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Apple Unveils Extra Leopard-isms To Developers

devilsecret writes to point out that some of the new Apple capabilities for developers on Leopard have been unveiled. The most interesting parts appear to be the opening of more of iLife to other programs, and the inclusion of Ruby on Rails.

25 of 181 comments (clear)

  1. RoR bandwagon? by not+already+in+use · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Anyone think Apple jumped on the RoR bandwagon a little too soon? The whole "movement" has lost a lot of steam and it doesn't appear to be the silver bullet everyone originally thought it was. Also, is this just part of the developer suite, or is RoR support somehow built in to the OEM OS?

    --
    Similes are like metaphors
    1. Re:RoR bandwagon? by nine-times · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Anyone think Apple jumped on the RoR bandwagon a little too soon? The whole "movement" has lost a lot of steam and it doesn't appear to be the silver bullet everyone originally thought it was.

      Wouldn't that mean they jumped on the bandwagon a little too late?

      Anyway, RoR isn't the solution to all programming problems, but it seems to have enough steam that it's going to stick around. OSX comes with Apache, and it's not hard to get PHP, MySQL, or whatever else installed. There's a ruby interpreter in the OS already, and a lot of the prominent people in the RoR community are OSX users.

      I can't RTFA to know what they've actually done, but why wouldn't they support RoR? In spite of not finding the meaning of life, solving world hunger, or finding hot women for me, it's a pretty good tool. Something can be useful without solving every single problem, you know.

    2. Re:RoR bandwagon? by mblase · · Score: 4, Funny

      Do you have concrete links and facts to support your observation?

      This is Slashdot. What do YOU think?

    3. Re:RoR bandwagon? by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 2, Funny
      Do you have concrete links and facts to support your observation?

      This is Slashdot. What do YOU think?

      Sure. If he's anything like me, he probably just doesn't remember what they were. He could find them with Google, but doesn't feel like it and suggests you go Google it for yourself.
    4. Re:RoR bandwagon? by larkost · · Score: 2, Informative

      A couple of notes:

      RoR is simply going to be included. Nothing more at the moment on that count. Apple already has a easy-to-use database solution for Objective-C applications in CoreData (though I wish they would make it multi-user/computer capable).

      And PHP is already included in the OS, you just have to turn it on. This is somewhat good from a security standpoint, but I wish they would put in a button to turn it on (next to the one to turn on Apache).

    5. Re:RoR bandwagon? by Fred_A · · Score: 2, Funny

      But since they name all they releases after large cats, they had to go "RoR!"

      Ehm. Ok, I know the way out...

      --

      May contain traces of nut.
      Made from the freshest electrons.
    6. Re:RoR bandwagon? by joshorion · · Score: 2, Informative

      And PHP is already included in the OS, you just have to turn it on.

      Minor correction, but, there's nothing you need to do in order to 'turn PHP on' with OS X. Pop open the command line and type 'php -v,' and, like any application, you'll notice it's always there for you to use.

      It's also configured with Apache by default, so you just have to start apache and you're able to serve PHP documents. It's PHP4, though.

  2. slashdotted already? by qw0ntum · · Score: 5, Informative

    Here's the link to Apple's page describing the developer features: http://developer.apple.com/leopard/overview/index. html

    --
    'Every story, if continued long enough, ends in death.' --Ernest Hemingway
  3. Re: ????? Link working? by gEvil+(beta) · · Score: 5, Funny

    3 browsers and 2 OSes, no luck loading the link yet.. anyone else?

    The problem is clearly that you're using the wrong browser and OS combination. Keep on trying different ones. One of them will get the link to load.

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    This guy's the limit!
  4. Re:No comments, but Slashdotted? by acaeti · · Score: 3, Funny

    I felt a great disturbance in the Internets, as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced.

  5. Boom! by zoeblade · · Score: 2, Funny

    BOOM!

    Boom... Boom.

  6. Re:I wish MS would come out with something like th by soft_guy · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I use both XCode and Visual Studio. I much prefer XCode and Interface Builder. There are also a lot of other very nice tools that Apple bundles for free. They are nicer to use than what Microsoft gives you, plus there are a lot of things that you get for free on Apple that you would have to buy third party on Windows such as the coverage tool (gcov) and the profiler (Shark). So, yes, Apple's tools ARE as nice as they appear to be.

    Unfortunately, today I have to use Visual Studio and I'm trying to figure out how to get my program to run in a Release build. It runs OK in Debug, but for whatever reason I'm getting an error dialog about not having a manifest file to load the C++ runtime DLL (?). I wish I could use XCode to write Windows apps. Or alternatively that our Windows users would just all buy Macs.

    --
    Avoid Missing Ball for High Score
  7. Why do people pay for this stuff? by Channard · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Maybe I'm missing the point here, but why would anyone pay the asking price of just under a hundred quid for a minor revision? No, this isn't intented to be flamebait - I'm a new Mac Mini owner myself and it's getting way more use than my PC. But I can't understand how Apple can charge for what is a pretty damn small upgrade. There were some major major differences between XP and 2000, and I can understand Microsoft paying for these. I can also understand Apple charging for the jump from 9.x to 10.x. But from 10.4 to 10.5? What am I missing here?

    1. Re:Why do people pay for this stuff? by 2nd+Post! · · Score: 4, Informative

      In the jump from 10.4 to 10.5 you get:
      You get built in backup and restore software
      You get automatic backup functionality
      You get virtual desktops
      You get built in remote presentation and remote control software
      You get new Widgets plus the ability to turn any webpage into a widget
      You get a new mail program with increased planning functionality
      New group management functionality in Mail and in iCal

      Under the hood you get:
      New animation libraries
      New 64 bit CPU optimizations
      New resolution independent ui

      You pay for this stuff because you find it useful.

    2. Re:Why do people pay for this stuff? by ckelly5 · · Score: 2, Informative

      FWIW, I also have to mention that the upgrade from 2000 to XP was also technically a minor revision (2000 is Windows NT 5.0, XP is Windows NT 5.1).

    3. Re:Why do people pay for this stuff? by NivenHuH · · Score: 3, Informative

      You forgot a biggie...

      Now in Leopard, the Objective-C runtime has been updated to include a thoroughly modern and high performance garbage collection system, making memory management a thing of the past.

      Garbage collection is included as part of the Obj-C 2.0 runtime... Say bye bye to most memory leaks.. :) I think this is turned on by default and is an opt-out option for your code.

      --
      Just when you make it idiotproof, some idiot builds a better idiot.
    4. Re:Why do people pay for this stuff? by lurch_mojoff · · Score: 2, Insightful
      ...No, this isn't intented to be flamebait - I'm a new Mac Mini owner myself and it's getting way more use than my PC. But I can't understand how Apple can charge for what is a pretty damn small upgrade...
      How is this not a flamebait? First, you bring up a question that has been answered about a jazillion times already - Steve Jobs is in lovez with the number 10 (or in Apple lingo "X") and from now on for Mac OS the major version number is the one after the first decimal point. And second, even if you actually believed that the numbering scheme proved that this is a minor update you didn't even bother to check what is the new and improved stuff in Leopard, yet you felt the need to post a comment titled "Why do people pay for this stuff?". This is definitely a textbook example of a flamebait.
  8. Re:No comments, but Slashdotted? by Overly+Critical+Guy · · Score: 2, Informative

    It should be noted that one of the reasons Apple is shipping Ruby on Rails is that Rails was developed on Macs, all the major Rails developers use Macs, and the preferred editor is a Mac application called Textmate.

    --
    "Sufferin' succotash."
  9. Re:I wish MS would come out with something like th by tconkling · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I'm a die-hard Mac user at home, but I write games for Windows (using MS's dev tools) for a living. As a Mac development hobbyist, I spent years using Metrowerks' CodeWarrior IDE, and -- more recently, and to a lesser extent -- Xcode.

    Although I prefer the look and feel of Apple's dev tools to Microsoft's, I find that I get work done more quickly with Visual Studio than with Xcode. More accurately, I get work done more quickly with Visual Studio and the excellent third-party plugin Visual Assist, which provides a number of important code navigation shortcuts including code completion that completely eclipses VS's IntelliSense.

    Visual Assist is one of those tools that's painful to be without once you start using it. It sounds like the company isn't planning on a Mac version, which is a shame... do any Mac devs out there have tips on how to make the Xcode development experience less painful -- specifically, how to deal with its poor code completion facilities and slow text editor?

  10. Re:I wish MS would come out with something like th by drakken33 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I'm a Linux and Mac user at home with almost no MS software (I have played with Vista RC1 recently and have Win2k in a VM for web site testing). I'm not a fan of MS or their software but I have to use XP at work. I think it's important that I say this up front because of what is to follow.

    We have VS 2005 at work and I recently got permission to install it (no one else was using it as our resident Windows dev has gone back to Delphi) to create some tools to make my life easier. I have to say I was very pleasantly surprised. I can make my tools very quickly indeed with C# and .NET and the IDE is pretty good.

    The downside is that .NET can make you lazy because it does so much for you. It does 90% of what I need but the last 10% has me spending too long looking through the docs to see if there are properties, methods or events that let me do what I want easily. For example, I'm using a TabControl but I couldn't find a way to detect right-clicks on a TabPage's tab so I could pop up a context menu so I wrote some code to loop through all the TabPages, see if the right-click was on each TabPage in turn and if so pop up the context menu. I'm still learning the framework but that seems like a round about way to do things and something that should be there already.

    Next to VS 2005, Xcode/Objective-C/Cocoa feels quite "old school" but I like that. It's more like the way I was taught. It can be hard work but it's worth it. I think Apple's approach may be less RAD but it maybe a more flexible approach. It's too early in my VS 2005 usage to be sure. At least Apple provide dev tools with their OS. If you want to attract the home coder you need good free dev tools so I'm glad MS offer the Express versions of VS and I plan to look at at least Visual C# Express to see how that compares to Xcode.

    --
    Andy.
  11. 64 bit applications in Leopard by iljitschvanbeijnum · · Score: 2, Informative
    For most applications you gain a lot of 64 bit support just by using the proper libraries. There are very few applications out there that would need both 32 bit and 64 bit versions of their code, so that probably wouldn't add to the size of the Mac version of Firefox 2

    On PowerPC you'd only want applications that actually need to do 64-bit math or address more than 2 or 3 GB of memory to be 64-bit, but for x86 it's a different story because the extra registers that are available in 64-bit mode may make applications that have no use for 64-bitness in itself a lot faster.

    So I'm curious as to what developers will do. Hopefully, they'll evaluate the performance of their code and compile for 32 or 64 bits depending on which is faster. But of course you want your app to work on older Macs too, so you may need to include:

    • A PowerPC/no Altivec version for G3 Macs
    • A PowerPC+Altivec version for G4 Macs
    • A PowerPC 64-bit version for G5 Macs
    • An x86/32 version for Core 1 Macs
    • An x86/64 version for Core 2 Macs

    18 MB may not seem so bad at some point in the future. :-)

  12. Re:Quartz 2D Extreme by Quila · · Score: 2, Informative

    Ars Technica said Quartz 2D Extreme was there and possible to use, just not enabled because it probably hadn't been completely worked out by Apple yet.

    But given fact #1, that Ars said that Q2DE is basically like running your whole desktop as an OpenGL scene, and fact #2, that Leopard will have "resolution-independent interfaces," I'm betting that Q2DE is fully running and implemented in 10.5.

  13. Emphasizing the Wrong Features by 99BottlesOfBeerInMyF · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Ruby on Rails and iLife integration? The former is for 10.5 server (which most people here don't care about) and the latter was announced months ago. I submitted a link to this information four days ago, but with focus on some more important features:
    • OpenGL 2.1
    • Automatically spawning a thread for OpenGL programs that feeds the GPU, allowing those programs that are CPU bound up to two times the performance when using multi-core systems, without any more work on the part of developers.
    • Application signing to determine trust levels
    • Mandatory Access Controls, for sandboxing applications like SELinux does

    It is these last two that are of real interest. Individually they are just adding more security features under the hood, which most people will never notice. In that case it is great, but nothing too new. Together, however, they could be the groundwork for just the type malware/spyware defense some security people have been hoping for for years.

    Imagine a system where all unsigned code runs in a sandbox by default, without access to any files it does not create, the internet, or any important parts of the system. Realistically, people want to run software they don't trust. They will run it. Most people don't understand the idea of multiple users as a security mechanism. It does not make sense to them that you need to create a new user account to sandbox an application and it is painful from a usability standpoint.

    This announcement could be the first indication of the first real, usable desktop that has the benefits of some of the most secure workstations on the planet. Who cares about RoR tools in OS X server?

  14. Re:I wish MS would come out with something like th by sofla · · Score: 2, Informative

    This is admittedly off-topic, but...the fix for the "error dialog about not having a manifest file to load" is to generate a manifest (linker setting and also the new "manifest tool") and use the new "assembly" based deployment model. The release builds of CRT in VS 2005 have a runtime check which throws an exception if you don't have either a manifest resource (embedded) or .manifest file (detached) for your application. In other words, M$ is FORCING you to use their new deployment model now, whether you want to or not. And just for the sake of doing it - the .DLL's themselves don't care how they are deployed as they still run on pre-manifest systems.

    Yay assemblies! They're like frameworks, except without versioning and without the development time support! More effort to build and you get nothing out of it.