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The State of Gaming in Japan

dean73 writes to mention an article at the SeekJapan site entitled The State of Gaming in Japan. The article runs down the seventh round of the console war from the Japanese perspective. IE: The one where Microsoft is probably going to lose. From the article: "The Xbox 360 comes to us now with a reduced price, a screwed-up slogan ('do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360') and a slew of games targeted at the Japanese audience. The trump card is Hironobu Sakaguchi: the Final Fantasy creator's studio, Mistwalker, is due to deliver the first of two Xbox-only RPGs, Blue Dragon, on December 7th. Given that the Xbox has until now lacked any decent Japanese-style RPG (the cocaine of the J-geek world), this might prove just the ticket, and Microsoft is predicting a big hit."

45 comments

  1. The 'X' is the key (to failure) by Crasty · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    There is no X in the Japanese language. Therefore the Japanese will continue to view the Xbox as a myth.

    1. Re:The 'X' is the key (to failure) by AKAImBatman · · Score: 1

      Really? I guess that would make the manga/movie X a little hard for them to swallow. Not to mention the Japanese rock band X Japan.

      Most countries that don't use the Roman character set are still quite familiar with it. In fact, you'll find common examples of English in nearly every country in the world. It always amazes me when I'm given a box of candy from Russia that has the label in English. Go figure.

    2. Re:The 'X' is the key (to failure) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      X-Japan would be a proof that it doesn't mean much for success or failure.

      (though they sure have something of a myth)

    3. Re:The 'X' is the key (to failure) by pkvon · · Score: 1

      And I thought japanese are big on XXX stuff ;)

    4. Re:The 'X' is the key (to failure) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It was a joke, Sparky.

    5. Re:The 'X' is the key (to failure) by Speare · · Score: 1

      Others have already said that your idea that the Japanese are unfamiliar with the letter 'X' as preposterous. They learn English in school and are inundated with western media. Algebra doesn't get taught with just kana for variable names. They get it.

      It is interesting to note that where many American quizzes refer to "true/false" questions, it's pretty common for a Japanese quiz to use a circle as "correct" and an X as "incorrect." I doubt that would become a negative product connotation (like the apocryphal Chevy "No-Go" Nova story), but it's another useless bit of trivia to add to this mostly worthless thread anyway.

      --
      [ .sig file not found ]
    6. Re:The 'X' is the key (to failure) by Satorian · · Score: 1
      It is interesting to note that where many American quizzes refer to "true/false" questions, it's pretty common for a Japanese quiz to use a circle as "correct" and an X as "incorrect." I doubt that would become a negative product connotation (like the apocryphal Chevy "No-Go" Nova story), but it's another useless bit of trivia to add to this mostly worthless thread anyway.

      Which seems to explain the UI logic of the PS2 in Japanese games, where the circle button confirms your choice and the X button cancels it.

    7. Re:The 'X' is the key (to failure) by Andrew+Kismet · · Score: 1

      Very true, in fact they're in love with the letter X - Rockman X, X Japan, Guilty Gear XX, they just don't stop using it...
      But it's because they don't have it in their language they're obsessed with it. The closest spelling I can get to it in romanised katakana is EKUSU. (that's three Japanese letters, E, KU, SU)

    8. Re:The 'X' is the key (to failure) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ekkusu, that's four Japanese letters, E XTSU KU SU

  2. "do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by gamer4Life · · Score: 1

    ...is that the Japanese version of Engrish?

    I wonder if the Japanese laugh at it and will use it as an inside joke like "all your base are belong to us"? Of course, perhaps they're more cultured and civilized than us.

    1. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by Aladrin · · Score: 1

      That's the English translation of it. I suspect the slogan was developed there, in their current culture, and sounds weird to us because of it.

      --
      "If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
    2. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by LilHapaGirl · · Score: 1

      not to mention I suspect that's a TERRIBLE translation. if they wrote "Choice shite" or "Choice wo shite" then that COULD be translated as "Choice, Do" but only if you were an idiot .... or maybe if you looked up each word seperately in a dictionary and didn't take grammar into account. On the other hand, since most Japanese people don't really speak english that well they could probably use that english slogan and sell it just fine. If I string together a whole bunch of japanese words and make them sound cutsey and cool, I bet I could sell something to most americans regardless of whether or not the real meaning of the words was "Stuffs Stuffs buy it yay!" or not

    3. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      On the other hand, since most Japanese people don't really speak english that well they could probably use that english slogan and sell it just fine.

      Knowing Japanese penchant for engrish (Americans aren't the only ones that buy stuff they don't understand because it "looks cool"), I'd say that the slogan as printed here is exactly what they are using there, with no translation. The people almost certainly know what "Do" means, the gamers will know what "game" means (especially with ruby-type katakana "ge-mu" over it), most will probably just ignore "choice", but they'll understand that it's an ad for the xbox 360.

      I bet I could sell something to most americans regardless of whether or not the real meaning of the words was "Stuffs Stuffs buy it yay!" or not

      Like people who stick random kanji on their cars or have tattoos done in a language they don't understand but they trust the drunk guy with the needle that it means "studly rock god"

    4. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by Baldrake · · Score: 1

      I don't think this is a translation; I think this is the slogan.

      In my experience from a few trips to Japan, it is very common to use weird English as product slogans. Most Japanese have enough high school English to understand a short slogan made up of common words, even if they don't speak it that comfortably.

      Perhaps my favourite was a 7/11-type store that had the phrase "So Delicious! So Happy!" plastered all over its fast-food takeouts.

      I no longer view this as badly translated English. It's really its own thing - the use of English words to convey a Japanese esthetic. It's clear that these big companies could use correct English if they wanted to.

    5. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by blahplusplus · · Score: 1

      "perhaps they're more cultured and civilized than us."

      They are to an extent more cultured, but more civilized is debatable.

    6. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by MeanderingMind · · Score: 1

      For those who don't understand Japanese, this is what the title says.

      (the) Keyword (is) do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360 media briefing's (bunch of kanji I can't read)

      So the slogan is probably closer to "The Keyword is do! Game, do! Choice, do!" than it is "do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360".

      --
      Thunderclone: ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE! ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE!
    7. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by Aladrin · · Score: 1

      Ah, thank for that. It makes a lot more sense that way, and with their grammar being different than ours, it probably sounds pleasing to them.

      --
      "If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
    8. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by Jesterboy · · Score: 1

      Actually, after browsing around their website, apparently they put the "do! do! do!" in English. The whole part listed on that page is "do! do! do! shiyou ze!", the last part being roughly translated as "let's do together!", with the "ze" particle emphasizing masculinity. They probably should have at least used "yarou ze!", since yaru, a more active "do" in Japanese, is the verb usually used for "play" as in "play video games".

      Although, the latter point is pretty easy to explain away with Sony's much forgotten development platform for homebrew games, the Net Yaroze.

      Little bit of Japanese perspective I guess. ^_^

    9. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by yaphadam097 · · Score: 1

      It's not all that different from our own English speaking culture. Look at some of the ridiculous things we do with French or Italian words in order to make something sound stylish or sophisticated. Sure there are plenty of English speakers who also understand these other languages, but it is nonetheless true that people will buy a product with a cool sounding name (or slogan) without having any clue what it really means.

    10. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by AKAImBatman · · Score: 1

      I dunno. The article seems to suggest that the slogan is actually:

      do!Game, do!Choice, do!Live

      The "do!XBox 360" is only in the title. The rest of the article (what I can decipher, anyway) dissects the three contructs above. Look a little lower, and you'll even see them each discussed in a table. It would appear that each "do!" is intended to represent some sort of attribute about the XBox 360.

      i.e.:

      do!Game - Possibly representing the game library available.
      do!Choice - Possibly referring to "chosing" the hardware and accessories to meet your gaming and multimedia lifestyle.
      do!Live - Almost certainly referring to the connectivity of the console.

    11. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by MeanderingMind · · Score: 1

      I'm just working based on the title of the japanese article. In either case the slogan is not "do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360". That slogan seems to be an obvious mistake of simply grabbing whatever English there was and ignoring the Japanese.

      I'm not claiming to know exactly what the real slogan is, I'm just guessing, so you may very well be right.

      --
      Thunderclone: ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE! ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE!
    12. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by badasscat · · Score: 1

      It's not all that different from our own English speaking culture. Look at some of the ridiculous things we do with French or Italian words in order to make something sound stylish or sophisticated. Sure there are plenty of English speakers who also understand these other languages, but it is nonetheless true that people will buy a product with a cool sounding name (or slogan) without having any clue what it really means.

      And I don't think it really matters - all this debate over the slogan is pretty pointless. Because the fact of the matter is, when we're using those French or Italian words in English, we are still speaking English. We are not trying to convince ourselves that we are speaking French or Italian, so it really doesn't matter what they think of it.

      The same is true here. This slogan, while it's using English words, is Japanese. It is true there is a lot of actual "Engrish" in Japan, but when you just take random words out of English and use them in slogans or as part of another expression, it's just an incorporation of those words into Japanese.

    13. Re:"do! Game, do! Choice, do! Xbox 360"? by AKAImBatman · · Score: 1

      I did Babelfish and Google translations of the page. While both (annoyingly) drop the "Live" part of "do!Live", it does appear I was correct. The slogan is "do!Game, do!Choice, do!Live", with each of the three standing for the features I was referring to. I'm still unclear on the spacing (i.e. is it "do!Game" or "do! Game"), but I think the mystery is otherwise solved. :-)

  3. intresting by Hennell · · Score: 1

    but I'd have thought the Japanese situation was fairly obvious: The Wii will sell well with its 'novelty' controller and family friendly games; The Ps3 will 'sell out' at launch and will move as fast as they can be produced/fast as people can afford them, and Microsoft will come trailing last selling just enough they can say its a 'success'.

    1. Re:intresting by DeadMilkman · · Score: 1

      You underestimate the Japanese facination with "Novelty"
      DDR was "Novelty"
      The DS was "Novelty"

  4. Perfect Gaming Forever. by Channard · · Score: 1

    No, I think someone just watched Perfect Hair Forever, and decided to lift Action Hot Dog's lines. Presumably the next ad will feature an old man asking his schoolgirl age companion to bend over and turn on his 360.

  5. Silly Slogans by EmperorKagato · · Score: 1

    As for the commercials I have yet to see at least one.

    I do hope their Japanese TV commercials do not end up like this.

    --
    ----- You know you have ego issues when you register a domain in your name.
  6. And we make fun of the Japanese for translations. by Zadaz · · Score: 0

    It's "Do! Do! Do!", a theme written by they boy band (Tokio) they got to front for them.

    But yeah, the 360 is doomed in Japan. Sure MS was touting the Blue Dragon 360 package sellout, but they only made a thousand of them.

    Last week they sold 22,380 PS2's in Japan to Xbox 360s 1,287. (source)

    So while selling an extra thousand 360s is impressive for Microsoft, it's garbage for the market. Hell, most weeks there are more GBA new releases than Xbox in Japan.

  7. This is stupid. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    A huge number of Japanese people speak decent English, why don't they ever write articles like this. I'd like to see more cultural analysis and an honest opinion of what the various players actually mean to the audience over there.

    Seriously, why doesn't anyone go to Akihabara and interview some Otaku? They're not hard to find, and can be easily bribed with Final Fantasy figurines.

  8. It's not a good state by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No one games anymore in Japan except otaku. The cool kids have all moved on to goofing around with camera phones. Nintendo has only stayed ahead of the game with the DS fad, which looks to be novelty-factor driven and probably won't have legs. Most market analysts predict the market is going to shrink.

  9. Re:And we make fun of the Japanese for translation by Babbster · · Score: 1
    Hell, most weeks there are more GBA new releases than Xbox in Japan.


    Wow, talk about obvious. Throughout this past generation, most weeks there have been more GBA releases in the United States than any of the three home consoles. The GBA has been monstrously popular all over the world and developers can make GBA games for virtually nothing compared to the cost of developing for home consoles (and, the [low] quality of GBA games, on average, tends to reflect this). It's looking more and more likely that this pattern is moving over to the DS and will continue throughout the 360/PS3/Wii generation.
  10. weird quote by llZENll · · Score: 1

    The weirdest quote from the article...

    "If [Steve] Jobs adds an Apple logo to the PS3, I think users will say it can be sold at $2,000. However it's not possible for the PlayStation brand. That is the difference in the computer world between the PlayStation brand and the Apple brand."
    Ken Kutaragi, Sony Computer Entertainment CEO & President

  11. because Japan cares more about innovation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    For the whole history of gaming, the innovation has come out of Japan, so that market is used to the sort of innovation you see now in the Wii. The US market is more one of sequels and clones, so it's natural that US based consoles will not sell well in Japan.

    Japan has been the world center of gaming for as long as there has been a gaming industry. The 360 is not going to change that.

    1. Re:because Japan cares more about innovation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "For the whole history of gaming, the innovation has come out of Japan"

      This is so true. Just look at the most popular videogames in the world: Madden, WoW, Counterstrike, Grand Theft Auto, Tony Hawk, all of them examples of fine Japanese innovation.

    2. Re:because Japan cares more about innovation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You make my point for me. Madden number 17, and first person shooter number 2934932423 are not innovation. Hell, madden #1 was not innovation.

      Japan has driven the innovation, so it's only natural that Madden 17 doesn't sell in Japan or for that matter anywhere outside the USA. The USA is not the whole world, as hard as that is for USAians to comprehend.

      Look at the history of the gaming industry, at who really made a difference. Nintendo. Namco. Konami. The arcade revolution, of which US companies mostly re-licenced or outright copied what was coming out of Japan. DDR. Katamari Damacy. Final Fantasy. The list is endless.

      The gaming industry was driven by Japan, not by the USA, and continues to be. There is no rational way to claim the 360 is half as innovative as the Wii, for example.

    3. Re:because Japan cares more about innovation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Tony Hawk wasn't innovative? Madden has never been innovative? First person shooters weren't innovative? MMORPG's weren't innovative? GTA wasn't innovative? How about Starcraft or Day of the Tentacle or The Sims or Civilization or Railroad Tycoon or Heroes of Might and Magic or Star Command 2 or Zork or Wizardry? Were any of those invented in Japan? Are you sure you know what the word "innovative" means?

    4. Re:because Japan cares more about innovation by Tempest_2084 · · Score: 1
      Japan has been the world center of gaming for as long as there has been a gaming industry.

      I believe that the gaming industry started in the US with Atari. In fact the US was the 'world center' of the gaming industry for many years until the crash of 83-84 when it shifted to Japan.
    5. Re:because Japan cares more about innovation by badasscat · · Score: 1

      I believe that the gaming industry started in the US with Atari. In fact the US was the 'world center' of the gaming industry for many years until the crash of 83-84 when it shifted to Japan.

      It's debateable where the gaming industry "started". Nintendo was making handheld and light gun games for longer than Atari even existed, for example. The Magnavox Odyssey is no doubt the first programmable home console, but in the modern era where the DS and GBA are the top-selling systems, I don't think you can say that marks the beginning of the video gaming market.

      It is definitely *not* the case that the US was the "world center" of the gaming industry until the crash, though. Japan's video game industry development pretty much paralleled our own - it's just that neither country's consumers really knew what was going on in the other. When the crash came, the Japanese companies that had been immune to it (because there was no crash in Japan) simply moved in to fill the void here. But it's not as if they didn't exist before 1983-1984 - they did, they were successfully making and selling games; you just never heard about it.

      I would say the two countries' video game industries pretty much developed simultaneously, but in isolation from each other.

    6. Re:because Japan cares more about innovation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "The gaming industry was driven by Japan, not by the USA, and continues to be. There is no rational way to claim the 360 is half as innovative as the Wii, for example."

      Well for that matter neither is the ps3. The sixaxis controller is just Sony's last minute biting on the "innovation" that you purport is the Wii. Not to mention motion sensing controllers have been done already, by Microsoft for PC no less, and that wasn't considered innovative. It was generally regarded as gimmicky. But time your "innovative" concept at a given moment when the market is starving for something new and it's lauded as groundbreaking. That's not innovation, that's business, especially when you can turn a profit off hardware sales when no one else can.

      "You make my point for me. Madden number 17, and first person shooter number 2934932423 are not innovation. Hell, madden #1 was not innovation."

      Neither is Metal Gear whatever, Ridge Racer 37, or Final Fantasy nobody cares. While they may be good games, they aren't innovative either. I'd say that currently the one game that has great potential for innovation is Spore and that's not coming from Japan. My point is you can't really prove one way or the other, particularly because the general masses aren't buying millions of copies of games like Katamari or Rez because they don't have the initial financial backing. It's a shame, but it's true.

    7. Re:because Japan cares more about innovation by triffid_98 · · Score: 1
      Did you mean Final Fantasy IV or Final Fantasy XIV? Anyway, I'd say it really depends on your timeline. Atari, Coleco, Williams, Interplay, ID, Sir-Tech, Origin, SSI, etc. Those sure are Japanese companies. Oh wait...



      Look at the history of the gaming industry, at who really made a difference. Nintendo. Namco. Konami. The arcade revolution, of which US companies mostly re-licenced or outright copied what was coming out of Japan. DDR. Katamari Damacy. Final Fantasy. The list is endless.
    8. Re:because Japan cares more about innovation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "I would say the two countries' video game industries pretty much developed simultaneously, but in isolation from each other."

      Sega was a Japanese-American company.

  12. Umm, there were 100K created, not only a thousand by jchenx · · Score: 1
    But yeah, the 360 is doomed in Japan. Sure MS was touting the Blue Dragon 360 package sellout, but they only made a thousand of them.
    Ehh, you are incorrect. There were 100,000 bundles created, with 10,000 of them being the limited edition versions (which are apparently sold out now).

    Last week they sold 22,380 PS2's in Japan to Xbox 360s 1,287. (source)

    So while selling an extra thousand 360s is impressive for Microsoft, it's garbage for the market. Hell, most weeks there are more GBA new releases than Xbox in Japan.
    Actually, it makes sense that the numbers are so low. If I were in Japan, it'd be stupid to buy a console now, since I know in a month, there's going to be a nice bundle offered for the system. Wait until mid-December, and we'll see how the sales go.

    I'm certainly not saying that the 360 is suddenly going to hit it big in Japan by any means. It's very close to "doomed" status. If sales continue to be poor post-Blue Dragon, then that'll be the final nail in the coffin. But if there's a decent size uptick in sales (especially considering that PS3 launch numbers have been reduced in Japan), then that's a sign of some life. I'm confident, though, that the top selling systems in Japan will be the Wii, the DS, and then the PS2, perhaps in that order. (The PS3 will have one huge week, then be gone, until the supply problems are smoothed out)
    --
    -- jchenx
  13. Re:And we make fun of the Japanese for translation by atomicstrawberry · · Score: 1

    According to Joystiq your number is off by a factor of ten. The 10,000 limited editions were apparently all preordered very quickly, too. And that's just preorders for the limited edition bundle. I think it's going to do better than you're making out. Nowhere near enough to crack the Japanese market, but they probably don't need to - the US and European markets are bigger, and if they can maintain a large hold on those markets, then having a smaller presence in Japan won't really hurt them that much.

  14. Re:Umm, there were 100K created, not only a thousa by Zadaz · · Score: 1

    You're right, I couldn't find my source so I was going from memory.

    That will boost the Xbox numbers here by a lot, certainly there hasn't been anything like a Must Have Game for the 360 in Japan in the year since it launched. But if the only games they keep releasing here are translations of American sports and shooters, well, they're screwed, because those games just don't sell in Japan. Get some RPGs, fighting games, something based on a good anime franchise, a trading card game, or a port of a game-center game and they might have a chance.

    But look at the top 50 games in Japan this week. Not a single xBox game on the list. The console has been out a year...

  15. Re:Umm, there were 100K created, not only a thousa by jchenx · · Score: 1
    Get some RPGs, fighting games, something based on a good anime franchise, a trading card game, or a port of a game-center game and they might have a chance.
    The thought is that Blue Dragon, Lost Oddysey, and Eternal Sonata will be be a good kick-start to the Japanese RPG genre. Well, there's already one RPG, Enchanted Arms, which was surprisingly decent. (Certainly no Final Fantasy, but good enough to interest some fans. It's also coming to the PS3 eventually)

    The problem with the 360 launch is that it takes time to develop a decent RPG for a system, so that's why launch titles rarely (never?) have any decent RPGs, unless they happen to be ports. The Final Fantasy games always debuted at least a year after the console launched, if that gives you any indication. Unfortunately, MS needed that kind of support sooner, which just wasn't possible. We'll see in a few months if it really is too late for the console, or if it's in fact too early too early to tell.
    --
    -- jchenx