Help To Map Light Pollution

jcgam69 writes "October 1 marked the first day of the Great Worldwide Star Count, a half-month citizen science project that will harness thousands of observers across the globe to help map light pollution."

Comments

Here ya go:

[Tablizer]

http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/image/earth_night.jpg

Done.

Re:Here ya go:

[Cassius Corodes]

That is totally a web 1.0 solution. What we are looking for is a web 2.0 solution - we need to harness the dynamics of social groups to create solutions for the 21 century. Either that or just waste time.

Re:Here ya go:

[Puff of Logic]

That is totally a web 1.0 solution. What we are looking for is a web 2.0 solution - we need to harness the dynamics of social groups to create solutions for the 21 century. Either that or just waste time. Is that the part where we leverage a synergy, or is that Web 1.0?

Re:Here ya go:

[Tablizer]

I fail to see how light pollution has any relevance to my life. Is it simply because you can't see stars at night? Tell me there is something more substantial than that.

If you cannot see the night sky clearly, then you'll miss that meteor headed strait for your Linux box.

Re:Here ya go:

[omeomi]

Now I do my part: I live in Hong Kong and the only star I could see all these years is that red dot behind the moon, probably Mars.

You can see behind the moon from Hong Kong?

Re:Here ya go:

[alien88]

It messes with human and animals circadian rhythm.

  Your eyes see better in the dark when they've adjusted and when you move from really bright to dark places.. or vice versa, it takes your eyes a while to adjust. At night, you shouldn't have to do this. This is a safety issue.

It's a waste of energy.

It effects animal migrations.

Re:Here ya go:

[LynnwoodRooster]

Duh, everyone KNOWS that China's on the opposite side of the earth! Thus you see the opposite side of the moon, too...

Geez, the level of basic science knowledge here at /. is downright scary...

Re:Here ya go:

[Zymergy]

That's My Favorite Desktop Wallpaper! http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/catalog/PIA02991 Original Caption Released with Image: Global city lights. The Eastern U.S., Europe, and Japan are brightly lit by their cities, while the interiors of Africa, Asia, Australia, and South America remain (for now) dark and lightly populated. (Image by Craig Mayhew and Robert Simmon, NASA GSFC. Based on data from the Defense Meteorological Satellite Program). FULL RESOLUTION IMAGE: http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/tiff/PIA02991.tif

Re:Here ya go:

[Kris_J]

Light pollution can seriously affect ground-based astronomy. If scientific progress is something you don't care about, I can see why you'd think it irrelevant.

Re:Here ya go:

[rucs_hack]

when I was a kid I lived in south Australia. where we were there was no significant light pollution (probably some, there was a city 50 miles away, but you couldn't tell).

As a kid I could watch the stars just by laying on the beach by our house. I remember when we moved to england I wondered why the sky didn't have as many stars, and that was in the seventies. I just wasn't fun to look at. Now I know of only one spot near where I live that I can get even a slightly better view, and to get there is a two hour walk across the countryside, then the view is, well, not great.

I don't even live in a city.

Re:Here ya go:

[UserGoogol]

That, and the amount of light radiated into space is not the same as the degree to which the sky is obscured. There's obviously a fairly tight relationship between the two, but measuring the latter directly is always nice.

Re:Here ya go:

[datadigger]

WOW, that's great! They managed to find that exceptional, once in a lifetime, moment when it's midnight all over the world at the same time.

Re:Here ya go:

[UbuntuDupe]

-Any ground astronomy actually discovering cutting-edge stuff, is already located far from cities.

-New observatories will be put on planes. (like NASA's SOFIA project) [1]

So, all it really means is amateur astronomers can't collect the best data. Which is bad, I agree, but

-in terms of scientific progress, is about as bad as not putting the latest scientific journal publications in high schools

-affects my life less than "noise pollution".

Yeah, mod me down, but someone had to say it.

[1] Before anyone else can do it: "Enough is enough! I have *had it* with these m/f'ing observatories having to go on m/f planes!"

Re:Here ya go:

[Kris_J]

Any ground astronomy actually discovering cutting-edge stuff, is already located far from cities.

Or it was. The observatory here in Western Australia has already moved once and it's becoming affected by the metro area's lights again. It's not going to be able to afford to move again.

Even if the facilities here aren't cutting edge, what if the next Galileo would have been born here but never gets into Astronomy because the facility was made useless just by people pointlessly sending light into the sky?

Um.

[Adambomb]

Wouldn't it be just as easy to record a spin of the earth from the dark side?

Am i missing exactly why the stars light pollution keeps us from seeing would be a more useful measure than simply the brightness of light emitted?

Seems Like a Cool Idea

[rm999]

But can't we just view how much light there is in space from satellite photos and guess what the light pollution would be (like in http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/archive/8/86/20040921144929!Usa_night.gif)?

A few 1000 observers will offer very little resolution, considering the fact that light pollution is very localized. I live in the middle of an urban area, but can drive a few miles to see 10x as many stars.

Re:Seems Like a Cool Idea

[Phroon]

But can't we just view how much light there is in space from satellite photos and guess what the light pollution would be (like in http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/archive/8/86/20040921144929!Usa_night.gif)?

We can. In fact, it's been done. This isn't the real goal of the project, though:

"This Windows to the Universe Citizen Science Event is designed to encourage learning in astronomy!"

They're trying to increase awareness of astronomy and the detrimental effects of light pollution. If it just gets people aware it's worth it. I might just do it myself so I have a measure of how much light pollution there really is in my backyard.

Re:Seems Like a Cool Idea

[dwarmstr]

Satellite measurements only catch the uplight. Horizontally emitted light ends up producing much more light pollution per lumen emitted than uplight.

Re:Seems Like a Cool Idea

[Abcd1234]

It's also worth noting that light pollution, represented as the total amount of waste light emitted skyward, doesn't give a realistic picture of the actual effects at ground level. Depending on the locale, things like humidity, atmospheric particulate levels, etc, can have a *dramatic* effect on the number of stars visible, even with moderate levels of light pollution. Consequently, having real, human observations of on-site effects can provide a more realistic picture.

Inaccurate...

[WithLove]

The sample size will be way too small. And how are you going to map rural areas where no one lives? And how do you know that everyone is counting every star (and just once!)? A good idea in theory, and if the project's aim is simply to get the general public aware of how bad pollution is... I guess it's a plausible concept. But it's in no way accurate. I mean, what if it's cloudy? This seems like just another thing to do so people can say "harnessing the power of (insert any word for great number of people here) to (insert undoubtedly noble concept/idea here)." I mean, really, there's astronomers who do this, right?

Support the idea but .....

[pauljuno]

As an amateur astronomer I always support these efforts, not so much because they truly add a lot of value as the potential PR they generate. I live in an extremely urban area and can only see planets and the very brightest stars. And the problem is that we tend to generate a lot of light pollution that is a waste. We don't just illuminate the areas that needs it, but throw off a lot of light pollution because our lights are not focused on the needed area. It's like the standard light in your house, you turn it on and it throws light everywhere even though you just needed it to read a book, it's a waste. I'm not a green fanatic, but it just makes economic sense to try and reduce and eliminate waste where it exists .... plus I really miss seeing the Milky Way.

How Timely -- Some Advice Please

[SRA8]

How timely! I am planning to take a trip into Arizona or Colorado this winter *just* to see the unadultered night sky. I'm not entirely sure where to begin -- just drive randomly until i'm in complete darkness? Word of mouth? Any suggestions on how I can finally see the stars for once in my life?!

Hey, don't ask me

[$RANDOMLUSER]

I live real close to Chicago. On a clear night I can see Venus (if it's not too cloudy here in the midwest). I do most of my skywatching here.

Re:Hey, don't ask me

[clarkkent09]

I live in Las Vegas. On a clear night I can see the Moon

Re:Hey, don't ask me

[StarfishOne]

That's no moon!

(sorry, just could not resist)

Science is too tough

[whitehatlurker]

I sleep at night. All night. Can I do this during the day sometime?

Light offset credits

[infonography]

Now that would make sense. Trade Credits from Blind people and religious fanatics for use by stadiums during night games and hefty fines for Las Vegas (baby!)

Hmm Vegas alone could pay for NASA's budget every year. I'm liking it.

Anthropogenic light pollution a media creation

[andy314159pi]

The whole idea that man made lights are causing light pollution is just a hoax foisted onto you by the libural media.
Laugh. It was funny.

In My Area...

[HexaByte]

In my area it's either light pollution or crime. Having been the victim of a couple of car break-ins because we didn't have the outside lights on, I choose light pollution.

It's either that or armed guards, and electric is cheaper.

Re:In My Area...

[alien88]

There are many studies and none of them over the years have shown any correlation between lights and crime. There are many ways you can use lights and still cut down on light pollution. You can use motion sensors, you can use full cutoff shields so the light doesn't go into the sky. These are just a few.

The idea that more light = safer is false. In some ways, it actually allows criminals to plan how they're going to break into something. Not to mention, if a light is always on, most people just ignore it whereas if a light is triggered by motion it will attract a lot more attention.

Re:In My Area...

[forkazoo]

In my area it's either light pollution or crime. Having been the victim of a couple of car break-ins because we didn't have the outside lights on, I choose light pollution.

It's either that or armed guards, and electric is cheaper.

Considering a lot of light pollution is mostly a matter of inefficiency... Since you think it's a choice between light pollution and crime, I have to assume that you think that shooting vast amount of light into the sky somehow feeds the moon god, who in turn stops crime out of gratitude.

Seriously, a big part of the problem is with street lights that don't point all of there light toward the ground. Sure, a really well lit ground will bounce some light back up, but some lights literally just shine right up into the sky.

Also, in many cases excessively bright lights are used, which results in pools of blinding brilliance with pools of pitch black between them. In that case, the solution to make people feel safer is not to make the light brighter, but more even (and possibly dimmer) so that you can't hide in the harsh shadows.

Re:In My Area...

[Darth_brooks]

My neighborhood has no streetlights. We don't have a problem with break-ins because;

-It's too dark to find our neighborhood. Unless you know it's here, the blazingly bright apartment complexes a mile down the road look like way better targets.

-It's too dark to see what you're doing. Are you breaking in to a pinto, or a lexus? If there's no moon, it's tough to tell.

Seriously though, just *having* a light on doesn't do anything more than give a thief a well lit work environment. I took this picture http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne?id=1400894628&size=l on the way home from a trip to New Jersey. You're looking at SE Michigan, in the metro Detroit area. There are hundreds of thousands of lights in that picture that are shining straight up, wasting energy and brightening the night sky.

motion sensors?

[Animaether]

have you considered motion sensors? or IR sensors.. or radiowave sensors.. You'll have the best of all worlds...
- light when you need it (i.e. somebody is in the vicinity. Heck, the light suddenly popping on has more effect than the light being on continuously)
- no light when you don't need it (makes the light-pollution people happy)
- lower electricity bill

down sides..
- initial cost (couple bucks)
- initial installation (screwdriver and some healty common sense when it comes to dealing with electrical wiring)

Count from Beijing, China

[Goonie]

I did this exercise repeatedly in Beijing, China, a couple of weeks ago. When the atmospheric pollution was bad, I could only see two stars - though I suppose they may have been planets. This increased radically to three on a windy day where some of the smoke blew away.

The solution: burn coal

[timeOday]

Sooty air will block that nasty light pollution. Any light pollution more than just a couple miles from the observatory will be rendered harmless!

This demands immediate action!

[Loopy]

This kind of pollution cannot be tolerated. Think of the health of our grandchildren. Damned SUV-drivin' polluters!

/removes tongue from cheek

There's a whole lotta stars around here

[yaphadam097]

But they all blink...

Maybe it has something to do with the Navy base to the South, or the other Navy base to the East, or the Air National Guard base to the East, or the regional airport to the North...

North of Monument Valley

[stefanlasiewski]

Start at Kayenta Arizona, which is the largest town in the Navajo Nation, and functions as a regional capitol, of sort.

Bring a good car, several maps, one map which shows BLM Land. camping supplies, plenty of gas, food and water. You'll be in the middle of nowhere, so always make sure you have enough gas.

Head North on Highway 261, go through Monument Valley, head towards Natural Bridges National Monument. Monument Valley is one of the most famous places in the world, yet you can stand on the side of the road without seeing anyone for 30 minutes.

Drive 4000-feet up the side of a cliff on a crazy curvy old Uranium Road. This area is called the 'Gooseneck State Park. When you get to the top, stop and look back south over the valley--- you can see quite far.

Head north until you leave Gooseneck. This is BLM land. You can drive on any road, find a nice spot and camp. Wait until the nighttime, and check out the stars.

This is one of the most remote places in the US-- millions of stars. I remember it being so dark, and the stars were so bright that I could see faint shadows from the starlight.

Check out IDA

[KlaymenDK]

From http://www.darksky.org/about/ :

Goals
      1. Stop the adverse effects of light pollution on dark skies, including
                    * Energy waste and the air and water pollution caused by energy waste
                    * Harm to human health
                    * Harm to nocturnal wildlife and ecosystems
                    * Reduced safety and security
                    * Reduced visibility at night
                    * Poor nighttime ambience
      2. Raise awareness about light pollution, its adverse effects, and its solutions
      3. Educate everyone, everywhere, about the values of quality outdoor lighting
      4. Help stop other threats to our view of the universe, such as radio frequency interference (RFI) and space debris.

There are a bunch of very interesting articles on how less exterior lighting gives better visibility, roughly speaking because floodlights don't really light up everything and end up blinding you more than general darkness with point illumination.

Re:Hawaii Big Island solution

[MikeyTheK]

I live in the country on the mainland. When I lived in the city the ambient light made stargazing impossible. When my family comes to visit my house in the sticks, one of the things they all comment on is all the stars they can see now.

The stargazing on Hawaii is even more spectacular. However, the best stargazing I've ever done was from a little island on a tiny atoll several hundred miles west of Hawaii. Since there isn't anything resembling civilization nearby, it was about as black as one could imagine, as it was before moonrise. The night sky is completely chock full of dim lights that we have no hope of seeing when there is any ambient light at all. It really is amazing.