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Google's Second-Class Citizens
theodp writes "Valleywag reports on a new caste system at Google, which will mean compulsory lunch breaks, two additional unpaid 15-minute breaks, limited OT, and e-clock punching for those reclassified as hourly workers starting April 1. Could be worse, though. Google also offers gigs through WorkforceLogic (the company that helped Microsoft deal with its pesky permatemps), which come with a guarantee of unemployment after one year. Guess that's what passes for the Best Employer in the US these days."
That's the law. If you are classified as an hourly worker you MUST take at least a 30 minute lunch break and have a 15 minute break for every 4 hours you work. Overtime is also regulated in a similar way.
What a fantastic non story.
How many people here still work for companies where the secretaries and janitors (sorry, don't have the inclination to use the newer politically-correct terms) actually are full-time, fully-vested, non-contracted company employees? I'm praying there are are least a few of you who do.
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
If you're hourly, it's a federal requirement to take at least a 30 minute lunch break and get two 15 minute breaks during an eight hour day.
The year-long contracts thing has been done-to-death in the employment world, especially in tech employment. This is nothing new or special, either.
Since when is offering temporary jobs a terrible thing to do? If you apply for one, you know _up front_ that it's a temporary position. It's not like they are baiting-and-switching anyone.
Oolite: Elite-like game. For Mac, Linux and Windows
I'm sure Google needs the ability to hire workers who will not spend 20% of their time on passion projects and who they can set to a fixed schedule. Not everyone at a large company will have the kind of work ethic that they enjoyed when it was still a smaller workplace. This is not some awful evil thing they are doing. It is the natural progression in the growth of a large company.
I'm sure I speak for a lot of the IT industry in saying: I'd love to be hourly! Man, If I got paid a flat rate for the hours I actually worked, I'd be rolling in cash--almost literally.
So, in short to Google workers: STFU & GBTW!
There are fairly strict laws about who is allowed to be an 'exempt' employee (exempt from hourly labor laws). Most of Google's administrative staff aren't going to qualify. They have to be put on the clock, and paid overtime if they work more than 40 a week. There are benefits to being an hourly worker.
All pass beyond reach of medicine. None pass beyond the reach of love.
It used to be that where I work, everyone in our department was exempt. The catch is that for a few folks, they were treated like hourly employees (strict work times for the help desk staff, for example). Eventually someone complained and certain jobs were reclassified as hourly.
In general, I don't think it made much of a difference to people's salaries. Certain Help Desk staff had their schedules adjusted to prevent overtime. Hourly people had to record their times. What's strange is that there was a loss of prestige of sorts. Hourly employees weren't considered as "professional" as exempt employees. It wasn't major, and I don't think anyone mentions it now, but it was a cause of grumbling at the time.
The problem I would have with the Google work environment is that it all appears to be geared to getting you to spend as many hours as possible at the office.
;-)
That is, the free food, and fun corporate events are all nice and everything; but my sense is that in return you're pretty much expected to work extremely long hours, to make your job your life.
IMO, it's extremely important -- crucial even -- to have a separate work life and home life. Work hard from 9-to-5 but then drop everything and go home, spend the evening with your wife and family. Forget about work and come back fresh the next day. Google doesn't seem to emphasize that. It appears when you work at Google, you work there 24/7. I don't think that's necessarily a healthy approach.
Still -- looks like a very fun place to work. If you are allowed to go home at the end of the day.
boxlight
Indeed, but keep in mind the scale we're talking about -- Google may have just noticed that it's making only stacks of money now, not big steaming piles of it. They'd be smart to cut costs NOW instead of waiting for crisis. I doubt they're about to fold.
Now on the other hand, I think pissing off your employees may well reduce motivation and productivity enough to offset much of the savings (particularly in a creativity-driven place like Google). I know they're the hourly folk, and I know it's federal law (though the law doesn't say anything about where they have to eat -- if they want to eat at their desk and are thinking about work while they do, I think that's still okay by law). And it could well be that we're talking more about grunts than creative types. But I can't imagine that it's worth the savings to have your entire support staff grumbling and calling your decisions "retarded."
It seems like such a strange morale killer that I wonder if they're cracking down now so they can respond to employee wishes and retract it all later to great fanfare. I'm not typically a conspiracy theorist, but this one seems so different from how Google is rumored to operate.
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.
Could be based on an accounting Fiscal Year. For many organizations this is April 1 - March 31.
Proof by very large bribes. QED.
I am not a particularly religious person but a rabbi once lectured on charity and its importance to being a good citizen. He even said that, "The highest form of charity is the anonymous donation." He said also said that true charity is not supporting a cause celebre. My cheers to those who stepped in to help that quasi-Microsoft employee. Your assistance was in the true spirit of charity.
The story is so short on details it's hard to form any opinion. For example, how many people will be affected and what kind of jobs? Are we talking 100 people? Are talking about jobs that may be temporary by definition (receptionists, contractors, etc.) or unskilled labor (janitors, garage attendants, security guards). Other companies like HP have had the same issues with "permatemps" and how to properly classify them. Other than linking to the same company as the Microsoft fiasco, it really serves no other purpose than to take a cheap shot at Google.
In the MS case, MS had people working at the same jobs as skilled salaried employees for years. But what irked the judge in the case what Microsoft did in the case. As soon as the lawsuit was initiated, Microsoft lawyers drafted an agreement that they tried to get all their temporary employees to sign that would relinquish all their rights to sue Microsoft for labor violations. It was insinuated that those who did not sign could not work for Microsoft. The judge sua sponte quashed the agreements. In the end, the courts ruled that they should have had rights to participate in the employee stock option program.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
Guess we know why that monkey's punching a clock. Welcome to the real world, kids, where the boss wants you at work on time. I work a similarly menial job. What I want to know is what the hourly wage for clock-punching down at the Googleplex is, and whether it beats my current wage.
Architecture/Engineering firms typically hire everybody, and everybody is in-house, form the mail room to the partners. Of course, everybody but the partners get paid poorly and work long hours without overtime (exempt folks, that is), so it's not like you're getting off scott free. Oh, and layoffs are pretty common as the building market swings up and down. *shrug*
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
The only thing I can say is that I really hope you aren't running a business, because if you are, you have a great deal to learn.
As a business, you're not just paying employees to do work. You're paying them (in the form of money, benefits, and culture) to do work for *you* instead of for your competitors.
It's about more than money. It's also a matter of respect. Tick off your workers enough, and they'll go to work for someone else.
Everything I need to know I learned by killing smart people and eating their brains.
"There is one rule for the industrialist and that is: Make the best quality of goods possible at the lowest cost possible, paying the highest wages possible." -- Henry Ford
Libertarians will kindly note that Henry Ford died in 1947.
The road to tyranny has always been paved with claims of necessity.
These are the rules for nonexempt employees.
Previously, many high-tech companies classified effectively everyone as "exempt" as a way of avoiding overtime. There are major law firms who make money suing such companies, their adds are all over BART in the bay area.
This is simply Google actually complying with employment law, reclassifying a large number of employees as nonexempt, so they either have to get paid overtime or go home.
Test your net with Netalyzr
When I worked hourly, I made more money then salary with equal positions. With an hourly position you always have the potential for at least some overtime. The only reason people don't like hourly pay is because it doesn't sound as official as salary and because it means they actually have to show up to be paid. Think of it this way, $50,000 a year is only $27 per hour if you work 5 days a week and have paid holidays and such. With benefits such as health care and the like, you are actually making around $35-$45 depending. Know, let's add a little over time. Let's say I wanted to work for time and a half another 8 hours a week (a pretty low number for someone who really wants to work). That's ($27 * 1.5) = $40.50 * 8 hours a week * 4 in a month = $1296 per month extra. Over a year that can earn an extra $15,552 from just 8 hours a week overtime. That's more then some minimum wage jobs and it doesn't even factor double time. If you think salary is a great deal, your mistaken. That hourly guy making 10k less then you actually might be making more then you in the end.
California labor code requires employers allow one 30-minute lunch break (unpaid) and two 10-minute breaks during an eight hour day. Whether an employer pays the employee during the short break is up to the employer (most do), but not allowing breaks at all will generally result in a law suit.
It would be so much more motivating to be paid by the hour. If the company wanted you to work long hours, they would have to pay extra for the privilege. The only tangible thing salaried employees get for working overtime is "maybe this will put you slightly higher on the list for raises next year, if there's money for raises at all".
It's a healthier attitude, I think. My employer would pay a fixed amount of money per unit of my time / effort. Of course, employers don't want that because they want you to donate a bunch of work to them, saving them some money. Of course, it never saves enough money to make your job safe from offshoring.
Many salaried workers these days aren't high status professionals who come and go as they please as long as the produce the desired results. They're just workers who have to have to be laboring at their posts when the man says so. Their big perk is that they get to work overtime and take work home when the boss says so -- without extra pay.
I realize there is a generational difference in attitudes towards work; younger people expect to be given responsibility faster and have looser restrictions on when and how they work, provided they get the job done. Some people see that as spolied, and sometimes it may be, but it also represents a shift in the kinds of work many people do. If you can redefine how your job is done, I say more power to you.
That said, there are still jobs where a worker's output is largely a function of his having his ass in his seat for a certain amount of time. These people don't need to prepare briefs in time for a court deadline. They don't have jobs where interrupting them while they're in the grip of creative inspiration would be tantamount to a crime. They are paid to perform relatively routine operations repetitively.
Some might think having one of those jobs makes you second class. But having legal protection so the boss can't extort more work out of you can't hurt your status.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
No problem. How about 15 minutes. I'll even throw in another one in 4 hours.
"When the powerful Jew is at last traced and his hand revealed, then comes the ready cry of persecution and it echoes through the world press." -- Henry Ford (from The International Jew: The World's Foremost Problem , ISBN: 978-0765315526)
With the permatemp who has cancer and no medical insurance. "Miller loved his job, made good money" .. 'Miller said he was well compensated by Microsoft, but did not buy health insurance. "I never thought anything about it. I never expected to use anything like that," he said.'
So he was compensated, but choose not to buy health insurance. And now it's Microsoft's fault? When I do contracts I take how much health insurance costs into account. Because I could get hit by a bus and become paralyzed, health insurance isn't for sick people it's for everyone. It protect you in precisely these unexpected cases. You don't have to have the super expensive stuff that covers ever single doctors visit, that sort of insurance is very expensive. What you want is the insurance that covers the sudden costly operations and treatments. True the kind that covers major incidences won't cover the hundreds of dollars of prescription drugs every month, but when you consider that the basic insurance costs hundreds of dollars less than the full coverage stuff it doesn't seem like such a bad deal.
Ideally you choose insurance that if your appendix bursts or you have a mild heart attack you can still make your mortgage payments. If you have a stroke, get cancer, need an organ transplant or become paralyzed you should be able to afford your treatment and care, but you will have to make major changes to your lifestyle. And possibly sell your extra car, and if you can make money off it sell your house for a small condo closer to the hospital where you get treatment.
Personally I prefer working as a long-term contractor. State law here prohibits me from doing it for more than 18 months, but if it is a statement or work rather than a contract/temporary position then I can take it on indefinitely.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
Everything I've seen points to the trend away from the "permanent employee". The internet has made it easier to find people with a given skill such that companies are less likely to worry about losing a skilled person when the scene changes. What they really want is Just-In-Time workers to plug in and work on a project, and then send them off when the project is done. The US specializes in changes and trends because anything that becomes predictable or mechanical moves to the 3rd-world where the labor is far cheaper. Our comparative advantage is "change". Thus, come-and-go projects is where it's at in the US, for good or bad, thanks to free trade.
Table-ized A.I.
"The white men were roused by a mere instinct of self-preservation ... until at last there had sprung into existence a great Ku Klux Klan, a veritable empire of the South, to protect the Southern country." -- Woodrow Wilson
Many of history's greatest men would not have their beliefs be entirely welcome today. Ford, at least, was simply a businessman.
The road to tyranny has always been paved with claims of necessity.
The article mentions at least one class of worker that was re-classified: the Adwords approval people. In a newspaper they would be the classified copy editors. It's a low-end job. I'm willing to bet Google isn't reclassifying engineers as hourly.
I own a sole proprietorship which specializes in helping businesses use open source software. So I know a little bit about labor laws, and other aspects of this article.
In general, if Google didn't employ some workers as hourly, that would be problematic in my view, not from a legal perspective, but rather that some work is best managed in terms of hours. Hourly workers must take lunch breaks (min. 30 minutes in most states), and in most states (including Washington) these are unpaid. Certain other break requirements apply, and these may be paid or not depending on state law (in Washington, you are entitled other short breaks, which are paid).
I have also subcontracted through companies such as WorkforceLogic. Interestingly enough, one of my customers through them is Microsoft. I am the author of the MySQL and PostgreSQL papers on Port25. While I certainly have some complaints with WorkforceLogic, they are not overwhelming. If Microsoft wants to retain the services of my business indefinitely, that is fine. I am just a service provider, and Microsoft is not my only customer. Whatever my (reasonable but small) complaints with WorkforceLogic, I do not think they are a Permatemp problem.
I would certainly consider offering services to Google as well if they wanted to be my customer. Why is this a bad thing? Isn't there a time and place to bring in outside ideas and people?
LedgerSMB: Open source Accounting/ERP
I spent 10 years working for "body shops" after I passed a certain age milestone, than after passing one more of those milestones, I could not get a job at all, period.
The "recruiters" or "headhunters" lie to you, keep you running around for nothing, bring you in to their offices for nothing, don't read the resumes, and other really stupid stuff that you'd expect from a bunch of mindless coke fiends.
The industry now (high tech) is all about getting labor on the cheap and all about not giving workers any of the benefits that we took for granted during most of my working lifetime. Surftemps (Tempsurfs?) and H1B's are how the multibillionaire punks "get over" on the labor laws here in the US of A, as a "Temp" you can be let go because you have gas & you get no benefits. As a "guest worker" (H1B) not only can you be fired for clearing you throat during a meeting but you can be deported too!
I know why people from "developing" countries come here, money, something in short supply (back home). But why the hell do I see people from western Europe working here? Maybe I'm missing something?
I killed da wabbit -Elmer Fudd