the law as written, regardless of whether or not it's the way things are usually done. Statute can break entirely new ground, make things illegal which were legal before (e.g. cocaine) or legal which were illegal before (e.g. abortion).

    Not so with common law. I believe "common law" just translates to "what we've always mostly done." It's just a short way to imply that what people have almost always done, on their own, spontaneously, in response to a given situation should, after a long enough time, acquire much the force of written law. Especially when "what the people have done" has been ratified by repeated and consistent judicial decisions that agree with the tradition.

    It's a way to recognize that all law derives ultimately from the will of the people, and in certain situations people have expressed that will directly, without the need for legislaturely lawyers to write it down on parchment in curly script. Hence, the idea of "common law" is a constraint on the judiciary, telling them that, in the absence of explicit written law, they can't just decide cases before them on the basis of their personal whim. They can't just say: well, there's no written law here, so I'll rule as I see fit. Instead, they are obliged to recognize as law that "law" which is merely implied in long social traditions and the body of prior related judicial decisions.

    So from this POV could a lawyer successfully argue that English common law supercedes the Constitution? Of course not. Written statute always trumps unwritten common law. Common law is only used when there is no written law to provide guidance.

    Could a lawyer successfully argue that English common law supercedes post-1776 American common law? Not any more than he could argue that the speed limit on highways should still be 55 MPH because the 1970s era 55-MPH laws predate the later laws allowing the speed limit to be higher. The later law always controls, even when it's common law.

    So what's left? Only that a lawyer could successfully argue that in the absence of any relevant written statute, and the absence of any unique post-1776 American tradition, the court should consider the traditions in England prior to the Revolution. That doesn't sound very scary, or unreasonable.

  22. I Am a Lawyer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative
    Heaven save me from people who read without knowledge.

    "Statute of Frauds" is a legal term of art referring to certain kinds of contracts that are not enforceable if they aren't in writing. If a contract comes within the statute of frauds, an offer to enter into it must be both in writing and "signed."

    English law, as codified in the U.S. in Uniform Commercial Code section 1-201(39), says that a writing is "signed" when it contains "any symbol executed or adopted by a party with present intention to authenticate a writing."

    The header was inserted when the email was sent. The sender didn't even know this was happening. Obviously, he didntt put it in, or adopt it, intending to authenticate his writing.

    Therefore the offer was unenforceable.

    For the same reason, if a name is accompanied by a disclaimer saying that it is not intended to authenticate a writing, this negates any "present intention to authenticate" the writing and would therefore not would satisfy the definition of "signed."

    The case is no big deal. Hold your towel and Don't Panic.