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Blizzard Officially Files Against WoW Glider

Posted by Zonk on from the it-sorta-kinda-is-cheating dept.

Marcus Eikenberry writes "Blizzard and Vivendi today filed against MDY Industries, the makers of the 'WoW Glider' software. Glider allows World of Warcraft players to 'play' while away from the keyboard; the software moves the player's avatar along a set path, following a complex set of instructions dictated in advance. Blizzard is seeking injunctive relief and money damages against MDY. What that means is they want him to stop the production of WoW Glider and they want him to pay them damages. Blizzard believes that Glider infringes on their intellectual property. They believe Glider allows players to cheat, giving them an unfair advantage and that they believe Glider encourages Blizzard customers to breach their contracts for playing the game. Last they claim that Glider is designed to circumvent copyright protections."

42 of 179 comments (clear)

  1. Thanks for clearing that up by Fozzyuw · · Score: 4, Funny

    Blizzard is seeking injunctive relief and money damages against MDY. What that means is they want him to stop the production of WoW Glider and they want him to pay them damages.

    Thanks for clearing that up.

    Cheers,
    Fozzy

    --
    "The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became truth." ~1984 George Orwell
  2. Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by fotbr · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I'm not a lawyer, but to me it seems like a tacked on item "because they can".

    As for the rest of their claims...I guess I can see the point, but if you look at the glider forums it would appear that Blizzard is being fairly strict on banning accounts. If Blizzard is able to utilize the ban-hammer effectivly enough, the problem will solve itself. And then people will move on to the next bot.

    The ONLY way for blizzard to make the problem go away is to remove the requirement to grind every character up to lvl 60 or 70. My suggestion would be to give people the ability to create alternate characters starting at any level UP TO the level of their highest character. So if you've got a level 52 mage and you've decided mages suck and want to play a warrior, you could create a new warrior character at any level between 1 and 52.

    1. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by LehiNephi · · Score: 4, Insightful

      That doesn't sound like a bad idea, except that the devil's in the details. How do you handle equipment that gets picked up along the way? Also, don't forget that players learn how to effectively play their characters while they level up. If they suddenly create a new character of a different class, they won't necessarily know how to use that character, which would cause all sorts of grief for any group that player joins. How much gold does that character get? Also, different people level up different skills at different rates and/or take slightly different paths. How do you handle those as well?

      --
      Help find a cure for cancer. Join the [H]orde
    2. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by carterhawk001 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You dont play many MMO's do you? Have you stopped to consider the suck that would come from teaming with someone who has never played a warrior before and all of sudden has all these abilities and powers and no idea how to use them effectively?

      Bad. Idea.

    3. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by Atlantis-Rising · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Except that grinding is Blizzard's main money earner, and therefore they have absolutely no desire to give people the ability to work less than is possible. In fact, the opposite is true- Blizzard wants to make it harder to get to level 70.

      --
      "It is possible to commit no errors and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life." -Peak Performance
    4. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by Lithdren · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Or you could simply go find another game.

      Seriously, such a thing would be pointless. your new character would start with what? beginner equipment? Might work for a mage, but a warrior type is only as good as his weapon in most cases.

      Then there's the whole issue that you're not playing the game anymore. I'd be fine with it if you could start a new character at level 10 or so. Before that you cant do anything, but its low enough that even beginner equipment is usable to make a little change, to buy something useable for your level.

    5. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by Dan+Slotman · · Score: 4, Informative

      I think the issue is that Blizzard has effectively created two games. The first game is the quests and missions performed while leveling up—unfortunately, they didn't provide enough quests to actually level all the way, so people are forced to kill random monsters to make up the difference. The second game they've created is the item-farming game. A "naked" character without gear is only a fraction as effective as a character with good gear. Blizzard did the same thing with Diablo II, but the difference between the playstyles of the two games was less pronounced.

      The problem is that some people only like one of the two games. Unfortunately, if you like the item game, you are forced to play the leveling game first.

    6. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by rob1980 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Mythic did this with Dark Age Of Camelot, giving you the option to start at level 20 and implementing NPCs to give you starter equipment, etc.. However hindsight being 20/20, they stated that starting a character at level 20 did more harm than good due to it killing the 1-20 crowd. The bottom line is, the easiest thing you can do to kill your incoming customer base is to give them nobody to play with.

    7. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by profplump · · Score: 2, Interesting

      You'd get the standard level-1 equipment and gold. If you want the stuff that comes from level 1-50 you have to go get it. You'd get talent points to match your level with none of them spent, so you can choose whatever skillset you want. And you'd learn to use the character by, um, playing, just like you would if you started at level 1 -- if you've already got a level 50 character you can probably skip a lot of the "learning" parts, as you only need to learn how the new character is different, not all the mechanics of the game.

      I'm not sure it's a great idea to let new characters start at any level, since it is a game and grinding is part of that game, but I also don't see huge problems with the plan. A useful compromise might be something like (at user choice) double-experience point awards to new characters in accounts that already have a top-level character; accelerated leveling would make it easier to start new characters but would still force players though the entire skill tree, if you think that's important.

    8. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by theckhd · · Score: 2, Informative

      unfortunately, they didn't provide enough quests to actually level all the way, so people are forced to kill random monsters to make up the difference.

      Have you ever even played the game? There are more than enough quests to level you from 1-60 without having to level grind. If you run out of quests in your current locale, there are at least one or two other areas (possibly on another continent, mind you) where there are quests appropriate for your level. If you can't be bothered to take 10 minutes to travel to another continent to keep questing, that's your own fault, not Blizzard's.
    9. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by Andy+Dodd · · Score: 2, Informative

      They did come up with a good solution to the problem (although only for all new classes, not the existing ones that still can /free) - New classes not eligible for /free get a hefty XP bonus from 1-20 if they have a Lv50 on their account.

      --
      retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
    10. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by The+MAZZTer · · Score: 2, Funny

      You dont play many MMO's do you? Have you stopped to consider the suck that would come from teaming with someone who has never played a warrior before and all of sudden has all these abilities and powers and no idea how to use them effectively?

      Bad. Idea. Not really, since once you've figured this out you can kill them easy and take their stuff. They should think twice about making a character they don't know how to use in the future. ;)
    11. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by Riff10111 · · Score: 2, Informative

      I think the issue is that Blizzard has effectively created two games. The first game is the quests and missions performed while leveling up--unfortunately, they didn't provide enough quests to actually level all the way, so people are forced to kill random monsters to make up the difference.

      Are you playing the same WoW I am? I've recently finished levelling a druid to 60, and not once did I run out of quests to do. In fact, I was offered more quests than I could do, and frequently ended up dumping or skipping some because I'd advanced past the point where the rewards were worthwhile.

      Not to say that there's no grinding in the game -- if you want to get in good with the firbolg at the north end of Felwood, or get the good prizes from the Argent Dawn, there's an unbelievable amount of grinding. And of course, some would say that collecting 25 goblin femurs or whatever is inherently grinding. But if your goal is to level a character only by doing quests, it's certainly possible.

      --
      "When I smile, I have a mouth full of teeth; when I frown, I'm not even here."
    12. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      Everyone remotely competent can switch classes easy.

      "Easy" is an adjective. You're modifying "switch," which is sometimes a noun but in this case is a verb. The adverb you're looking for is "easily." Good grammar doesn't require a PhD in quantum physics or even a solid grasp of using warrior forms correctly.

    13. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by benfinkel · · Score: 3, Insightful

      But there is a point at which is doesn't benefit Blizzard to make it harder. It's a parabola, not a liner graph. At a certain point it's too hard and players begin to stop playing/paying. Blizzard has to find that sweet spot between hard enough and too hard.

      Not to make too fine a point on it, but they appear to have been successful in that venture.

    14. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by Austerity+Empowers · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Regardless of how the game mechanics work, it strikes me as the epitome of wrong for them to sue someone for a 3rd party app. It's not interacting with their servers any differently than the client (because it uses the client) and itself is not hurting their player base. Sure, players get annoyed by glider-farmers, but it was the concious decision of a person to use that tool. If anyone is responsible, it is the person using it on their account ("guns don't kill people, people kill people"). Next, most players assume the person who runs in and kills stuff and doesn't talk is a bot, but it could easily be people like myself or my wife. We don't keep public chat up (emote/say/tell/yell/any general chat), and we play pretty...aggressively. Tag it or we take it. The point of all this being, it's impossible to figure out what the actual damages from bots are, opposed to just assholes like us. Finally, do we want bliz to be able to sue anyone who doesn't play the game a certain way to be able to sue? Is that even reasonable? Hard-core raider? Feel my lawsuit.

    15. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by MeanderingMind · · Score: 4, Informative

      It takes about 20 minutes to learn how to play any class in WoW. WoW isn't exactly challenging and in general there are only 5-6 skills that are regularly used by each class. I quit playing WoW a little while ago, but the guild I was in had all of Naxx on farm status and we'd regularly play each others characters, with little or no experience with that class, in an attempt to make the end game more enjoyable. I've seen people who've never played a warrior before tank Kel'Thuzad without any problems.


      If by "learn" you mean in the same sense as Othello.

      There's a difference between learning what does what and learning how to use every skill you have effectively. A lot of players fail at the first step, only learning what 5-6 skills they'll use the most and ignoring the rest. The result is Paladins who don't heal others, Warriors who tank in Berzerker Stance with a 2H, and Druids who aren't aware they're different from Rogues.

      It's true that there are typically 5-6 skills each class will use far more than the others. However, the difference between your average player and a good one is the use of the dozen or so others. You may not use Blessing of Protection, Intimidating Shout or Remove Lesser Curse constantly, but knowing you have them and also when to use them makes as big difference.

      Some people are capable of getting the basics and some intermediate concepts of a class down in a very short time. More often than not, there are factors which separate these people from others.

      1) Experience. These people may not have played the class, but their general game experience is vast.
      2) Observation. These people have had the opportunity to observe the class at work whether in game or in videos, and have the sense to remember this information.
      3) Adaptation. Even with the previous two, the ability to adapt and fill in knowledge gaps quickly is a notable contributor.

      The vast majority of players are lacking in one or more of these categories. For them, it is entirely imperative that they have 60+ levels where skills are slowly added into their repertoire and dungeons slowly progress in role difficulty. Even veteran players can benefit, as extensive exposure to a class allows insights that a 20 minute glance does not typically afford.

      I learn quickly, but I remember when I seredipitously discovered my typical opener as a hunter was less efficient than one that was somewhat less intuitive. Even after 30 levels worth of play, there are still things to learn.
      --
      Thunderclone: ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE! ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE!
    16. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by ADRA · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I think you're missing the big picture. Blizzard will never address your grievances on this issue because in the end it makes them money to not implement your change.

      As a wow player, here's how I see it. Most people will fall into two camps:
      1. Will make one character and play them all the way to level cap
      2. Will muddle around with a whole bunch of characters not really advancing quickly with any particular character

      The second group isn't a problem for Blizzard at all, because the creation of content is reused over and over for every one of that player's characters. It is the group 1's that causes Blizzard so much angst.

      To keep group 1's happy, Blizzard has:
          - Added more content. Most of it was better gear and not so much story driven, though the caverns of time looks promising (haven't been yet)
          - Extended the level cap simply extending the period of time before there's nothing left to do
          - Introduced end-game PvP as an incentive to keep playing instead of just a small pastime from grinding, item hunting, raiding dungeons

      The one thing they never needed to add was the drive for people (once level capped) to roll new characters. Because of the large amount of time to get to the high levels, thats a large amount of time that you're not 'bored' at max level with nothing to do. Bored players are unhappy players, and if they're so unhappy playing the game, they're more likely to quit.

      Personally, I really enjoy playing through the entire content over again. It isn't so 'griding' back up to with new chars since after the first or second character, you should know the best, most fun ways to level up. I don't grind levels often because I play new characters to -enjoy- the content, not to be king-o-the-hill.

      --rant--
      My biggest pet peeve is people in game talking about how bored they are. This is supposed to be entertaining. If it isn't entertaining anymore please quit and find something else to do!

      --
      Bye!
    17. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by dghcasp · · Score: 3, Insightful

      As compared to all the warriors who has leveled themselves and still doesn't know how to hold aggro?

      Bad warrior! No heal for you!

    18. Re:Circumventing Copyright is a bit of a stretch by Korvar · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yes, you hurt people.

      You contributed to the breaking of the in-game economy. You made it harder for other people, who don't happen to share your particular play style, to gain gold playing as the game designers intended. You made it profitable for the gold-selling ****tards to spam players' in-game mail and chat. You have made that game a worse place.

      --
      Korvar the Fox!! www.korvar.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk
  3. Strength of their argument by Fozzyuw · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Blizzard believes that Glider infringes on their intellectual property.

    This point can seem to be a strong suit.

    They believe Glider allows players to cheat, giving them an unfair advantage

    This is really a legal issue? Can I be put in jail for taking a few 100 extra monopoly dollars when no one is looking? The first thing I can think of is Insider Trading, which is punishable, but is a video game = the stock market?

    ... and that they believe Glider encourages Blizzard customers to breach their contracts for playing the game.

    Can the company be held responsible, even if it's the users choice? If I tell my friend that if he drives really fast when a police offer wants to pull him over, am I responsible when he runs from the cops the next time he might be asked to pull over while driving?

    Last they claim that Glider is designed to circumvent copyright protections.

    This seems laughable, but IANAL. Copy protection? I guess all users are circumventing such protection. One could draw a stern defense that a person playing WoW becomes little more than an automated computer program. Though, I'm not familiar with Glide or how it interacts with the WoW programming, but I imagine it just a program that interacts with the WoW client or the packets it sends to automate processes.

    What's Blizzards strength for their argument besides "they're breaking our EULA or TOS"? Are they saying that "Hey, we've had to ban 100,000's of accounts because people are using your products and we want you to pay us back for those 100,000 accounts. Lets see, that's 100,000 accounts at $15 / month and the average account is active for 1 year. So, pay us $18,000,000."

    Hmmm... could local governments sue nitrous and 'after market' car parts manufacturers that encourage people to drive over the speed limits? Or maybe a better analogy would be those who cause accidents and injure other people. Could those injured parties sue the manufacturers of such products?

    Cheers,
    Fozzy

    --
    "The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became truth." ~1984 George Orwell
    1. Re:Strength of their argument by RabidJackal · · Score: 5, Funny

      Can I be put in jail for taking a few 100 extra monopoly dollars when no one is looking?
      Not only that, but I hear you aren't allowed to pass Go OR collect $200. Talk about harsh.
    2. Re:Strength of their argument by Rydia · · Score: 2, Informative

      There is a cause of action called "tortious interference with contract." The thrust of it is that if you actively try to get someone to breach their contract, they actually breach the contract, and the other contracting party suffers damage because of it, then the interferer is liable for the damages they should have reasonably foreseen due to their enticement.

    3. Re:Strength of their argument by tbannist · · Score: 2, Informative

      This is really a legal issue? Can I be put in jail for taking a few 100 extra monopoly dollars when no one is looking? The first thing I can think of is Insider Trading, which is punishable, but is a video game = the stock market?


      I think this is a case of technicality. Because the players are required to agree to a contract that stipulates they will follow the rules of the game which prohibit bots, then by providing the bots to break those rules means you are encouraging others to break a contract. Furthermore, to develop the WoW Glider, they obviously had to have a WoW account to test it on, and therefore are themselves guilty of breaking the ToS.

      I have no idea where encouraging others to break a contract can be actionable under those conditions, but it's a little less cut and dried than making counterfeit monopoly money, because of the contract that you have to agree to to play. A big problem for Vivendi could be that click-through contracts are not real contracts. No one bothers to read them because they're a waste of time and probably not legally binding in any way.
      --
      Fanatically anti-fanatical
    4. Re:Strength of their argument by arkanes · · Score: 2, Interesting
      I don't think you really got the point.

      A) Use of Glider is a violation of the TOS.
      B) The creators of Glider actively promote it's use (by selling and marketing it). C) People who use Glider have their accounts banned for TOS violation, which harms blizzard financially.

      That looks like enough to get the case into court to me. Your arguments are a combination of "it's the users choice", which ignores the very existence of this category of law, and "another one will pop up anyway", which misses the point entirely - suing bot creators is how Blizzard is attempting to keep these bots down to a minimal level.

    5. Re:Strength of their argument by Dachannien · · Score: 2, Informative

      Can the company be held responsible, even if it's the users choice? If I tell my friend that if he drives really fast when a police offer wants to pull him over, am I responsible when he runs from the cops the next time he might be asked to pull over while driving?

      The legal concept is called "tortious contract interference". Usually it's a charge levied against one company by another if the second company has an employment contract with someone, but the first company attempts to hire that person out from under them. It could conceivably be applied more broadly, although this is probably the first time it's been used in this specific context. (I've been hoping that MMOG companies would use it against gold sellers, which they quite possibly might if this case works out.)

      As for your analogy, there are a few things that make it not very apt for this situation. First off, are you talking about criminal or civil liability? I'm pretty sure (I ANAL, though) that you wouldn't be criminally liable, but I have no idea about civil liability if actual damages arise. Second, you're talking about a different sort of case. Contract interference is a specific tort that's different from the damage to property or person that might arise in a car accident.

      Analogies usually fall short of their intent, but I'll try to come up with one anyway: Suppose I'm contracted to fix the roof on your house, and you need me to finish the job by the weekend because it's supposed to rain. In fact, the finish date is in the contract. Now suppose that CowboyNeal (hey, why not) wants me to do some work on his house, and he pays me extra to do the work for him ahead of all the other work I'm supposed to do. As a result, I don't even get started on your house before the weekend gets here, and the rain causes a bunch of damage to the inside of your house.

      Now, you could sue me and probably win, not only for any money that you paid me already (because I broke the contract) but for the water damage that was caused to the rest of your house as a foreseeable consequence of not honoring the contract. But you could also sue CowboyNeal for interfering with the contract that you and I had, and there's at least a possibility that you could claim damages against either or both of us (jointly and severally, meaning you can claim your pound of flesh from whichever of us you choose, as long as you get exactly one pound of flesh total).

      In the WoW/Glider case, the idea is that the folks making Glider are interfering with the contract between Blizzard and the player, because the player (every player) has contracted with Blizzard not to cheat while playing the game (among other things). The Glider folks permit the player to violate the contract by providing a tool that allows the average person to do things they ordinarily would lack the proficiency to do (i.e., hack the game). What's more, they actually charge money for their software, meaning that they enter into their own contract with the player, which probably makes them more culpable than if they merely posted their software on the Internet for anyone to use.

      (Again, I ANAL, so take what I just said with a big ol' lick of salt.)

    6. Re:Strength of their argument by Planesdragon · · Score: 2, Interesting

      However, all glider did was provide a way for people to cheat

      And that's a tort against the game company. ("tort" is "something that you can be sued over." Not necessarily a crime, but still something that's a bad idea.)

      It's almost the exact same tort as, oh, a P2P company that encourages sharing of copyrighted music. And it's the same legal principle that applies to, oh, hiring someone else to kill your mother.

  4. question from a non-wow player by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Something doesn't make sense to me.

    Why pay to play a game, and then have a computer play it for you?

    First, it seems like a waste of your dollars. You might as well just install Progress Quest. It will play for you too, and it's free.

    Second, if an RPG has simplistic enough mechanics that it *can* be played automatically, then it seems too simple to be interesting to a human.

    1. Re:question from a non-wow player by Fozzyuw · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Why pay to play a game, and then have a computer play it for you?

      Funny because it's true. In actuality, such games are not so much about the 'enjoyment of playing' but the 'enjoyment of collection'. It's like when I was a kid and spend endless money on football cards. Sometimes obsessively so to try and get a special card from a pack, or go to 'specialty stores' to buy it specifically from someone else.

      Like that, WoW and other MMO's are about collection or completing 'sets' of things. In this case, leveling your character to the level cap. Maxing out all their abilities. Sure, a Hunter might only use a bow for 99% of his play time, but this person will still max out their sword, 2 hand sword, axe, hand-to-hand, polearm, staff, etc skill.

      They might NEVER care about the cooking skill, but they max this out too, because they have it and it's not maxed yet. So, you might say "yeah, but if you're still not playing the game, then you'd still have no interest in the game and therefor no interest in doing it in the first place.". That would be true as well. Most of this maxing out skills would be done for some of the tedious tasks that the person really doesn't want to spend the time doing, but has spent the time maxing out the stats that matter when he was playing.

      Otherwise, most uses are simply for those who are trying circumvent the 'boring' process of acquiring wealth to purchase things that would allow them to enjoy the game. For instance, this goes to your second good point...

      Second, if an RPG has simplistic enough mechanics that it *can* be played automatically, then it seems too simple to be interesting to a human.

      Half of the game is fun, and not necessary for automation. That's the leveling/quest process. There's fun action/story involved in the game. When you reach the level cap, that's when the 'tedium' kicks in. My own example. I've recently hit level 70. Now, I'm doing the 'max out my skills' area or 'finish all the quests in my book' thing. It's the football collector / perfectionist side of me. I want that 100% completion rating kind of thing. Actually, I now find myself not caring to play as much, since I know all that's left is 'grind' with little accomplishment and I'm not looking forward to waisting my time maxing out my fishing or cooking skills again.

      However, the parts I am interested in, where I now have to 'grind' out 5,200 gold to afford that epic flying mount, which could take weeks or months, would be a waist of my time as there's no enjoyable benefit for me. I 'could' just keep doing the quests and dungeons until I reach 5,200 gold, but that would take months if I spend no time focusing on making money.

      That's when people turn to these automated programs (or for those who use them to sell gold on internet sites). The problem is not the automated program, but that people feel like they need automation to avoid waisting their time and to reach a point they feel comfortable playing again.

      So, in your 2nd point, you've pretty much hit the nail on the head and that an game should adjust their development if there are automation problems. However, I think the automation problems are fairly limited to those who are using it to farm in-game gold to sell for real money. So, I think the amount of grind required for 'most' things is fairly reasonable with the latest expansion (I feel it was much worse before the latest expansion pack) and Blizzard has noticed the amount of unpleasant grind on 'some' things, but are keeping others due to the fact that it's just part of the business model to keep people playing and paying.

      Cheers,
      Fozzy

      --
      "The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became truth." ~1984 George Orwell
    2. Re:question from a non-wow player by SydShamino · · Score: 5, Funny

      I installed this cool game called SETI. It's all about searching for life in the universe or something.

      But, I never have time to play. The cool thing is, I got it configured so that my computer can play the game itself. I just let it run whenever I'm not using the machine, and check up to see if I've found anything yet.

      No luck so far. You'd think they would put more aliens into a game like this to make it exciting. If I haven't found any by next month, I think I'm going to return it.

      --
      It doesn't hurt to be nice.
    3. Re:question from a non-wow player by DerekLyons · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Why pay to play a game, and then have a computer play it for you?

      Funny because it's true. In actuality, such games are not so much about the 'enjoyment of playing' but the 'enjoyment of collection'. It's like when I was a kid and spend endless money on football cards. Sometimes obsessively so to try and get a special card from a pack, or go to 'specialty stores' to buy it specifically from someone else.
       
      Like that, WoW and other MMO's are about collection or completing 'sets' of things. In this case, leveling your character to the level cap.

      That's an attitude I've never been able to understand. In game after game I see the same thing: "I've ground my $template to $levelcap and I'm bored! There's nothing to do but $handful of stuff!"
       
      Well, duh idiot. You ground yourself right past all the content! WTF did you expect? When you play a console game or PC RPG you don't try and leap right to the boss fight - why do you do that in a MMO?
  5. That's a big no... by KingSkippus · · Score: 3, Insightful

    You dont play many MMO's do you?
    It's not rocket science. Everyone remotely competent can switch classes easy.

    That's a big "no," if ever I heard one.

  6. sigh by spykemail · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I still play Diablo II, and I have to say that I've seen a pattern of unreasonable behavior on Blizzard's part. Preventing cheating is one thing, but who defines cheating? They do, and their definition is pretty much "regardless of whether the program is completely harmless and improves a crappy aspect of our game, it's still cheating if it allows a player to play our game in any way that wasn't determined solely by us." The one that really gets to me is the map thing for Diablo II. For the love of God, nobody that still plays Diablo II enjoys exploring the same levels over and over and over again.

    I'm also not a big fan of their anti-cheating tactics, and I applaud these people for circumventing them, even if it may have been for a bad cause.

    --
    Haiku for you!
    1. Re:sigh by brkello · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I am trying to refrain from putting you down, but it is really hard. How in the heck is this unreasonable behavior? I know the whole bnted thing...and I agree that Blizzard was right to shut that down because its primary reason to exist was to allow people to play their game online without paying for it. I don't know of your Diablo example, so I can't really comment on that...but you really can't comment on WoW.

      The program allows a person to leave their computer and let the script play for them. It is cheating...period. Blizzard has done an amazing job with their interface...allowing tons of user created AddOns that enhance your ability to play the game. But making something like this is unacceptable to everyone who plays the game. Stopping cheaters and gold sellers is why a lot of people support Blizzard. There was rampant cheating in FFXI that turned so many away. Blizzard has to fight to keep their game cheat free and I say good for them for doing it.

      And then there are people like you that applaud people who find ways to allow people to cheat. Seriously, what is wrong with you? If you don't like the way Blizzard runs their games, then don't buy them. Don't encourage people to find ways of screwing over others.

      --
      Support a great indie game: http://www.abaddon360.com
  7. Author is a moron by charlesbakerharris · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Blizzard believes that Glider allows players to cheat. Having used Glider myself I would have to say that it is not really a cheat program. It does not allow you to dupe items or create things out of thin air. It does not do anything a real player can do with one exception. It does allow the character to be played 24x7. Humans can't do that. Groups of people could do this though. There are many farm companies that offer powerleveling services that will run your character 24x7. There is not much difference between the two of these. Both of them level up your character as fast as possible. They both can farm for you as well.

    Is this guy serious? "it is not really a cheat program"? No, it doesn't dupe items. It just gives you a massive competitive advantage, equivalent to a bunch of other ways of cheating (that the author delightfully lists) in violation of the ToS. That's not cheating at all.

    What a tool.

  8. Anyone have a link to Vivendi's filing? by Kaikopere · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The only articles I've been able to find about this aren't exactly objective and haven't provided the actual text of the claims being made by Vivendi. While it's easy to hate the big conglomerate, I've had a number of games ruined for me because of bots/farmers (indirectly and directly) and tend to support action being taken to squash gold and item farming. I'm not sure that I would support action against the third party software providers (since they haven't agreed to the TOS) and I'm interested to see the exact nature of the claims Vivendi is making, uncolored by the bias of supporters of the folks being sued.

  9. bots by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    The keyboard allows botting. Why are people in support of keeping it on the shelves?

  10. One valid reason for it to exist by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 3, Interesting

    After you've leveled up a few toons to 60, sorry 70 now, its a PITA to level up the rest of your toons. Same thing happened in D2, where it was a MAJOR PITA to level up to 99 -- Blizzard tried banning a few people, but the bots kept coming, and eventually they gave up.

    If the author really wanted to keep WoWGlider going, he would of open-sourced it before got the big take down. I seriously doubt he has the money to win the legal case.

    Didn't bnetd teach us anything??

  11. HOW is it illegal, exactly? by thepropain · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Glider sounds like nothing more than WinBatch, or VisualBasic's (or any other language's) SendKeys. If software that automates input is truly illegal, how far down does it go? Would this apply to the BIOS (or whatever) that feeds op instructions to the CPU?

    --
    "You know you're narcissistic when you quote yourself in your sigs." -- PRoPAiN!
    1. Re:HOW is it illegal, exactly? by geekmansworld · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The issue is not that automating keystrokes illegal. The issue is that the WoW EULA says that you can't use software that does this very thing. If indeed the company that makes Glider is selling it as a WoW autopilot, then they're encouraging users to violate their license agreement. In that aspect, I'm inclined to side with Blizzard. They're trying to create an environment as egalitarian as possible for their players.

      What perplexes me is that WoW already includes the hardy anti-cheating monitor nicknamed "The Warden" to watch for programs that do exactly this sort of thing. Wouldn't Blizzard simply modify the Warden so that WoW won't run when Glider is active?

    2. Re:HOW is it illegal, exactly? by crabpeople · · Score: 3, Informative

      Well it's UNATTENDED macroing. Obviously, no one can make macros illegal as they can perfectly rplicate user input as to be indistinguishable. The issue is probably that a GM comes on, sends you some sort of private message, then another one in like 10 minutes. If you dont respond then they kick/ban.

      Its a sensible restriction in most games to ban unnattended macroing. I am against banning tools as well, but it would be different if they were watching the screen while running this app.

      --
      I'll just use my special getting high powers one more time...
  12. Why the EULA is vital for an MMORPG by Velops · · Score: 3, Informative

    The social aspect is one of the most important things for an MMORPG to be successful. It is one of the driving factors that keep people playing the games. Without a strong community, many players would quickly stop playing the game. As a result, developers like Blizzard need to keep the community happy. Nobody cares if people cheat or use 3rd party tools on single player games. That's because the only person affected is a single player. It matters a lot in an MMO because the characters don't exist in a vacuum. They exist in a world populated by other characters that interact with each other. Cheaters can cause serious damage to a game economy by flooding the market with rare items causing rampant inflation. This directly hurts any players who did not cheat. When these problems arise, the community gets unhappy and the devloper must take action or risk having the entire game fall apart.