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Microsoft, Google Agree to NGO Code of Conduct
Aditi.Tuteja writes "Technology companies have come under fire for providing equipment or software that permits governments to censor information or monitor the online or offline activities of their citizens. For example, last year, Google's approach to the China market was criticized over its creation of a censored, local version of its search engine. Microsoft, Google, and two other technology companies will develop a code of conduct with a coalition of nongovernmental organizations (NGO) to promote freedom of expression and privacy rights, they announced Friday. The two companies along with Yahoo, and Vodafone Group said the new guidelines are the result of talks with Business for Social Responsibility (BSR) and the Berkman Center for Internet & Society at Harvard Law School."
Big business not raping & pillaging?
Where's the catch???
does google china still censor it's content? yes? then this is a load of bullshit.
If you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can imagine....
This code of conduct (CCC) for nongovernmtal organisations (NGOs) is a result of BSR and shows the effectiveness of clear communication and cooperation (CCC). The groups participating in the guidelines (apart from MS and G) are BCISH, BSR, EFF, HRW and RWB. A YS (Yahoo subsidiary) was cited by HRGs to identify PAs who were posting AGOs and O&I online.
Yahoo in particular got in pretty thick with the Chinese Government, helping them find and jail those reporters and bloggers. Jerry Wang was completely unapologetic about it.
e tail.cfm?ReleaseID=187725
Here's several pages of waffle by Yahoo's Media Relations department: http://yhoo.client.shareholder.com/press/ReleaseD
So far as I can tell, it says absolutely nothing.
The Hong Kong Journalists association is much more to the point: http://www.fcchk.org/media/FCCToYahoo2.htm
I find it a little hard to believe Yahoo is going to do an about face. Can you imagine Yahoo executives at their next liason with the Chinese Government telling them "Ok, Commies, the rules have just changed. From now on, we're going to insist things are done right around here!" It's a nice thought, but it just isn't going to happen. Walk away from money? Never! (Unless they think they've lost the market to locals anyway?)
If those companies came out together publicly and criticized the Chinese Government, we might see something. But short of that I'm guessing it's just to make us feel better. "Oh Google and Yahoo? That's old hat; They have an NGO Code of Conduct now."
FYI:
:) and against most of the board's recomendations :)
The recent MSFT shareholder voting had the question of whether Microsoft should be prevented or not selling their technology to regiemes with history of human rights volations, the board recommendation was to NOT RESTRICT the selling of their (Microsoft's) technology to China etc.
I hope those with the right to vote on these corporate issues did so.
I voted the entire of MSFT out btw, wont happen but I voted that way anyway
I say, Fuck China
Curious. How will this agreement mean anything if MS is still going to have Vista DRM'ed up the wazoo?
I just read Slashdot for the articles.
I agree with your assessment of why they are aiming at a uniform agreement between all the major providers. (and I also agree that the parent is probably missing this point)
...and with that, America's drug problems were solved!
But the principle you explained is fundamentally flawed. (Don't worry, I know you didn't think of this principle, and I'm not criticizing you.. I simply want to point out some problems with it)
It is akin to saying, "hey, drugs are bad, so let's all make a rule saying no one will sell drugs anymore. In fact, to deter people, let's make another rule saying you go to jail if you do!"
The point is, it's a matter of supply and demand. If google, msn, yahoo all agree to provide the whole truth and nothing but the truth to chinese citizens.. and to refuse to turn in chinese bloggers (etc).. i suspect they will find themselves firewalled. And then one of the lower guys on the totem pole will climb to the top in china. Either an engine with a lower market share, such as Ask/AltaVista/etc will step up, or perhaps google.cn will just magically DNS resolve to a state-run search engine.
I think MSFT/GOOG/Y! are doing the right thing by agreeing to resolve to not do BadThings[tm], but this is only a step, and won't solve the problem that China doesn't want its people to read/see/say certain things. Maybe faced with the efforts involved in bypassing MSFT/GOOG/Y!, this might at least soften China's resistance somewhat (information wants to be free, and they will have to face and accept this at some point), but I don't see the proverbial dam busting anytime soon.
I am Jack's complete lack of surprise.
...shouldn't require them not to censor any content as some people have been suggesting. I actually like the way Google is dealing with China, as I understand it they don't give the full results but do tell you you're not getting the full results. So long as people know that there is more out there but you are not allowed to see the content it should at least;
1) make people aware that their government is doing this to them, maybe making people push for more openess
2) if the government ever does back down and open up it should make the transition a lot easier
People ultimately want to know what they are having withheld from them... Just not telling them and not letting them know you're censoring is the worst of all worlds, and that is what they would get from the state engines that would replace an open google
*''I can't believe it's not a hyperlink.''
MS and google are just the players I would expect to craft guidelines specifically for the purpose of making it look like they're trying while simultaneously allowing the to run all over their customers' rights. They'd be better at it than government! (Well considering that a lot of regulatory legislation is drafted by the business that legislates, the government is often as "good" as business in that regard.)
The requested URL
I think the worst isn't the content alone, but the way those companies cooperate with authoritarian regimes in identifying people.
In Brazil, Google has fully cooperated with the government for the most absurd reasons. One recent example: they handed over IP addresses of people who participated in an Orkut community called "Eu sei dirigir bêbado" ("I know how to drive drunk"). The reason was that this was, allegedly, "apology of crime", a felony according to the draconian "liberty of expression" laws in Brazil.
Why do MS and Google need to collaborate on this? Could it be that each of them perceive that this will hurt their business, and give a competitive advantage to the other? And that by presenting a united front, neither one gets the advantage?
"Right thing, wrong reason" comes to mind. The greatest treason.
Why couldn't they both have done this independently, because it was the "right thing to do?" I know, I live in this fantasy world where humans beings actually have value outside of the accounting department.
bugger !
Let me tell you what will happen if they do not agree to censor results.
China will ban them from doing business there, and the Chinese people will just wake up and find google not available, and after 6 months of unavailability, they will forget about the whole Google thing. Some Chinese will remember, in their old age, the times when they could go too google, but how they had to switch to Baidu, and how it went on to become the largest search engine in the world.
The Chinese do not appreciate people or entities that may be influential trying to speak out like that. Small guys, they can ignore, but if corporations start being too meddlesome, they can and will shut them down. I say, let people search for what they have access to, like Google is doing, and maybe one day, the Chinese will wake up and find that nothing is censored anymore.
The problem is that no one ever thinks their actions are the evil ones.
"The recent MSFT shareholder voting had the question of whether Microsoft should be prevented (from) selling their technology to regiemes with history of human rights violations..."
So Microsoft shareholders were asked to vote on whether the company should withhold its technology from the Bush administration?
Wow. BSR. A corporate propaganda organization. Socially responsible business is a pipe dream in capitalist society. History of BSR.
That's great, but it doesn't mean a damn thing. It's their word, against their actions. Simply public relations stuff. They'll do what they can under the radar, and the countries will oblige them because they want the company to do business with them.
Just moving more of the motions which make the world turn 'round under the table.
~/ssh slashdot.org ssh: connect to host slashdot.org port 22: too many beers
The United States of America is waging a war to subvert and change governments in its "stategic" aim to subdue the world, and especially frantically now that it remains the only superpower, so the gnomes in power believe they have "a window of opportunity" to site the lingo of their official and pretty well known documents. It is factually untrue to state that MS and Google are fughting towards a high goal, diminishing of censorship or something like that. Google routinely censors opinion in Europe, as one example, as a quick comparison of searches from the US google to those in Germany will reveal - but no TV channel or paper even mention that. Censorship in Europe is done under the same heading "compliance with local laws" that Google used in China. However the logic of (hypocritical) outcry about Google being a helper of censors in China is not so irrational. See, the result is that Google and MS together with a bunch of NGOs are n ow simply POOL RESOURCES in providing subversion against Chinese government , a geopolitical enemy of the United States. The scheme is very much the same as has been used all over the world for installing US puppet governments: (a) campaign for "freedom of speech" as a univesal value (b) opening (CIA-related) NGOs, in the target country,if possible (c) preparation for coup d'etat; there are several well-tried scenarious. One of them is "the orange revolution" - i.e. what has been run in Yugoslavia, Venesuela, Ukraine, Georgia, in Asia, successfully or not. One should rid himself of the infantility and see corporate fidgeting and twisting for what it is - a manifestation of certain steps in struggle for power. P.S. This is not the only recent announcement reflecting an obsession about penetration into Chinese information space. Some half-baked student kludge, hatched by an NGO in a Canadian university was announced recently as a means to "beat censorship" in China with the help of someone "from the free world": the program was a (badly done) proxy for browsing sites not allowed behind the Great Chinese Firewall
This could be Googles path to get out of the China deal. At the time they made the China deal, they didn't have such a standard to rely on.
In the future when dealing with oppressive governments they can now say,
"WHOA! We are a participant in this set of rules, which we can not break. If you want Google, you have to change, not us."
Once these set of rules and agreements are out, I suspect a lot of companies will be eager to sign on, thus giving them an safety ring.
Party at O'zorgnax's Pub! Buy me a Slurmtini aye?
A convicted monopolist is going to help tell other companies how to behave nicely?
"...to promote freedom of expression and privacy rights...", all the while cramming DRM down our throats.
The Chinese are not children, they know very well that they're being censored, whether Google tells them or not. This just makes them far less likely to try to get around the censorship, making it easier for the government to crack down on people who do.
I'm just waiting until governments as they are become obsolete as the global corporations of the world replace them. Then the real raping & pillaging can start :)
to glorify and encourage others to engage in the smoking of cannabis.
Evil regimes cannot flourish, and much like the Soviet Union those who seek to control their people through fear and intimidation will be vanquished. This will happen not because of politicians or activists but rather through economic means.
And that's why we're buying as much land in America as possible, for ownership is everything!
P.S. -where is kfg?