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Motorola's New Open Source Resource

Posted by ryuzaki0 on from the moving-slowly-in-the-right-direction dept.

illogict writes "Among with their new A1200 GNU/Linux-based mobile phone, Motorola unveiled yesterday its new community-based development platform, http://open source.motorola.com. It is primarily aimed at developers who are willing to contribute to Motorola's GNU/Linux-based mobile phones, either directly on firmware, or creating programs (native or Java) who are aimed to work on those phones. It currently features phone kernels, SD-TransFlash card reader drivers, Java MIDP3.0 draft. Such commitment on open source-development could be seen as a good step, and may show the way to other companies."

76 comments

  1. Amiga by Ithika · · Score: 3, Funny

    A mobile phone based on the A1200? With Motorola technology? Who would have guessed.

    --
    the layman's guide to computer science
    1. Re:Amiga by fatphil · · Score: 1

      You can still get 68k family processors from Freescale Semiconductor (who split off from Motorola 2 years ago). www.freescale.com -> 32-bit Microcontrollers -> 68k/coldfire.

      There's no reason why a 68k couldn't be an application processor (rather than modem processor, in a dual-chip design) in a mobile phone. There's also no fundamental reason why AmigaOS couldn't be the GUI/AFX too. (The anciliary chips (SID? et al.) might be a problem, perhaps they could be emulated?)

      That's something I would certainly like to see. I know you were only joking, but it's a nice image.

      FatPhil, not speaking for anyone apart from himself.

      --
      Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
  2. Lets see how they handle things by moore.dustin · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I think it is a great move, but I just wonder how people who actually contribute will be treated by the company down the road. Often times, little or no credit is given to someone who makes a successful and meaningful contribution because they could easily just take the idea and release it as a feature on the next iteration of the phone. Either way it is a great move on the companies part - they can rest now and let other people come up with the next ideas that will sell the phones next iteration.

    --
    Invexi - a Phoenix, AZ based web design and web development company.
    1. Re:Lets see how they handle things by diegocgteleline.es · · Score: 1

      they can rest now and let other people come up with the next ideas that will sell the phones next iteration.

      If they do that, they'll fail. Open source really needs a community to work, ie: you've to give something. If they don't keep offering anything people will go elsewhere. They need to keep releasing new things and features to attract people. Then, other people will come and will start adding other things and helping in the development. But if they expect that people are going to do all the work for free and they're going to become rich by just doing that they're crazy bceause nobody will find a reason to do that.

  3. My solution by Council · · Score: 2, Interesting

    My open-source mobile phone development solution: Verizon Broadband, Ubuntu, VoIP, and an ultraportable Fujitsu Lifebook P1510. And with the number of unsecure networks around, I can probably drop the Verizon Broadband one of these days.

    Yeah, I may look silly with a laptop against my ear, but it's no sillier than a boombox back in the day. I hope it conveys similar street cred.

    --
    xkcd.com - a webcomic of mathematics, love, and language.
    1. Re:My solution by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      You could always use a headset, like everyone else. If it doesn't have bluetooth, well, you could plug one in, like the stone age men.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  4. Phon-E Details. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    "Such commitment on open source-development could be seen as a good step, and may show the way to other companies.""

    Well that's all well and good, but how's the phone itself?

  5. A1200 an Asian Release Only (So Far) by ewhac · · Score: 2, Informative
    The Motorola A1200 (MING) has only been released in the Asian market. So far, no US cell providers have deigned to carry it (although you can probably find someone to import it).

    Schwab

    --
    Editor, A1-AAA AmeriCaptions
    1. Re:A1200 an Asian Release Only (So Far) by sabrebutt · · Score: 1

      wireless imports currently sells it at a somewhat decent price.

    2. Re:A1200 an Asian Release Only (So Far) by wiml · · Score: 1

      Froogle shows a bunch of US sellers.

    3. Re:A1200 an Asian Release Only (So Far) by duranaki · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I think as your repliers have pointed out that you can probably buy it here (USA). The question is whether any operator will subsidize it (answer: no) and therefore it will fail miserably like every other handset that doesn't cave to the operators will to maximize their DRM/lock-in of every single bit of content they can get their hands on.

    4. Re:A1200 an Asian Release Only (So Far) by mustafap · · Score: 1

      That will be in part because 'Ming' is a rather nasty slang word in the uk :o)

      --
      Open Source Drum Kit, LPLC deve board - mjhdesigns.com
    5. Re:A1200 an Asian Release Only (So Far) by walt-sjc · · Score: 1

      Ding ding! Verizon also won't carry it because it's not CDMA. If they DID carry (a CDMA version of) it, they would ensure that it only ran the qualcom crappy DRM encumbered OS that doesn't allow third party apps that are not digitally signed by Verizon. They would also ensure that bluetooth only worked with headsets and nothing else. Why pick on Verizon? Because they are "the" Poster Child for a carrier that behaves badly in regards to user flexability. They also have one of the best networks from my experience (of course they do have their deadspots as all wireless carriers do.)

      Anyone else notice that wireless plans have gotten WORSE in the past few years? Now the "nationwide no roaming" has so many exceptions that it's basically useless outside of major cities. And text messaging is more expensive if you go outside the carriers network (not that it really costs them any more...)

  6. Aha. by Poromenos1 · · Score: 1

    Nice, more software for Motorola phones which they don't have to pay for.

    --
    Send email from the afterlife! Write your e-will at Dead Man's Switch.
    1. Re:Aha. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You Slashdot people are never content. If the source is closed, you gripe about it not being open-source. If they source is open, you accuse them of just wanting free development. Grow up.

  7. That's nice but... by BigCheese · · Score: 1

    Apps are nice but I want the phone part to work first. No dropped calls, no wierd charging issues and for heavens sake clean up that godawful UI.

    --
    The obscure we see eventually. The completely obvious, it seems, takes longer. - Edward R. Murrow
    1. Re:That's nice but... by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      At least "that godawful UI" is easy to use, if slow and ugly. Sure, Nokias have an interface that runs about four times as fast, too bad it's about ten times harder to navigate. I found everything I was looking for on my V300 without a manual, and quickly too, but every time I pick up a Nokia I get pissed off at it because the interface is bullshit.

      And ANYTHING is better than the Sony phone I had back in the day...

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    2. Re:That's nice but... by dslbrian · · Score: 1

      At least "that godawful UI" is easy to use, if slow and ugly. Sure, Nokias have an interface that runs about four times as fast, too bad it's about ten times harder to navigate. I found everything I was looking for on my V300 without a manual, and quickly too

      Are you serious about this? I've owned several Motorola phones up until recently, from about 2000 to 2005, probably about 4 phones in all (mostly because I wanted GSM). They have all had bad interfaces IMO. As near as I can tell Mot had not changed their software significantly over the entire period. I could tell each successive one was simply the one before with a few more icons/menus added to it. And what the hell is with the phone book?!? over all my phones they could never figure out how to collapse multiple numbers under one name (scrolling the phone book was a pain in the ass, every person had 3 entries).

      Finally I decided to forego GSM and picked up a LG VX9800. It was like being let out of a dungeon - seriously night and day compared to my old Mot phones. The biggest problem on the 9800 menu system is an occasional lack of consistency (sometimes OK button == "done", sometimes right/left softkey == "done", stuff like that).

      I think this is a very good move for Mot to open source their system. They are in desperate need of a UI upgrade (mabye that changed recently with the Razr, I don't know, but it was apparent to me that nobody was upgrading it before). Too bad the national carriers never carry this stuff.

    3. Re:That's nice but... by blackraven14250 · · Score: 1

      The first two aren't motorola's problem, I don't think. I've eben using Motorola phones since they came out with the V551 (a couple years ago), and the V551 and RAZR have both been very good, combined with Cingular coverage in Jersey. The phone I had before, a Nokia cheap POS, never had signal. I'd like to think your issues aren't because of Motorola, but rather the service provider. As for the UI....I've found no problem with it on either the RAZR or V551. The default skins were OK, and I could live with them. However, there's never a problem some phone hacking can't solve about UI issues. Have to do it to add more skins, which sucks, but hey, the new skins look alot better then the Verizon one. Oh, by the way, from what I know, Verizon's phones are either locked into, or just come standard with, a really, really nasty skin. It's by far the most godawful thing I've ever seen, but that's Verizon-only.

    4. Re:That's nice but... by ChrisA90278 · · Score: 2, Insightful
      and for heavens sake clean up that godawful UI.

      That's the whole point. If you don't like the UI YOU can fix it on YOUR phone. If you want you can contribute the fix the the world and other users can have it. It Moterola likes your fix they can include it in thier next relese. There is no need to submit your changes and hope they are accepted, yes that's nice as it lets others see your hard work but you can keep them all to yourself too and have a one of a kind phone too.

      No more complainning about how the UI could be better. You have the means to fix it. OK but few users have the skill to fix it but itonly takes a few. If you can't write software maybe you can step in and manage some usability studies or write some documentation or something

    5. Re:That's nice but... by sacbhale · · Score: 1

      Somebody Mark the parent Funny because You have to be kidding. The nokia's have the most intutive interface out there. And they are fast. Less cluttered. I have a Nokia phone I own and a Motorola phone given to me by my employers. Using the Motorola is a nightmare compared to the Nokia.

    6. Re:That's nice but... by BigCheese · · Score: 1

      I don't think it's the provider. I have too keep letting my wife borrow my N-Gage QD (sucky game machine, great phone) because her Moto just can't get a signal, or the stupid 2 pronged charger wiggled loose and now it has no charge.

      Now, I got a friend the newer Moto because it was the cheapest Bluetooth phone T-Mobile had. The BT was to save her having to mess around with the directory since her eyesight is not too good.
      Well, this one has a camera and one of those itty bitty SD cards. She wanted to get a couple of pictures off it so I tried plugging it into the USB on her computer. The SD showed up fine but the pictures weren't there. Why would you put SD in a camera phone and not store photos on it?

      Also, she wanted to show someone a couple of pictures and she couldn't find them in the menu. It took me a couple of minutes of poking around to find them myself. Not the sign of a good UI.

      The new USB charger/connector is a step in the right direction but they've got a long way to go before I get another one.

      --
      The obscure we see eventually. The completely obvious, it seems, takes longer. - Edward R. Murrow
    7. Re:That's nice but... by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      They may be fast but the whole phone comes across like a kung-fu movie, something is definitely lost in translation. Based on the names of the options categories it's kind of nonsensical where options are hidden.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  8. Why is this open source?? by i+am+kman · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Hmmm, open source for a proprietary, niche HW platform. Sounds like they're too cheap to hire their own developers and are using the Open Source buzzward in hopes for some free SW development.

    So, there was some debate about whether you can package proprietary drivers with open source. So, can you package open source drivers with proprietary hardware?

    Open source generally implies users installing the OS on their own devices. I don't really see this happening on a large scale with Motorola since it'll come pre-bundled. So on has to wonder, what's the point of open sourcing stuff?

    1. Re:Why is this open source?? by mtenhagen · · Score: 1

      The point is that you get the freedom to do with your device whatever you like!

      It doesnt play ogg vorbis? write it yourself!
      It doenst sync with outlook? purchase the plugin from microsoft
      It contains a bug but motorola stopped support? hire someone to fix it!

      Its about FREEDOM but I guess people dont care about freedom anymore.

      --
      200GB/2TB $7.95 Coupon: SAVE90DOLLAR
    2. Re:Why is this open source?? by typical · · Score: 1

      I don't understand exactly what this entails. If this means that I can write regular ol' Linux software in C that can run on the phone (and communicate with other phones in some way) then I admit, I'm interested in getting a cell for the first time ever. I can think of a lot of software that would be damned useful in a portable package.

      And modern cells have GPS...I wonder if it's possible to get at that data.

      I wish I could get a summary of "what this means from a programmer's standpoint"

      Hmmm, open source for a proprietary, niche HW platform. Sounds like they're too cheap to hire their own developers and are using the Open Source buzzward in hopes for some free SW development.

      If my understanding is correct, and you're just coding to Linux, it's not as if you're locked into their API, whatever it is.

      So, there was some debate about whether you can package proprietary drivers with open source. So, can you package open source drivers with proprietary hardware?

      Yes. Besides, it's not like your desktop is "non-proprietary" -- try getting Verilog (or whatever) sources for the P4 from Intel.

      Open source generally implies users installing the OS on their own devices. I don't really see this happening on a large scale with Motorola since it'll come pre-bundled. So on has to wonder, what's the point of open sourcing stuff?

      Almost all desktop computers come with an OS pre-installed too.

      --
      Any program relying on (nontrivial) preemptive multithreading will be buggy.
    3. Re:Why is this open source?? by DavidNWelton · · Score: 1

      Yeah, it's a proprietary platform, but... 'niche'... depends on how you look at it. At least for J2ME, potential users number in the millions, given the phones out there right now. That's an awful lot of people.

      --
      http://www.welton.it/davidw/
  9. What is with gnu? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I saw lots of "linux," but I didn't see any "GNU/Linux." Is this embedded device loaded down with the GNU software, or is the person who submitted the article ignorant and politically pushy?

    1. Re:What is with gnu? by tvon · · Score: 1

      Seriously good point.

    2. Re:What is with gnu? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      seconded.

  10. Please let Motorola get it right.. by moreati · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Motorola showed actual thought and innovation for the V3 RAZR and it's ilk. Thin flip-phones makes so much more sense. I hope they can do it again with the software.

    Other than an old Ericsson T39m, the V3i is the best phone design I've ever used. That is, except for the software - which is.. quirky, to say the least. Games consoles get much of the attention in terms of reverse engineering and modding, each generation is designed to be more locked down and 'trustworthy'. However phones seem to have fared infinately better against the modding crowds and this sucks. Mobile operators get away with charging 15p for a 20 byte SMS and other restrictions that would leave Sony/MS XBox division drooling.

    I wish it were possible to rip the Motorola supplied firmware and replace it with something buggy but useful. I wish I could sync to anything and actually run real software, that does real things like access bluetooth and the camera. I wish my current phone could run programs written in C, C++, Perl, Python, Ruby, Java, C# and AIML. I want my phone to make a Star Trek communicator noise every time it opens. I want it to work in landscape mode and allow input from a bluetooth keyboard and to log GPS. I want it to do all the things Motorola didn't think of or didn't have the budget for.

    So please, if anyone from Motorola is reading, do this properly. Open up more than just a few smartphones or far east only models. Let your geek users break from the shackles of MIDP across everything. I note from TFA that you've released an open source mmc+sd driver, that's a great move - make it the first of many.

    Thanks

    Alex

    1. Re:Please let Motorola get it right.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      The problem is that even if Motorola puts all those great features in their phones, US carriers are going to force them to disable most of them to make their money. I still remember Verizon's crippled V710, and think that trend is likely to continue. Of course, you could import a phone, but then you forgo the subsidized pricing.

    2. Re:Please let Motorola get it right.. by coofercat · · Score: 1

      As a Razr V3 touting O2 UK customer, I'll just chip in a bit of the same...

      The Razr V3 is probably one of the best bits of phone hardware I've ever seen (and I've seen a few). It's emminently usable, small, has good battery life, and looks good too.

      However, the software is awful. Terrible, in fact (even though it's field upgradable, unlike 99% of other phones that need a trip to the shop). Why don't phone companies duplicate Nokia software? Nokia has always had the best software, although tends to trail on the hardware a bit.

      Open sourcing phone software could lead to projects like the open source ipod software. It's totally different software, doing much the same job as the original + extras. If someone could write a cut-down version of the V3 software without dog-slow animations and dodgy UI choices that makes calls and texts, I'd use it. Of course, if it could also allow me to send Bluetooth messages to unsuspecting people on the train, then that would be a bonus ;-)

      Motorola need(ed) to do something about their software. If they work on this like Redhat do with Fedora, then they could be onto something (ie. provide 80-90% of the workforce, but listen to the open source 10-20%). In time of course, the open source contingent would probably grow if it was worth their time.

      The unfortunate fact is that by the time some new software is ready for (say) the RAZR V3, I'll be long onto a new contract and a new phone (which probably won't be Motorola).

  11. Oh dear Jesus! by adminsr · · Score: 0

    The author put a space in the link's text. A SPACE!!!!!!!!!!!

    When this happens on /. , we're doomed.

  12. Assuming you can get one unlocked.... by otis+wildflower · · Score: 1

    ... in order to load your shiny custom cross-compiled apps on it, this could be hella-sweet. If only so I can have an IMAP and SMTP over SSL, it'd be almost worth getting an unlimited rate plan.

    I'd still prefer a Treo 650 keypad if it doesn't have SonyEricsson P800-level print recognizer though.

  13. On the other side... by OpenSourced · · Score: 3, Funny

    Such commitment on open source-development could be seen as a good step

    But we can always spin it to look like pure evil.

    --
    Rome taught me patience and assiduous application to detail. Virtues which temper the boldness of great, general views.
  14. Who REALLY gets the benefit from this? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Could somebody explain to me what is in it for the open source community when huge multi million dollar companies do stuff like this? They get hundred's of programmers working for them for free and what does it get the rest of us?

    Can't we see that this is just doing the rest of us out of jobs? If a company like this can get people developing and testing software for them for nothing then they don't have to higher as many developers, so we all end up working in jobs we hate so that we can do what we love in the evenings... for free.

    I am all for [and love] the little guys, the Apaches and Firefoxes of the world. But has anyone ever thought that this is just "Big Business" getting richer by taking advantage of the generosity of the open source community?

    1. Re:Who REALLY gets the benefit from this? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Jeez, cynical much.... I agree with another poster - big companies can't win with you Slashdot crowd - you whine if it ISN'T open source, and you bitch if it is.. Grow up..

    2. Re:Who REALLY gets the benefit from this? by queazocotal · · Score: 1
      The problem is that - at the moment - it's not usefully open source.

      They've open sourced a few drivers, which are admittedly handy, and may be useful for other stuff, but at the moment, most of the stuff they've open sourced is that that they are required to do, as they have used it in their product, and gained by not having to write their own kernel.

      To be truly 'open source' in a meaningful way, you should at leat be able to add your own applications to the device, and ideally be able to completely rip out all the existing user interface stuff, and only use the camera, touchscreen, phone, ... drivers to do whatever you want.

      There are all sorts of possible nifty applications that you could do with this device, that are not available in the default application.


      (Based on some assumptions about the hardware and installed software - I can't find a proper manual)

      Time lapse photography.

      Use any bluetooth keyboard to enter SMS/email

      Connect to bluetooth GPS to do routing.

      Do VOIP.

      One-time-pad encrypted voice - 1Gb of flash is quite enough to store several one-time pads lasting hours each for talking to different people.

      Photo, or voice-print authorisation to use the phone.

      Email/... the real user if phone thinks it's stolen, if it is, turn on eavesdropping mode.

      Print pictures to any bluetooth enabled printer.

      Use any bluetooth mouse to 'paint' on pictures you've taken.

      Notify the user if a radio program they are interested in is about to start.

      Connect to the internet via bluetooth if it's available locally, rather than going over the phone network.

      Offer internet connectivity over the phone network via bluetooth, for a small amount paypalled.

      Speech synthesiser to read ebooks to you over bluetooth, .........

      There is simply so much that could be done with the hardware, if it was properly open sourced.

      Much of this sort of stuff is not put in by motorola et al, because the networks don't want it.

  15. Its more how the carriers handle things by EmbeddedJanitor · · Score: 3, Insightful
    In the US, quite a few phone features are turned off because the carriers don't want them available. For example, some phones that are internally wifi capable have the wifi disabled to prevent them meing used as VoIP handsets, thus forcing people to use regular (billable) phone services instead.

    So if new apps start to threated revenue streams for the carriers you can expect them to be disbaled. Or, alternatively, you can expect the carriers to provide their own similar services. If you think about how MS destroyed 3rd party middleware developers you'll probably be on the right track.

    --
    Engineering is the art of compromise.
  16. That's What FOSS is All About by RichiP · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Under the FOSS philosophy, software developers really are reduced in value. Basically, any work a FOSS developer does will not translate to much personal value for him/her. If any money is to be made, it is in services that set up and customize said FOSS for paying customers. The programmer gives whatever value he/she had away. FOSS developers only hope for a sustained source of income from developing software is to setup a donations-based system (think PayPal) or work for a company who takes the zero-value software and make money off of it from services.

    Which is why companies who make money off of FOSS should not be frowned unless they do not contribute anything back to the developers (either by hiring them or donating money).

    What FOSS developers gets is 1) recognition, 2) satisfaction knowing he has contributed something to the greater public and 3) should the FOSS community grow, he/she will have the benefit of using all that available FOSS software. (Admittedly, there's not much there that translates to man's basic necessities of food, shelter and security.)

    As a software developer, I can (and do) charge money for that one-time development of FOSS. From there there'll be no recurring charges nor can I sell it again. My hope is that if there's a groundswell for this kind of development, I can make money off of other people's work as well. In that sense, it's a cross between capitalism and communism.

  17. Dialing? by MConlon · · Score: 1

    Just curious... how do you dial this thing? Do you need to use the stylus on the touch screen or what?

    MJC

    1. Re:Dialing? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, using the stylus on the touchpad. I assume it also has voice recognition like the a780 in which case you can dial with your voice.

    2. Re:Dialing? by JourneymanMereel · · Score: 1

      I haven't managed to see a picture of it yet, but that is possible. My current phone (a PPC6700) doesn't have a keypad and requries dialing by touching the on screen dialpad. A bit of a pain, but not impossible.

      --
      Life has many choices. Eternity has two. What's yours?
  18. Motorola Charges for USB Drivers for the RAZR by WimBo · · Score: 1

    I'd love to have a straightforward way of developing software on my phone. I can't even connect it to my windows machine without spending another $30 on software from motorolla.

    1. Re:Motorola Charges for USB Drivers for the RAZR by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If it has bluetooth, you can transfer Java apps/ringtones/blah easily enough with a cheap dongle. (not tested on Windows, but I'm sure it has some BT stuff too)

      Todays Trashcan Turing Test Tonguetwister: "Osmosis"

  19. NO NATIVE application support!!! by Eugenia+Loli · · Score: 5, Informative

    I downloaded the source code for the A1200 and e680/a780. There IS NO WAY you can create a native graphical application with the tarballs they offer. Whoever submitted the news on Slashdot is an idiot and he didn't try the tarballs. The modified Qt/EZX toolkit is NOT included in these tarballs.

    In other words, Motorola gave us NOTHING more than they didn't before. They just released a fancy web site about it. And we, Linux phone users, STILL CAN NOT create graphical native apps!

    1. Re:NO NATIVE application support!!! by Capt.+Beyond · · Score: 4, Informative

      Sorry Eugenia, you will have to wait for Qtopia 4 and it's Safe Execution Environment (SXE) to have native applications on a Linux phone.

      --
      -- "Perceptions create reality. By changing your perceptions you change your reality."
    2. Re:NO NATIVE application support!!! by Eugenia+Loli · · Score: 2, Informative

      I don't see why I can't have Qt 2.x.x native apps too. Zaurus had native apps and was based on the same version of Qt. The problem is not SXE or anything like that. The problem is that Motorola hasn't released their EZX SDK.

    3. Re:NO NATIVE application support!!! by Capt.+Beyond · · Score: 3, Informative
      No, the problem is with the phone operators/carrers. They are extremely paranoid.
      As an example, from this article Device Profile: Grundig Dreamphone G500i
      "The carriers are afraid of what kind of software might be connected to the network if users could run their own "hacked" Linux OSes. For example, think of an application sending millions of SMS messages per second. They expect from us a certain level of security."

      This also includes 3rd party software. Currently, Java applications are king, because they are sandboxed, and do not have full access to the device. With SXE, native applications are sandboxed as well as some other security restrictions that are in place, to restrict access to the device/network.

      --
      -- "Perceptions create reality. By changing your perceptions you change your reality."
    4. Re:NO NATIVE application support!!! by ubersonic · · Score: 1

      I do actually own a A780 and tried to develop software for it.
      There are two processors, one for the network handling (some prop os) and the other running Linux.
      Its nearly impossible to write a native app, you need to do major reverse engeneering. Java apps, if not signed can't do shit either. You need to be in Motorola developer program to get the right Jar files, and you can only access them if your application is signed.

      On top, you cant replace the kernel - because all required drivers are released, the source its quite outdated AND you the kernel has to be digitaly signed as well :(

      Means I bought a very expensive brick - totally USELESS!
      Never again will I buy Motorola hardware.

      --

      -- ubersonic Kfz Versicherung
    5. Re:NO NATIVE application support!!! by edxwelch · · Score: 1

      Agreed completely.
      Unfortunately because of their hysterical paranoia they cripple a lot of technology unnessecarily. Take, for instance, the JSR-75 API which allows a midlet to read and write files on the phone. This API is mostly unusable because of confirmation dialogs that appear for each and every operation - unless you buy a number of expensive certificates. The confirmation dialogs appear even for *read* access of file - there's no way a midlet can possible do any harm by reading files.

  20. Question by biglig2 · · Score: 1

    Is there enough of a market out there for someone (with a lot of seed cash) to produce a totally generic mobile device designed for open source hacking?

    What I'm thinking about is a fairly simple PDA type design, maybe with WiFi/Bluetooth/GSM/EDGE radio(s), with a CF and an SD slot, not too big, 320x320 screen maybe, 1MP camera, the entire hardware design open and published, running Linux, the whole thing made from commodity hardware, designed for people to put freaky applications on?

    I imagine such a device would be initially very very ugly, that over time various Koreans etc. would rip it off and make pretty ones to the same spec that ran the same software.

    How many people would buy it? Could you sell it into commercial stuff?

    This I guess is prompted by thinking about Warren Ellis' box. That is not rude, Americans. Basically, Mr. E recently blogged about a ridiculously cheap hardware device he bought, a camera+SD card slot+screen+TV in/Out. It's ugly and crap, but it's £150 and does twice as much as my new ipod does. Reading about it, it occured to me that if this thing had a radio in it so I could make it talk to my PCs, I'd probably buy one.

    Actually, this is deeper than this - work are about to take away my converged phone/pda and replace it with a Crackberry. This pains me, as I hadn't realised how attached I am to the idea of a converged device. My p910i isn't perfect in this regard, but it was getting there. It can theoretically do everything that the Box can. But it's a Sony, and so full of proprietary nonsense that just makes it difficult.

    --
    ~~~~~ BigLig2? You mean there's another one of me?
    1. Re:Question by wiml · · Score: 2, Insightful

      There's the Silicon Valley Homebrew Mobile Phone Club. If the comparison with computers is accurate, then in about twenty years we'll start seeing phones that don't suck.

    2. Re:Question by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 1

      Wait for a software defined radio to be readily available. Then you can do all your protocols in software and sell everybody the same hardware. CDMA is the only thing that comes in around here so I wouldn't buy a GSM device, and you don't want to run off multiple SKU's.

      Some of these protocols are patent encumbered so those parts of the phones probably can't be easily open sourced. Yeah, it shouldn't make a difference as long as you pay the license fee, but that's how these companies think.

      --
      My God, it's Full of Source!
      OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
    3. Re:Question by braindead_in · · Score: 1

      There are few roadblocks for it actually.

      1) The GSM/GPRS/EDGE baseband needs a specific hardware (eg a digital DSP and a RF). The chipset makers Ti, ADI, etc. have it. But before they allow you to work on it you have to sign up for an NDA!

      2) The Protocol Stack itself has to go through an certification process before they can be used on a commercial network. And they are very expensive. The certification process is a business in itself. Its too much of investment required and would be difficult to recover if you make it open source.

      3) Any radio device has to go through the approvals process before it be used. And thats expensive as well.

      Even if you get past these, the Telcos. will most probably outlaw you. They dont want the hardware to open up and get commoditized. That will disrupt the whole pecking order in the market existing right now.

    4. Re:Question by biglig2 · · Score: 1

      Aw crap.

      OK, a box with a double PCMCIA socket in it for the radios, to let someone else worry about this sort of thing? Of course, there's a joke about that.

      Joe stops a man in the street and asks him the time. The man puts down his heavy suitcases with a sigh of relief, and looks at his watch.

      "I'ts 13:27 and 15 seconds preciesely. That's here of course, it's 08:27 in Tokyo. The temperature is 30 degrees; 25% chance of showers later. We are located 127 meters from the nearest Starbucks, and are 172 metres below sea level. Traffic on the freeway is slightly heavy for this time of day, there are two dupes on the slashdot front page, my washing machine at home is just coming onto it's spin cycle, and George Clooney's new movie has got two thumbs up and 3 rotten tomatoes."

      "Wow!" says Joe. "What an amazing watch!"

      "Yes," replies the man, rubbing his hands in obvious discomfort. "It's also bulletproof, waterproof, has Skype built-in, runs OSX and Linux dual-boot, and in the event of a plane crash it doubles as a flotation device."

      "Must have been expensive" muses Joe.

      "No, just $20."

      "Blimey, I've got to get one of those!" says Joe.

      "Oh, I wouldn't recommend it." says the man, heaving up his heavy suitcases and starting on down the road.

      "Why on earth not?" Joe calls after him.

      "Because you have to carry these bastard batteries around everywhere!"

      --
      ~~~~~ BigLig2? You mean there's another one of me?
  21. Good 'ol Motorola Freeware by Bing+Tsher+E · · Score: 1

    I remember the old Motorola Freeware BBS. You could download source code and development tools for all the classic Moto microcontrollers. 6802, 6805, and (most important) the 68HC11. All assembly language work, of course. There's still a lot of 'hc11 code worth slinging, even today. I have a few tubes of parts on hand for future projects.

    Good old Motorola. I wish the good part of the company had kept the name, because Freescale just doesn't have the history that 'M' logo carries.

  22. Finally!!! by thechronic · · Score: 1

    RMS can buy a cellphone!

  23. What, no disclosure of who runs the site by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm completely amazed that the /. editor didn't make a point to mention that the site is powered by the commercial version of SourceForge which is owned by the /. parent company. Nothing like driving up the hit counter and not disclosing the parentage..

  24. Too late... by Chop · · Score: 1
    "Such commitment on open source-development could be seen as a good step, and may show the way to other companies."

    Me thinks they are trying to keep up, or compete, with Nokia's 770 Web Tablet. Next OS version (Q2 2006 release) will include VoIP capabilities. And Nokia has already setup a development community here: http://www.maemo.org/

    Chop

  25. sourceforge? by peektwice · · Score: 1

    Hopefully this is not redundant, but did anyone else notice that they used the word "SourceForge" in various places on the web site, and I assume that the site is SF based, but you don't find a link to it by searching for Motorola on sourceforge.net?

    --
    Other than this text, there is no discernible information contained in this sig.
    1. Re:sourceforge? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      It's using the commercial version of SF (SF Enterprise Edition). It is NOT hosted on the SF.net server complex, therefore you won't find a link to it there.

  26. Where is the A910? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Well Motorola? Where is the JIUX phone with the 802.11?

  27. Outstanding! by Enderandrew · · Score: 1

    When my phone contract is up, I sure hope that Sprint can sell me one of these.

    --
    http://blindscribblings.com - Tasty pop-culture in conceptual fashion.
  28. One word: OpenEZX project by Mafia$oft · · Score: 2, Informative
    I'm astonished that with such a specific Motorola OSS topic, the #1 OSS website about all this hasn't been mentioned yet:
    http://www.openezx.org.nyud.net:8090/

    The OpenEZX project seems to be quite active, with Harald Welte (of GPL-Violations fame) doing a lot of 2.6.x kernel porting and hardware support. Join the mailing list if you are interested in helping out with this rapidly progressing project!

    Unfortunately several people say that Motorola has been less helpful with OSS development than they could have been, but let's hope that this site will change this in a very positive way.

  29. Understand this is for recruiting by m0llusk · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Motorola is having a lot of trouble in the market. In order to make it they have to attract not only more customers, but more top engineers as well. This move could draw in more customers and also interest more potential employees. If this works for them, then this could be an extremely efficient way to build up an email list of competent engineers while at the same time generating the goodwill necessary to harvest their labor in the future.

  30. So where's the source code for MIDP 3.0? by edxwelch · · Score: 1

    I don't even see any proper specs for MIDP 3.0, let allown source code.
    For instance, what new graphical functions are going to be in MIDP 3.0?
    " Enable richer and higher performance games" ...is all it says.
    Seems like just mouth service with no beef behind it

  31. And they're hiring too... by Darby · · Score: 1

    I suppose this is probably related to this job ad I got in my email this morning

    I would apply, but I'm happy in my current job. Also, with my well known skills at smooth talking and diplomacy it would be too easy ;-)