Slashdot Mirror

← Back to Stories (view on slashdot.org)

Web 2.0 Distracts from Good Design

Posted by samzenpus on from the but-I-like-a-jumbled-mess dept.

stevedcc writes "The BBC is running a story about web 2.0 and usability, including comments from Jakob Nielsen stating "Hype about Web 2.0 is making web firms neglect the basics of good design". From the article: "He warned that the rush to make webpages more dynamic often meant users were badly served. Sites peppered with personalization tools were in danger of resembling the 'glossy but useless' sites at the height of the dotcom boom."

12 of 176 comments (clear)

  1. Old fashioned by andy666 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I stick to html, since everyone can read it (mostly). And I hand code it, since most of the editors seem to make a real mess of the code, and sometimes I want to change it. Anyone else this old fashioned ?

    1. Re:Old fashioned by Mouse42 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Really? Thats considered old fashion? I figured everyone these days hand coded their HTML with close integration with CSS, because thats the only way you can really ensure a minimal amount of code, cross browser compatibility, good SEO, and ease of updates.

    2. Re:Old fashioned by cultrhetor · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Dreamweaver wouldn't be so popular if everyone took this sensible route. I once had to unscrew about 15 pages created by Dreamweaver and Fireworks. It took forever - each page, despite coming from the same "template" was messed up in its own unique way.

      --
      "Tu fui, ego eris" - Virgil
    3. Re:Old fashioned by DittoBox · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Don't discount Dreamweaver. It's editor is absolutely top-knotch.

      Now it's definitely not emacs, eclipse or VI(M) but it's awfully good and has nice auto-complete features. And if used properly it can help you stick to standards better. It also can do direct FTP editing, another big plus for me.

      --
      Good. Cheap. Fast. Pick Two.
    4. Re:Old fashioned by CastrTroy · · Score: 5, Interesting

      The point is, is that they don't want to make it possible. By making the resulting html not human readable, they lock you into using their application to edit it. So once you have hundreds of pages developed in dreamweaver, it's very hard to move away from using dreamweaver.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
  2. All good things in moderation. by AltGrendel · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Web 2.0 doubly so.

    Seriously, just because you can doesn't mean you should.

    --
    The simple truth is that interstellar distances will not fit into the human imagination

    - Douglas Adams

  3. Some explain this to me? by zappepcs · · Score: 4, Insightful

    stevedcc writes "The BBC is running a story about web 2.0 and usability, including comments from Jakob Nielsen stating "Hype about Web 2.0 is making web firms neglect the basics of good design". What does Web 2.0 have to do with people neglecting the basics of good design? As far as I can tell they have always done that.

    From the article: "He warned that the rush to make webpages more dynamic often meant users were badly served. Sites peppered with personalization tools were in danger of resembling the 'glossy but useless' sites at the height of the dotcom boom." Hmmmm "glossy but useless" ? Is the author talking about all these 'news' sites that are dripping with advertisements interspersed with only a small to modest amount of content? The web sites of today are looking more and more like magazines of yesterday; >60% advertisements and 30% content, where the difference is filled with trying to find the table of contents or the 2nd and 3rd parts of the story buried deeply in the magazine with incorrect page number links to them.
    --
    Support NYCountryLawyer RIAA vs People
    1. Re:Some explain this to me? by Bogtha · · Score: 4, Insightful

      What does Web 2.0 have to do with people neglecting the basics of good design? As far as I can tell they have always done that.

      It's a story that reoccurs every few years when a new technology comes along. Somebody comes up with a new technique/technology/approach, and gets a lot of attention because it's quite useful. Then the hype engine goes into overdrive, PHBs start putting it on job advertisements, and people get book deals. A multitude of copy & paste monkeys buy the books, get the jobs and apply that technique/technology/approach to everything they see, with no understanding of when it's actually useful. The industry gets flooded with a bunch of one-trick ponies.

      This happened with frames, JavaScript, Java, Flash, DHTML, ActiveX, Ajax, and now it's "Web 2.0"'s turn. Eventually, the field will settle down and there won't be quite so many fanboys around — they'll either broaden their skills and get a clue, their business will fail, or they will get fired. And then things will be relatively stable until the next big thing comes along.

      So I guess you're right, this is an ongoing problem, but it's still news when the cycle starts again.

      --
      Bogtha Bogtha Bogtha
  4. Management 'distracts good design' by hendridm · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Of all of the best practices that I've learned as a designer analyst over time, I've come to realize that management (with a bug in their collective bonnets about some new-fangled technology), do a better job of screwing up design and usability than the technology itself.

  5. Pssh. by MeanderingMind · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Sure, blame Web 2.0 for your horribly designed web pages.

    The man in the article himself states clearly Web 2.0 is simply the "latest fad". It's simply the most recent in a long stream of red herrings chased by ignorant companies in an attempt to be web savvy.

    The root of the problem is that the people who understand web design and make webpages are beholden unto managers, bosses, and other autorities who haven't the faintest idea what a good webpage does or looks like. The web designers bring prototypes, designs and nifty things to these people and get asked stupid questions such as "Is it Web 2.0". They want everything the internet has to offer in their webpage, whether or not it makes any sense for it to be there.

    Web 2.0 is another potentially awesome facet of the internet being turned into a collective migraine for web designers.

    --
    Thunderclone: ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE! ONE MAN ENTERS! TWO MEN LEAVE!
  6. Hmm... by EinZweiDrei · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Although people in their late 30s make very different use of the web to those in their teens, Mr Nielsen expects that when those teenagers grow up the time they spend online will diminish.

    Yeah...
    Just like our parents' generation grew up to watch less television.
    --
    Perhaps life really is full of possibilities.
  7. Nielsen a sellout by zakkie · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Nielsen is a sellout and has no credibility. Shortly after releasing his "Flash is 99% bad" work, Nielsen took money from Macromedia, and suddenly it's not so bad:
    http://www.useit.com/alertbox/20001029.html

    Usability includes being able to access the content without using proprietary software, Jakob!