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What Vista SP1 Means To You
An anonymous reader writes "Geek.com has an interview with Nick White, Microsoft's Vista Product Manager, covering the upcoming release of Vista SP1. The interview goes over some of the new features, how the change will affect admins, and how Microsoft decides if a change should be rolled out as an update or as part of the service pack. One of the most interesting questions asks whether people should feel that they have to wait until SP1 to upgrade to the operating system, a common practice with Windows users. White writes off this practice as no longer being necessary and notes how Windows Update has lessened the importance of the release of a service pack. Just the same, a News.com article explores the possibility that this update will finally begin driving users to Vista."
From TFA:
"If you're an administrator, then you definitely have a lot more to look forward to when it comes to SP1. One thing that caught my eye was the additional ability in BitLocker to encrypt extra local volumes. Many enterprises still partition their workstations and laptops into a C and D drive. Since users are usually instructed to use the D drive to store their data, this means data was at risk if the enterprise also used BitLocker as a security measure, since D couldn't be previously encrypted."
Wait. Only C: could be locked? Full of fail.
I'll tell you what it means to me - Windows XP 64-bit. I "upgraded" to Vista early in the summer, and I kept telling myself through all the headaches that I'd just wait it out until SP1. Now that that's not until next year, I've decided I'm no longer waiting. Instead, I'm switching to XP 64-bit, which appears to have a lot more driver support than the last time I tried it. There's no way I'm going to wait until Q1 2008 for a service pack that might fix my issues, especially if, according to Microsoft, service packs are less important now that Windows Update is widely used.
"Anyone who [rips a CD] is probably engaging in copyright infringement." - David O. Carson
it means that we will have a flood of articles about Vista SP1, just like the initial flood of Vista articles. Seeing as there's now 2 articles already inside an hour.... I shudder to think how many we will see until March 2008.. or whenever SP1 comes out.
What can someone be xpected to say about a mere Statement of Intent from Microsoft, about a Service Pack.... which right thinking people would expect a big comapny to release RIGJHT NOW and solve teething troubles faced by Vista users daily?
The schedule for SP1 indicates MS is under zero pressure to deliver anything or do anything innovative. No point fantasizing about it.
If you keep throwing chairs, one day you'll break windows....
I think you need to stop looking at things as black and white. Its not "stable vs. unstable." Personally, I've not had a single Vista OS crash since I started using it. So its been very stable for me. I think that covers most Vista users actually.
The presense of bugs or unstability in some computers does not mean its not a value to most; even those affected by the bugs may see value depending on the severity of the bugs. Some may be annoying, but taken as a whole, the product is of value to them.
I'm not sure where you're going with your activation complaint; its seems to me to be the exact same thing that WinXP activation is, and it wasn't any more intrusive than XP.
On the other hand if Apple deploy some patchs later, they are just getting sure that everything is fixed right, and if they deploy them early, then wow! they are just blazing fast to help their users! oh well....
It's time to realise that Abble's products are the biggest abomination these days. Just say NO to the dumb iAbble way!!
This will not be popular here but my experience was exactly the opposite. I was a happy Ubuntu user for the most part but never looked back after trying Vista. I like Vista and can't imagine switching any time soon.
The couple games I play run great. Making and burning dvd movies could not be simpler. The media center is awesome. The voice recognition is amazing and saves me a lot of typing since I can just dictate to my computer now using a headset. The dvd making software, voice/speech abilites and media center all came with Vista! No messing with a bunch of different purchases to do things with my PC that should be easy now in 2007.
My computer has only locked up one time with vista - that was during a vmware uninstall.
The $500 dual core laptop with Vista home pro pre-installed is the most effective way to spread Vista - and that's exactly what's happening.
It has started a huge shift from desktop computers to laptops, just check out your local stores. I picked up a decent HP dual core, 1 GB memory, 80GB HD, DVD-RW, firewire for my daughter to replace her aging desktop.
Since Vista was pre-installed, everything works, of course. I would not want to switch over to Vista, but since it's included in the $500 laptop price, and it would cost me $160 to get an XP OEM plus my time, there is really no incentive to change it. I don't know how much HP paid for Vista, but with the $500 laptop price it felt like Vista was free.
With this price drop I suspect mass migration to laptops - at least for home users and the spread of Vista.
Bah, I have had 100% software compatibility with Vista so far, and I'm even using x64 version. Yes, it's a new version, and yes, there's the possibility of incompatibilities to arise, but people need to quit being such crybabies having never even used it.
Click it and weep, boys:
http://thinktanktraining.com/vistax64
Bill Gates, if you're reading this, hook me up with a laptop, and I'll tell everyone how much I like Vista, which is true, which is the only reason why I would extend this offer.
Short list of reasons I like Vista:
* The Aero Glass theme is very nice and very clean looking.
* The start button enhancements are fantastic. I love the instant search box.
* The sidebar is very well executed, and I especially like the default picture slideshow.
* Runs great and fast for everyday use (ie, not multitasking WoW) on 1gig ram (2 is better).
* Solid as a f'n rock, and I don't say that lightly.
* "Poor" driver support is still easier than dealing with Linux, 95% automatic so far, and I'm actually fairly good with Linux.
* Window-Tab.
* Boots fast.
Suck it, haters. Vista==100% satisfaction. And I'm not fanboy, I just believe in giving credit where credit is due, and frankly I think Vista is getting a raw deal. I'll never forgive you farkers for putting me in the position of having to defend Microsoft.
-=-=-=-=-
UPDATE:
I added a new 8600gt video card ($112) and an extra 2 gigs of ram ($90 for 3gigs total) and a new AMD x2 2.2ghz chip ($65, up from a single core 1.8), and the machine just smokes. It boots fast, runs stable, etc. It now multitasks WoW like a dream with the game running at 1152x864 in a window.
I've been doing some programming in vb.net 2005, and that is going swimmingly. I tried quake 4 (which is admittedly a little older, and it sucks) but it ran smoothly. My Vista x64 Business machine (that I'm typing on) still kicks tremendous quantities of butt daily. My Vista 32 laptop still hums along quietly, ripping dvd's to my wife's ipod, pumping music to the stereo, connecting to the net from anywhere via at&t's 3g (I hate at&t, but work provided it). The laptop also has full and proper power management. My other buddy here at work has vista on his desktop here, and he doesn't even click over to his old xp machine anymore.
Overall rating: GOOD. Not great, not tremendous, not suck. GOOD. Wholly adequate with a strong hint of pleasant.
My only complaint so far is with the UAC, which I actually quite like for myself, but I hate it when I'm on the phone with people and I tell them to do something, and they INSIST on reading the damn message. Look, jerky, I told you to run the damn program, so yes allow it, please. Alternately, you could click cancel, and we can sit here and think about what it would be like if you knew how to follow instructions. Ehh.. I guess the new search kind of sucks too.
I'm with you on the marketing BS, though, like DX10 being vista only and DRM (not that it's bit me yet) and shenanigans like that. Microsoft is still evil, but when you exaggerate the problems and, in the same breath, push Linux, it comes across as desperate. Windows doesn't have to suck for Linux to be good too.
New features, my shiny pink ass. I want an operating system that runs Sonar and Premiere and Eve-Online, and runs them fast and with little hassle. I want an operating system that doesn't snoop on me or limit my ability to manipulate the data on my machine in any way I desire. I want an operating system that doesn't pretend to know what's good for me better than I do myself, and I want an operating system that uses my computing resources efficiently.
In other words, I either want an updated XP Pro or OSX that will run on my own sweet hardware.
In regards to Microsoft's "commitment to Service Pack 3", I've got a sick feeling that XP SP3 is going to try to basically bolt on most of the horrible shit in Vista onto my XP system. Microsoft's clearly pissed that we haven't embraced their wonderful new OS and they're going to try to shove it down our throats.
I think what I really want is a third professional, commercial operating system that will run my software and light a fire under MS and Apple, perhaps convincing them that it's worthwhile to actually consider what their customers want. Their ability to make fat profits while ignoring customer satisfaction is not the way the "free market system" is supposed to work, and it speaks volumes about the disdain corporate America has for the rest of us.
I make a living using software that runs on XP Pro. But I am so sick of having companies like Microsoft disregard the desires of "the market" and act like the monopoly they are that not using Vista has become as much a political act than it is a consumer decision.
You are welcome on my lawn.
I agree. I happened to buy a computer the first week Vista came out. I honestly didn't even realize it had come out. My old computer went bad and I needed a new one fast. I honestly can't see where all the gripes are. I leave it on all the time. It never crashes on me. It's only rebooted a couple of times because of certain updates it's gotten that required it (I know I know, why should an update require a reboot blah blah blah). It's really run like a dream. I don't have particularly fast hardware. It wasn't an expensive computer. I got it for $750 at Staples. I've never noticed a slow down because of aero. I run as a standard user and not as admin and the only time I get prompted for UAC is when I install something or I make system changes which is as it should be. (I had an issue with an HP program that assumed running as admin to check for updated drivers every day. Luckily that program was finally updated and so is no longer an issue.)
I mean honestly, what is the big problem? I keep reading articles and comments talking about how crappy Vista is and I just shake my head and say I don't get it. I don't know. I guess prejudices are hard to give up.
www.joshferguson.org
Let me know nine months from now if Vista can actually do anything for you that XP, Mac or gnu/linux could not do faster
My mother-in-law is a very unknowledgeable user. I bought her a computer a week after I bought mine and I set it up with Vista (came with XP but Vista had just been released so I got a free upgrade). My mother-in-law's biggest problem has always been her kids coming home to visit and downloading or installing crap. It's always been a challenge to lock her XP down. With Vista it's a piece of cake. She runs as a standard user and since she isn't a power user, she rarely has to be bothered by UAC. When she is, it's no big deal to enter the admin password. Now when I go to visit I don't have to spend hours cleaning off viruses and spyware. It all just works. She's never had an issue and I never have to fix something using the VNC server I installed on it like I used to with her XP.
As for faster, it really doesn't have a speed problem. I've never noticed any speed issue and that's with Aero running. It's an HP that I paid $650 for and it included a monitor. Not exactly high-end hardware.
www.joshferguson.org
So what the AC said, although obviously correct, should be ignored because we don't have a name attached?
One: Actions speak louder than words. The AC posted as AC intentionally, most likely because he/she/it is concerned that their credibility is already too crappy to be listened to or will be if they say things like... what they said.
Two: M$... Windoze... M$... Windoze... [unsubstantiated blabber]... M$... Windoze [bad spelling]... M$... Windoze... [self-references]... M$... Windoze... What was "unsubstantial" about the "blabber" other than the AC's opinion? What does "bad spelling" have to do with insight and correct logic? Did the AC mention that the "self references" each refer to a reposting of someone else's article by Twitter? That is not a self reference!
The only thing the AC was right about was that Twitter tends to use slurs like "M$" and "Windoze". While I agree that's retarded, it's not important if the rest of his post is valid.
The AC never gave anything but his own opinion about Twitter. Nobody should listen to his opinion of someone else if he's too afraid to even identify himself. We should listen to logic if he posts it. He didn't, not a shred.
I cannot wait to get Vista on my folks computer. My mother seems to trash their computer all the time. However, she'll aways call me whenever XP gives a "Are you sure, Dave?" message. With UAC, she'll be calling me every time she tries to install yet another DVD duplicator or some weird ass media player.
Or just try to use any version of Ciscos vpn software. Apparently the 5.0 version works *sometimes* and only on fresh installs of vista. I tried to verify it working on a fresh install of vista in a vm and it couldn't hold the vpn up for more than a few minutes at time. Back to XP I went...
Stats for a non-technical site with enough visitors to pick up meaningful statistics on less popular OS:
/.ers too young to remember CP/M.
All Mac variations 3.5%
Linux 0.1%
Symbian 0.01%
Solaris 0.003%
HP UX 0.001%
BSD 0.0005%
RISC OS 0.0002%
CPM 0.0001% (still more than 100 hits per month)
I thought this might be interesting as (a) a contrast to stats on OS usage derived from technically-oriented sites, and (b) just interesting to see some of the OS's still out there - I bet there's plenty of
In theory, there's no difference between theory and practice; in practice there is.
White writes off this practice as no longer being necessary and notes how Windows Update has lessened the importance of the release of a service pack
.NET 1.1. To get a stable .NET install, you need to first install .NET 1.1. Then you need to install 1.1.SP1, because there is no installer with SP1 slipstremed in. Then you have to install two seperate hotfixes. I'm sorry I don't have the KB numbers. That's FOUR installers (if you're using Windows update, 2 reboots) to get you up to the latest version.
I, for one, cannot stand Microsoft's ignorance when it comes to rollups and Service Packs. Windows XP, slipstremed with Service Pack 2, still requires 80+ patches and at least 2 reboots to finish patching. At one point it looked like Microsoft was going to be releasing more rollups, which means less actual patches to apply. The "Internet Explorer Cumulative Security Patch" is a step in the right direction. At least you can be reasonably assured that if you patch yourself with said patch, IE is relatively up to date.
One package that's been pissing me off lately is
Message to Microsoft: we WANT rollups and service packs!!! Windows Update is a pain in the ass!!!!!
If nothing else, I'd like to see a method of downloading all patches since SP2 into a single installer, so I could easily build an offline installer kit. Install XP with SP2 slipstremed, install the patch kit, done without a network connection (and saving HOURS of patch downloading time).
I've been doing slashdot since like 97 - right around senior year in high school. Back then I would have been a good little member of the cult of RMS, I would have been all "fuck the man" for software patents, I pirated software like hell (even had a really good warez server when comcast was beta testing cable modems) and I had gigs of mp3's.
If I'm anything like other people on Slashdot, I'm now older and wiser. I am about to plunk down $1,600 on Photoshop/Dreamweaver. I bought and paid for all the software on all my computers including Visual Studio, Quickbooks and Office Pro. I own two Vista boxes, one XP box and a Mac laptop. I've got half a rack of linux gear in the Westin building, but I've grown too old to pull my hair out with it's stability and I'm moving the farm to FreeBSD. I cannot wait until my business grows to the size then I have to plunk down cash for a wicked cool "big iron" system.
I've been through Slashdot and got bored. I went to kuro5hin before it died. I trolled with the best on adequacy before it died. I tried digg until it turned into youtube without video. It has been 10 years and despite everything, slashdot is still here going strong. As much as people diss slashdot, it is the only website of it's type that is still around. It may have new ajax tricks, but it is still the same as it was in 1997.
So has the traditional Linux stronghold been lost, or has the general slashdot population just grown up, got jobs and now see linux for what it is? A tool just like any other tool. And that is okay.
Hi Almantar
:)
I cannot speak for the original AC post that started this thread, but some of us post AC not because we "don't have the balls to do it on our own account" but rather because we don't have accounts are not interested in making them. I for one have never made an account because I think if I did I would end up wasting too much time posting here. As an AC however I make maybe 6-10 posts a week, and I'm fine with that. Moreover I have been doing so as an AC for about 6 years now.
If that means nothing I say is credible or my opinion doesn't matter to you, that's fine. But really how is posting AC any different than posting under "Almantar"? Your login name doesn't tell me anything about you, and certainly doesn't make anything you say seem any more or less credible (at least to me). For all intents and purposes you seem just as anonymous as I.
For interests sake I wanted to address your argument. What the original AC did was clearly an ad hominem attack, and did not refute any of Twitter's points, but I don't think it was meant to. He was not commenting so much on Twitters argument but rather on Twitter's style; he compared that style to the style of someone else he knew, and extrapolated that there can never be any intelligent discourse on a subject as long as Twitter persists in infantile name calling and outright lying. On this point I agree.
Those of us that have been around Slashdot for a while have long ago tired of Twitter and his antics. You can write the most eloquent and insightful response to one of his posts, meticulously picking apart every one of his "points" and prove that they are lies/misrepresentations/fud, but it is just tilting at windmills. Believe me I used to try. He will never respond to logical rebuttals, and rather will simply pull one or two things you write out of context, preface them with something like "Another M$-shill Twitter-bashing AC writes.." and follow up with "How much does Bill pay you to respond to my spreading of the truth all day? Not enough!". It was humourous for a while. Then it was sad. Now it's just annoying.
For what it's worth Twitter's real identity was figured out quite a while ago (you can check out the archives for posts that provide such information, if you wish to). I for one (as well as most Slashdot posters, I imagine) couldn't care less about what he does or who he is in real life, but it's interesting to note that Twitter has never worked at the enterprise level, has never programmed anything, and by his own admission hasn't used a MS product since the 90's. Yet he seems content to comment on all sorts of things he's never done and doesn't know anything about, often under the guise of being knowledgeable in the field. In my mind that is far worse than posting AC.
Now whether you give a damn or not about what I, another anonymous coward, have written is up to you. I enjoyed writing this post, so I already gots mine
Cheers
I don't think you are right. I bought a nice crap of the line dual core HP laptop with Vista Core 550$ added 50$ ram to bring it to 1.5 gigs. Hibernate as well as wifi work wonderfully. Standby is nice. I didn't used to have it so when I close the lid my laptop goes into standby. It is so fast now that I left it that way. Hibernation works alright but it seems to take a MUCH longer time to go into Hibernation. Coming out of hibernation is extremely quick though.
I thought I would hate Vista but it is alright when using the included programs. However a lot of my favorite programs like nero as well as many nice little things I run don't work right. Unless... you buy the upgrade. Same story as with XP but I really liked that upgrade and had no gripes with it whatsoever. I wasn't excited about XP but I loved it after I tried it out. Not really the same with Vista.
Vista is Ok for people who don't game. Maybe your error was in not buying a HP.... If you game like me the performance hit for Vista is wayy to much for me to deal with. There aren't any real great reasons to upgrade to vista you can already skin XP and get Yahoo widgets for free!