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Netscape Dumps Critical File, Breaks RSS 0.9 Feeds

Posted by ryuzaki0 on from the hate-when-that-happens dept.

An anonymous reader writes "In the standard definition of RSS 0.91, there are a couple of lines referring to 'DOCTYPE' and referencing a 'dtd' spec hosted on Netscape's website. According to an article on DeviceForge.com quite a few RSS feeds around the web probably stopped working properly over the past few weeks because Netscape recently stopped hosting the critical rss-0.91.dtd file. Probably someone over at netscape.com simply thought he was cleaning up some insignificant cruft." Some explanation has been offered by a Netscape employee.

8 of 137 comments (clear)

  1. Why would this break RSS readers? by eurleif · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I don't see how this would break RSS readers. DTDs pretty much never get read except by validators. Normal SGML and XML parsers just treat the DTD URL as an opaque string, not as something that can be retrieved.

    1. Re:Why would this break RSS readers? by acroyear · · Score: 5, Informative

      Actually the DTD is loaded up by pretty much every proper XML library even if validation is "off".

      The DTD contains more than just the element definitions and hierarchy. Its also used to define entities (&...;) that are non-standard to XML but may be expected in the file. HTML has tons of pre-defined entities but XML only has the core 4. All others are defined in DTDs and loaded on the fly as part of the processing.

      There are ways to turn it off at the lowest levels, but higher-level abstractions/libraries might not give access to that. For example, with JAXP + SAX you can turn off DTD loading, but Jakarta Commons Digester doesn't give a setting where you can trigger that, so Digester tries to load the dtd, and even with validation off you can't change that. My only recourse is to take the DTD lines out of the various config files. (Reason: My JBoss server is deployed in private networks where the server can't reach the internet).

      --
      "But remember, most lynch mobs aren't this nice." (H.Simpson)
      -- Joe
  2. Obligatory Lamport quote on distibuted systems by Programmer_Errant · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "A distributed system is one in which the failure of a computer you didn't even know existed can render your own computer unusable."

  3. HAHA by eMbry00s · · Score: 5, Funny

    Suck that, Web 2.0!

  4. This is a major problem, by Morky · · Score: 5, Funny

    This could seriously affect both of the guys using Netscape.

  5. Netscape Says No RSS 0.91 For You by gastropod · · Score: 5, Informative

    From April 2001, "Netscape removed the RSS 0.91 DTD from their website. This means that all RSS feeds which depend on the RSS 0.91 (many, MANY news sites) cannot be used with a validating parser."

    It seems as though it just took them 5+ years to follow up on the threat? Primary links are broken, but of course the lively /. discussion (which, um, I haven't read) remains.

  6. Sorry about that by christopherfinke · · Score: 5, Informative

    my.netscape.com is undergoing a redesign, and when we announced the redesign about 10 days ago, the DNS entry for my.netscape.com was changed to point to the new server where My Netscape will be living. This had the effect of making anything under the old my.netscape.com unavailable, since the only thing public on the new server is a splash page. (Nobody on the team was especially aware of this DTD file since all of the old Netscape employees were let go last year around the time Netscape.com was redeveloped; anybody working at Netscape now was hired since then.)

    Now, why this file was living under my.netscape.com is anybody's guess, but we'll have it restored ASAP. I only wish that someone had brought it to our attention so that I didn't have to find out about it from Slashdot.

    Christopher Finke
    Netscape Developer

  7. Seriously bad programming by owlstead · · Score: 5, Insightful

    If I would create a reader that was dependent on version 0.91 of the distribution, it sure as hell would include the DTD in local storage. It makes no sense to create a reader that can also use, say, version 0.92 since you would not know what had changed (and there is no such thing as inheritence between versions of a DTD afaik). Actually, as other readers noted, it would be terribly stupid to make your web-server or client rely on a third party computer for which you cannot guarantee the uptime.

    These URL's are mainly there for their Uniqueness, not so much as for a place of quaranteed storage. Of course, they are also a nice place to look for the actual definition, but after that you would need a local repository. This is the first thing an XML library should support, and the first thing a moderately intelligent programmer should look at. I get *very* annoyed if this kind of basic rules are ignored. And I've even seen them ignored by people pointing to the XML digital signature definitions, where security and reliability should be the first requirements in the design.

    Also, what would happen if w3c.org or netscape.com go the way of the Gopher? If they go bust? It's a quickly changing world out there.