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OEM Industry Leaders Interviewed

Posted by ryuzaki0 on from the where-the-industry-goes dept.

jkwdoc writes "In one of the few mass interviews ever conducted, the crew at HardOCP.com talked to seven different OEM presidents and founders to ask them about the PC industry. The names include Michael Dell, Kelt Reeves (Falcon Northwest), Randy Copeland (Velocity Micro), and Albert Wang (ABS/Newegg), among others. The questions ranged from their business principles, to the effect of the enthusiast and gaming markets, to what dual- and quad-core technology means for the next generation of computing. You'll be surprised at some of the answers." Of course, the article has to span nine pages because they have to show their ads over...and over...and over.

81 comments

  1. Red Rover by Atomm · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    Red Rover, Red Rover, send the ads Over! ;-)

    --
    RTFG - Read The F#$%ing Google!
  2. Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Nice to see that you still have many different companies competing AND cooperating in an open fashion on the PC platform. The Mac OS world would be greatly strengthened if you have such an open and responsive situation of multiple hardware vendors making machines to run Mac software.

    --
    Where were you when the voynix came?
    1. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      It would make the platform cheaper, but probably not stronger. There's only one brand of hardware that OSX is ever supposed to run on, which surely contributes to its stability / supportability.

    2. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Guppy06 · · Score: 1

      "The Mac OS world would be greatly strengthened if you have such an open and responsive situation of multiple hardware vendors making machines to run Mac software."

      Making machines that run OSX or machines that claim to run OSX? Part of the reason why I don't touch OEM any more is the use of second-rate hardware and second-rate drivers that cause issues with the OS (be it Windows or Linux), and one of the main selling points of OSX (and the hardware it runs on) is "it just works."

    3. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 1

      "It would make the platform cheaper, but probably not stronger. There's only one brand of hardware that OSX is ever supposed to run on, which surely contributes to its stability / supportability."

      Only a little. Do you really think that OSX security would become something full of holes because it had to run on a variety of platforms? You'd also avoid "forced from on high" design errors, such as the time Apple shipped machines with nothing but USB ports when most Apple users had printers that would not plug into them: multiple competing vendors would be much less likely to make such unfortunate decisions. (and, in this example, would only have phased out USB ports *after* the users had no use for them anymore).

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
    4. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Daniel_Staal · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Apple tried that, mid-90's.

      It didn't help. And it hurt Apple's sales.

      (Yes, perhaps the situation has changed, but never mind. Apple only has two unique things at this point: their industrial design, and their GUI. They are competing on both with everyone else. Get over it.)

      --
      'Sensible' is a curse word.
    5. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Joe+The+Dragon · · Score: 1

      Apple is miss out on a big part on the mid-end market by not having a mid-range head less system something that would not happen in a open market. Now that apple is using x86 hardware there hardware lock in may hurt them even more and why did apple have to lock you it to only useing video cards from apple with there new systems?

    6. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by nra1871 · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately they never get rid of ancient tech. Most new computers still come with floppy drives and parallel ports (and no I don't care that you need a floppy drive to install your obscure SCSI controller, get rid of the friggin things.)

    7. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Daniel_Staal · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Actually, we can see exactly what would have happened in that case, since it had been going on: USB would have been included, but no one would ever have used it because they didn't know about it.

      The iMac was not the first computer with USB. USB had been out, and standard, on PCs for years. The iMac just got USB noticed.

      And there were quickly cheap third-party solutions to connect ADB and serial devices to USB ports.

      --
      'Sensible' is a curse word.
    8. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 2, Informative

      "Apple only has two unique things at this point: their industrial design, and their GUI. They are competing on both with everyone else"

      On the first, the "uniqueness" has eroded a lot, as the platform has evolved to be able to take the same mice, monitors, and plug-in cards everyone else uses. Used to be that this wasn't the case. As such, this uniqueness was never really a strength.

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
    9. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 1

      "Unfortunately they never get rid of ancient tech. Most new computers still come with floppy drives and parallel ports"

      Is this a problem unless you have a real tiny laptop? It is not like you have to use them, or that they get in the way at all on a desktop machine. The reason they are still there on many machines is that the market (the users) still need them, although in dwindling numbers now.

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
    10. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 1

      Is "forcing of the USB transition" this really so important unless you happen to be in a company that sold USB plugs, cables, and devices?

      "And there were quickly cheap third-party solutions to connect ADB and serial devices to USB ports."

      Or maybe you were in a dongle company at the time. Having both kinds of ports (unless you have a tiny laptop without the room) is a lot nicer. It also frees up USB ports.

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
    11. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Daniel_Staal · · Score: 1

      You are talking component design, more than industrial design. Industral design is how it all fits together, and what the end result looks like. Apple still has a very distictive look.

      But I agree with you on the fact that Apple's previous unquieness on components wasn't truely a strength. It was on occassion when the components were truely superior, but overall they were behind as much as they were ahead, and the uniqeness had it's own disadvantages.

      --
      'Sensible' is a curse word.
    12. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 1

      "You are talking component design, more than industrial design. Industral design is how it all fits together, and what the end result looks like. Apple still has a very distictive look."

      You are right; the main desktops (iMacs) really stand out. It's less so with notebooks, where extravagent design flourishes are less tolerated. Remember the orange toilet seat notebook computer? Not one of their best moments.

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
    13. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Daniel_Staal · · Score: 1

      I still have one, that gets used regularly. ;) (Though it is the 'bondi-green' color instead of orange.)

      They were decent computers, and the design has many nice aspects. It's biggest probablem actually is that it doesn't fit in standard laptop bags. It is also bigger and (slightly) heavier than it needs to be. Still, it was a decent experiment. In many cases it is actually more portable than a standard laptop. (It has a built-in carry handle which helps quite a bit...)

      --
      'Sensible' is a curse word.
    14. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by truthsearch · · Score: 2, Informative

      by not having a mid-range head less system

      You mean like the Mini?

      --
      Developers: We can use your help.
    15. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 1

      The Mac OS world would be greatly strengthened if you have such an open and responsive situation of multiple hardware vendors making machines to run Mac software.

      The OS would be strengthened by needing to support more, less centrally controlled hardware? The OS would be weakened, however, the platform of OS X running on a computer would be better for end users as they would have more granular choices and competition in the hardware part of the market. It is too bad this is not really a viable business plan right now.

      Like it or not, MS has a monopoly on desktop OS's. Other OS, obviously superior to the version of Windows with which they were competing were driven out of business in short order because of MS's power over OEMs and artificial lock-ins. One of the few ways to get around a monopoly's power in the market without bowing to it is to maintain a complete, separate, vertical chain including a "competitor" for the monopolized product, but not actually competing. Apple has pulled that off and make a fair bit of money with it.

      The problem is, Apple and OEMs know Mac OS X can't take the market for Windows by competing directly with them, regardless of whether or not it is better. The pre-install market and the corporate market are something like 99% of the market. Corporations are locked into Windows via protocols and file formats and have long term contracts. To migrate away is a very large expense and anyone in their right mind would go to Linux in that event. Successful OEMs won't pre-install because the market won't shift all at once and they'd be betting the entire company on that market shift since MS will kill their Windows market in retaliation, using their discriminatory licensing. Apple won't sell to either market, because it would be killing a lot of their hardware business, with little chance of making it up.

      This situation exists for one reason. The US courts cannot or will not enforce their antitrust laws against MS. Probably due to interference from politicians to whom MS made very large campaign contributions, the market simply does not believe MS will be punished for said discriminatory pricing nor will the courts act to stop them from leveraging their lock-ins by mandating adherence to open standards. If I was in business, I'd have no confidence in the courts to effectively stop MS's illegal action either, and certainly not in time to save my business and my job. Fix the political system, legal bribes, and replace the justice dept. officials with honest men, then demonstrate that the laws will be enforced and then and only then might it make sense for Apple to compete with MS directly.

    16. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 1

      "The OS would be strengthened by needing to support more, less centrally controlled hardware?"

      Exactly. Multiple platform vendors compete with each other to provide hardware features that satisfy users. There's much less of a problem with one vendor deciding that a useful port (for example) is not needed anymore even if the users still need the port. You end up with a more versatile hardware platform with more features (likely costing a lot less too because companies compete for the customer dollar). With such competition, you get a significantly larger user base. Much more interest in the OS being refined/improved, and a lot more software available for the OS.

      "One of the few ways to get around a monopoly's power in the market without bowing to it is to maintain a complete, separate, vertical chain including a "competitor" for the monopolized product, but not actually competing."

      In other words, you fight it with another monopoly???

      "Fix the political system, legal bribes, and replace the justice dept. officials with honest men, then demonstrate that the laws will be enforced and then and only then might it make sense for Apple to compete with MS directly."

      Why rely on frivolous lawsuits and punishing companies for having too many features in their software? Why not just let the options compete, and let the users decide?

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
    17. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by dave562 · · Score: 1
      And there were quickly cheap third-party solutions to connect ADB and serial devices to USB ports.

      But have you actually tried to use a serial to USB adapter on anything like a CNC-machine? They simply don't work. You need a true, honest to God, hard wired serial port. Those serial to USB adapters seem to only be good if you want to run a serial mouse. If you need to do any thing else serial, like the CNC machine, or connect up a console cable... good freakin luck.

    18. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 1

      Multiple platform vendors compete with each other to provide hardware features that satisfy users.

      That strengthens the platform for end users, but does not strengthen the OS itself.

      In other words, you fight it with another monopoly???

      Not at all. Apple does not have a monopoly on any of the elements of the bundle they sell. Other companies, like Dell and Lenovo sell competing computer systems. But because they provide their own OS, in house, they are not subject to the monopoly influence on those computer companies, from MS's dominance in the desktop OS market. Apple has no leverage in the OS market to abuse because they don't sell their OS to other companies. Apple has no leverage in the computer market to abuse, because there are lots of competitors (albeit all of whom suffer because on one of their suppliers abuses). I think maybe you're failing to understand what a monopoly is.

      Why rely on frivolous lawsuits and punishing companies for having too many features in their software? Why not just let the options compete, and let the users decide?

      With a monopoly, you can win a head to head competition with a superior competitor, even with all buyers acting in their own immediate interest. Companies have tried to compete with MS, with superior offerings and died. It was many years before any of them saw any return from suing MS for its illegal actions at that time. Now who in their right mind would fund another company to compete with MS in that space? How could you sell a proven failure of a business plan to investors? You can't which is why the OS space has been dead so long.

      As for you "frivolous lawsuit" dig, you demonstrate an ignorance of antitrust law. We're talking about enforcing criminal law, not a civil lawsuit. It is just like the courts not prosecuting a company who commits fraud, or more accurately who does prosecute them, but in the punishment phase decides to not even take the money back or stop them from continuing their fraudulent operation.

      Apple not releasing OS X is the right move for Apple, because of the courts failure to make MS obey the law. The failure of any other company to create and sell a competing desktop OS is the right move based upon the same. That is why the courts should act, to provide a reason for a company to compete. After all, if you have a better product, but know you will still lose, why invest the time and money that can be more profitably used elsewhere? If I can invest in creating a new OS, which is almost doomed to fail and which even if it succeeds will not be as immensely profitable as MS is (since you'd then have to compete against them on price) or I can invest in creating a new line of cookbooks, which will be competing in a non-monopolized space and which will, thus, have a much greater likelihood of succeeding for better return... why would I try the former?

      Finally, just to disabuse you, users don't pick their OS. OEMs pick what OS to bundle based upon both what they think users want and what is profitable. If they bundle Windows, they stay slightly profitable like now. If they somehow convince Apple to sell them OS X and bundle it, they are risking their multimillion dollar company on a single gamble and will probably be sued into extinction by their shareholders unless they get very, very lucky.

    19. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Trelane · · Score: 1
      Why rely on frivolous lawsuits and punishing companies for having too many features in their software?

      By categorizing and then dismissing out-of-hand the lawsuits as "frivolous" and "punishing [Microsoft] for having too many features", your bias wrt this topic has already been displayed.

      Why not just let the options compete, and let the users decide?

      I'll answer this with a question. What chance does a lone soccer player have?

      --

      --
      Given enough personal experience, all stereotypes are shallow.
    20. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 1

      "I think maybe you're failing to understand what a monopoly is." Good points otherwise, but I still disagree that platform diversity and increased installation doesn't "[strengthen] the platform for end users, but does not strengthen the OS itself."

      A diversity of platform vendors means a larger market. That means more installations. This means more users of the OS. This translates into a "better OS" because there is more software for the OS, and a larger and more diverse user base provides more pressure on the OS makers to refine it.

      " I think maybe you're failing to understand what a monopoly is.

      I'm using the dictionary definitions, all of which mention the "monopolist" having sole control ("exclusive", "sole control"), not just one option out of many something that happens to be very strong. Logically, if Microsoft met several the most common definitions, there would not even be an OSX.

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
    21. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 1

      Now that apple is using x86 hardware there[sic] hardware lock in may hurt them even more and why did apple have to lock you it to only useing[sic] video cards from apple with there[sic] new systems?

      Umm, Apple does not lock you into using any video cards in any of their systems that I've seen. Most of their offerings are small form factor, or laptops, which use integrated graphics like every other computer of the same style. You can use any video card that supports Apple systems and firmware in their tower or with their other systems for that matter, if you move them into a case with room for them.

    22. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Daniel_Staal · · Score: 1

      Why in the heck are you trying to connect a CNC machine to an iMac? Especially when the iMacs first came out? If you wanted to connect to a Mac, the PowerMac G3 had serial ports, and was their professional machine at the time.

      Oh, and I have actually connected a console cable through a USB converter. It didn't work well, but I could do what I needed.

      The iMac was/is a consumer machine. USB did not make connecting consumer devieces appreaciably harder when it was introduced, and makes it much easier now.

      --
      'Sensible' is a curse word.
    23. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 1

      "By categorizing and then dismissing out-of-hand the lawsuits as "frivolous" and "punishing [Microsoft] for having too many features", your bias wrt this topic has already been displayed."

      I am indeed biased against frivolous lawsuits, and companies that compete by conniving to get the government to punish their competitors (instead of merely providing better product). An example of the former is Netscape (which combined making a crappy product with filing frivolous lawsuits and presenting false testimony: what a business plan!!!). An example of the latter is Mozilla/Firefox, which succeeds by making a good browser (no frivolous lawsuits involved).

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
    24. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Joe+The+Dragon · · Score: 1

      The mini has POS gma 950 video.

    25. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 1

      This translates into a "better OS" because there is more software for the OS, and a larger and more diverse user base provides more pressure on the OS makers to refine it.

      More software for an OS makes the platform better, again, not the OS itself. A more diverse user base is your guess as to what would happen, when in reality it might mean a smaller user base. As for pressuring Apple to innovate more, they are already under more pressure than simply straight up competition would provide. They survive by constantly staying ahead of what MS can copy into Windows.

      I'm using the dictionary definitions, all of which mention the "monopolist" having sole control ("exclusive", "sole control"), not just one option out of many something that happens to be very strong.

      The laws consider monopolies in economic terms, since the laws regarding monopolies exist for practical, not ethical reasons. Monopolies break capitalism as a functional model for an economy. They do this by allowing one company that gains significant influence in a market (note that is a market not a product) to use that influence to take over other markets, despite having inferior products in that second market. So in the eyes of the law, you can have a monopoly on cheese, if you are the only company selling cheese, even if another company sells pizza that comes with different cheese on it. Any cheese not sold or bartered in the primary market, does not in any way lesson the monopoly's ability to break the capitalist model.

      MS sells desktop OS's mainly to computer companies like Dell and Gateway. Dell and Gateway have no other options for an OS to buy that won't drive them out of business. Mac OS X is not in that market, because Apple will not sell it to them. Linux might make up a tiny portion of that market (pre-intalled by OEMs) but its influence is so small (in terms of money that changes hands) as to have no practical effect. Many legal systems set 70% of a market as a point to begin investigating whether on not a company has monopoly influence.

      Note, having monopoly influence is not illegal by itself. It is only abusing monopoly influence by tying multiple markets together that is illegal. Every court that has examined the issue has found MS to both have a monopoly in the market and to be abusing it. You can argue that according to a different way of defining monopolies they don't have one, but it does not matter. They are undeniably having the same adverse affect upon the market as is banned by law.

    26. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Joe+The+Dragon · · Score: 1

      In the macpro you can't use any pci-e video card you must use one form apple that has a efi rom on it.

    27. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 1

      "So in the eyes of the law, you can have a monopoly on cheese, if you are the only company selling cheese, even if another company sells pizza that comes with different cheese on it. Any cheese not sold or bartered in the primary market, does not in any way lesson the monopoly's ability to break the capitalist model."

      Did you intend this as an analogy? In the OS world, many companies sell cheese. Some products are cheesier than others!

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
    28. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 1

      In the macpro you can't use any pci-e video card you must use one form apple that has a efi rom on it.

      Apple does not make video cards. You can use any one of a number of offerings from ATI, NVidia, or any other company that makes them and supports both EFI and drivers for OS X. Apple has done nothing to lock them down at all and you can buy them from Apple or some other store. If you look on the Web sites of those vendors you'll see them for sale.

    29. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 1

      I am indeed biased against frivolous lawsuits...

      Why would you mention this in this same thread 20 minutes after responding to my post where I pointed out to you that there are no "frivolous lawsuits" or even regular lawsuits, only criminal indictments for breaking the law?

      ...and companies that compete by conniving to get the government to punish their competitors (instead of merely providing better product).

      Yeah, it sure is crazy for them to expect the government to enforce the laws against those who break them and not against those who don't.

      An example of the latter is Mozilla/Firefox, which succeeds by making a good browser (no frivolous lawsuits involved).

      Gee, yeah. What a great example. They provide an obviously superior product for years, that is so much better no one even bothers to argue it, and they get 10-20% of the market as compared to the inferior product which maintains 80%. Tell me again how that is the market rewarding companies for making a better competitor?

    30. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Trelane · · Score: 1

      I note your lack of replying to my question.

      --

      --
      Given enough personal experience, all stereotypes are shallow.
    31. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 1

      Maybe if it was on the sports forum.

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
    32. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Trelane · · Score: 1

      haha. Wow. Way to lean to avoid the point.

      --

      --
      Given enough personal experience, all stereotypes are shallow.
    33. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by krell · · Score: 1

      Which would easily be the case if you had bothered to make one in the first place.

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
    34. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Trelane · · Score: 1

      Fun times. Heh.

      --

      --
      Given enough personal experience, all stereotypes are shallow.
    35. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by profplump · · Score: 1

      They take up all sorts of board space (which you may not value but I do), the connectors are expensive (as far as motherboard components go), and most importantly, the motherboard still has low-speed I/O channels to support such silly things.

      Moreover it's easy to find cheap, fairly reliable USB floppy drives, parallel port, and PS/2 adapters. So if you did actually need one of those things you could add it; adding a bit of ancient hardware to the 1/1000 systems that need it seems much more cost effective than shipping 999 systems with extra, useless parts.

    36. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by dave562 · · Score: 1

      I wasn't talking about iMacs specifically. I was more addressing the issues with USB to serial converters.

    37. Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment by Lesson+No.+25 · · Score: 1
      Those serial to USB adapters seem to only be good if you want to run a serial mouse.
      Overstatement, I think. I use one often to sync my Palm Vx with my desktop via the cradle (9-pin serial).
      If you need to do any thing else serial, like the CNC machine, or connect up a console cable... good freakin luck.
      I've also used them to connect to the console of a Cisco router, no problem.

      I'm not familiar with CNC machines, though. Are you sure the problem is the USB to serial adapters in general, or could it be that you got a cheap one?

  3. Re:0000 by krell · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    "http://goatse.cz/"

    Sorry, I don't think that this company was there with their reknowned Goatzway computers (quite well known for their wide-open-port philosophy).

    --
    Where were you when the voynix came?
  4. You'll be surprised at some of the answers. Or not by Kenja · · Score: 1

    "You'll be surprised at some of the answers"

    Not realy, I couldn't get through more then a page of that marketing/manager speak. I didn't see the word "synergy" but you know they where having to choke back saying it.

    --

    "Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
  5. No ads, but no surprise either by Rosco+P.+Coltrane · · Score: 2, Informative

    That page was surprisingly free of any ad for me, thanks probably to the filter in Firefox. But it was also unsurprisingly devoid of content, as most of what those execs have to say is rah-rah or generic bollocks.

    --
    "A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
    1. Re:No ads, but no surprise either by Rob+T+Firefly · · Score: 2, Funny

      That's what Firefox needs, a generic bollocks filter! Adjustable settings could include stuff like "corporate press release," "mainstream news," and "emo livejournal." Somebody, write a plugin!

      --
      Slashdot Burying Stories About Slashdot Media Owned
    2. Re:No ads, but no surprise either by Rosco+P.+Coltrane · · Score: 1

      That's what Firefox needs, a generic bollocks filter! Adjustable settings could include stuff like "corporate press release," "mainstream news,"

      Sounds easy to do: your filter just has to look for "is a leader in", "empowers customers" and "breakthrough" to zap PR bullshit; "Bush" and "Iraq" should cover mainstream news. As for emo livejournals, I have no idea what emo is I'm afraid...

      --
      "A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
    3. Re:No ads, but no surprise either by solevita · · Score: 1

      You could just block Slashdot at your external firewall...

      Not to troll (my karma has already had the crap beaten out of it on more than one occassion), but if Hemos agrees that 9 pages of ads isn't great, why'd he still put the story on the front page? Here's an idea, don't put such stories on slashdot; the internet will be a better place as a result.

      Now karma burn!

    4. Re:No ads, but no surprise either by Chosen+Reject · · Score: 1

      your filter just has to look for "is a leader in", "empowers customers" and "breakthrough"

      For fun one day go to the jobs section of gamasutra.com and look at the description of the game companies. It's amazing how many "award winning", "leading developer/publisher", "highly creative", "most innovative", and "ground breaking" companies there are. You would think that not a single crappy game has ever been made.

      --
      Stop Global Warming!
      Just say no to irreversible processes!
    5. Re:No ads, but no surprise either by ediron2 · · Score: 1

      Back in the day, slashdot used to be a relatively effective part of this sort of a peer-managed geek filtering system. Generic crap in, only the good stuff as headlines.

      Nowadays, they're up to their eyeballs in the BS. Heck, I'm not a conspiracy theorist type, but it does seem like they've changed at a pretty fundamental level. Granted, content often comes wrapped in these paragraph per page of ads schmears, but if slashdot as a group doesn't try to exert some influence, what good are they!?

    6. Re:No ads, but no surprise either by yuna49 · · Score: 1

      I especially liked the responses about the enthusiast and gaming markets. They all said how important these markets are to them. I suppose the smaller retailers might care about them because they can't compete with the Dells and HPs on price, but Dell? What proportion of the PCs that go out their door do you think are designed for gaming? I'd bet it's way under 10%. I'm sure few, if any, of their large corporate clients care about having machines designed to play Oblivion.

      I would have loved to hear one of them say, "No, those markets aren't that important to us. We're concentrating on the business market." But, then, unlike most Slashdot readers, I don't think PC gaming's all that important either.

  6. ABS/Newegg absent? by BenFenner · · Score: 1

    Is it just me, or were others expecting a lot more from the ABS/Newegg camp? I mean, it's almost an insult leaving his comments in there. Not to say I still won't shop there. The real question is, how do I get a job at Falcon Northwest?

    1. Re:ABS/Newegg absent? by Joe+The+Dragon · · Score: 1

      You may have to be willing to be on call 24/7 to work at Falcon Northwest

    2. Re:ABS/Newegg absent? by BenFenner · · Score: 1

      Wouldn't be any different from my current freelance computer tech work. I treat my customers/clients well.

  7. Pages and pages of Ads by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I don't understand why Slashdot has decided to finally start complaining about interviews or reviews split up until a many bite-size pages with a ton of ads. This has been going on for years, it's been annoying for years, and many-a-site that Slashdot regularly links to, like Tom's, is littered with articles laid out the exact same way. Did someone just wake up and decide to try cleaning up the internet?

    Slashdot's layout is great, and the ads are unobtrussive, no matter what some trolls will say. This isn't Slashdot bitching about practices it's guilty of.. so why is this starting up all of a sudden?

  8. Re:0000 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I hear the extra large blowhole in the back makes for great cooling.

  9. How long will these small OEM last by Joe+The+Dragon · · Score: 1

    With Dell and Hp buying up boutique oems how is before they can build a system that is as good as a Falcon Northwest system for a lot less then Falcon Northwest and other make you pay?

  10. Supply/pricing by jense · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It seems to be a universal concern across this panel that the dependency on hardware vendors (and their ever-lowering prices) is choking the ability to sell at a high profit margin, and the future of these companies lies in their value-add or approach to the problem. Dell seems to be leaning to the ever-successful volume model, while smaller niche companies will be focusing on specialty services differentiation. In the end, though, it's likely that many of the smaller companies will either be bought (like Alienware) or stay very small in their respective niche. IMO.

    --
    Touting MyEclipse AJAX Tools
  11. Only vaguely related question by StressGuy · · Score: 1

    This may well be modded "off topic" but I'm curious nonetheless.

    Albert Wang (ABS/Newegg)

    Is he related to the old Wang computers? Perhaps some of you remember the old joke:

    Q: "What were the first two computers?"

    A: "Eve had an Apple and Adam had a Wang"

    Seeing as Slashdot is loaded with computer engineers, I figure one of you might know.

    --
    A goal is a dream with a deadline
    1. Re:Only vaguely related question by Gregory+Cox · · Score: 1

      No, that was An Wang (and his son). Wang's a fairly common name.

      --
      If you all Google Slashdot, will it Slashdot Google?
    2. Re:Only vaguely related question by n17ikh · · Score: 1

      Nope, different Wang:
      Wang Laboratories
      Wang Labs was founded by the now deceased An Wang.

      --
      Hard work pays off tomorrow, but procrastination pays off NOW!
  12. in other words by krell · · Score: 1

    In other words, I don't like the idea at all that a platform computer makes the decision that it is immoral to use a certain type of peripheral plug, and excludes it for that reason. With competing platform makers, such anti-user decisions get marginalized.

    --
    Where were you when the voynix came?
  13. Re:You'll be surprised at some of the answers. Or by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I stopped at "boutique builder".

  14. Can somebody clue me in here? by StressGuy · · Score: 1

    Unfortuantely, I gave up modding this thread to ask a question but I'm sure the parent will be modded to oblivion anyways. So, I'll ask another one. What is it about Slashdot that attracts links to that particular site? I frequent several other sites where you can post comments...including FARK, and this is the only place I see these links.

    What is the connection here? What is the fascination with trying to lure people into seeing these pictures? If blocking a controversial image is censorship, then luring some unsuspecting person into viewing that image is the other side of that coin...and just as bad.

    --
    A goal is a dream with a deadline
  15. Corporate press releases? by krell · · Score: 0, Troll

    That's what Firefox needs, a generic bollocks filter! Adjustable settings could include stuff like "corporate press release"

    Didn't you mean to say Fox News, not Firefox?

    --
    Where were you when the voynix came?
  16. Albert Wang by pr0nbot · · Score: 0

    Of course, the article has to span nine pages because they have to show their ads over...and over...and over.

    No, they just had to make space for Albert Wang's contributions. Geez, can't that guy shut up?!

    1. Re:Albert Wang by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      OH MY GOD! BEST SARCASM EVER!

      Too bad I am too lazy to make an account and award funny points.

  17. Translations by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    Q1: What is the current state of the computer hardware manufacturing industry?

    Michael Dell: We pretty much own what we can get of the US/European market, so we're trying to find out how to sell in other parts of the world where people want computers but don't have money.
    Wang: Mumble mumble buy this now
    Falcon Northwest: We don't really care, we just sell whatever is most expensive
    Maingear: I am a nerd
    Velocity Micro: I went to graduate school
    Puget: Our computers are cool, and we're cool
    Overdrive: Hello, I used to work at IBM

    Q2: How would you characterize your company's current place in the manufacturing industry? What, if anything, do you plan to change about your company's place in the industry?

    Velocity Micro: We keep fighting hard, although we are the best.
    Dell Corporation: We hire nerds who went to graduate school
    Falcon Northwest: Our PCs are better than yours
    Wang: We're just the best
    Overdrive: Our PCs are really very good
    Maingear: Your PCs will be assembled by organic workers
    Puget: Leading Computer Supplies, Top Value

    Q: What practices and values have helped your company succeed? How important are the following ideals in your company: (a) innovation and (b) consistency of build quality?

    Falcon: We have sex with our customers, even if they are men. We even get them the latest toys. Hey, they are paying.
    Overdrive: My PC is better than yours
    Dell: We annoy you and you will tend to see us everywhere, yet people still buy from us. Suck ass.
    Maingear: For the final quality testing, we strap our computers to the crotches of technicians, who proceed to battle it out. The best wins.
    Velocity: We are, in fact, organic ourselves. Look, I have a flesh arm.
    Puget: You could build houses of our computers
    ABS: We suck

    Q: Does the hardware enthusiast market influence the integrator strategy? What about the PC gaming market? If so, how, and what is the net effect on your company?

    Maingear: Nerds.
    Dell: We suck up to people
    Wang: We are robotic drones. Maybe that makes our computers cheap?
    Falcon: We pretend to be like you so you will buy our computers
    Overdrive: We just do whatever.
    Puget: Buy more of our computers, they really rock
    Velocity: We are the elite of technocracy

    Q: How will the mainstream arrival of dual- and quad-core technologies affect the industry as a whole? How will these technologies influence your company?

    Falcon: We're not paying attention but it doesn't matter since we're just selling the most expensive stuff anyway
    Dell: Buy our computers, we're spread them out here for you to look at
    Puget: Zen zen, the future is now!
    Wang: We're just being silly
    Overdrive: We're just selling stuff that people want.
    Velocity: We're boring people at parties, but boy can we make computers
    Maingear: Impossible is nothing. You'll see. Once we've grafted this computer into your eyes.

    Q: Currently, what serious bottlenecks or obstacles do your company and the whole industry face?

    Wang: Can someone sue Dell please?
    Maingear: Customers, stop being cheap, sucky bastards.
    Dell: Our boring nature hides a master of hypnosis
    Velocity: We grow our computers like others grow broccoli
    Falcon: Not buying our computers gives you cancer
    Puget: You won't be better at 'doing this yourself' than you will at DIY, so don't consider it.
    Overdrive: We're boring.

    Q: With the rapid changes in hardware, how far ahead is it practical to project future developments in the hardware manufacturing industry? What will be the state of the industry at the end of that projected timeframe? Where do you want your company to be then?

    Overdrive: We live in the crazy home, if you join us there will be throwing of cake. It's not likely to change.
    Maingear: We're trying to build a monopoly. Shut up.
    Wang: We're the best, B-S-T-E
    Falcon: I'm just a simple blacksmith, making thees computers
    Velocity: Our products will be like spiders - unless you buy e

  18. Puget Custom Computers by pjbgravely · · Score: 1

    I see that they offer to install Linux for you.

    No idea if they remove the price of Microsoft Windows from the total but it is a start I guess.

    --
    Star Trek, there maybe hope.
    1. Re:Puget Custom Computers by WilliamGeorge · · Score: 1

      I work at Puget Systems, and if you want Linux we can remove the cost of Windows from a system. We don't support Linux, as we aren't getting any money from providing it, but we will pre-install it for you. We can also sell systems with no OS, if you want to do that yourself. The only exception to this is our Certified Systems (http://www.pugetsystems.com/certified.php) where we require a Windows install (along with having other hardware restrictions).

      Feel free to email us at sales@pugetsystems.com for more info.

      --
      William George
    2. Re:Puget Custom Computers by sharkey · · Score: 1

      They even pre-install Fedora Core 6! Talk about being ahead of the curve, they're even ahead of the Fedora Project itself.

      --

      --
      "Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
    3. Re:Puget Custom Computers by pjbgravely · · Score: 1

      Thanks for the info. It is nice to hear of a company selling a computer without the windows tax. I will keep you in mind next time I can afford to upgrade.

      --
      Star Trek, there maybe hope.
  19. Let's Be Clear About The Terms by mpapet · · Score: 1

    The summary lumps generic retailers (newegg) with PC retailers. They are completely different.

    NewEgg is a straight retailer. Boxes come in the back door, priced and shipped out the front door. They don't even come in the front door anymore, they just ship them straight from the distributor in many situations.

    PC retailers brand Other People's stuff. The Other People are mostly no-name (and some not-so-no-name) pc parts manufacturers. (think computex, & China) Their value is discriminating the good from the bad parts, getting a good price, put them all together and sell at a higher price. From there, they sell them through retailers like newegg.

    Completely different businesses each with their own set of problems.

    --
    http://www.maxineudall.com/2010/02/should-economists-be-sued-for-malpractice.html
    1. Re:Let's Be Clear About The Terms by jkwdoc · · Score: 1

      ABS, the SI that owns Newegg, was being talked about. ABS was making systems long before Newegg was around. Albert's comments, such as they are, were in the context of ABS, not Newegg.

  20. Wang == Smith by maggard · · Score: 1

    No.

    You can learn all about this incredibly common last name on wikipedia.

    --
    I don't read ACs: If a post isn't worth so much as a nom de plume to its author then I wont bother either.
  21. Michael Dell: Android? by meburke · · Score: 1

    IMO, the games-oriented CEO's were close to their customers' needs, while others, Michael Dell particularly, were almost clueless. Michael Dell sounded like a politician in a close race who is afraid to say anything substantial or controversial.

    Why don't I recommend Dell computers anymore? Because tech support sucks. I'd like to give Dell a clue: Your systems don't work flawlessly every time and you need to have better tech support. And when I get to the third-level support tech who is supposed to know something, I want solutions, not someone saying, "This is unusual." It usually isn't unusual. I can google for the problem and find dozens of complaints over the same issue.

    Michael Dell has become the Max Headroom of the computer industry.

    --
    "The mind works quicker than you think!"
  22. Why don't dell sell its own software .. by rs232 · · Score: 1

    Why don't they start selling their own software. Why didn't they move into other product areas. What's stopping them

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/07/13/microsoft_ japan_trouble/
    http://www.thechannelinsider.com/article/Tangent+S uit+Claims+Microsoft+Soaked+Partners/171923_1.aspx
    http://slashdot.org/articles/02/04/27/231221.shtml
    http://www.usdoj.gov/atr/cases/f212700/212766.htm

    re Re:Nice to see a competitive open environment

    --
    davecb5620@gmail.com
    1. Re:Why don't dell sell its own software .. by krell · · Score: 1

      "Why don't they start selling their own software. Why didn't they move into other product areas. What's stopping them"

      What does this have to do with anything?

      --
      Where were you when the voynix came?
  23. Mod Parent Down! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That's NOT insightful at all!

    How's the mini a mid-range system? It's a ENTRY level computer:

    -A CPU that's a bit slower than an Athlon64 3800+ (an entry level CPU)
    -512MB of RAM - very much entry level (I bought a 500$ HP a year ago that had 1GB)
    -a tiny (60 or 80GB - my 500$ year old box shipped with 200), slow 5400rpm drive - VERY VERY much entry level! (totally unacceptable IMO)
    -Intel GMA video which is using some of the system's [already low] RAM - again very much entry level
    -seemingly DVD writer ("superdrive") doesn't come with the "basic" mini, even though DVDRW drives are only like 40$ retail - very much entry level

    There's NOTHING mid-range about it, except perhaps the price. Yes, it might be tiny, but the specs are way too low. If it shipped with a decent HD, faster CPU and at least a GB of RAM, I might have considered it.

  24. Re:Michael Dell has become the Max Headroom of the by twmcneil · · Score: 0

    That's a terrible thing to say about Max.

    --
    "The ferrets, they're every where I tell you!"
  25. BINGO! by ISoldat53 · · Score: 1

    Buzzword bingo anyone?