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'Long Tail' May Not Wag the Web Just Yet

Carl Bialik from WSJ writes "Expanding on an article he wrote in 2004 (and discussed on Slashdot), Wired magazine editor Chris Anderson argues in his best-seller 'The Long Tail' that the web is changing commerce from a hit-driven business to one focused on niches. But Wall Street Journal columnist Lee Gomes questions Anderson's data, and adds, 'I don't think things are changing as much as he does.' Gomes writes, 'At Apple's iTunes, one person who has seen the data -- which Apple doesn't disclose -- said sales "closely track Billboard. It's a hits business. The data tend to refute 'The Long Tail.' " ' On his blog, Anderson responds that Gomes 'stumbles over statistics and more, and in the end simply makes a muddle of what might have been an interesting debate over the magnitude of the Long Tail effect.'"

132 comments

  1. The message is clear: by THE+MESSAGE+IS+CLEAR · · Score: 1, Funny

    The web has FAILED!

    1. Re:The message is clear: by 'nother+poster · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yeah. Now all the rest of you kids get off my internet! Using my electrons and clogging my tubes up with their pr0n and myspaces and Youtubes. Back in my day we had Gopher, and we were damn glad to have it, even though our electrons had to go uphill both ways. In the snow!

    2. Re:The message is clear: by Ingolfke · · Score: 2, Funny

      The web has FAILED!

      Thank goodness for Web 2.0!!

  2. Look at Amazon sales by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    Amazon doesn't keep their sales rankings private. There is clearly an element of hits ("best sellers") and long tail (everything else that isn't new). I've seen books from the 90s go from the 500,000s sales rank to the 1,000,000s range and back over the course of a year.

    1. Re:Look at Amazon sales by The-Bus · · Score: 1

      The cool thing is that through AWS (Amazon Web Services) Amazon lets you into some of their data. An example here is the sales history of Running Blogs with Slash . TicTap keeps 60-day sales rank history. I'm guessing with this book there was some free publicity on June 13 and July 19, because the ranks shot up a whole lot. You can then see it died out for a while, then shot back up.

      First off, Amazon sales rankings aren't that useful. But, it's still interesting to look into them. For example, look at the Clerks DVD. It's been steadily gaining sales, presumably from the theatrical release of Clerks II. (You can see the same effect on sales with other DVDs related to recent theatrical releases, from Pirates of the Caribbean to The Sixth Sense. It looks like the effect kicks in a couple of weeks before the movie; maybe when advertising begins to really ramp up?)

      I'm actually surprised this information is given out so openly. In the past, it may have cost thousands of dollars to get this kind of data, if the companies released it at all. Maybe someday Wal-Mart will make their huge database accessible and we can finally find the link between hurricanes and Pop-Tart sales.

      --

      Small potatoes make the steak look bigger.

    2. Re:Look at Amazon sales by kfg · · Score: 1

      500,000s sales rank to the 1,000,000s range and back over the course of a year.

      We call this "noise." What you are seeing is the effect of a random event on low absolute values.

      One extra person bought/did not buy the book to create the variance, whereas one extra/lost sale of a best seller doesn't even register.

      One sale is a datum, not data. Noise is meaningless - unless you're an epidemiologist.

      KFG

    3. Re:Look at Amazon sales by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 1

      Books aren't songs. Book consumers can think better than music consumers (overall), pay more in money and time so are more committed, and have to wait for delivery. In other words, book "hits" are completely different than music hits, and are much more similar to book niches.

      Of course, I hope publishers decide "the long tail" is BS, and concentrate solely on hits. Because the new music hits they manufacture are worthless, and I want them to stop hogging the copyright on all the long tail stuff. So we can all consume and exchange the older stuff as much as we want without paying their extortion, the way we have with folk art since time immemorial.

      --

      --
      make install -not war

  3. How could it not change things? by LunaticTippy · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I don't see how having 3 million songs could not change everything. Even a good record store will only have a few thousand different CDs. Naturally the most popular will match the top 40 or whatnot, but there are millions of extra choices that will sell every now and then. As it grows to 30 million, we can expect the long tail to kick in more and more.

    --
    Man, you really need that seminar!
    1. Re:How could it not change things? by RendonWI · · Score: 0

      You also look at the 3 million songs while only looking at what you are interested in. Unlike a normal store you don't have to look at 6 rows of advertising before getting to the genre you want. That has to change how things work.

    2. Re:How could it not change things? by $RANDOMLUSER · · Score: 1

      It's a question of shelf-space. My local Blockbuster has mostly "hits" on the New Releases shelf, and an even larger percentage of "hits" among the year-old titles they've decided to keep on hand.

      --
      No folly is more costly than the folly of intolerant idealism. - Winston Churchill
    3. Re:How could it not change things? by andrewman327 · · Score: 3, Insightful
      As a fan of very obscure music, I am glad that there is a place I can find it. Try finding A Flock of Seagulls' third album in just any store.


      I think that a lot of the comments here are missing the point. You do not have to advirtise for the bottom 50% of music. It already has a devoted niche following. Just realize that it will never be as popular as the chart toppers.

      --
      Information wants a fueled airplane waiting at the hangar and no one gets hurt.
    4. Re:How could it not change things? by electroniceric · · Score: 1

      I think you're on to something that's the key all this (I haven't read the book, so I'm probably making a weak version of the points the author makes):
              What do people do when they can choose from everything?
      I mean seriously, what if you could go anywhere, see anything,listen to anything, etc.

      This explosion of choice is partly a product of the internet, but also a product of dropping prices on consumer items. Most middle class Americans can now afford any work of music they want, plus with a little scrimping and prioritization, about 80% of the dishwashers, washers, dryers, bedding, etc, they could want. In the example of the CD store the choice the "price" is the effort it would have taken to find the rare album, and the "price cut" is really that the track is just as easy to find as anything else. But so is moving - you can now pretty much move to any major American city and make it - find work, make a few friends, rent or buy a place. Find a job, an apartment, a girlfriend, and a restaurant - all of which you can afford or borrow to afford if you're reasonably well educated - and you're off to the races.

      Here's a speculation: I would bet that the long tail effect is dwarfed by the "all the water sloshing the same way" effect - because choices and changes are so much easier these days, a vast number of people can all make the same choice at once, and swamp something. Hence the pile-ups of people trying to find work in San Francisco, Boston, DC, Seattle and driving rents and home prices up. Had moving been harder, more of these folks would have ended up doing something different than all doing the same thing, and the markets wouldn't have been quite as overwhlemed. OK, fire away on that one...

    5. Re:How could it not change things? by LunaticTippy · · Score: 1

      Well, California has suffered from booms before. 1849 for example. Back then it was very difficult, but still millions did it. People do tend to fall into herd mentality.

      Things have already changed a bit, though. When I was a kid in the 70s there were just a couple of TV shows that people talked about. We have much more choice now. It is kind of neat to run into someone into Red vs Blue or Venture Bros. or some other thing that simply couldn't exist in the 70s. There is a lot of crap too, but that's how it's always been. I'm hoping more smallish things develop followings and can be profitable. So far it looks encouraging.

      --
      Man, you really need that seminar!
    6. Re:How could it not change things? by toad3k · · Score: 1

      Although I've never used itunes I think the main difference between netflix and itunes may be that on netflix you have detailed reviews and ratings for every title no matter how far down the tail it is, whereas on itunes you don't have ratings? and so buying the longtail is more of a risk.

      Also I think there may be a psychological difference between a buck a track and 17 bucks per month. When you are buying at a price per song, you are thinking about whether you are likely to get your money's worth, however I routinely stick random crap tv shows on my netflix queue without considering production value.

    7. Re:How could it not change things? by VAXcat · · Score: 1

      "There's a lot of crap too".....it's like Theodore Sturgeon said, when someone told him that 90% of science fiction is crap. He replied "90% of everything is crap"...too true...

      --
      There is no God, and Dirac is his prophet.
    8. Re:How could it not change things? by costas · · Score: 1

      I think this Long Tail business is just another way of verbalizing The Innovator's Dilemma: we are at the point where a disruptive technology has been deployed (the Web), but the market hasn't caught up yet.

      Example: Lets' say that Anderson's correct and Amazon makes a disproportionate amount of profit from low-sellers. Why is that? probably because the prices of the low-sellers have already accounted for *higher costs* than Amazon is incurring. I.e. those low-selling books still had to be edited, marketed, printed, distributed, sold and returned. Those costs are either reflected in the price of the book, or the book has already been marked down to clear the stock. So, now because Amazon has lower distribution costs than say your local bookstore, they can get rid of that book and still make a profit. But that's the case *now*. Sooner or later, the market will adapt by removing a chunk of the book's cost so that the upstream (author, publisher) can take a cut of Amazon's higher profit. For example, niche publishers may start selling books *only* online, getting rid of the return costs. Or they can print on-demand, or go to e-book only.

      When the market will adapt, two things will happen: more goods will enter the market (as they will become profitable at the new margins) skewing the "long tail", and prices will come down, increasing the cutoff percentile of those items that make a profit and removing this "Long Tail" nonsense.

      None of this is bad: prices come down and consumers get more choice. But the retailers will still have to fight the old battle of picking products that can bring in high margins and organizing their (now infinite) shelves to attract consumers to items that may become hits.

      Just because you now have infinite shelf space and reduced supply chain costs (at only a portion of the business), doesn't mean we got some new economy of "more of less".

    9. Re:How could it not change things? by Eivind · · Score: 1
      Too much is nonfindable as it is. Where can I buy "Natural Tools" by "Weld" ? I had it once, and loved it. Alas, the CD went missing, and after that I've been unable to find *anywhere* to repurchase it.

      I suspect a very large portion of copyrighted works become unavailable a LONG time before copyright expires.

    10. Re:How could it not change things? by tehcyder · · Score: 1
      Try finding A Flock of Seagulls' third album in just any store
      As I can't see any other reason why you'd want to find it, I can only admire your dedication in tracking down and destroying every last example of this monstrosity.
      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    11. Re:How could it not change things? by andrewman327 · · Score: 1
      "Where can I buy 'Natural Tools' by 'Weld'?"


      Right here: Natural Tools by Weld I think the Internet keeps a lot of stuff available (like the aforementioned AFOS and Weld albums) long after 99.999% of the world doesn't really care about it anymore. Needless to say, this is a real boon for those of us still living in the 0.001%

      --
      Information wants a fueled airplane waiting at the hangar and no one gets hurt.
    12. Re:How could it not change things? by andrewman327 · · Score: 1

      I will admit that it was not nearly as good as their self titled debut album, but it was pretty well received at the time and I think there are some good songs on it. What do you think is the matter with it?

      --
      Information wants a fueled airplane waiting at the hangar and no one gets hurt.
    13. Re:How could it not change things? by LunaticTippy · · Score: 1

      It's a very strange market. Now that music, e-books, video, etc. has zero duplication cost and print-on-demand is viable there is effectively infinite supply. Price would tend to zero without government intervention. I don't know if supply and demand even make sense with intellectual property.

      --
      Man, you really need that seminar!
    14. Re:How could it not change things? by DahGhostfacedFiddlah · · Score: 1

      increasing the cutoff percentile of those items that make a profit and removing this "Long Tail" nonsense.

      I don't think you understand the term "long tail" - it's a demand tail, not a profit tail. There will still only be a small demand for [obscure topic], no matter how the pricing and profit models change. It will still be a part of the "long tail" of demand.

    15. Re:How could it not change things? by costas · · Score: 1

      Sure, but if the demand cannot be fulfilled profitably, does it really matter? Because, long-temr, if no-one is looking to meet that demand, then how's that different from what we have now, other than the overall size of the market?

      (I am not arguing, just genuinely trying to understand if there's something I am missing here...)

    16. Re:How could it not change things? by Eivind · · Score: 1
      /me goes *duh* loudly.

      Hi man, I owe you a beer if you're ever in my parts of the world. (Stavanger, Norway that is)

    17. Re:How could it not change things? by andrewman327 · · Score: 1

      Beautiful part of the world; I might take you up on that someday.

      --
      Information wants a fueled airplane waiting at the hangar and no one gets hurt.
    18. Re:How could it not change things? by DahGhostfacedFiddlah · · Score: 1

      I don't think I understand your argument. Why would the long tail become unprofitable? For music, for instance - storage is going to cost next to nothing, bandwidth a per-purchase cost that exactly matches that of hits. Administration costs diminish with every new item added. With next to no per-item-offered expenses, how could it possibly be unprofitable to carry an item?

    19. Re:How could it not change things? by abb3w · · Score: 1

      I think that a lot of the comments here are missing the point. You do not have to advirtise for the bottom 50% of music. It already has a devoted niche following. Just realize that it will never be as popular as the chart toppers.

      I wouldn't quite go as far as to say "don't advertise". However, the focus of targeted advertising campaigns should remain on the big hits, where a small percentage sales increase may yield big numbers. Long tail advertising should probably rely on broader swaths... not single hits, but entire genres; facilitating searches of music, conceptually linking one song to another so people can find more of what they might want, might help. That's one main point of effective advertising: reducing consumer information costs.

      --
      //Information does not want to be free; it wants to breed.
  4. Duh by TubeSteak · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Ecast says 10% of its songs account for roughly 90% of its streams; monthly data from Rhapsody showed the top 10% songs getting 86% of streams.

    Part of the problem is, of course, advertising.

    The biggest sellers are always the most heavily advertised/talked about.

    How do you advertise the other ~90% of your catalog?
    Hint: You can't. Not in any specific way.
    --
    [Fuck Beta]
    o0t!
    1. Re:Duh by RingDev · · Score: 1

      "How do you advertise the other ~90% of your catalog?"

      You can, but at the expense of the other 10% that is currently generating 90% of your income. What successful company in their right mind would risk that kind of cash cow?

      -Rick

      --
      "Most people in the U.S. wouldn't know they live in a tyrannical state if it walked up and grabbed their junk." - MyFirs
    2. Re:Duh by Red+Flayer · · Score: 1

      And I'd be willing to bet that those same 10% of songs represent over 90% of the airplay on pop, pop country, and hip-hop radio stations.

      --
      "Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
    3. Re:Duh by jdcool88 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The best way for these sites to advertise lesser-known products is to adopt the recommendations format of Amazon. I have found a lot of things on Amazon through their recommendations that I wouldn't have known about otherwise.

      Alternatively, they could use a program similar to Pandora.

    4. Re:Duh by rthille · · Score: 1


      Sure you can advertise the other 90% of your content. Look at what Amazon does. They look at what you've bought and said you like and they find other things you might like. Sure, as a consumer, I can't even look at 5% of what amazon could sell me, but a million consumers can cover 95% of what they sell, and actually be interested in buying it.

      --
      Awesome furniture, accessories and cabinetry in Santa Rosa, CA: http://humanity-home.com/
    5. Re:Duh by TubeSteak · · Score: 1
      The best way for these sites to advertise lesser-known products is to adopt the recommendations format of Amazon.
      Well, yes and no.

      Yes, that would draw more people into the ~90% of music that isn't wildly popular
      BUT
      they would be advertising their recommendation 'feature', not the obscure music.

      Too much choice = too much noise.
      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
    6. Re:Duh by Brickwall · · Score: 2, Interesting
      "How do you advertise the other ~90% of your catalog?"

      The following snips are from Slate's recent article on the long tail:

      "At Slate, our inventory is our articles. We publish 20 or so stories every weekday, but we also have a backlog of about 33,000 pieces in our archives. Because those stories are freely available to our readers, a chunk of our traffic each day comes not from our "hits"--current pieces that are promoted on our home page, which typically draw tens of thousands of readers--but from older pieces with narrower appeal. "

      "Why did the piece pull in such consistent numbers? Google. When readers type "Girls Gone Wild" into Google's search box--seeking intellectual succor, no doubt--Levy's piece is the fourth hit. The story here, of course, is not that Levy's dispatches got 2,354 hits last Tuesday; Slate as a whole pulled in about 1.9 million hits that day. The story is that that traffic was free--we paid for the piece years ago, and we didn't expend any additional man-hours last week assigning, editing, or producing it. That means Levy's dispatches provided 2,354 chances for our advertisers to reach our readers--and pay us for the privilege of doing so--without costing us a thing. " Whole article is here: http://www.slate.com/id/2146301/

      --
      What was once true, is no longer so
    7. Re:Duh by greg_barton · · Score: 1
      How do you advertise the other ~90% of your catalog?
      Hint: You can't. Not in any specific way.

      Hint: It's called P2P advertising, or as my grandma used to say, "Tell yer friends!"
  5. Mr. Anderson by Itninja · · Score: 1

    Mr. Anderson told me in an email...
    Mr. Anderson writes that as things move online....
    I was thus a little surprised when Mr. Anderson told me that he didn't have any examples...
    Mr. Anderson told me the lack of an example of misses...
    By Mr. Anderson's calculation, 25% of Amazon's sales are from its tail...

    My name...is NEO!

    --
    I judt got a nre Kinesis keybiartf so please excusr ant egregiou typos.
  6. sales "closely track Billboard" by tcopeland · · Score: 4, Insightful

    > [...] sales "closely track Billboard."

    Right, but isn't that the point of the long tail? If Dan Brown sells a bazillion copies of "Da Vinci Code" and I sell 500 copies of PMD Applied, we're both happy since we're meeting the expectations that we budgeted for. Of course, he's then a billionaire, whereas I've still got my office in the laundry room, but, er, anyhow.

    1. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by OakDragon · · Score: 1

      I think you're right, they seem to be missing the point of the "long tail." (By they, I mean I've read something like this recently at Slate.com.) The long tail seems to be taken to task for not being "big" - but it's not supposed to be big, it's the left-overs for the niche merchants and individual artists.

    2. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by QuantumFTL · · Score: 1

      Your plug-fu is strong, master, you must teach me.

    3. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's some nice comment spam you've posted there.

    4. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by deinol · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Right, but isn't that the point of the long tail? If Dan Brown sells a bazillion copies of "Da Vinci Code" and I sell 500 copies of PMD Applied, we're both happy

      No, Apple is the one that is happy. The point of the 'Long Tail' is really that a lot of money can be made from large stocks of low volume items. Particularly with digital merchandise where no product needs to be stocked or with things like print-on-demand where the product is produced quickly to meet actual orders. You may only sell 500 copies, but when Apple sells 500 copies of 100,000 different less-known artists songs they make a hefty amount of money.

      --
      Got Apathy?
    5. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by tcopeland · · Score: 1

      > Your plug-fu is strong, master, you must teach me.

      Practice, young Jedi, practice :-)

    6. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by LunaticTippy · · Score: 1

      The tail will keep getting longer. Maybe someday it will be long enough that it will be quite big compared to the popular items. Imagine living in the year 3000, with over 1,000 years of movies and music to pick from. Surely there'd be many interesting items for anyone!

      --
      Man, you really need that seminar!
    7. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by QuantumFTL · · Score: 1

      On a more serious note, I should mention that I found PMD quite helpful for my masters project (too many underclassmen writing with bad coding style...). Thanks for all your efforts!

    8. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by tcopeland · · Score: 1

      Many thanks indeed! I was happy to see that the folks at Virginia Tech (Dr Edwards, specifically) are doing the same thing as part of their WebCat automated grading gizmo; more on all that here.

    9. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by TopShelf · · Score: 1

      Not only that, but when you become the most reliable source for those 100,000 lesser-known items, customers will tend to come back to you for the hits as well.

      --
      Stop by my site where I write about ERP systems & more
    10. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by jeremy_hogan · · Score: 1

      > [...] sales "closely track Billboard."

      Right, and Billboard and iTunes both only look at, care about, and pimp "head content". There is not nearly enough tail content in iTunes to make any real determination as to how it affects sales.

      --jeremy

    11. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by ConceptJunkie · · Score: 1

      Put me down for a copy of "Quizblorg, Quizblorg" on SUMHD3D-DVD, please.

      Oh, and the Beastie Boys will have 2 more albums by then...

      --
      You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
    12. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by SeattleGameboy · · Score: 1
      No, Apple is not happy about carrying a huge inventory of tracks that rarely, if EVER, get downloaded. But it is part of doing business.

      The tracks that get almost no play still takes space on your hard drive, eats space on your index, require time to enter information, etc.

      It is highly unlikely that 80% or greater number of tracks in iTunes will every sell enough to recoup the costs.

      Only reason they do it is because the other 20% or so more than make up for the rest and you need to be able to say "we have over 2 million tracks" to get people to come to your site (just so that they can come and download exactly the same songs everyone else is downloading).

    13. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by generic-man · · Score: 1

      Wouldn't that lead to situations like the Loews Aleph_0-Plex from Futurama, with a countably infinite set of movies to choose from?

      --
      For more information, click here.
    14. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by jandrese · · Score: 1

      How much does it really cost to put an album on iTunes though? The hard drive space required is laughably cheap (probably about one penny's worth), and assuming that loading it onto the service requires the equivelent of some tech loading it into a CD-Rom, hitting "rip" and then just double checking to make sure the Gracenote info is correct and tagging the price, well, that's a 10 minute kinda job (if that). This also assumes some large blanket license (there is no way they're negotiating with each band individually), but overall it costs them almost nothing to put an album up.

      On the other hand, Apple's margins on the record store are apparently very very low (they gotta pay for breakage and stuff on their AAC files), so it might take a couple dozen downloads before something breaks even, which could take awhile with some albums.

      --

      I read the internet for the articles.
    15. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by SeattleGameboy · · Score: 1

      It does not take much money to get the song in the database. However, there are A LOT of songs that practically never get touched (I used to workf for a music distribution company). I would say there were about 80% of the catalog that averaged less than 1 download per month.

      So I have spent (and spending) about 80% of my capital investment, and more importantly, on going maintenance cost, for stuff that hardly ever get touched.

      These items will NEVER break even (due to the maintenance - ie. power, share of IT, etc.).

    16. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by mgblst · · Score: 1

      So would your setup really only cost 20% as much, if you didn't host that extra 80% of music?

      No.

    17. Re:sales "closely track Billboard" by SeattleGameboy · · Score: 1
      Do you have a point?

      So let say even if you got rid of the 80% of the title and you only keep the 20% that actually makes money. Let's say it costs twice as much since you are losing the cost benefits from scaling (unlikely, it probably would be closer to 20 ro 30% increase in cost, but lets just assume the worst). That would STILL BE 60% LESS to maintain then the old infrastructure with 80% catalog that lost money.

      So what is your point?

  7. There are a lot of niche markets by isaacklinger · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The long tail is supposedly the collective worth of the niche markets. It may add up to a lot more than the mainstream market, but I believe the tail is naturally distributed among the smaller, specialized suppliers. iTunes can potentially offer to cater to those niche markets, but would someone go to a popular music service to purchase his unique and less popular music?

    The sum of the unpopular music sold, or niche commodity for that matter, may be larger than the sum of popular music sold. Whether or not that's the case is not important to big business. They see in terms of numbers of units sold, and increase the supply (or marketing, or front page links) of the popular items. Any way you slice it, if you want to cater to the long tail, you're going to have to split your resources. And that might not make business sense.

    1. Re:There are a lot of niche markets by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Traditionally, a big brick and mortar company cannot afford to keep niche items in stock in hopes that a customer in close geographic proximity to the store would one day buy that item.

      A net based company is different because its geographic reach is much larger than a brick and mortar company, thus it has a much larger pool of customers. This is where the long tail (or Zipf's law) comes into play. A net company can afford to keep niche products in stock because its customer pool is larger.

    2. Re:There are a lot of niche markets by tjuricek · · Score: 1

      I agree that there's more opportunity for niches to develop with the web then with brick and mortar. But the idea of "hits" still applies; just to a more focused audience.

      Ergo, I think the "long tail" argument is incorrect. Yes, you see niche stuff (like my EDM example) getting momentum on the web, each niche starts to develop it's own little hierarchy of best-sellers, and only after it gets enough traction to generate identity and trust. The difficulty lies in making connections through the meme.

    3. Re:There are a lot of niche markets by DahGhostfacedFiddlah · · Score: 1

      The point isn't to cater to the niche though - just make it available. The niche will take care of itself, but when one Pinhead asks another "Where can I get 'Double-tips and Printed Pins' by Graydon X Philmore", it's in Amazon's best interest that Pinhead B says "Amazon", rather than "it's out of print, there will never be another, here, let me just photocopy my 20-year-old 1st Edition".

      The Long Tail may apply to other domains, but at the moment it's mostly applicable to distribution. Distributors don't have to know a thing about the niche or the audience - they just need to provide a place where people enter their CC number and a database ID to get a product. All niches are represented equally by these distributors, but (and here's the important bit) all niches are represented.

  8. iTMS really doesn't HAVE the long tail by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Much of what I look for: Jethro Tull, German Technopop, ... isn't on iTMS. So, I can't "contribute" my datapoints for the long tail since they're not there to buy. So, the hits are snapped up, but I end up trying to find stuff and failing most of the time.

    Companies should recall that boomers still have a whole lot of money, and iTMS represents a great way to cherrypick songs. Until I start finding what I'm looking for, which was QUITE common "back then", they're only in the mid-tail, not the long part.

  9. People look for fewer options on the web by tjuricek · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It seems to me that the only time you're going to see an obscure product selling better on the web is when it's on a page that's focused on a niche. This is just because most web sites with a large stock make it hard to find quality niche products. You really have to dig to find gems sometimes; and digging isn't what folks seem to do a lot of on the web unless the product's expensive or the digging is fun to do.

    A music example is electronic dance music. I don't go to iTunes for this stuff, because all the major retailers have extremely limited stock, and the stuff they have is all mixes and it's usually crappy "anthem" tunes. But I've found websites like etn.fm that play EDM I do like, and a store (beatport.com) that sells it, so when I'm looking for EDM, I'll check out those sites for what's best in my nice. But there's still the "hit effect" in place, so to speak; I'm far more likely to check out the popular EDM in play.

    If people master a search method that allows you to regularly find what you consider "good", that would probably change the "hit effect". But we're talking about a search tool that can understand people's opinions and current emotional state. I doubt we're going find that anytime soon. Though I'm sure Google's trying.

  10. I don't see that happening. by khasim · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It is possible with items that take no physical space (music on your iPod or NetFlix rentals), but not so with anything else.

    For items that take physical space, the limitation will be the space available to the average consumer.

    If 100 titles account for 90% of your sales and you have 1,000 titles that account for the other 10%, adding 10,000 titles will just give people 11,100 options to take up their limited space. If they have space for 100 items, then most of them will be focusing on the same top 100.

    1. Re:I don't see that happening. by s20451 · · Score: 1

      It is possible with items that take no physical space (music on your iPod or NetFlix rentals), but not so with anything else.

      It is true that data takes essentially no physical space, but it is not true that it takes no resources. A file sitting on a filesystem is maintained in various ways; it is scanned to build file databases, possibly moved in a defrag, possibly copied in a RAID configuration or backup. These operations take a tiny but nontrivial amount of processing time. There is also the extra cost of the larger drives needed to store such a large filesystem, and many other small costs. Once the filesystem becomes sufficiently large, the cost of maintaining the filesystem becomes an issue on the basis of incremental cost per additional file.

      Now, I agree that this cost is at most a penny per year per file, so one sale every few years will probably make up for it. However, the same principle applies to digital music as it does to physical music -- the warehousing costs are much, much smaller in the digital world, but they are not zero.

      --
      Toronto-area transit rider? Rate your ride.
    2. Re:I don't see that happening. by DahGhostfacedFiddlah · · Score: 1

      But it moves the power of choice from the distributor to the consumer. Before, a lot of genres simply didn't have a chance because you could get a Greatest Hits album and not much else in most record stores. Now if you have different tastes from everyone else, your entire 100 items will be taken up by items that simply weren't available before.

      The "top 100" phenomenon is more about retailers than consumers, since a top 100 list for retailers all look the same - "What sells the most". Consumers can pick their top 100 on "What do I like the most", and while there will be overlap, will be significantly more varied than what a retailer would select.

    3. Re:I don't see that happening. by colmore · · Score: 1

      In many modern consumer economies, however, the top 10 only appeal to a minority group though. American Idol may be the most popular show of the decade, but still many more people who watch TV don't watch it than do.

      The fat head (or whatever the opposite of the long tail is -- if that catches on, I'm claiming credit) might be the most lucrative market segment, but if you only cater to it, you're still cutting out the majority of consumers.

      This is exactly the problem with traditional cinema distribution these days; it's unable to cater to the long tail. I expect that once digital movie distribution really kicks in, movie theaters will be small rooms where parties can, in advance, request a showing of whatever they want.

      --
      In Capitalist America, bank robs you!
  11. What a crock! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    On his blog, Anderson responds that Gomes 'stumbles over statistics and more, and in the end simply makes a muddle of what might have been an interesting debate over the magnitude of the Long Tail effect.
     
    In other words: "Gnomes is using math to prove that my theory is shit. Too bad people won't just let me live in my private own deluded world."

    1. Re:What a crock! by overunderunderdone · · Score: 4, Informative

      But did you read the blog post?

      Gomes is refuting Andersons thesis by saying that 20% of the items still make up 80% of the sales (percentages of the old 80/20 rule used for illustration)

      Anderson's response though is that with essentially *unlimited* inventory percentages aren't always the best or only way to measure the "tail". Anderson's definition has to do with the absolute numbers that used to get cut off. So Gomes is counting a bunch of sales as "head" which Anderson is counting as "Tail".

      For example: Imagine a market in which the old brick and mortar stores could stock only the 100 most popular items and that only 20 of those items made up 80% of the sales. In the new world of unlimited inventory there is an ecommerce store has a 100,000 items in stock and the top 20,000 account for 90% of the sales. So before the web the top 20% of items accounted for 80% of the sales but afterwards the top 20% accounts for a full 90% of the sales. Gomes says this means that Anderson is wrong and that the web made things even *more* hit centric. Anderson's "tail" includes items 101 through 20,000 which Gomes is including in the "head". This overlap between Anderson's "Tail" and Gomes's "head" used to be unmarketable "misses" but are now able to find a market & have even increased sales individually and also now make up a significant percentage of total sales to the retailer. Sales that previously didn't exist because the old brick & mortar store didn't have space for the product

      As Anderson said. If Gomes had been a little more intellectually honest about his argument there could have been an interesting debate over how long the long tail is & what the limits of the phenomena are etc. Gomes does have a good point which he simply overstated. 20% of the products *are* still accounting for 80% of the sales, which Anderson's thesis *seemed* to undermine. To be fair Anderson (at least in the original article, I haven't read the book) doesn't dispute that 80/20 rule. Instead I think he could be summed up as saying that with unlimited inventory the 20% of inventory is a much bigger absolute number and also that retailers can profitably capture the 20% of sales that come from the 80% of the inventory that they used to have to forego for reasons of limited physical space.

    2. Re:What a crock! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dude, shut the fuck up. I was trolling. Get a fucking clue. I'm sure you're very proud of your analysis but frankly I was just going for the -1. Dumb bitch.

    3. Re:What a crock! by Anthony+Boyd · · Score: 1
      Gomes does have a good point which he simply overstated. 20% of the products *are* still accounting for 80% of the sales, which Anderson's thesis *seemed* to undermine. To be fair Anderson (at least in the original article, I haven't read the book) doesn't dispute that 80/20 rule. Instead I think he could be summed up as saying that with unlimited inventory the 20% of inventory is a much bigger absolute number and also that retailers can profitably capture the 20% of sales that come from the 80% of the inventory that they used to have to forego for reasons of limited physical space.

      Yeah, I think you're on the right track. I remember reading the article in Wired the first time around. And my impression wasn't that he was suggesting, "ooohhh, the long tail is overshadowing the hits!" Instead, my impression was that he meant, "the long tail exists in a digital world, but not brick & mortar!"

      In other words, Blockbuster stores would stock 10,000 movies. Maybe even 100,000. And that provides enough variety for most customers. But weird freaks such as myself, who want to view every film from Sundance, or want to view every documentary produced in a given year, are pretty much out of luck with Blockbuster. Enter Netflix. They have 1 massive warehouse (or a few), stocking everything they can possibly get their hands on. Maybe 10,000,000 titles. They can ship every obscure film to me, whereas the Blockbuster store down the street cannot.

      So it isn't that the long tail is wagging anything. It's that the long tail exists. It's that 10 years ago there was no long tail market. But now people such as myself will buy things I couldn't before. On the surface, that simply means that Netflix gets 20% more sales (following the 80/20 rule). However, because Netflix provides more of everything, I eventually consolidate 100% of my purchases/rentals there, leaving my Blockbuster account to atrophy. That's why the long tail is so interesting: it's disruptive technology, in a sense. Being able to offer long-tail-anything is a business advantage, which causes other models to be overturned.

  12. It's economics, not statistics by theStorminMormon · · Score: 5, Insightful

    If you don't understand profit, you probably shouldn't write at the Wall Street Journal. Profit = revenue - cost.

    It seems that Mr. Anderson's book (I RTFA, but not the book) claims that higher sales in the tail will increase the profit of the tail and this will change the economics of the web. This doesn't make much sense to me, and the article rightly points out that there is not that much interest in the tail.

    But that's not the point. The point is that to stock "tail items" (niche items) in a brick-and-mortar store COSTS a lot of money. It costs money in terms of the hit-items you can't stock because you've got limited inventory space (opportunity cost at work). But the cost of stocking niche items digitally is far, far less. The promise of profit from the tail is not based on increased revenue as much as it is on decreased cost.

    Take the example of Apple's iTunes sales. Even if they do closely track Billboard sales, this doesn't change the fact that Apple is profiting MORE from their tail items than a brick-and-mortar store would be.

    It seems as though both of these guys are missing the point: the promise of the tail is not in increased revenue, but in decreased cost.

    -stormin

    --
    The Southern Baptist Convention has creationism. On Slashdot, we have porn.
    1. Re:It's economics, not statistics by booch · · Score: 1

      I think you're on the right track, but you miss 2 important points.

      First, the additional availability of the niche products in the long tail will help to increase their sales. For example, I bought a book on metaprogramming from Amazon. I'd been looking for that book for a long time, but was never able to find it. Amazon's ability to (virtually) "stock" that niche item was a major factor in me buying it.

      Second, it's not the individual items that matter. It's the sum of the items in the long tail that add up to become significant. There's a significant amount of revenue in that aggregate. And that's the insight that led to the coining of the term.

      --
      Software sucks. Open Source sucks less.
    2. Re:It's economics, not statistics by Jeff+DeMaagd · · Score: 1

      The other point of the "long tail" is to allow more people to find employment at home doing what they like doing, or to pick up extra money where it might have been impossible even in mail order. The decreased costs you mention is key. I can set up a web store for a small amount of money, a very tiny fraction of buying retail frontage which couldn't be supported by my product line yet. Even the shelf space in a store might cost more than my web hosting costs.

    3. Re:It's economics, not statistics by Iambic+Pentametor · · Score: 1
      I absolutely agree with you.

      Just think of how many bags of sugar are on store shelves in the hopes of a sale for $0.79. The cost to make a product available to your target market via brick-and-mortar distribution is ridiculous! How many Treo700p units were necessary in order to have them sit on Sprintel shelves across the country? How many of those will be sold before another two generations makes them obsolete?

      The reality is different for digital content. Negligible storage and duplication costs mean that advertising is the only marginal cost. And even that is undergoing reinvention. Just a few weeks ago, I had never heard of Jonathan Coulton (http://www.jonathancoulton.com/). I heard RE: Your Brains while listening to part 2 of How to Succeed in Evil: Cheap Labor (http://succeedinevil.com/?p=47) and got hooked. A few YouTube videos and streamed songs from JoCo's website and I was gladly throwing $50 through PayPal to get all of his songs.

      Eventually, the cost savings will allow physical items (like the Treo 700p) to be handled the same way. The cost of return shipments will be dwarfed by the savings in pushing the shiny boxes through retail distribution and the increased.

      Before I get too rabid, I'm not predicting the death of retail. I'm predicting the explosion of online purchasing and the death of scarcity in digital content. The dinosaurs clinging to DRM and Special Extended Widescreen Collectors' Edition DVDs will be swept away by artists producing high-quality (in both technical and artistic senses) downloadable content for a twentieth of the price.

      --
      So, rather than appear foolish afterward, I renounce seeming clever now.
    4. Re:It's economics, not statistics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Parent hit it right on the head. All the previous comments were just side topics to the main point, which is... .. the Tail is the "left overs", or niches, that will become increasingly more profitable due to the change in the way we do business on the internet. The change is a decrease in cost to sell and market the niche market items thus increasing profit.

    5. Re:It's economics, not statistics by qbwiz · · Score: 1
      It seems as though both of these guys are missing the point: the promise of the tail is not in increased revenue, but in decreased cost.


      I don't know about that. I would be more likely to buy books from a brick and mortar bookstore if they have the books that I want (this is ignoring the issue of cost - Amazon.com doesn't discount mass market paperbacks).

      Case in point - I wanted to buy Conventions of War (Dread Empire's Fall) at the bookstore, but they didn't have it. If that book isn't there, the probability that I would spend the money I would've spent on that one book on another is less than 1.0, because the other book is less desirable to me. If the other options are less valuable than the $8 I would pay for the book I want, then the bookstore has lost at least some of that $8 of revenue.
      --
      Ewige Blumenkraft.
    6. Re:It's economics, not statistics by theStorminMormon · · Score: 1

      I'm not trying to be rude, but this is exactly the problem I'm talking about. Business decisions are about profit. One of the most prevalent reasons for making bad decisions about business is the failure to think in terms of profit.

      In your case, you are talking about revenue. You point out that if they don't stock enough books, they will loose revenue because you won't by the book. But what you fail to acknowledge is cost. There are at least two types. First of all, they have to pay rent for every square inch of display. Every single book on a store shelf costs them money directly. Then there's opportunity cost. If one person a week wants to buy book X for $10, but 10 people a week want to buy book Y for $10 (and, for the sake of illustrating scarcity, they have only 1 display space left) then which should they display? If they display X, they are making $10/week from selling book X and LOSING $100/wk for not selling book Y (that's opportunity cost).

      What you seem to fail to realize is that sometimes the right choice for a company is to lose revenue. In your example, the book store lost revenue because they didn't have your book. We don't have to worry abut probability. We can say "if they don't have Conventions of War there is probability 0 that I will buy another book". Fine. But if they make $8 selling the book and it cost them $4 to buy the book, and it has cost them another $6 to keep the book on the shelf until the moment you walked in then they LOST $2 by selling you the book. Get it? If passing on revenue means you save even more in cost - YOU SHOULD PASS ON REVENUE.

      So this is where the Long Tail comes in. Using your example we could say that it costs Amazon $4 to buy the book, but it only costs them $2 to store it* until you buy it. The decrease in costs means it makes sense for Amazon to stock it (revenue - cost = profit --> 8 - (4+2) = 2) whereas it does not make sense for Borders to stock the same book (revenu - cost = profit --> 8 - (4+6) = -2). Even though you bought the book, that doesn't mean Border made money on it.

      That's the whole point of the Long Tail. Books, CDs, etc that are unprofitable if you have to store them in retail space until they are sold can be profitable if you store them in a warehouse (e.g. Amazon, Overstock, etc.) and even more profitable if you store them digitally (e.g. iTunes). So niche items that could not be sold profitably in brick-and-mortar stores would simply go out of print and become rare collectors items in the 1970s, but now they have a chance to live a long and happy life thanks to the ability of the internet to reduce costs and thus increase the profitability of niche items.

      I don't know how much more emphaticaly I can say this: it's all about profit. Revenue or cost - in exlusion of the other - are simply not intelligent ways to make business decisions.

      -stormin

      * the savings in cost can be comprised of both actual savings (e.g. it's cheaper to buy space in a warehouse than retail space) and opportunity cost (e.g. if you have restricted space you have to decide either/or, whereas if you have more space you can stock more stuff and thus pass on less stuff and thus reduce opportunity cost)

      --
      The Southern Baptist Convention has creationism. On Slashdot, we have porn.
    7. Re:It's economics, not statistics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You have it backwards. The "long tail sales" structure is a result of decreased cost of stocking items, not the other way around.

    8. Re:It's economics, not statistics by theStorminMormon · · Score: 1

      You have it backwards. The "long tail sales" structure is a result of decreased cost of stocking items, not the other way around.

      What I said was: The promise of profit from the tail is not based on increased revenue as much as it is on decreased cost.

      How is that backwards? And in any case, the long tail is not a result in the cost of anything. The long tail is just an artifact of the fact that a few items are really popular and account for most of the purchases, while the majority of titles account for only a few sales each. This has been true for as long as there have been brick and mortar stores. You clearly don't understand what the long tail is at all.

      The whole point is that the long tail has always been there. You go to Border and they have the NYT best sellers. (The hump). The rest of the store is the long tail - books that move slower and make less money per title.

      The point is that now that inventory costs have decreased, the long tail will grow longer. It's not being created by low costs, it's merely growing in length and importance. If long-tail items got sold in higher quantities the curve would flatten out and it would no longer be a long tail. If it only makes sense to sell the top 20% of available CDs in a brick and mortar store (tail relatively short), it may make sense to sell the top 50% of available CDs from Amazon, and it may make sense to sell the top 90% if your iTunes. The tail grows in length as increasingly less-popular items become profitable as costs decrease.

      I can't believe I spent this long replying to a 1-line AC. I must be trying really hard to avoid studying.

      -stormin

      --
      The Southern Baptist Convention has creationism. On Slashdot, we have porn.
    9. Re:It's economics, not statistics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Before you come to the conclusion that a respected journalist for the most important newspaper in the world doesn't understand profit, you may want to stop to consider that he is only a journalist. He's not an insider at a record company, for example, who would have access to the cost figures in the brick and mortar world.

      Second, you seem to fail to draw a proper conclusion from your own statements. As marginal cost approaches zero, marginal revenue BECOMES the marginal profit. Thus, using revenue figures is a perfectly acceptable proxy for trying to figure out the impact of these changing economies of scale. And THAT is what is at issue here: everyone has known for years that the costs of doing certain kinds of business would change dramatically, now we're almost able to see just how much. Our lack of perfect information is leading to some conjecture, which is why we have a debate as to how important the tail is.

  13. Agent Smith by digitaldc · · Score: 1

    Agent Smith: Did you know that the first internet was designed to be a perfect online experience? Where none suffered, where everyone would be happy. It was a disaster. No one would accept the program. Entire fortunes were lost. Some believed we lacked the programming language to describe your perfect internet. But I believe that, as a species, human beings define their online persona through suffering and misery. The perfect internet was a dream that your primitive cerebrum kept trying to wake up from. Which is why Internet 2.0 was redesigned to this: the peak of your civilization.

    --
    He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson
  14. Maybe it all depends on how you look at by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    For instance, did he look at the amplification of the hits relative to the niche markets? For instance, if a hit sells 100x as many songs as a niche piece of music before iTunes, and the hit sells 2x as much but the niche sells 50x as much, the hit still has 4x as many sales, but the niche song sold much more than it would have otherwise.

  15. It ain't iTunes, but.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There are "who listens to what" charts here:
    http://www.last.fm/charts/music/track/

    Obviously, any music community that you have to join is to a certain extent self-selecting, but no more so than iTunes. It's not a million miles from the current UK chart, either (last.fm is UK / European based and so that's probably the best comparison).

  16. missing the point by blamanj · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The point of the "long tail" isn't that the sales stop being weighted towards the "hits". You still have a power-law distribution, that doesn't change. The point is that today, the distribution is artificially restricted, because items are dropped from availability. When you extend the number of products available, you make more money from the "tail" products and the portion that came from the original set of hits is smaller.

  17. So how do hits become hits? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If Apple downloads closely follow Billboard, so what? Radio used to be the way pop music was marketed. People are listening to less radio. Overall sales of music are going down. What's happening? More people are marketing their own music on the web. Those sales never make it into the official statistics. Occasionally a hit will happen on the internet and be picked up by a large music company (Ldn by Lily Allen comes to mind). More often you have artists who are really happy if they can sell a thousand of the CDs their buddy burns for them.

    The market is changing because of the internet, the big boys just haven't found a way to quantify it yet (other than blaming their loss of revenue on piracy).

  18. How strange by LunaticTippy · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I have "Story of a Young Heart" on vinyl, bought it when AFOS was still somewhat popular. I was listening to a cassette I made of the album in my old truck (cassette only) just last weekend.

    It's true you don't have to advertise. It doesn't cost anything really to have it available for download. Just sit back and rake in the .99 every few months or so.

    I'd like to see the music industry change in a lot of ways, but one really cool thing would be for the top 40 to account for 10% instead of 99.9% of sales. I don't know if we're headed that way or not. People seem to be following the herd more and more, but at least technology might stack the deck a little.

    --
    Man, you really need that seminar!
    1. Re:How strange by heinousjay · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      It's not necessarily fair to say someone else is "following the herd" because they don't like things the way you do. Your lifestyle is not innately superior, and your way of thinking has no objective edge over anyone else's.

      The arrogance behind that kind of thinking is amazing.

      --
      Slashdot - where whining about luck is the new way to make the world you want.
    2. Re:How strange by LunaticTippy · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I'm pretty arrogant.

      But aside from that, people really do follow the herd. I do it too. You can't seriously believe that tens of millions of people made an educated decision to buy the latest 50 cent album. People are more likely to buy something if it is perceived to be popular. Sometimes it even makes sense.

      Many people use Windows because it is popular. Heck, I do. It makes it easier for me to earn a living if I am comfortable programming Windows applications. I'm not really proud of that, but I at least made a conscious decision.

      I'm sorry that I amaze you with my arrogance, but I really think most people would be happier if they thought through little things instead of going with the flow all the time.

      I don't want everyone to be like me either. For one thing, it's not realistic. If everyone was a computer programmer where would all the toasters come from? I value people who have different preferences and outlooks, sometimes even learn something or see things in a new way. It does make me sad when they don't make a choice about it, just do what everyone else does without thinking about it.

      I used to go along with my peer group in some ways back in high school. I'm much happier now, and even found that there are lots of people who share my tastes.

      --
      Man, you really need that seminar!
    3. Re:How strange by CouchP · · Score: 1

      In my experience, I have a very hard time recalling the names of bands/songs/albums for genre's that I like or have liked in the past. So, the search criteria helps there, not following the crowd that is. But, if you call looking at the top 40 and hearing new and cutting edge songs in order to find new and interesting artists or genres, then, I guess, following the crowd it is.

      In my fellow posters words, though, how arrogant..

    4. Re:How strange by shmlco · · Score: 1

      I think you're confusing popular with new.

      When my favorite author writes a new book I buy it. Same for my favorite musician. In both cases, I already own most of their older works, as do plenty of other people who also like them as well. So when a new book or album of theirs is released, I buy it.

      From my perspective, the majority of the sales proceed from that point, rather than someone thinking everyone is buying 50 cent (over-priced) and they should too.

      --
      Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
    5. Re:How strange by DerekLyons · · Score: 1
      Re: having obscure music available.
       
      It's true you don't have to advertise. It doesn't cost anything really to have it available for download. Just sit back and rake in the .99 every few months or so.

      [sigh] the same "doesn't cost anything really" fallacy.
       
      Sure - it doesn't cost 'anything really' for a single piece of obscure music. The problem comes when you are handling a couple of million obscure bits of music - those little costs start to add up fast. Even if it only costs a (US) penny a month[1] to store an obscure song - then a million obscure songs cost you (US)$10,000/mo just to store them. (And the costs of the delivery end will have to be figured in eventually as well - so must 'overhead' costs like the HR department and the writers who create the text the web spinners will paste in...)
       
      It's not cheap and it's not free when you look at the big picture.
       
      [1] Hard drives cost money. So does the electricity to spin them and the air conditioning to keep the cool. The server they are mounted in, the rack the server is mounted in, and the datacenter the rack is housed in - all cost money. Hardware breaks and must be replaced - and the tech that does the replacing must be paid... etc... etc..
    6. Re:How strange by Eivind · · Score: 2, Interesting
      If you're storing a million songs online, then frankly, $10.000/month is a very small cost. If you sell these songs for an average of $0.69 then you need to, on the average, sell one copy of a song every 5 years or so to break even.

      It's true, songs that sell less than 1 copy every 5 years don't turn a profit, but that's still very different from a record store. Try stacking a record-store with all songs that sell atleast 1 copy ever 5 years....

      Besides, sysadmin-costs and so on do not go scale O(n) with the number of records stored. In other words, if you are already storing 100.000 songs that sell well, then adding a million songs that sell less will *NOT* multiply your costs by 10. It'll be more like a factor of 2.

      Raw discspace is ridicolously cheap. About $1/GB *including* RAID, powersupply etc. (i.e. you can build a fileserver holding 3 terabytes in a RAID and pay $3000 for it) Given that the average song is on the order of 5MB, that means your 1penny/song budget is double the hardware-cost. Migth be realistic, when you factor in backups, sysadmins etc.

      The storage is only going to get increasingly trivial too. Today storage costs on the order of $1/GB, so the storage of this million songs costs on the order of $5000. If capacity/cost continue to double every 18 months, then in 10 years the cost will be about $50. In other words, the entire collection will fit trivially in a home-computer bougth at Wal-Mart for $399.

    7. Re:How strange by LunaticTippy · · Score: 1

      I have 100,000 songs on a $100 drive. It'll last 3 years average. That's 3/100th of a cent per song per year. All the other costs are sunk. You're going to have a datacenter anyway. You're going to have racks. Servers. Just a few hundred watts extra.

      I'm not claiming it's free to sell millions of songs over the internet. I'm claiming if you're selling millions of songs it is insignificant extra cost to have a huge catalog.

      --
      Man, you really need that seminar!
    8. Re:How strange by LunaticTippy · · Score: 1

      I'm the same way. There are many authors I'll pay the "hardcover tax" for. I don't actually know how it works firsthand anymore, but it used to be whatever crap got played on the radio or MTV sold well. Whatever crap wound up on the bestseller list sold well. Didn't matter if it was some self-help book by a nobody, some bogus diet book, if it was on the list people bought it. If Milli Vanilli got played 25x/day people bought it.

      --
      Man, you really need that seminar!
  19. Misses the Boat? by vitaflo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Of course hits are going to continue to outsell the "long tail". I think what the author here misses is that when I buy a "hit" off of let's say Amazon, I may also be buying a long tail item as well. And I may be buying both off of Amazon *because* it lets me buy the long tail item as part of my purchase.

    Stores always want the most selection. If it was all about hits, why stock anything other than the Top 40? Because people want other things as well, even if the Top 40 sells the most. What the long tail does, is makes offering selection much cheaper to the stores.

    Say you have a mom and pop store in a town. They need to take a risk to buy one or two copies of a relatively unknown book or CD. Since they're not buying in bulk they don't get as much of a discount from their distributor. Then they have to hope someone in that area wants to buy it. If not, they're stuck with it because their customer base isn't large enough.

    With an online store, suddenly your potential customer base is millions of people. Many more than the thousand or so that may come into a local store. Now you can order a small bulk order of an obscure item and most likely you will find people who want to buy it, regardless of where they are located.

    In fact, people who find obscure items at your store will probably be more willing to buy other things from your store because you sell the niche items they like. Some of these may even be hits!

    I think this is why the Long Tail is important.

  20. Completely wrong. by shrapnull · · Score: 1

    So long as mainstream media still publishes flashy ads with peppy backbeats business will still be a primarily hit-driven model. What I understand about the "Long Tail" effect is that niches that are out of the current meme can last forever and pick up sales as trends shift and individual taste develops. A failure is no longer an "indefinite" failure, but can be recalled if and when the consumer chooses to do so, leaving an awfully large window by which one can measure 'success' especially if and when an item becomes "en vogue."

    Where it fails is that it assumes this will be the bulk of stores. The bulk of purchases will not be niche-driven, nor nostalgia items (while they will still exist), but rather it will be (drumroll please) mainstream as it always has. When something becomes popular, mainstream gets in on the business and controls it until demand fades.

    Also, people with no preference are forced to choose from what they think they know. What they know is what they see and hear on a daily basis, and big money puts out more advertising. Niche models will still have a place, but will not prevail in the forseeable future. It will still be all the rage in basions like San Franciso, but hell, hasn't it always been cool to consider yourself 'underground' and 'elite.' Don't think it's above mainstream to stoop there too.

    --
    If you're half as beautiful naked, you'd be 4 times as beautiful with twice as many clothes on.
  21. The Long Tail and the Blogosphere by Rachel+Lucid · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Personally? I think the 'long tail' effect is going to be highlighted more in the blogosphere.

    Case In Point:

    Person A likes something really popular at the moment(Say, Pirates of the Caribbean), but also likes some less popular things at a constant rate for a longer period of time (the DS Lite, Gaia Online, Crocs) and some niche things that have a burst of interest for a short time period (Sonata Arctica, Super Princess Peach, Jibbitz)

    Person A blogs about all seven items in a single entry, and most likely spends more time talking about the niche things in total than on the really big popular item. Likewise, while information about PotC is probably easily accessible on Wikipedia or elsewhere, the user may have to seek out (and link to) niche sites for the less popular items, and thus lead her readers to these niche sites as well. The niche sites generate interest for the niche item, and boom, we now have more people wanting the niche.

    It's the rough equivalent about how Shopping Centers usually have an 'anchor' in the form of Wal-Mart or a Bookstore, and then have the specialty shops around it to fill out the real estate. As more people notice themselves doing this with their blogs/LJs/MySpace/whatever, the niche items gain swing and soon gain a sizable portion of the market in this way.

    The internet's main impact on the Long Tail is its ability to piece together far-flung bits of interest in an item, allowing them to congeal into a sizable force. Saleswise, however, the impact is only noticable to internet sellers (or big volume concrete sellers, like department stores), since smaller concrete retailers still find the costs of marketing to a niche prohibitive unless they dive into specialties. However, with the Long Tail, the consumers of these niche items become far more entrenched than before.

  22. Long Tail vs. Sustainable Content Production by G4from128k · · Score: 1, Insightful

    I would submit that the long tail, in any form, creates false hopes for content creators. Consider the economics of being in a band with 4 members plus a couple of multi-talented support crew (e.g. manager, equipment engineer, lyricist, sound engineer, etc.). Such a group needs to clear $120,000/year after expenses (equipment, vehicles, gas, marketing, etc.) just to stay above the poverty line (20k/person before taxes). That's suggest a gross of $150,000 to $200,000.

    Getting that from iTunes means getting 150,000 to 200,000 downloads per year. If the group creates one album of new songs each year, and if the band's album is like most, then maybe 3 "good" songs shoulder the burden of feeding the band. The band would need their three good songs to average more than 50,000 downloads/year (that's 1,000 per week). That's a 1,000 downloads per week just to stay afloat. If, by some miracle, the band creates 12 good songs every year and has a deep backlist of 24 more good songs with steady sales, then they still need to average 80 downloads per each and every song.

    iTunes has about 3 million songs and perhaps 25 million downloads per week. Thus the average song only gets 8 downloads per week. Under the long tail model, the vast majority of songs have average performance and relatively few have above average performance. That means that the vast majority of songs don't pay enough to keep a band above the poverty line. In fact, under this model, iTunes probably represents only 1% to 10% of the money needed to stay afloat.

    My point is that the long tail is great for consumers because it gives them more choice. But the model consigns the majority of the content creators to a below subsistence wages existence as they hope that they can climb out of the deep long tail.

    --
    Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.
    1. Re:Long Tail vs. Sustainable Content Production by cdrguru · · Score: 1

      I don't care how incredible your new-paradyme way to distribute music is. If iTunes is charging $0.99 a song to the consumer, a band is not going to get $150,000 from 150,000 sales through iTunes. Far from it.

      While iTunes might have the best business model in the world, they aren't going to do it for free very long. Sure, at some initial point selling music at cost without expenses pushes the iPod into people's pocket. But that only goes so far. Then, reality sets in.

      I think $150,000 income would require 1,500,000 downloads (or sales) because just the operational cost is going to come to nearly $0.89.

    2. Re:Long Tail vs. Sustainable Content Production by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Lets not forget that a record label band only gets points of the profits rather than getting paid direct profits. The indy band gets direct profits.

    3. Re:Long Tail vs. Sustainable Content Production by kthejoker · · Score: 1

      An alternative band economics tutorial for a mid-sized band with regional/semi-national touring (from an ex-band member):

      You have 3 members. You have a booking agent (who collects 5% commission on all gigs booked) and otherwise it's all you.

      You play 40 gigs. You make (a fairly liberal) $1,000 a gig. (Some places pay $100. Some places pay $2,500. Most places pay around $1,000. Plus free beer!) $40,000 - your agent's take ($2,000) = $38,000 in concert revenue.

      Your latest CD's production session cost you $30,000, you printed 10,000 CDs for $1 a CD = $10,000. You sell 20 CDs at each gig, at $10 a pop, netting you $80,000 - ($40,000 costs) = $40,000 on CDs. Doubled your investment!

      You also make shirts and stickers, but those are basically sold at-cost as promos for your bands (for future concerts + CD revenue.) Profit line: we'll be generous and say you make $5,000 on swag. (If you are a major-label band, you make much, much more on your shirts. Some mid-level indie bands try to do this kind of thing, too. Major turn off. (I'm looking at you, Yo La Tengo.))

      And finally, one of your songs gets picked up for play on a regional sports commercial (happens more than you think), and you get a hefty $5,000 contract for a royalty-free limited use of your song in that commercial. (This is unlikely for your average band, but happens a lot at the level just below the superIndies.)

      (If your song is picked up for a soundtrack to a big-budget movie, you can pull up to $40,000. Then you can subsidize your CD sales a bit to increase exposure. Which you offset by negotiating for a slightly higher appearance fee at concerts. The major coup for ANY band is to get exposure on a nationally-marketed product. Ideally one you can sleep on at night after you snuggled with it.)

      Total revenues: $88,000.

      Costs:
      Travel to the gigs: $5,000.
      Hotel: $5,000. (A money-saving tip: make friends in cities you visit who have beds you can use.)
      Equipment repair, and other music-related expenses: $1,000. (Unless it all gets stolen. Ask Pretty Girls Make Graves.)

      We'll assume that food is out of pocket (it usually comes from the band slush fund, but that's out of pocket, technically), and all other expenses incurred are auxiliary (not guaranteed to happen), and while you should of course have a good contingency if bad things happen, they're less costs than crises for a band anyway (#1 cause of band fighting: whether something justifies spending band money on it, instead of personal money.)

      Total costs: $11,000.

      Revenue ($88,000) - costs ($11,000) = $77,000. Divided by 3 leaves you about $26,000 each. Which is actually a bit higher than the best I ever made in a band ($22,000) but then again, we never made any money on shirts, and we didn't gig quite this much. Plus the gig only lasts maybe 3 months, and then you need a real job for the rest of the year, so you make another $18,000 working in your label's mail room or stocking groceries or doing tech support or whatever. And you wait till next year, where you might make $30,000 on the road, and you won't have to work one month. The American Dream, realized.

      Now if you're an established act on a good label (think Fugazi or Apples In Stereo) you probably can pull 4 or 5 times this much money just on increased appearance fees alone. If you're just starting out on regional touring, you'll be lucky to make 75% of this.

      One of the hidden advantages of being in a band is having multiple members. The 3 of you can cover 3 times the ground one person can, posting flyers, doing interviews, getting your name out, manning phones, etc. You really have to work as a cohesive unit on the "business" side of being in a band if you want to succeed. If one person simply refuses to help out, they've got to go, and the sooner the better, because being in a band of the dedication level I described requires financial sacrifice. To make up for it, you need real dedication to the band's economics from all of its members. And the plus is, if

  23. Forget about iTunes... by bennomatic · · Score: 4, Insightful
    My feeling about the long tail is that it means that books should never go out of print. With self-publishing houses like Lulu.com printing books on demand, there's no reason that I shouldn't be able to print a copy of any book I want, with any kind of binding, etc.

    A couple of years back, I was telling a friend about a great book I had as a kid, called "Who Needs Donuts" by Mark Alan Stamaty. My friend had just had a kid, and I was thinking it would be cool to get a copy for him, but it was long out of print. I shelved the idea for a few months, and then decided to try again, and if that didn't work, scan my old copy, which I had saved, and print a new one. In the intervening months, the book came back for a reprint, 30 years after its first printing.

    My feeling is that it shouldn't have been that much work, and there's no reason the publisher should have to print up a whole multi-thousand book run. The occasional nostalgia buyer would do really well for publishers and authors who have low-volume books.

    So if I want to find old editions of the Book of Knowledge from 1944, where the commentary following the story of "the first men on the moon" indicates that "maybe your children's children's children will walk on the moon", I should be able to.

    In short, no more dark ages. No lost wisdom. No lost idiocy, either.

    --
    The CB App. What's your 20?
    1. Re:Forget about iTunes... by jgmitchell · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yep, this is exactly what this about. Technology and the internet make things such as older books and music available because of on-demand-printing, inexpensive storage and transfer.

      Seriously, what does it cost for a book publisher to store an electronic copy of a book and than kick out a single copy when somebody decides they want one?

  24. Targeted Ads are good business by Kadin2048 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    An excellent point -- there might not seem to be any way to advertise the other 90% of apparent "non hits," but that's only when you consider advertising in the traditional, fixed billboard and shelf-end type of way.

    Advertising can take a lot of different forms, and I think Amazon is just scratching the surface with their recommendations. As advertising companies become less obsessed with just shotgunning a "message" out to as many eyes and ears as they can, and hoping they hit the right audience in the process, and instead catch on that you can get a lot more bang for your buck when you don't try to sell the same product to everyone, I think the "recommendation engines" type of ad-delivery will play a bigger role. (Because, when you get right down to it, the difference between a "recommendation" and an "advertisement" is just the context.)

    There are always going to be hits, because people always want new stuff. Even if everyone had access to the entire back catalog of human civilization, for free and on demand, there would still be 'new hits.' Not as big, probably, because right now there are a lot of people who only listen to hits because they can't find the stuff from the back catalog that they want, but they would still happen.

    What has to happen is that the music/movie companies have to realize that "hey, we make just as much money if you buy a song from 1994 than if you buy a song from 2006." That's the key thing that I don't think they've really understood yet, as evidenced by their seeming refusal to advertise anything but the newest stuff. A sale is a sale -- particularly when selling a back-catalog song doesn't mean that it's been sitting in a warehouse for 10 years, doing nothing but tying up capital.

    What I see happening is more individually-targeted advertising that takes into account consumer preferences and offers up stuff from the catalogs for them to buy. Once you've accepted that it doesn't matter whether the consumer buys "MI:3" or "Dr. No," as long as they're both your products, you can advertise whichever one they're more likely to buy. In fact, it's stupid not to advertise whichever one you think they'll buy, because to do otherwise risks losing a possible sale. It just makes good marketing sense.

    This requires that you have a lot of information on the purchasing patterns and preferences of each customer, but that's not hard to get (and a lot of people will give that up freely, if it means they get good recommendations).

    --
    "Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
    1. Re:Targeted Ads are good business by Scroatzilla · · Score: 1

      I think advertising as we know it is dead. All advertising is, is manufactured information. The long tail is the natural state of things; it's just a reflection of the real tastes of real people. The new "advertising" already exists in sites like this and myspace (sorry to lump this site and that one together, but...), where the critics--amateur and pro alike--have been set loose.

      The "big star" concept isn't dead, but soon there will be a crossover where "big stars" will be bubbling _up_ from the long tail, vs. being crammed _down_ to the masses. The more universal the appeal, the bigger the star.

      The scales will be tipped toward artists, because they will no longer have to fit into any kind of stereotypical fake "old advertising" mold. Instead, because of easy, cheap, wide digital distribution, art will find its audience--or possibly die a nice, silent death, without anyone having sucked a zillion dollars down the drain.

      And somewhere in between, people will be making decent, modest, non-billionairre livings, like the rest of us.

  25. It's about where that revenue goes by jfengel · · Score: 1

    The idea of the long tail is the area under the curve. If he height of the curve represents the amount of money going to any one item, the area under the curve is the total amount of money available. That area is supposed to be more or less constant: people will spend a fixed amount of money on books, music, etc. They may spend a bit less on music if the music itself is cheaper, but in general the assumption is that things will even out so that prices would rise and/or people would buy more music.

    The long curve is about shifting the curve so that it's flatter. Same total revenue but distributed to more people.

    The profit doesn't really enter into it. It may be cheaper to produce indie music/books/movies/etc, but it may not. A studio may spend $200 million to make one movie and sell $400 million worth of tickets. Or 2,000 little indie studios could make 2,000 movies for $100k each. One will be a blockbuster hit and make $100 million. Three will be minor hits and make $5 million. The rest will sit there on the tail, and most of them will make squat or turn a bare profit.

    But aggregated, they'll all make up about the same $400 million on $200 million in revenue. The winners change, and the profitability computations get complicated (somebody won a zillion times more than the studio ever could have; many suffered losses.)

    The consistent winner, as you point out, will be the companies that "own" the tail. Those companies are like the current studios: big central points of reference where people when they want stuff: Amazon, iTunes music store, eBay. Like the studios, they depend heavily on marketing, and that keeps out other players.

    To sum up, it's less about the amount of profit as redistributing where the revenue. The cost of that profit is actually not all that different from what it used to be, once you factor in the losers; there are a great many losers on the long tail.

    But it sucks revenue away from the big hump in the center. They're losing out to a new competitor: they might actually split that $400 million that people are willing to spend on a movie with the long tail, but if they get only half of it they're profitability has gone from 100% ROI to 0. And that's all the difference in the world.

    1. Re:It's about where that revenue goes by theStorminMormon · · Score: 1

      The long curve is about shifting the curve so that it's flatter.

      This is incorrect. See the wikipedia article on the topic: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_tail

      The curve represents sales of a type of commodity. Say CDs. The height of the curve is the volume of sales. The curve has a very high "hump" near the left - representing that a few select titles (the hits) make the majority of the sales. The "long tail" doesn't refer to shifting anything, it refers to the narrow part of the graph to the right of the hits. The "also rans". The sales for any given title in the long tail don't justify stocking them in brick-and-mortar stores. But the cost of inventory decreases for centralized distributors like Amazon or Overstock, and almost dissappears for digital media. As a result, these companies can eek profit out of the vast majority of titles that you would never find in a brick-and-mortar store.

      The profit doesn't really enter into it.

      This is nonsense. You don't run a business by saying "profit doesn't enter into it". No profit means not making money. Businesses, with rare exceptions, don't do things that don't make money. Profit may not always be the only or even the most important consideration, but it ALWAYS "enters into it".

      The cost of that profit is actually not all that different from what it used to be, once you factor in the losers; there are a great many losers on the long tail.

      This just doesn't make sense. The losers ARE the long tail, by definition. They are the things that appeal to only a few people. If there weren't losers, they would be part of the hump, and not part of the tail.

      As far as redistributing revenue, this is purely speculative. The long tail may contain more than the hump, or less than the hump. But there's no bright line demarkation of what is in the hump and what is in the long tail, and so it doesn't make sense to compare them in this way. The point of the long tail is that based on lower costs companies can afford to offer a greater selection. In addition, some niche companies that don't have any hits at all can survive on just niche items becausee of lower operating costs.

      It also doesn't make sense because the phrase "cost of profit" is nonsensical. Profit is what's left over AFTER the costs have already been deducted out. You really need to realize that revenue and cost mean NOTHING as disconnected entites. The only mean something in context. If you "raise revenus 100%" or "cut costs 200%" this means NOTHING. Thinking about cost or revnue leads to ridiculuous things. Want to reduce costs to 0? Shut your business down. Losing $100 on every unit of x you sell? Sell twice as many and you revenue goes up 100%.

      Read the article on the long tail and keep profit fixed firmly in mind and you can avoid a lot of the weirdness. You may have some really good points. I can't tell because your terminology is too confused.

      -stormin

      --
      The Southern Baptist Convention has creationism. On Slashdot, we have porn.
  26. Flawed Argument by twofidyKidd · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Citing the iTunes store as representative of anything but a "Hits Business" is flawed. I think consumers who represent the statistics in the long tail don't shop at the iTunes store. While I know it's not a vaild argument to cite what my own purchasing practices are, I for one spend a lot less on music at iTunes and more at places like Om Records, Defected, and other independent label online stores. In fact, if I do purchase at iTunes, it's usually a very popular song which is consistent with iTunes being in the "Hits Business". The arguer is right about that, but wrong about who it accurately represents.

    --


    Hades, PoD: Official Advocate
  27. Long tail effect by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yes, but in Soviet Russia the tail longs for you*

    * Disclaimer: Soviet Russia no longer exists and may never have exactly matched comments in this post which are for illustrative purposes only. Anonymous Coward industries takes no responsibility for geeks swarming towards present day Russia where the tail may long more for their dollars than for their persons.

  28. I think you're looking at it wrong. by Kadin2048 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I think you're factually correct, but your conclusions are wrong. The long tail doesn't really help content creators who can't develop a large market for their work. Period. You can't make $200,000 a year, if you only sell $100,000 worth of stuff. "New media," or "the long tail," or any other buzzwords are not going to help you. (Creative accounting might, but not for very long.)

    Where I think you're off-base is to somehow imply that the situation that your hypothetical band faces is any worse than the situation they have right now. At least in this model we're discussing, they have the possibility of making a few bucks from their music alone -- perhaps enough to make simply recording music a pleasant hobby, if not a day job. It might be enough for a garage band who previously played only for themselves to justify buying some better equipment, or justify it instead of some other way of spending their free time.

    The band who is not going to make a professional career out of the "long tail" music scene, certainly wouldn't be able to do it in a purely corporate, hit-driven model, where your odds of success are comparable to what you'd find by playing the Lottery (and the effect roughly the same -- for every person who strikes it rich, dozens if not hundreds of other bands go bankrupt).

    If you were a band that could have done well under the old hit model, then you can still do well today; the 'hit effect' still abounds, and by cutting out the middle man, a band today or tomorrow could conceivably make more money selling less songs, but cutting out the labels' overhead.

    Furthermore, in your calculations you're leaving out the band's income due to non-music sales: concert tickets, merchandise, endorsements, etc. Those make up the bulk of a popular band's revenue today, under the studio-centric model, and that probably wouldn't change immediately. People are still going to want to go and see a band they like in person, wear that band's t-shirt, and companies trying too hard to be hip are always going to be willing to pony up dough to artists willing to promote their schwag. It's a mistake to assume that a band's main source of income must come from iTunes. In reality, a smart band would treat the iTunes income as a "bonus," and use it in ways that help to increase their real revenue sources.

    Nobody ever said that being a musician should be easy: that you should be able to just make music and then wait for the money to roll in. Succeeding in that business is like any other, it takes a lot of hard work; under a 'long tail' model, the most successful bands would probably be the ones that stay endlessly on tour, working venues small and large, selling high-markup merchandise, and using their music essentially as an advertising vehicle for self-promotion and to establish a fanbase. If the Internet allows them to derive income from their music directly instead of having to pay radio stations to pay it (as the studios basically used to do), all the better.

    --
    "Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
  29. How to Dig out of the 'Deep Long Tail' by Rachel+Lucid · · Score: 1

    Let's go back to your assumption of having 12 'good' songs (averaging 8 downloads a week), 24 okay songs (averaging maybe 4 hits a week), and add on another 12 crap songs (maybe 1 download a week). (12 * 8) + (24 * 4) + (12 * 1) = A little over 200 downloads a week.

    That's $200 a week that the band can count on, if they sit on their ass. Now let's assume that they're not.

    Let's toss in that every concert they play, they manage to spike iTunes downloads enough to make an extra $100 each time, with a residual of $10 a week to add onto their sitting-on-ass total thanks to continued interest. Let's also say that the band gets slashdotted/Digged every now and then and this gives another $100 spike with $40 residual when this occurs, while the average user's blog drums up maybe only $5 in extra revenue for a day with no noticable residual.

    So...

    Week 1:
    $200 normal revenue
    $100 concert spike (and one guy blogs about it next week on MySpace)

    Weeks 2-5:
    $200 normal revenue + $10 concert residual (+ $5 from the MySpace post for one week)

    Week 6: (Slashdotted about an upcoming concert at the end of the week):
    $210 normal revenue
    $100 concert spike (with $10 added residual + ten people blogging about the concert)
    $100 Slashdot spike (with $40 added resiual + added concert interest + five fans coming out of the woodwork to blog again)

    Week 7:
    $260 normal revenue + $75 in blogging revenue

    And the cycle continues ad nauseum. Yes, Not even making $500 a week on iTunes sucks, but we're not even including how many of those users bought actual CDs, posters, apparel . . . it may be that $500 is a perfectly good showing if they can count on that without even having to do anything, and my model suggests that every time they actually DO something, it only gets higher. It's easy to see how if the cycle continues at this rate, our hypothetical band could easily hit $1000 every few weeks or so with the right amount of activity and press. (And I didn't even include the impact making new songs has on their income!)

    Quite simply, if there wasn't money to be made in the Deep Long Tail, there wouldn't be content providers there.

  30. Lyricist, what? by eldalonde · · Score: 1, Insightful

    First of all, as the other poster said, while this situation may suck for a band, it's not really any worse than how it sucks now. Not to mention that playing shows is how most bands make most of their money. Anyway, that's been said already. I take issue with your breakdown of the payout a band gives. Essentially I think you have no idea how small bands that aren't in the mainstream operate. When I read that you would pay a "lyricist", I almost broke out laughing. Outside of manufactured pop bands (who aren't likely to be in the long tail) most bands write their own songs and lyrics themselves. I don't know what kind of music you listen too, clearly not much in the long tail. Most bands at this level probably don't have a manager either. Under your economics they just plain couldn't afford a manager and so they probably would just manage themselves. Equipment manager - most small-time bands do this themselves, it's only the big-shots who have people looking after their guitars for them. Sound engineer is the only reasonable one on your list there for a small band, however they're sure as hell not going to take in an equal share of the profits as the other band members. The sound engineer would produce their album and then be done with it. It would be a contract job, not an equal stake. Regardless of your ridiculous assumptions about the nature of small bands and what they spend their money on, you are somewhat correct. The long tail helps consumers more than producers, perhaps. However, part of the long tail online is that things can be bought from far across the world. This helps a band get a larger geographically dispersed audience rather than simply getting people in their local area.

  31. Sears & Roebuck, the "long tail" of retail. by Kadin2048 · · Score: 1

    I'm glad somebody pointed that out.

    There's a reason it's called "the long tail" and not "the long club-foot." The tail tapers out -- it's not very big, in terms of sales volume per item. It just goes on for a while (hence, long).

    Right now, the tail is chopped off because of the costs of maintaining a huge physical inventory. It's only economical to keep the stuff in stock which generates a certain number of sales per week, because it costs a significant amount of money to keep it there. Digital distribution reduces this cost -- it doesn't eliminate it -- so that it's now practical to keep a lot of stuff 'on the shelf' that wouldn't be there otherwise.

    As a result of this, these "tail" items will probably get more sales than before, when they got zero exposure, but I don't think anyone's saying that they'll suddenly grow to the point of being bigger than the "body."

    The point is just this: as the marginal cost of stocking an additional item approaches zero, the number of items you can keep in stock approaches infinity. (Note 'approaches,' which doesn't mean 'equals.') Or in other words, there's money to be made, and if you can keep your costs low by using new technology, you can make it.

    I think people are hyping this a bit out of proportion. It's analogous to the changes that happened to retail when mail-order companies first appeared at the beginning of the last century. Suddenly you weren't restricted to buying the one model of stove that your local general store had on display -- because of centralization and transportation, it was now practical for Sears & Roebuck to stock 10 or 20 different models of stove in a single warehouse somewhere, and ship you whichever one you wanted via Rail Freight. Digital distribution takes this one step further, by making the warehousing and transportation even cheaper.

    The only thing that makes digital distribution startling is just how much cheaper it makes selling the "one more copy." While the difference in costs between a general store and a centralized warehouse might mean the difference between stocking one model stove and stocking 20, digital distribution means that an online music store can have millions of titles for roughly the same cost as a physical store with a few thousand.

    But take away the orders of magnitude difference in costs, and the overall change is very similar to what we've seen in other industries before.

    --
    "Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
  32. Is that meaningful? by yankpop · · Score: 2, Interesting

    So what? How many copies do you need to sell to get an Amazon rank of 500,000? How many for 1,000,000? I'm guessing that to qualify for a rank of one millionth you'd have to sell somewhere in the 0-1 copies range. So if two people bought your book in the last week you might 'spike' to 500,000th, then drop right back down until your next sale in 2020. Hardly a compelling argument to support the importance of the long tail.

    yp.

  33. Reality is in between by ursabear · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I think the whole discussion about the long tail is interesting and worthwhile.

    I think the truth between the two discussions (Anderson vs. Gomes) is more likely to be something in the middle, not at one extreme or the other. I don't think hits are going away, and I think hits make their mark on most any marketable thing/meta-thing. With that said, I think that niches are more meaningful and valuable than ever before.

    The book example is great - I get more access to niche publications because of the long tail concept, largely because of funding and popularity of hits. Said a little differently: the niche stuff generally sits alongside the hits, and generally benefit from some of the hits' halos.

    My music isn't hit music. That's OK, it's just stuff made from my soul, and I am not planning to quit my day job. The money made from niche availability on the internet (for me) fund dinners out, an occasional instrument upgrade, or a small household bill or two. Why is the long tail beneficial to me? Because when someone is browsing James Blunt, they'll often see me on the front page in a promo, and sometimes (well, briefly) listen to my stuff too. Similarly, iTunes/Rhapsody/Emusic/Yahoo! Music/etc. browsers often buy the latest hits, but will splurge on a Jimmy Bear tune or two - how do they find my tunes? Because my niche music is available with the hits, and because searches sometimes come up with one of my funky little musings.

    My point is, that niche stuff isn't taking over the world, and hits aren't all there is. I think the niche markets of the world have been greatly enhanced by Internet access, and that they also benefit from proximity to the hits.

  34. not really by YesIAmAScript · · Score: 1

    Yes, some say the point of the tail is the length. That with proper margins you can even make money off of small volume stuff.

    But more people use long-tails to state that if people could buy off-brand and specialized products as easily as they can buy mainstream stuff, the off-brand stuff would gain a disproportionate boost in sales. That is, big brands have advantages due to inequal distribution in traditional channels.

    Since iTunes is equal access, it should show off-brand stuff selling at higher rates than through other channels. If it doesn't (as is said here), then it would put a crimp in the acceptance of this part of the long-tail theory.

    I don't really believe in this theory that much. I personally think that people buy stuff through familiarity (both from experience with brands and from advertising) much more than the proponents of the long-tail would suggest. For example, look at the success of fast food. None of it is particularly good, but it still sells, especially when you are buying something in a new market (which in the case of food is perhaps when you are on the road).

    --
    http://lkml.org/lkml/2005/8/20/95
  35. Your right, but wrong analogy by DavidShor · · Score: 1

    Fast food tastes very good for a low price, thats why its so popular. Most fast food customers are local consumers who fit it into their daily routine(for better or worse).

  36. Doubt it by DavidShor · · Score: 1

    I think costs are fairly proportional with downloads, as the major cost is streaming. The costs you mentioned are very insignifigant, as each song is only around 3 megabytes. I'm not sure about the exact cost, but I have a feeling that its in the micro-cents.

    1. Re:Doubt it by SeattleGameboy · · Score: 1
      First, it is more than 3 megabytes of storage since you need to store the original in non-compressed format (you can do lossless, but it is a wash since then you have to spend more CPU cycles) PLUS any number of formats you support.

      Then you can add the prices for the cached sites all around the world. You maybe able to get around not caching unpopular titles, but when the user tries that unpopular title for the time and it takes considerably longer time than other regular titles, they bitch, and they bitch LOUD.

      And you have to remember that vast majority of the catalog never gets touched - about 80%. That means 80% of your on-going maintenance cost is for stuff that you never sell.

      Even if the per-track monthly cost is in the micro-cents, they add up fast when they are in millions.

  37. It exists for some products by LParks · · Score: 1

    You CAN advertise any part of your catalog very specifically to people who like similar products.

    Especially with things like music. Look at some internet radio like http://www.pandora.com/ or http://www.launch.com/ there are some great ways to market that 90% that doesn't usually get big advertizing.

    Both of those sites let you start off your own internet radio stations, and then they try to match your preferences and bring in similar music, and once in a while they throw in a curveball that you may or may not like.

    So I start off a station with my favorite Indie Band A that gets marketing, and then I hear favorite bands B, and C. But whats this? Some new Band D that I've never heard because it is never advertized? Cool, I like this!

    It's a lot like Amazon's preferences, and products that can be marketed in this manner support the idea of the Long Tail. But it definately is not for every market.

  38. Best way to advertise: PRICE by maillemaker · · Score: 1

    >The biggest sellers are always the most heavily advertised/talked about.

    When all songs cost basically the same (say, $.99 as most do on iTunes), that's true.

    But what if the "hits" cost $.99 and the "old stuff" cost, say, $.50?

    How many people would sort by price and suddenly start buying on PRICE instead of what the latest advertising is pushing?

    When all songs cost the same, there is no tail.

    Steve

    --
    A work that expires before its copyright never enters the public domain and thus enjoys eternal copyright protection.
  39. Mod Parent Up by QRDeNameland · · Score: 1

    I think you explained Anderson's rebuttal point better than he did.

    --
    Momentarily, the need for the construction of new light will no longer exist.
  40. Targetted advertising. by jotaeleemeese · · Score: 1

    The only gaming machine i have is a PSP.

    The shop that sold it tome asked me about itand i told them so.

    StillI keep getting advertisements for other gaming platforms and far and between forPSP titles, novelties and news.

    Companies are sitting in a gold mine of information and are doing naught with it

    --
    IANAL but write like a drunk one.
  41. Data by bitspotter · · Score: 1

    First of all, unpublished data doesn't count. Gomes has the privilege of not only analyzing Anderson's data, but of criticizing Anderson's analysis. Anderson has none of that. Nothing to see here - literally!

    Second, iTunes catalog is certainly skewed toward commercial catalogs, and not toward most musicians you'd find appealing to the Long Tail. Given this selection bias, is it any wonder Apple's data doesn't confirm Anderson's analysis?

  42. Ironic by prockcore · · Score: 1

    The ironic thing is that this article wasn't on the front page of the WSJ. The article itself is part of the long tail.

  43. Not sure about the tail. by ghyd · · Score: 1

    I don't think that, for example, the Pixies are in the tail of any other band, though they sell less than many other bands. Tail suppose a head and vice versa, but in music, some bands don't need another band to sell. Thats not a tentative for a rebutal or whatever, just that in this case i find that the "head and tail" analogy is not really that good.

  44. I-Tunes Not The Best Example by lorelorn · · Score: 1
    In Anderson's Wired article, he illustrated his points using Amazon. With it's 1,000,000+ inventory, 52% of their sales were coming from outside their top 150,000 selling titles(IIRC).

    This was a valid insight, as the largest bookstores typically carry 150,000 titles. Anderson revealed that the size of the book market is more than twice as large as what the largest bookstores can carry.

    It was Bezos' decision to launch with 1,000,000 titles that drove this, plus Amazon's own set up, which makes it easy for browsers to find related titles, see what others who bought a book also bought etc.

    This was another valid point: that the tong tail won't emerge without software to allow customers to easily find what they want to find, and see what else might be of interest to them.

    Itunes is not like Amazon. Their range is actually quite limited. It consists of current and past bestsellers (billboard albums and tracks) and not much else. Apple have so far displayed little interest in having a richness of content equivalent to Amazon's coverage of print. Or maybe it's supplier problems.

    I'm sure Amazon, just like any other bookseller, look at their 80/20 sales. It shouldn't take a genius to figure out that 20% of 1,000,000 is a greater range than 20% of 150,000. In fact Amazon's top 20% represents more books than the entire range of titles stocked by a large bookstore! That's a long tail.

    The Long Tail does not discount the importance of bestselling titles. Actually it reinforces it. To sell successfully (ie profitably) online, you need both. Bestselling titles bring customers to your website. What you need to have is a huge range of titles (whether books or music tracks it makes no difference) that those customers can easily and intuitively access, a range that the brick and mortar stores can never match.

  45. What about other countries? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

    Here in the UK, I'd say the web has had a massive impact on the way I do shopping, and is starting to affect non-geeks as well.

    The UK is famous for it's "clone towns", i.e. cities where all they have are chain stores and no independants. I live in Portsmouth, which is a prime example.

    Chain stores take all the fun out of shopping. Plus, you can never really get what you want, so I do most of my shopping online. eBay and independent web sites are fantastic for this. And it's starting to cross over to normal people too, especially eBay. People are realizing there is more to shopping than Woolies, Top Shop, Dixons and all the other pointless chains. You get better choice and a better deal, and companies can cater to a niche market online.

    A perfect example would be Maplin. They used to sell electronic components, but now they hardly stock any (you can still mail order a more limited selection). But you can get much better prices on the web from places like Farnell, who traditionally would not have sold to hobbyists like myself (you needed to buy their catalogue for a start). I get components from eBay too, often from Hong Kong or China. So, suddenly a niche market that Maplin more or less abandoned in favor of consumer electronics has reached a global scale.

    --
    const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
    SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    1. Re:What about other countries? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      People are realizing there is more to shopping than Woolies, Top Shop, Dixons and all the other pointless chains.

      As an eminent scholar once remarked, "Nobody goes there anymore; it's too crowded."

  46. I am a cell in that long tail. by RonTheHurler · · Score: 1

    I've read all these posts, and they almost exclusively focus on the music business and a little on the book business. But what about the rest of us little businesses who would not, could not exist without the Internet?

    In 2000, I shocked my friends when I told them I was going to start a business selling catapult kits ( http://www.trebuchet.com/ http://www.catapultkits.com/ http://www.mangonel.com/ http://www.trebuchetplans.com/ and more). "Who needs a catapult kit?" was the reaction I got. "People do." was my response. I told them I'd sell my kits on the Internet- this was just after the big dot-com stock market meltdown. Because of that meltdown, all too many people believed that e-commerce was a doomed business and that I was a fool.

    Maybe I am a fool, but I started my business with about $200 (not a typo- two hundred dollars), a digital camera and a fistfull of open source software. I spent zero dollars on marketing, zero dollars on advertising, and after a few months, I was already profitable.

    Now I employ myself and some other people too. It's a very small niche market. So small, that it's actually NOT cost effective to manufacture these things in China (I tried). It's such a small niche market, that if I had to spend any money on advertising, I wouldn't survive. I tried actually- Radio, magazines, direct mail (not spam!) even a few appearances on TV. None was cost effective. Not even Google's AdSense is cost effective for my product line.

    So, I live by the internet. I do no advertising other than a simple affiliate model. It's a widely distributed market, impossible to target. Thanks to the search engines, I don't have to find my market, they can find me.

    Without the Internet, I wouldn't be in business. I am a cell in the long, long tail of niche businesses that simply do not make sense for a brick and mortar world, but thrive in cyberspace.

    The long tail is real. My business is proof of that.

    http://www.rlt.com/

  47. Negligible cost.... right.... by zanderredux · · Score: 1