Slashdot Mirror


Hollywood Says Piracy Has Ripple Effect

ColinPL writes to mention a Washington Post article about a new study backed by Hollywood on intellectual piracy. The study, which they're presenting to lawmakers today, claims that piracy has a ripple effect on the economy. According to the study, lost revenues may have as much as three times the impact previously imagined. From the article: "Lawmakers and federal agencies such as the Justice and State departments have helped Hollywood battle physical piracy -- specifically, counterfeit DVDs. But now the stakes are especially high for entertainment companies as they sell more of their products online in the form of digital songs, movies and other intellectual property. Internet piracy may be tougher for lawmakers to conceptualize, entertainment companies fear."

30 of 309 comments (clear)

  1. The entire movie industry by Tweekster · · Score: 5, Interesting

    is sooo small economically wise it is rather pathetic they have as much pull as they do...the candy industry is about 10 times the size

    --
    The phrase "more better" is acceptable English. suck it grammar Nazis
    1. Re:The entire movie industry by TubeSteak · · Score: 5, Insightful
      The entire movie industry is sooo small economically wise it is rather pathetic they have as much pull as they do...the candy industry is about 10 times the size
      FTFA:
      "It's important to remember, however, that even though piracy prevents money from reaching the movie industry, those dollars probably stay in the economy, one intellectual property expert said."

      Translation: It doesn't really matter if they take their made up number and multiply it by three. The economy wasn't hurt.
      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
    2. Re:The entire movie industry by patrixmyth · · Score: 4, Funny

      Shh!! Don't give them any ideas, or we'll have CRM (Candy Rights Management), and I won't be able to share my skittles. Oh wait, that would actually be a good idea. Get your own damn skittles, hippie, these are mine! Proceed.

      --
      "Don't you know you're going to shock the monkey?"- Peter Gabriel
    3. Re:The entire movie industry by tddoog · · Score: 5, Funny

      Hollywood props up the monstrous candy industry. Just think of that $10 box of raisinets you buy at the theatre. This is exactly the kind of ripple effect they are talking about. No movie patrons in the theatre => no candy sales => no $2000 root canals. Won't someone think of the dentists?

    4. Re:The entire movie industry by Znork · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "The economy wasn't hurt."

      Actually, quite the opposite. Considering that the IP industries are particularly inefficient in their production as protected entities, the economy as a whole _gains_ from the failure to enforce their monopoly priviliges.

      Piracy means the economy as a whole gains _both_ the wealth inherent in an extra copy of a certain material for the particular consumer _plus_ the wealth inherent in whatever else the money is spent on.

      Translation: The numbers made up by the industries are completely irrelvant, IP is merely a method of redistributing wealth to achieve a specific purpose, similar to taxes, and as such the only interesting measure is wether a) the money actually goes to it's intended recipient and b) wether it's an efficient use of resources.

    5. Re:The entire movie industry by Sathias · · Score: 5, Informative

      The more money the movie studios get, the more money that gets given to actors. More disposable income in an actors hand's means they will snort more coke. Buying more coke means drug dealers get more money, which means the cash goes into the black market. And if the government is to be believed, it will end up in the hands of terrorists.

      Do your part for the War on Terror now, download some .avi files!

      --
      Blessed are the 1337, for they shall pwn the earth.
  2. More on the Study by eldavojohn · · Score: 5, Funny
    The study, which they're presenting to lawmakers today, claims that piracy has a ripple effect on the economy.
    The study also claims that piracy is on the rise to become America's number one killer by the end of the year. It claims that piracy is capable of running rampant down the street and reeking havoc everywhere.

    They interviewed a crew hand from Waterworld and, aside from forcing him out of a job, the unnamed victim reported that piracy forcefully entered his home and raped him in front of his youngest son. Piracy has taken not only his source of income but also the joy that he and his son once shared.

    The report concludes with piracy being at large and dangerous. Piracy is capable of flipping bits in a pattern that resembles music and is also known to cause cancer.

    The study, which they're presenting to lawmakers today...
    So when are lawmakers presented with the Piracy Is Actually Pretty Bitching for Consumers report? What about the Economics Research is Bullshit & Baseless report? Oh, that's right, the other side of the issue never gets to hear it's voice heard and no alternatives will ever be explored. Silly me.
    --
    My work here is dung.
    1. Re:More on the Study by TubeSteak · · Score: 4, Interesting

      "According to the L.E.K. study, 38 percent of all movie piracy occurs on the Internet, with counterfeit DVDs accounting for the rest."

      Caption of the picture:
      Pirated-movie distribution operations such as this one in New York mean a loss to industry of about $20.5 billion per year, lost opportunities for about 140,000 new jobs and $800 million in lost tax revenue, the study says. (Recording Industry Association Of America Via Associated Press)

      60% of piracy has NOTHING to do with the internet
      XYZ x 60% = ~$20.5 billion

      Despite that, the MPAA does exactly what the RIAA has been doing with its plethora of lawsuits aimed at filesharing instead of targeting counterfeiters.

      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
  3. Not really much of a surprise... by Gadgetfreak · · Score: 4, Insightful

    *Everything* has a ripple effect on the economy. That's why it's called "the economy" as a whole. You can't expect a noticeable shift in traditional cash flow to not have at least some sort of chain reaction or reactions elsewhere.

    --
    "No fair, you changed the outcome by measuring it!" - Professor Hubert J. Farnsworth
    1. Re:Not really much of a surprise... by mlmitton · · Score: 4, Insightful
      It's sillier than that. The money that would have paid for all the popcorn and ushers doesn't disappear; it just doesn't go into the entertainment industry. Consider the extreme case: everyone pirates all movies. Here, the entertainment industry will disappear, but the video game industry (or tourism, or books, or whatever you want to put here) *grows*. These "ripple effects" are straw men designed to get society to think it impacts them. There would be a negligible impact on GDP or taxes.

      The more technical detail: it's the difference between a partial equilibrium and a general equilibrium model of the economy. In the partial model (the supply and demand curves we all know and love), you assume that you've completely modeled all relevant aspects of the economy, or rather, you assume nothing else matters. It's an incredibly useful approximation in many cases, but an approximation all the same. In general equilibrium, everything (theoretically) gets modeled--all the goods remotely related to entertainment, income, where income changes get spent, and so on.

      The idiocy of these "ripple effect" arguments is that they're using partial equilibrium to derive general equilibria effects! In other words, they're using a model that assumes nothing else matters to draw conclusions about the very things the model says doesn't matter.

      --
      "My girlfriend's got sodium laureth sulfate hair."
  4. Easy to make them conceptualize it. by krell · · Score: 4, Insightful

    All Hollywood has to do is change the language so words like "theft" apply to non-applicable situations such as copyright infringement. After they succeed at this, they can transmute the words arson, rape, and murder to describe it. Make sure "think of the children" is mentioned occasionally.

    --
    Where were you when the voynix came?
  5. Other things that have ripple effects. by Demon-Xanth · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Making crappy movies.
    Sueing your audience.
    Making your customers go through crap that people who don't pay don't have to go through.

    --
    If you think education is expensive, you should try ignorance -- Derek Bok, president of Harvard
  6. Um... by Pancake+Bandit · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This study recieved funding from NBC Universal and the MPAA. Why am I having a hard time taking it seriously?

  7. Ripple Effects... On DVD Purchases... by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I stopped buying DVDs since I'm never certain if the version out today won't be replaced by a extended version in six month and/or a gift box set next year. I want to spend my money only once. Not twice or thrice for the same product with extra features that should've been there in the first place.

    1. Re:Ripple Effects... On DVD Purchases... by ShibaInu · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So, when the new version comes out, your old version suddenly becomes unwatchable? Seems to be that whatever content you had is still there. The problem isn't that Hollywood does this, the problem is that people reward them by buying the stuff.

  8. Re:Wrong word... by LordEd · · Score: 4, Funny

    They can find it here

  9. Ripple? by misleb · · Score: 4, Funny

    Ripple effect is fine. I just don't want to see a butterfly effect. One person pirates, and the next thing you know we have a chimpanzee for president and our rights are being eroded every day... Oh damn.

    -matthew

    --
    "THERE IS NO JUSTICE, THERE IS ONLY ME." -Death
  10. Keyword here... by DittoBox · · Score: 5, Funny
    lost revenues may have as much as three times the impact previously imagined.

    Need they say more?

    --
    Good. Cheap. Fast. Pick Two.
  11. Piracy by Led+Nudd · · Score: 4, Funny

    It's important to remember, however, that even though piracy prevents money from reaching the movie industry, those dollars probably stay in the economy, one intellectual property expert said. Ridiculous! Doesn't everybody do what I do? That is, sink every penny I save through downloading pirated films into doubloons I keep buried in a chest in my back yard. Pieces of eight! Pieces of eight!

    1. Re:Piracy by johnw · · Score: 5, Funny

      No, it's "Pieces of seven! Pieces of seven!"

      That's a parroty error.

  12. Another broken window argument by Colin+Smith · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Hmm, perhaps the memories of the members of parliament, senators, congressmen and women should have their memories refreshed.

    In fact, it's the pirates who benefit the economy most, they produce the goods at a far lower cost, the benefit is far and wide, what is saved on music and videos can be spent on more important items.

    --
    Deleted
  13. Study finds need for more studies by sinij · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Hollywood study finds that Hollywood deserves more money. Big surprise?

  14. Champions of morality... by CrazedWalrus · · Score: 4, Interesting

    ...now that immorality is hurting them. Is this the same Hollywood that has been overtly hostile to people who insist that there is such a thing as right and wrong? Piracy is just one of the many effects that Hollywood's fuzzy morality is having on society, and it happens to be the one that's directly biting them in the ass. I don't feel a bit sorry for them. In the various ways they've attacked traditional values over the years, I can't help but wonder how they didn't have the foresight to expect their current predicament.

    -Walrus

    1. Re:Champions of morality... by Travoltus · · Score: 4, Insightful

      They've undermined the authority of parents by luring their children into their culture of natural born deviancy (and now complete and utter stagnation), and especially, they've been encouraging kids to be rebellious.

      Now that rebellion has returned home.

      Hollywood can boo hoo hoo all they want to, but the truth is, you always reap what you sow.

      --
      --- Grow a pair, liberals... stop letting the Republicans bully you!
  15. Re:Wrong word... Has to be said... by patrixmyth · · Score: 5, Funny

    Vizzini: Inconceivable.

    Inigo Montoya:, You keep using that word. I do not think it means, what you think it means. ...

    --
    "Don't you know you're going to shock the monkey?"- Peter Gabriel
  16. Voodoo by ObsessiveMathsFreak · · Score: 4, Funny

    RIAA: Those danm Pirates are attacking our economy with their Voodoo Economics!!

    Pirate: Arrr!! But 'tis naught to the voodoo that you do so well!! Ye scurvy dogs!

    --
    May the Maths Be with you!
  17. Who Wants to Copy this Stuff?? by mrs+clear+plastic · · Score: 4, Interesting

    There has been nothing worth copying! The stuff they put out is so pathetic that I would not want to waste bandwith copying.

    I have not been to a first run flick for over 1 year. I have been seeing only 70's and 80's classics such as Blade Runner and Xanadu and James Bond.

    Hollywood's product has really be very dissapointing to say the least. Perhaps Congress shall pass laws that dictate minimum quality to this stuff.

    Luv

    --
    Cleara
  18. Ummmm, I don't think so. by khasim · · Score: 5, Funny
    "It's important to remember, however, that even though piracy prevents money from reaching the movie industry, those dollars probably stay in the economy, one intellectual property expert said."

    I'm pretty sure that pirates bury their loot on tropical islands.
  19. Re:This Is Disgusting by Luscious868 · · Score: 4, Insightful
    UNDERSTAND THIS YOU ARROGANT, GREEDY BASTARDS, /no one/ wants to fucking download your DRM'ed/non-DRM'ed bullshit movies and music.

    Is that so? From a recent press release:

    The iTunes Store also features the world's largest catalog of online music with over 3.5 million songs and has sold a stunning 1.5 billion songs, making it the world's most popular digital music store.

    Just because the Slashdot crowd doesn't like something doesn't mean that average consumers have the same view. Get over yourself and UNDERTAND THIS, the RIAA and MPAA don't give a flying fuck about what you think. You are not their target customer.

  20. Read the study? by Americano · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I'm sure that everybody was far too busy thinking up cute "+5 Funny" comments to go out and actually take a look at the actual study... but for anybody who's perhaps interested in formulating a defensible position on the matter based on facts rather than groupthink, the actual publication is available here.

    For a bunch of geeks, I'd think that doing a bit of research & gathering the facts before reaching a conclusion would be the *first* thing you'd do when trying to combat what you decry as a campaign of FUD & misinformation. Sarcasm isn't going to win the case in a courtroom, or in Congress. Deconstruct their argument & their methods. Show their assumptions & conclusions to be faulty.