Slashdot Mirror


Fly-by-Wireless Plane Takes to the Sky

galactic_grub writes to tell us that engineers in Portugal have built and flown a plane with no wires or mechanical connections between the major systems, only a wireless network. From the article: "Tests flights carried out in Portugal have shown that the system works well. Cristina Santos, at Minho University in Portugal, who developed the plane, says the aim is primarily to reduce weight and power requirements. 'Also, if you do not have the cables then the system is much more flexible to changes,' she says."

8 of 376 comments (clear)

  1. Holy Crap! by Whiney+Mac+Fanboy · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Goddamn it! A 'wireless' plane! My first thought was why the hell would you want to do that? First thing I decided after 802.11 got cheap was "wireless for convenience, wired where it matters". The following quote from TFA clued me in however:
    the aim is primarily to reduce weight and power requirements. "Also, if you do not have the cables then the system is much more flexible to changes," she says.
    I tell you what ladies & gents - this is one plane where I'd take notice when told to switch my cell phone off!

    PS - I note the next story on the front page is "IT: Wireless Security Attacks and Defenses." Coincidence? I think not ;-)
    --
    There are shills on slashdot. Apparently, I'm one of them.
  2. Do we really need this? by DougLorenz · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Does an optical cable REALLY weigh that much that someone would want to replace it with wireless? This goes for any situation where functionality is considered to be important. I have a wireless network at home, but I've also run gigabit ethernet through the entire house. The wireless goes down from time to time, but the hard cable does not. The article talks about two benefits, weight reduction and power reduction. In both situations, I would expect that a single lightweight fiber connection and some LED lasers would not be significantly heaver, and would likely use a good deal less power... It just seems to me that the whole idea is little more than academic. I can't think of a single situation where it would be more desirable for a device like an automobile or an airplane to use a wireless system for communicating control information. Someone's got way too much free time on his hands...

    --
    Slashdot, where you get modded down as redundant for stating an opposing viewpoint... Independent thought anyone?
    1. Re:Do we really need this? by DougLorenz · · Score: 3, Insightful
      I'd more like to know if there's a way to communicate over the power lines, which you'd have to run anyway, or if this is already done.

      If they have to run power lines anyway, then just string the fiber along with the power line. Fiber isn't significantly affected by EMI, so what would it matter...

      You have brought up an additional point though... If a plane needs to have power in both the front and back, then what is someone going to do without wires? Batteries located everywhere power is needed? That pretty much trashes the whole "weight saving" aspect of this project.

      Or maybe some sort of microwave transmission of power from the front of the plane to the back... The upside to that is that anyone sitting in the middle of the plane wouldn't need a blanket to stay warm.

      --
      Slashdot, where you get modded down as redundant for stating an opposing viewpoint... Independent thought anyone?
    2. Re:Do we really need this? by Greyfox · · Score: 3, Insightful

      According to this, a 737 contains 36 miles of electrical wire. So it probably would be a fairly significant weight savings. I woudn't want to put my life on the line on that airplane though, at least not until they can demonstate that the safety is the same or better than a conventional one. Give that the FAA implies that a passenger accidentally leaving his cell phone on is enough to make a conventional one go slamming into the ground in a firey ball of death, I'm not sure it's as difficult as it sounds...

      --

      I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?

  3. +1 Neat, -1 Impractical by AKAImBatman · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Such wireless links could be susceptible to electromagnetic interference or even jamming, Mellor suggests. And it could be more difficult to build in back-up wireless connections, he says. "If you jam one link you would jam both," he warns.

    That's also my concern. A high powered transmitter is a lot easier to attack a plane with than a shoulder mounted rocket. (Which simply doesn't have the same range as a high powered transmitter.) A truck with a few generators in series would make for an excellent jamming platform.

    There's also the concern of an onboard terrorist using implementation flaws to hack the airplane. The crew would have a deuce of a time trying to understand why they're locked out of their controls.

    Some planes, such as the Boeing 777 even use optical fibres, which can carry multiple signals through a single cable.

    IMNO, this makes a lot more sense. Optical busses between the necessary components are fast, lightweight, and easy to install. I can't see wireless saving more than a few kilograms over fibre connections.

    That being said, in-flight entertainment systems might save weight if they weren't wired up. Running fibre for such systems results in a lot of unnecessary wiring and weight. Since the entertainment system is effectively a low-security system, airplane makers can feel free to use these linkages as long as the control systems remain wired.

    She also admits that stringent aviation regulations may mean the technology first appears in cars rather than planes.

    That makes even less sense. AFAIK, the horrid nests of wires that previously ran all of a car's electronics have been replaced by more standardized busses. The remaining wiring merely hooks a cars features into the power system. Unless I missed something, Bluetooth can not wirelessly provide power to accessories. Which means that they can't replace the wiring in cars anyway.

    Hopefully we'll see this technology help with UAVs and other super-light aircraft. But I have no desire to fly on a plane that has its key systems hooked up through a technology that can be potentially interfered with by the cellphones the passengers are carrying.

  4. no thanks by yagu · · Score: 4, Insightful
    no thanks

    Considering that every RF technology I've ever worked with has been imperfect, I'd hesitate to ride (or even fly) a wireless network controlled plane.

    Here are some of the wireless technologies I know:

    • XM radio... Great stuff, love what it offers, but I've NEVER gone an entire day without some interruption of signa.
    • 811.x lan. Love having wireless LAN at home, but please please please don't turn on the microwave!
    • remote controlled anything (wireless). I've used wireless IR repeaters, I've had RF remote controlled devices, every single one of these devices exhibitied anomolous behavior at some point, and every single one showed anomolous behavior more than once!
    • satellite TV (see XM bullet above)
    • GPS. many many "disconnects" over the course of a day.
    • AM/FM radio/OTA TV signals, always susceptible to interference, multi-path (FM), lightning (AM), etc.
    • cell phones... don't get me started -- probably one of the most promising technologies beat to death by money-grubbing telcoms squeezing every bit of quality out of the transmission protocols and tower dispersal until it's mediocre technology.
    • cordless phones... if you've still got the 2.4Ghz phones, don't try talking on them while you're moving large data streams on your 811.X network... noise, noise, noise (not to mention the interference the other direction)
    • garage doors. It's not as bad these days, but our garage door would spontaneously open and close when aircraft were near.

    She states she is working on the reliability problem. I wonder if it's possible to solve (any EEs out there to chime in?). I used to work for a telcom, and they always had an interesting poster up describing what 99.99% accuracy meant. The most interesting representation: if commercial jets took off and landed at that rate of effieciency, there would be a failure every 10,000 landings/takeoffs. For the sake of simplifying, if there were 5,000 flights a day, that would be 10,000 landings plus takeoffs implying a statistical expectation of failure each day.

    I don't know to what level RF can be perfected without some backup system (also RF) that would guarantee perfection but if they ever start flying those suckers, I'm going to wait a while before I board one.

  5. Composites by everphilski · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Composites are the future, Boeing's dreamliner and whatever Airbus's new airliner is are being made of more and more composites. Composites are strong, but composites are very flexible. They don't lend themselves well to control wires although cabling is acceptable if you have slack (which adds weight)... but movement is never a good thing so wireless kinda makes sense if you can make it fault-toloerant.

  6. Could actually improve safety by RobertB-DC · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Most of the early comments seem to be in the vein of "OMG wireless hax!", but consider a real worst-case scenario, like the one that brought down ValuJet 592. It was caused by a fire in the cargo hold that cut critical links between the cockpit controls and the hydraulic systems needed to keep the plane running.

    As long as you have a physical connection from point A to point B, it is vulnerable to the most brute-force of DOS attacks: cut the connection and it's lost. A wireless link between the pilot and the control surfaces, on the other hand, can't be cut by a fire in the cargo hold, or even by a shoulder-fired missle (as long as it missed the kablooie stuff).

    In a real-world application, I'd expect both wired/optical links *and* wireless backup links. Such a fully redundant system would work both as a sanity check (both systems should be reporting the same results) and as a backup (wired works when wireless is jammed, wireless works when wire is cut).

    Plus, I can hardly wait for the netstumbler/kismet folks to write a monitor program to let me monitor things from the comfort of my tray table (on the emergency exit row, of course).

    --
    Stressed? Me? Of course not. Stress is what a rubber band feels before it breaks, silly.