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Fighting Porn Vs. Ruining Innocent Lives

After news of the conviction of a substitute teacher for endangering minors — because porn popups, possibly initiated by adware, had appeared on her computer during class — comes the even sadder story of 16-year-old Matt Bandy. His family's life was turned upside-down when he was charged in Arizona with possession of child pornography, even though the family computer was riddled with spyware and Trojans. After the intervention of ABC's 20/20, Matt finally was allowed to plead to a lesser charge (namely, sharing a Playboy magazine with friends) and just barely escaped being labeled a sex offender for the rest of his life.

25 of 815 comments (clear)

  1. Sad but true... by winkydink · · Score: 1, Informative

    If you don't keep your security stuff up to date, especially on a Windows machine, you have no idea what it's being used for.

    --

    "I'd rather be a lightning rod than a seismometer." -Ken Kesey

  2. Save me from my internets by fatduck · · Score: 4, Informative
    The clueless parent:
    "It means that computers are not safe," said Jeannie Bandy. "I don't want to have one in my house. Under even under the strictest rules and the strictest security, your computer is vulnerable."
    The "internet expert" isn't much better:
    "If you have an Internet connection, high speed, through, let's say, your cable company, or through the phone company, that computer is always on, and basically you have an open doorway to the outside," said Tammi Loehrs. "So the home user has no idea who's coming into their computer."
    Or you could secure your wireless router and stop installing Top 100 Mouse Pointers!!!!.jpg.exe.

    Oh here's my personal favorite quote from TFA:
    ...toss innocents into a living hell intended solely for sexual predators.

    Admittedly the prosecution's behavior in this case is excessive, especially the part about pleading to an obscenity charge for a Playboy magazine, but it doesn't have to be another excuse to spread FUD about the evil "here there be dragons" internets.
    --
    Making you think you're crazy is a billion dollar industry.
    1. Re:Save me from my internets by bckrispi · · Score: 4, Informative

      The 'bots' on his PC uploaded kiddie porn to a Yahoo Group. Yahoo notified the authorities with his IP address.

      --
      Xenon, where's my money? -Borno
  3. The American legal system by iminplaya · · Score: 2, Informative

    has become nothing more than part of the Prison-industrial complex. The concept of justice is no longer in the picture and just gets in the way of the profits.

    --
    What?
  4. Really? by elzurawka · · Score: 2, Informative

    "when he was charged in Arizona with possession of child pornography, even though the family computer was riddled with spy-ware and Trojans."

    I am currently taking a Data Forensics Course at Sheridan Institute, and the teacher of the course is a Peel Region Data Forensics officer. He told us in the last 5 years of him being there he has not once come across a machine where child porn was put on the machine by a popup, or spyware. He Said this does not happen, as it would be easily traced back to the company that advertised it. This is not a valid deference in child pornography cases

    --
    -EL
    1. Re:Really? by wjeff · · Score: 4, Informative

      You don't read very well do you, it wasn't spyware and/or popups, it was trojans and/or rootkits.

      From the Article:
      [For that answer, they turned to computer forensic expert Tammi Loehrs. ...

      Loehrs went into the Bandys' computer and what she found could frighten any parent -- more than 200 infected files, so-called backdoors that allowed hackers to access the family computer from remote locations, no where near Matthew's house.]

      With the proliferation of rootkits, and lack security on most home computers, I wouldn't be the least suprised if most perverts use hacked computers to access child porn these days.

      I seem to remember there was a case in Texas similar to this about 8 months ago, where a man was arrested and charged with possessing child porn on his computer. Luckily for him, the local police department's computer forensics people were actually clueful and found the rootkit used to control the computer.

      Not to mention the well documented use of open wireless networks to access illegal content.

      The problem with computer security these days, is that it requires to far too much expertise and vigilance to keep your computer secure, even if you are an experienced professional, much less the proverbial hapless grandma.

      When you have to spend hundreds of dollars a year, and 5 hours a week keeping your computer clean and updated, and then never open emails the look like they came from your grandkids, or from your quilting circle web-ring. All the supposed productivity benefits of using a computer rapidly disappear.

      --
      my old sig is obsolete, and I haven't come up with a stupid enough new one yet
    2. Re:Really? by RexRhino · · Score: 2, Informative

      Your instructor is pretty dense for someone teaching a "Data Forensics Course". A trojan or rootkit downloads whatever the person who created the program wants it to download. Typically, they are used to send spam or engage in DOS attacks, but there is absolutly no reason that if someone wanted to download illegal materials, that they wouldn't use a compromised machine to hide their actions.

  5. Re:Unproportional by foreverdisillusioned · · Score: 3, Informative

    I believe that the catch is, while it's technically not illegal for a minor to read Playboy, it's not legal to GIVE a minor a playboy ("corrupting a minor" or some such nonsense.) Even though the kid was a minor himself, it's still technically illegal for him to give the Playboy to another minor. Similarly, if two 16 year olds have sex, they can both be charged with statutory rape, though typically either they are only threatened with arrest, or only the boy is arrested.

    Note that I'm not DEFENDING this bullshit--just explaining it.

  6. Re:I might be missing something by Cadallin · · Score: 4, Informative

    Yes, Absolutely! In fact, according to one study cited on Wikipedia, the age group most charged for Child Pornography offenses is young males aged 15-20. Note that the law makes absolutely no distinction between pictures depicting an 8 year old, and pictures depicting a 16 year old. Both are "Child" Porn, both get you convictions resulting in registered sex offender list for life. Which, yes indeed, means that two 16 year olds (who may very well be consenting depending on jurisdiction) can have sex with each other, and thats fine, but if they videotape it, or take pictures, they can end up with felony Child pornography convictions.

  7. Re:your country is fucked by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    I'm not European. I come from the land of Oz (you know, with the wizard and what not). You may prefer American, but as another post pointed out, others that live on the continent America should not be associated with the stupidity of the USA. My intent was not to insult others on the continent.

  8. Re:Is a Mac expensive compared to this? by Chanc_Gorkon · · Score: 3, Informative

    That would be correct, however root exploits are a little harder to achieve on a Mac. Harder, not impossible. The Mac, BY DEFAULT has you type your password every time you want to install software. The Mac, BY DEFAULT has the root login disabled. The Mac, by default has a better infrastructure then Windows....period...and I am not a fan boy. I'll put up Linux, the Mac or any UNIX based system against the swiss cheese that is Windows XP any day. Yes, even Mac OS X and Linux are vulnerable, but the time to patch at least on Linux is very fast compared to Windows XP and the architecture is different and more secure....BY DEFAULT. They are all what Windows should have been.

    --

    Gorkman

  9. American == USA citizen by gvc · · Score: 4, Informative

    We Canadians take "American" to mean a citizen of the USA; not of Canada, Mexico, Brazil or Argentina.

  10. Re:Unproportional by jeff4747 · · Score: 3, Informative
    Similarly, if two 16 year olds have sex, they can both be charged with statutory rape

    Just to be complete: in lots of states there's a provision in the statutory rape law that says if both parties are "old enough" (usually 16-ish), and close in age (usually 2 years), then it's not a crime. This appears to be the new and trendy way to modify the statutory rape laws.

    Disclaimer: I'm not a lawyer, yadda yadda yadda, check your local laws before trolling for jailbait.

  11. Re:your country is fucked by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative
    USAians is definitely appropriate cause us other "Americans" (those of us in Latin America) or even those in Canada don't want to be included when speaking about your fucked up country.

    Oh, and tell me, which Latin American country do you come from that has the word "America" in it's name that would cause confusion? The name of this country is "The United States of America" and it's citizens are Americans, much as someone from the "United Mexican States" is referred to as being Mexican, not a UMSian. There is nobody who actually lives on this planet that is going to hear someone called an American, and think "Wow, he must be from Brazil". The real issue is that you're a pointless troll, and you have an inferiority complex regarding your national identity. As far as the Canadians go, if their nation's name was "The Canadian Dominion of America", maybe you'd have a point, but it isn't, so you don't.

  12. Re:I might be missing something by rahvin112 · · Score: 2, Informative

    There are a number of teenage girls on sex offender lists for taking pictures of themselves!

  13. Jury nullification by b0s0z0ku · · Score: 2, Informative
    Folks who are against that kind of abuse of law: make sure to serve on a jury. If the case is something like that, I'd even be tempted to lie to get on the jury. Remember, it only takes one juror in most states to block a conviction and prosecutors are hesitant to retry in the case of a hung jury. Plus you can try to convince other jurors not to convict. In addition to judging the accused, jurors are required by quite a few state constitutions to judge the law itself.

    -b.

  14. Re:I might be missing something by R2.0 · · Score: 2, Informative

    Close - she called the wrong hotline - child abuse hotline instead of LaLeche League.

    The real outrage was that the final abuse ruling was predicated on the trauma she put her kid through while *trying to get her back* through the court system. The court ruled that, by fighting for custody (it had been years, I think), she was abusing the kid by dragging her into court, and therefor wasn't a fit mother.

    Paging Judge Yossarian...

    --
    "As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." A. Carlson
  15. Security analogy humor by Beryllium+Sphere(tm) · · Score: 2, Informative
    Chris at Riosec quotes Chandler Howell:
    Security is like an analogy. It only works up until the point that someone considers an angle or aspect that you haven't previously considered and accounted for.
  16. For those who have sigs disabled by VirusEqualsVeryYes · · Score: 2, Informative
    A test of civilization is how it fights nihilism without itself becoming more destructive than the nihilists.
  17. Re:I've seen similar ~3 years ago by Fred_A · · Score: 2, Informative
    I'm puzzled about something here. According to this there were two users logged into Yahoo! on the same computer at the same tyme. Yet neither I nor anyone else I know has been able to do this,
    Run two different browsers (Firefox and Opera for example) and you're done. It's not a very mighty hack.
    --

    May contain traces of nut.
    Made from the freshest electrons.
  18. Re:statutory rape by TheLink · · Score: 2, Informative

    Not in Georgia I hear.

    http://www.gwinnettdailypost.com/index.php?s=&url_ channel_id=32&url_article_id=22700&url_subchannel_ id=&change_well_id=2&weak

    He 17, she 15.

    What they did: _consensual_ oral sex.
    What Georgia Supreme Court confirmed it was: aggravated child molestation.
    What he gets: 10 years, plus probably being classed as a sex offender for the rest of his life.

    --
  19. Re:I can take a guess... by AGMW · · Score: 3, Informative
    It's the equivalent of Nuclear Power, Communism and Drugs for the new millenium.

    Indeed, it appears to be the modern day McCarthyism! The whole concept to stopping whatever your country decides are children from experimenting with each other is ludicrous! Obviously, there's a problem with predatory adults (and sad to say usually males!), but to apply those same rules to 16 year olds is crazy!

    Age of Consent by country (some examples from the page) :-
    UK - 16
    USA - up to 18 (differs by state!)
    Spain - 13
    Madagascar - 21

    Spain seems low to me, but I guess I am just used to the UK's 16. 18 seems high, and who'd want to grow up in Madagascar!

    Maybe the issue is just when there's a large age range between the (otherwise) consenting parties? There was a case recently in the UK of a substitute teacher who the school governers discovered had a previous sex offence with a 15 year old when he was 30-something. A big to-do in the papers (Daily Mail!) about it. He lost his job - probably never worked again as a teacher, which is all well and good you might say - serves him right! Turns out, they married a year or so later and are still married now! Perhaps he really did love her?

    Rules are (usually) good, but the blanket application of rules will pretty much ALWAYS come across cases where the rules should be flexible or there will be injustices.

    If these childporn hackers are looking for PCs why don't the authorities setup some honey-trap PCs without firewalls etc, and catch the people who use them - spammers, pornographers, whatever! Surely that would be the sensible thing. The pornographers are seeding (potentially!) innocent people's PCs with illegal pictures to try and grey the concept of guilt, why not fight back with honey-trap PCs so the hackers have a grey area to ponder on about whether this really is a safe PC for them to take over!

    --
    Eclectic beats from Leeds, UK
    handmadehands.co.uk
  20. Already happened in US by Mathinker · · Score: 2, Informative

    Old news in US...

    From URL http://www.usatoday.com/tech/webguide/internetlife /2004-03-29-child-self-porn_x.htm :

    > PITTSBURGH (AP) -- A 15-year-old girl has been arrested for taking nude photographs of her self
    > and posting them on the Internet, police said.

    (Found via the English Wikipedia article on Child Pornography, found via Google.)

  21. From the Bible, Genesis19: by jernejk · · Score: 1, Informative

    31 And the firstborn said unto the younger, Our father is old, and there is not a man in the earth to come in unto us after the manner of all the earth:

          32Come, let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.

          33And they made their father drink wine that night: and the firstborn went in, and lay with her father; and he perceived not when she lay down, nor when she arose.

          34And it came to pass on the morrow, that the firstborn said unto the younger, Behold, I lay yesternight with my father: let us make him drink wine this night also; and go thou in, and lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.

          35And they made their father drink wine that night also: and the younger arose, and lay with him; and he perceived not when she lay down, nor when she arose.

          36Thus were both the daughters of Lot with child by their father.

          37And the first born bare a son, and called his name Moab: the same is the father of the Moabites unto this day.

          38And the younger, she also bare a son, and called his name Benammi: the same is the father of the children of Ammon unto this day.

  22. until it happens to a senator by wardk · · Score: 2, Informative

    we can all expect the inquisition to assume guilt and punish quickly, damn the facts, damn the humans

    it's the price of using Microsoft. meet the new tax