Slashdot Mirror


Defused Googlebombs May Backfire

linguista submits for us today an article on the Guardian site, which theorizes Google's bomb defusing may backfire on the company. Article author Nicholas Carr calls out Google for tweaking search results based on the company public image. As he notes, the Google blog entry announcing the end to bombing didn't cite a desire for better queries as the reason behind the change. Instead "... we've seen more people assume that they are Google's opinion, or that Google has hand-coded the results for these Googlebombed queries. That's not true, and it seemed like it was worth trying to correct that misperception." While the general image of Google is still that it 'does no evil', it's worth noting that the search engine is not solely a link popularity contest. The results you get from Google are tweaked by a number of factors, and at the end of the day the company has complete control over what rises to the top.

29 of 105 comments (clear)

  1. Sounds like sour grapes by jandrese · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Is it just me, or does it sound like this was written by someone who was previously making a living off of increasing people's pagerank and is now miffed that his job is harder?

    --

    I read the internet for the articles.
    1. Re:Sounds like sour grapes by garcia · · Score: 2, Informative

      It's just you IMHO. It sounds like someone that doesn't like the fact that Google is doing it for the sole reason of improving its image in the world and not for the reason that its algorithms shouldn't have allowed it to occur in the first place.

      To be honest, Googlebombs that point you to relevant information from somewhere else (i.e. linking a restaurant's name to your blog content from another post) is an important feature of Google's indexing. It should not be limited. Linking unrelated content ("failure" to various individuals that may or may not be) needed to be fixed.

      As long as their new methods allow for related content to continue to be linked to and unrelated content to be bumped, I'm good w/it.

    2. Re:Sounds like sour grapes by drinkypoo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      More telling is his conclusion, which typically is a summary of the article, in which he basically says "google belongs to google". Wow. Now THAT is a revelation. Next thing you'll tell me is that the police department doesn't belong to me. That might really break my mind.

      He's not even arguing that preventing googlebombing is a bad thing! All he says is that he's concerned that google is preventing googlebombing to protect their corporate image. I have news for this idiot: google is a corporation. They have a corporate image. If they want to keep doing business with other corporations, they have to protect it.

      On top of all that, the corporate image google wishes to present is of a company that does no evil. Arguably they fall down on their ass on this whole China censorship thing, but other than that they do a pretty good job and preventing mob rule in the form of googlebombing is definitely not evil.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    3. Re:Sounds like sour grapes by Threni · · Score: 5, Insightful

      No, it's not just him. When I go to Google, I expect to spend as little time as possible finding what I want. Google should know what I'm looking for, and by and large it succeeds. If some sad bunch of nerds wants to manipulate sites so that a bogus link between a phrase and a person/organisation is created then they are of course free to do so, and Google is free to take whatever steps it likes to fight it. There's always robots.txt, isn't there, if you want to ensure no-one ever visits your site. Or there's cheating, and getting caught by Google.

    4. Re:Sounds like sour grapes by QuickFox · · Score: 5, Informative

      but other than that they do a pretty good job No, they do a terrible job. They endorse and encourage domain squatting.
      --
      Terrorists can't threaten a country's freedom and democracy. Only lawmakers and voters can do that.
    5. Re:Sounds like sour grapes by cultrhetor · · Score: 2, Funny

      But I miss "miserable failure!"

      --
      "Tu fui, ego eris" - Virgil
    6. Re:Sounds like sour grapes by Sponge+Bath · · Score: 4, Funny

      But I miss "miserable failure!"

      Don't worry, he will be around for another 2 years.

    7. Re:Sounds like sour grapes by Irish_Samurai · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Do you understand how Bayesian statistics work?

      Yeah, it wouldn't be anything like this part of my post would it?

      Google doesn't know everything about everything. So this "sad bunch of geeks" that are out "manipulating" the search results are actually the backbone of google's original ontological analysis. If there is a huge spike in term to concept linkage, Google (in theory) recognizes it and begins to retroactively evaluate their previously indexed relationships.

      My problem isn't with Google, or the googlebomb for that matter, its the kid thinking that a system should automatically know what he wants no matter what he put into it.

    8. Re:Sounds like sour grapes by susano_otter · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Next thing you'll tell me is that the police department doesn't belong to me. That might really break my mind.
      Actually, unless you toil under a non-democratic regime, the police department does belong to you.

      Of course, it belongs equally to several hundred thousand of your fellow citizens, and you've all agreed on a layer of bureaucracy between you and the police, to prevent each of you from trying to exercise direct control over the police department on an individual basis according to your whims and moods.

      If you can think of a better way to manage a publically-owned police department, I'm sure political scientists the world over would be eager to hear about it.
      --

      Any sufficiently well-organized community is indistinguishable from Government.

  2. Not specifically targetted by Bandman · · Score: 4, Informative

    They tweaked the algorythm so that it fixed googlebombs in general, not manually removed these particular bombs. In fact, in the text about the tweak, they specifically stated that they changed the algorythm so it would work with multiple languages, etc

    1. Re:Not specifically targetted by UbuntuDupe · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Exactly. I'm tired of people jumping to the conclusion that Google used some crude, quickfix solution to googlebombs, like manually removing that particular bomb, or ending the use of links and pagerank. PLEASE -- give them just a teensy weensy bit of credit here. If you really think they just inserted those particular phrases (e.g., "miserable failure") directly into the search engine's code, then please -- try another Googlebomb. If the fix really was just for the known, existing googlebombs, you should have no problem stacking Google's results again. If you can't do that, then do us a favor, and shut the hell up until you know what you're talking about.

    2. Re:Not specifically targetted by anaesthetica · · Score: 4, Funny

      Yeah, they looked into it more deeply and found that apparently what happened is that googlebombs originally weren't supposed to work, but through some kind of glitch in the algorithm, they still got a pagerank bump.

      So they just went ahead and fixed the glitch. Googlebombs won't be receiving a pagerank bump, so it'll just work itself out naturally. Google always likes to avoid confrontation, whenever possible. Problem is solved from their end.

    3. Re:Not specifically targetted by Kelson · · Score: 2, Funny

      Um... yeah. Mr. Miserable Failure? We're going to have to ask you to move your desk down into the basement, mmmkay? And if you get a chance, while you're down there, you could squash some bugs in the code, that'd be great.

  3. Pitr? by srw · · Score: 4, Funny

    I'm not sure how they can keep saying they do no evil now that Pitr works there.

    1. Re:Pitr? by spellraiser · · Score: 3, Funny

      Yes, it's kind of hard to reconcile.

      --
      I hear there's rumors on the Slashdots
  4. Axes to grind ? by CmdrGravy · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The results you get from Google are tweaked by a number of factors, and at the end of the day the company has complete control over what rises to the top You don't say ! Luckily I like the fact Google does its best to cut out the nonsense spam sites which seem to be intent on swamping the web. Whoever wrote this article seems to me to be a little too concerned about this and makes me suspect he is some kind of spam merchant himself.
    1. Re:Axes to grind ? by smoker2 · · Score: 2, Funny

      Luckily I like the fact Google does its best to cut out the nonsense spam sites which seem to be intent on swamping the web.
      Yeah right, "Find Brain Surgery at Ebay" is always relevant to a search.
    2. Re:Axes to grind ? by krotkruton · · Score: 2, Insightful

      That's what I thought at first too, but then I thought about my mom, who only three years ago asked me how to rewind the DVD before taking it back to the video store and last year told me to stop signing up for porn on her computer (which I never even use) because she keeps seeing ads that say "Girls from want to date you!". Just yesterday my roommate asked got an instant message from some girl he didn't know that asked him to check out a picture of them so she could add it to facebook, and he actually clicked the link to check it out and then wondered why his computer started acting funny. The point I'm trying to make is that a lot of people don't know how Google works, and it might be a good idea for some of us who do know to inform them. Then again, I'm not sure it would make much of a difference anyway.

    3. Re:Axes to grind ? by StikyPad · · Score: 2, Funny

      Of course. Who wants to pay full price for brain surgery?

  5. Sounds To Me by moore.dustin · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Sounds to me like Google just made their product/service better is all. Of course Google can control what goes to the top of the search engine - that is what they do. They are "doing no evil" by upgrading and refining their algorithms if anything.

    Just because people cannot ghost and bomb their pages to get quick boosts in pagerank does not mean that Google is doing evil, it just means they were never good at their jobs to begin with.

  6. Why is this a problem? by oneiros27 · · Score: 3, Interesting
    From the rant:

    But last week, after years of taking a fairly laissez-faire attitude toward Googlebombing, Google decided to put an end to the popular sport. It incorporated into its search engine a Googlebomb-sniffing algorithm that somehow manages to identify and neutralise any concerted effort to skew search results for a word or phrase.
    So um ... they changed pagerank so pages that actually contain a phrase are ranked higher than pages that don't contain the phrase?

    Now, given that this originally was their strong point as compared to other search engines, and they picked up many more articles that were useful, yes, it might be a problem. However, you could also say that the simple fact that they used an algorithm that hadn't been gamed by all of the 'search engine optimized' as their real advantage, and there may be an advantage to changing it so that it's a moving target.

    I mean, how awful would it be if we actually found the stuff we were looking for when we searched, rather than the search engine spam? If it gives worse results, then it's a problem ... but let's wait and see how it goes, and let the market sort things out.
    --
    Build it, and they will come^Hplain.
  7. I see by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    French Military Victories still works. Guess that one really must be objective information.

  8. OpenGoogle by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Google should expose at least part of their ranking formula as a dead-simple GUI to control parameters to Google users. That way we can control our own "Google" rankings according to our own agendas. People could share their params with friends so we don't have to figure out what to do to be trustworthy, just which of our friends' searching techniques we trust. Just like in the real world.

    Doing so would go a long way towards making it less necessary to trust Google. Eventually we would be best served by a totally open ranking client that searches multiple competing backend indices. But if Google handed us "trust web" to do it ourselves, they'd probably preempt that inevitable infomediation that would also disconnect them from the users, and thereby from their highest value relationship.

    --

    --
    make install -not war

  9. Careful by markov_chain · · Score: 2, Funny

    You guys will get Slashdot in trouble, what if the Boston police are reading this article?

    --
    Tsunami -- You can't bring a good wave down!
  10. Nothing to see here, please move along... by honkycat · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Google's explanation for why they hadn't fixed this in the past was that Googlebombs never displaced useful searches. That is, they didn't get in the way of many people actually trying to find information. The canonical, "miserable failure" example illustrates this -- is there any reason to expect that Google would give you useful hits for that search? I can't think of a reason to use that search that unless you were just curious about what Google would return.

    It was clear from Google's release that they considered the Googlebombs a perhaps amusing nuisance, but it wasn't something they supported. Rather, it just wasn't worth the effort of fixing since that effort would be at the cost of other development that they felt would do more to improve user searches.

    Now, they found that people were assuming these funny responses were somehow endorsed by Google. They could put up a disclaimer, but a) not many people actually read fine print, and b) many would not believe the disclaimer anyway. Since the Googlebombs didn't actually serve any useful purpose and Google didn't want to be mistaken for endorsing whatever might be inferred from the presence of these odd search results, they did away with it. That's perfectly legitimate.

    So, Google really DID claim they were making a minor improvement to their search results through this change, but that wasn't the highest priority. It's not like they've got any particular duty to maintain details of the PageRank algorithm. Further, protecting their image IS an important goal, particularly when it can be done through a means that has a positive impact on the searches. Too bad that a cute Google game is gone, but another one will crop up before long, I'm sure...

  11. This article was shitty and banal. by Lazerf4rt · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Here are a few shining turds from TFA:

    The company is allowing concerns about its public image to influence the search results it dishes up.

    Wow! What the hell motivation do you think Google was built on in the first place? The motivation was to achieve popularity, by being a good search engine. Yes, that's the "public image" they aimed for. So, what changed?

    Let's not forget that Google's machine is not our machine. It's Google's, for better or worse.

    OMG. Do you actually mean to tell me... I didn't invent Google?

    Seriously, the entire lame article was just one big excuse to use the word "salubrious".

  12. Autobiography by benhocking · · Score: 2, Interesting

    You won't find the text 'miserable failure' in George Bush's biography.

    You might - it depends on the author. ;)

    However, you're correct that you won't find it in his autobiography.

    Still - good point about the page actually containing the phrase that was being searched for.

    --
    Ben Hocking
    Need a professional organizer?
  13. "Yahoobombing" still works by adnonsense · · Score: 2, Interesting

    See this Yahoobomb, which faithfully links to the world's number one mostest miserable failure of all time.

    Microsoft's search offering (a Billbomb?) only comes up with Jimmy Carter and Michael Moore, at places two and seven respectively, with the rest of the results being links to stories about the Googlebomb as it pertains to that miserable failure .

  14. Re:Dubya's autobiography by Eternal+Vigilance · · Score: 2, Funny

    Yeah, but I'll bet his attempts at writing an autobiography will be a miserable failure.

    "My Pet Congress - a children's story by George W. Bush"