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New Copy Protection to Make Playing DVDs on a PC Difficult
The Cowardly Pirate writes "ZDNet's Hardware 2.0 blog is reporting that new copy-protection software for DVD publishers from a company called ProtectDisc not only makes it difficult to rip movies that you've purchased but also prevents discs from playing in a Windows PC at all. From the article: 'Protect DVD-Video is the brainchild of a company called ProtectDisc. Part of the copy-protection mechanism is a non-standard UDF (Universal Disc Format) file system which results in the IFO file on the DVD (this is the file responsible for storing information on chapters, subtitles and audio tracks) appearing to the PC as being zero bytes long.'"
Just the other night we had more DVDs to watch than TVs and players. Our daughter wanted to watch her Smallville (purchased), and we were watching one of our circulating Blockbuster "mailer" DVDs.
She was delighted when I showed her how to watch her DVD on the upstairs computer -- she hadn't known that was possible. Problem solved, everybody happy.
But, now this? What the hey? So now potentially what she presumably knows about watching on an alternative device could not work, and she wouldn't know why -- yes, the article mentions the latest new "tool" that "effortlessly" bypasses the security, but again, What the Hey? She isn't going to know about that tool, or how to use it, and I'm about as sick and tired as I can be of setting up the workarounds for restrictions that shouldn't even exist.
Interestingly, the article mentions (emphasis mine):
I only almost agree with that -- "they" in this case seem to be blurring the line between use-use and piracy. Each day I toss a coin to decide who annoys me more -- media "providers" or spammers. It's a close call.
I used to wonder whether the DVD industry would totally shoot itself in the foot with the HD vs. BluRay DVD wars coupled with intrusive DRM, sending potential customers away in droves. If this new protection technology is for existing DVDs (it's not clear from the article), they could send existing DVD customers away in droves. I no longer about the sanity of the industry -- I worry about the sanity of artists allowing contracts for their "art" to be wrapped in technology like this, I wonder why they allow it.
(Interesting (and I think important) aside: I recently updated the firmware on my Creative Vision:M mp3 player, a player I've absolutely loved for its features, ergonomics, screen quality, you name it, there was hardly a thing about it I could find fault with. As the new firmware was installing I browsed the release notes... looking for the standard blah blah blah on what's fixed, what's new. The very last line of the notes said (paraphrasing), This firmware upgrade will disable your FM recording capability(!). WTF? It was too late for me to stop the upgrade -- sure enough, I now have a Creative Vision:M sans FM recording capability, (a feature which I was quite fond of)! Creative doesn't say whether it's RIAA induced, I have no idea why they did this... but if it IS more DRM crap, what a crock!)
(Other aside: I love that the ad for the slashdot page for the "read more" for me was an HD-DVD ad...)
...mechanism is a non-standard UDF A non-standard anything on a DVD makes it not a true DVD. We've seen this tried before on CDs and the response was that they'd have to stop using the "Compact Disc" trademark because that's only for people who follow the standard.
As I recall, the XBox operating system was based off some version of Windows (although HEAVILY modified). Also, as many (most in the /. crowd, I'd wager) know, the XBox is pretty much just a small form factor computer. I don't own a normal DVD player, I just use my XBox for this purpose. Would this mean that I would be unable to watch movies using this tech with my existing setup?
There is no mod option "-1: Disagree" for a reason. "Overrated" is not an acceptable substitute. Post something instead.
IANAL, but if Creative, in any way, induced you to upgrade the firmware (i.e., it fixed an existing bug), then they have just handed the class action vultures a nice gift. Can't sell a product based on features, and then take them away.
If you want to see Creative punished (you won't benefit, class action suits never actually benefit the consumer), take a screen grab of anything on their site that still shows this capability, and then email it to the proper vultures.
jh
This will lock out people that use their PCs as Media Center PCs to play DVDs, watch TV, etc., and they usually spend quite a bit of money on tvs, dvds, sound systems, so this may not play out too well.
On 10 October 2006, SlySoft released a press release: AnyDVD beats new copy protection "Protect DVD-Video"
With the latest release of AnyDVD, version 6.0.8.0, SlySoft has again confirmed its position as the market leader in providing video DVD decryption software. With this version it is now possible to bypass the new "Protect DVD-Video" copy protection which first appeared on the DVD "Silent Hill" (german rental version).
Among other mechanisms, Protect DVD-Video comes up with a messed-up UDF file system, in which an IFO file appears with a zero-byte length on a regular PC. The unsurprising result is that these DVDs will refuse to run on a Windows PC with Windows Media Player, Windows Media Center Edition or all software players that are based on DirectShow (e.g. the very popular ZoomPlayer).
"With this copy protection the film industry clearly overshot the mark", says Giancarlo Bettini, CEO at SlySoft. "The premium customer who spent a lot of money on his multimedia home cinema and who, for quality reasons, would never even consider watching anything else but an original DVD, is being slapped in the face. These customers with their shelves stuffed with rightfully aquired DVDs, can't watch their videos."
This is incredible nonsense! Any Media Center freak will have no choice but to install AnyDVD on his PC in order to watch his original DVD." "The film industry should actually thank us for taking care of their premium customers so well. Maybe one day I'll be nominated for an Oscar", Bettini adds with a grin.
Background info: The company ProtectDisc is being run by Volkmar Breitfeld, also managing director of ACE (FluxDVD copy protection). Remarkably enough, Volkmar Breitfeld was previously known for creating copy protection circumventing products like InstantCopy or InstantCD/DVD, before he changed fronts to selling copy protection mechanisms.
Gone!
After all, it only took the branching features of The Matrix to make several popular brands of DVD player come to a screeching halt until they were updated (which itself required sending the player back to the manufacturers)
Safedisc. Or Discguard. Or Safecast. Or SecuROM. Or...
Oh hell. Here's the list of those who have gone before.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
Or: Gentlemen, start your magic markers!
Or: Fingers on the shift key!
It's always great to hear about new hacks, designed to keep us from watching our purchased content, likely to keep some legitimate players from being able to play the content, and which will be quickly and simply foiled by some low-tech solution. It's hard to believe companies want to be in this business of "content protection" (but of course they are, because a solid, secure protection system is the holy grail for content providers). Thanks a lot, Hollywood, we love you, too.
When DVD-ROM drives first came out, one could purchase the drive with a card for handling things like encryption for the multi-channel soundtracks, copyright protections and various picture formatting. Having the hardware handle that made it fairly simple to access anything on the disk, even if it was "protected". Granted, that is fairly old technology in today's computer world but the beauty of hardware is that for input, there is output. If you want to see what is going on, there are ways to access the hardware at a basic, sub-system/sub-software level that would allow you to circumvent any measures like this silly stuff to be put in place. The hardware needs commands to run and to build those commands, you need input. At some point, you can extract that input from the hardware, encrypted or not, especially if the hardware is what is handling the encryption.
I suppose new laws could be written to cover such technology and tighten the noose on it for new purchases but the old hardware is out there and there are no current restrictions on it. A creative coder could find ways around it if the incentive was there. I think this just notched that incentive mark up a few notches.
The reason for a standard format is so that anyone can make a player, or perform an encoding that they KNOW will work. Companies rarely want to create multiple copies of their video to different specifications, because they want to be able to reach as wide an audience as possible. Creating a modified format that can only be reached by a subset of your audience is a really good way to fail.
Plus, according to the article, since the DVD still has the chapter info (for the non-PC players), it's not that hard to write a program to obtain that data. Which means you've deviated from the standard for little reason, as pirates will bypass it, and even non-pirate software will probably eventually bypass it, since the information is still encoded on the disc. Which means that suckers who pay them for their 'system' are just throwing cash away.
Come to think of it, I wish I could come up with a buisness plan to get people to give me money for a product that cannot work.
"Part of the copy-protection mechanism is a non-standard UDF...file system which results in the IFO file on the DVD...appearing to the PC as being zero bytes long."
Then how does a dedicated DVD player read the data?
"designed to keep us from watching our purchased content"
You would purchase this? I suppose people must do... personally, I don't own DVD players, I watch everything through my computer, so the only way I could watch it would be to download it.
The revolution will not be televised... but it will have a page on Wikipedia
These days? THESE DAYS? If you think this is new, then you haven't been paying attention. Remember when you had to enter the answers to some questions to play a game? Did that actually stop piracy? Obviously not. It just meant that people had to download the answers, too. Or that a patch had to be developed to route around that code. Whoop de doo.
There is no such thing as effective copy protection. If the data can be viewed by a human, then it can be viewed by something else, too. ALL copy protection is useless. The tools for bypassing it are only getting cheaper (for instance, you can get DVDFabDecrypter for free) and easier to use (a couple clicks, and the movie is ripped.)
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I thought a lot of people watched DVD movies on their home entertainment systems - a lot of which are based on PCs (Windows Media Center/Linux). Or what about people with just big monitor?
So now i cannot watch this new Hollywood-DVD that I'd buy on my home entertainment system?
there is no issue with my network
When are the content producers going to stop shooting themselves in their own foot with this kind of stuff? Actually, what REALLY blows my mind is how these companies can be so fricken stupid... I mean they have literally created out of thin air an industry consisting of companies whose sole line of business is inventing ways to take their money without delivering a product that actually works. Every single one of these "copy protection" schemes has been snake oil with NO exceptions. None. Not a single one of them works effectively. The fact that the content owners keep buying them is frankly a pretty harsh indictment on their intellect. Maybe they should start trying to hire executives whose IQ exceeds their shoe size. Or just get a clue as to WHY people want what they want and figure out a business plan that lets them give it to them.
- sigs are stupid
Same here. I haven't bought a single music cd for myself or for others since I last bought one that was copy-protected.
Hmmm...this sounds very similar to the copy protection on the old PS1 discs if I'm not mistaken. Except for DVD's.
The more I see stuff like this, along with the recent issues brick and mortar retailers are having over the pricing difference from online movie distribution, the more I think the movie industry wants the standard DVD format to die. Without having a phyical product being placed in the hands of consumers, and forcing movie downloads to be tied specifically to a single computer/user, it makes the process of transferring the content to third parties (either by illegal file sharing or through legal after-market resale) nearly impossible for the average person.
Just think, that $14 movie you "conveniently" downloaded from iTunes today won't be nearly as "convenient" to resell to someone else later on, as a physical DVD would be. To resell that one single movie, you'll need to literally hand your entire computer and iTunes account over to the buyer. Otherwise, your only remaining option is to delete the file and eat the loss... and all because you didn't buy a physical copy when you had the chance.
The industry *wants* you to buy downloaded movies instead of DVDs, despite their seeming lack of support for it. As soon as the "trusted computing initiative" is in full effect, it be game over for the consumer.
8==8 Bones 8==8
What it will do is to keep ordinary users from PLAYING the discs on their PCs/Laptops/etc. And at the same time, it probably won't slow down anyone who's seriously copying DVDs at all.
This will get broken just like every other measure, and the break will get incorporated into the same software people are already using to copy DVDs, and within a couple of months you won't even know there's any protection on the disc when you go to copy it.
Another thing it will do is to force people who otherwise would not copy their DVDs to do so, so that the copies will then be playable on their PCs. I already know people who have done this when they unknowingly bought out-of-region DVDs from eBay or while on vacation. They're not pirates, they just want to watch what they bought.
Actually, I have run into several DVDs (mostly Disney) that won't play on my set-top DVD player (says either "bad disk" or "wrong disk type"), but play fine on my computer.
They will, however, play on my set-top after I "process" them on my computer.
Is this what the movie industry wants?
---
"I can't complain, but sometimes still do..." Joe Walsh
I don't know about there, but over here in the UK we have the right to make a request to the Secretary of State (I'm not sure which one, but one of 'em), who should issue an order to the copyright holder to provide you with a copy that allows you to perform all of your legal rights.
(Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended, available from here.)
"Protect DVD-Video is the brainchild of a company called ProtectDisc"
:))!
I first read "brainchild" as "child's brain"
I still do.
You see, whenever somebody invents a such pathetic copy protection for specific software (read: UDF filesystem driver) you have to keep in mind that the only device that is 100% surely programmable to avoid the protection is.. TA-DA.. the COMPUTER!!! [Applause]
This is a 1-day job for any CD/DVD writer software author, to read the raw and use it in another way.
So, some person will lose 1 day in life walking around this `protection`, the other `hackers` will lose 1 googling minute for finding, downloading, installing and finally playing the DVD.
This is why the entropy principle is there to stay! These sort of thoughts/inventions will never _create_ information
gtkaml.org
I have long ago stopped going to the movie theater on a regular basis. Not because of price, but because I was rather upset the first time I paid to see a movie and got a comercial. One of the things I paid for was to have an uniterupted movie experience. If you want to show me trailers before the movie starts, go ahead, but don't give me a standard commercial. That first commercial was for Nestle Quick. I remember the commercial, but not the movie. If I am in the store, I will now try to pick another brand, just on principle.
Since then, I have become a collector of DVDs. I can sit at home and watch it on my own terms. If the beging has too much stuff other than trailers, I will rip it into a format that I can enjoy. Commercials and piracy notices are not part of your "creative work." That is not what I paid for, that is not what I want, and it is not what I am going to buy. If you wish to send me the DVD for free with the commercials, then like TV, I might or might not watch it if I have the time.
If you are going to take the ability for me to watch a movie that I have paid to watch without commericals, then I will go back to books, then I can tear out or paint anything that I find offensive.
You are trying to do business in a capitolistic society. The intent of that economic system is that people or companies that provided the products that people want at a resonable price are allowed to stay in business. Please quit trying to stretch our legal system to get around that simple fact, and please quit trying to force DRM onto people that do not want it. Provide the general people with what they want, and you will continue to have a thriving business.
Oh come on. Breaking copy protection on data is easy. You don't need to be a genius hacker. Just try, as in just take a look. Dump the beginning of a protected DVD (dd is one tool for that), then compare what you see to specs on the UDF file system, or whatever it is, and you'll see stuff-- stuff like setting the file size to 0. In many cases the copy protection will fall right over because it's that pathetic. Change a few bytes (like, set the file size to the correct amount), and viola! Broken. That's why all those licenses say it's a violation to reverse engineer, etc. They know their stuff won't stand up to even casual examination.
Intellectual Property is a monopolistic, selfish, and defective concept. It is "tyranny over the mind of man"
*Hint Hint* What kind of non-hidden / external storage/device bays are available on PC cases?
I'd hope they'd have to label them as similarly protected CDs are labeled, or not be allowed to use the DVD logo.
Disney, for one, has never used the DVD-Video logo, They have their own "Disney DVD" logo that they've been using all along.
-- Alastair
Ironically enough, AnyDVD itself uses some decent copy protection to prevent people from copying it without paying.
:)
Even more funny, the DVD ripping forums are full of people explaining how to use "rollback" software to fool AnyDVD into thinking it's never been installed, so that you can just keep re-using it without paying. Of course, this rollback software is also copy-protected.
But I'm sure we all use AnyDVD to bypass FBI warnings
Good for the goose, good for the gander, I say.
Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.
Good call. This bullshit about "DRM is there to prevent the normal user from pirating" is the most moronic thing I've ever heard. It's a rationalization that content companies come up with to convince their shareholders that they haven't just wasted billions of dollars.
The normal user doesn't pirate. It's the clever user that breaks copy protection and learns to properly transcode. DRM just slows this guy down. Not much either.
KFG, I know you know how DRM works, but some people here don't, so here's a quick primer:
DRM is encryption. Encryption is a simple concept; A wants to send something to B, but doesn't want C (the attacker) to read it. B gives A a key with which to encrypt, having a personal decryption key. The attacker can't decode it because he doesn't have B's decryption key.
In DRM, B and C are the same guy - the attacker has the key. Sure DRM technologies try to obfuscate this key, but ultimately, the key must exist somewhere that is accessible to B - and as such, C.
As a result, there only needs to be one clever guy in the 6.5 Billion people in the world. Everyone else just downloads the program they wrote to do the magic. Result: piracy isn't even slowed by these technologies; they end up being an inconvenience to normal users and a tremendous waste of money in the anti-piracy game.
A better solution: Steganography. Embed the purchaser's customer ID in his purchase. There are some good algorithms that can do this reliably even through a transcode (especially if it's only 16 bytes of ID; the larger the difference between message text and embedded text bandwidths, the more resistant the embedded text can be to lossy compression).
Even for DVDs purchased at a store, add a unique ID to each DVD sold. The buyer's and DVD's info is taken at point of purchase and associated with one another.
Casual piracy would end quickly - the purchaser would be held accountable for leaking stuff into the wild. Professional piracy would move into the realm of credit fraud investigation (as that would be the only way to shift accountability away from oneself), and would thus carry a heavy penalty.
Of course, there'd still be the 'mom-and-pop' hole, but it would quickly get filled; a couple hundred thousand to give mom and pops a cheap little reader is a hell of a lot cheaper than this DRM arms race.
110100 1101000 1101000 1100110 0 1101111 1101000 1100011 1
You would purchase this? I suppose people must do... personally, I don't own DVD players
In the USA, analog TV is slated to go away for over the air broadcasting. I'm slowly dropping analog TV products as they fail and not replacing them. I get my news and TV online. I purchased a very nice LCD display. The last DVD player I bought randomly dies. I think the spindle motor bearing is failing. Due to the high cost of a Digital TV reciever that can recieve an over the air broadcast, I don't have one. If I have to buy a player to play the new DVD, I would not get one with NTSC only output. If I can't play the DVD in my computer, I don't want it.
I travel lots. Sometimes for stuck on the road downtime I'll throw a few DVD's in my laptop bag. Now they say new ones can't play in a PC. If I get one that can't play in a computer, I'm taking my laptop to the store with the DVD to exchange the defective DVD. I'll verify the replacement DVD works befor I leave the store. I won't let them sell me DVD's that won't play.
I sure hopt they put a big label on them so I don't have to stop buying DVD's like I stopped buying CD's. I stopped buying CD's simply because I could find none anymore with the Compact Disk Logo showing it met the original CD format standard. (In other words a CD that really is a Music CD, not a rootkit install kit.)
The truth shall set you free!
My dad bought a fancy Denon integrated DVD player and surround amplifier to get rid of all the different boxes under his TV (yeah I know. I thought it was a silly idea, too).
It absolutely refuses to play copy-"protected" CDs. If he puts one in it will refuse to function in any way until the disk is removed again, due to function locking while the disk is loading. The kicker is that if he copies the disk on his computer (which will luckily read the "protected" CDs just fine), the Denon player accepts the copy right away, every single time.
So the only way for him to play copy-"protected" CDs is by copying the damn things! How's that for ironic?
I would not be surprised at all if it acted the same way with these new "protected" DVDs.
Eat the rich.
As is usually the case, it isn't nearly as difficult under Windows as you imagine.
At the very least, ISO Buster shouldn't have any problems with it. There are many other utilities out there. I don't have an example with a screwed up IFO to test, but I suspect the popular freebie utility Daemon Tools could do it, too -- it would just treat the disc in the drive as an image.
Slashdot quality declines as the number of hot grits posts decreases. - Provolt's Law, Apr-09-2005