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Technology Leveling The Playing Field In Modern War

The IEEE spectrum site has up an article written by the author Robert N. Charette describing the 'empowerment of the individual to conduct war' through technology. In the piece, entitled Open-Source Warfare, Charette describes the cheap, inexpensive, but clever ways that militants are adapting to modern warfare. "As events are making painfully clear, [counterterrorism expert John Robb] says, warfare is being transformed from a closed, state-sponsored affair to one where the means and the know-how to do battle are readily found on the Internet and at your local RadioShack. This open global access to increasingly powerful technological tools, he says, is in effect allowing 'small groups to...declare war on nations.' Need a missile-guidance system? Buy yourself a Sony PlayStation 2. Need more capability? Just upgrade to a PS3."

44 of 304 comments (clear)

  1. what a nonsense by jacquesm · · Score: 2, Interesting

    the germans did pretty good with old technology, and I think that even today they'd make most smaller countries think twice about attacking them if they 'only' had wwII era weaponry.

    In fact all that tech is quickly becoming a weakness.

    Think about South Korea, more afraid of North Koreas conventional weaponry and artillery then of their nuke (assuming they really do have one).

    http://rndpic.com/

    1. Re:what a nonsense by F34nor · · Score: 2, Insightful

      We now are the German army. We still use their weapons as spoils of war. We have become the grand masters of the blitzkrieg. We have mastered tank warfare and air supremacy. Ahhh but what good is it against insurgents? Nothing. We would be better of withdrawing from Iraq waiting two years and invading again. (kidding/serious)

    2. Re:what a nonsense by dajak · · Score: 2, Informative

      That's just selective attention. The Nazis also taught us a lot about counter insurgency warfare. I know that in the Netherlands Dutch former Germanic SS soldiers were appointed as officers of counter insurgency units in the Netherlands Indies in the late 40s, because of their valuable counter insurgency experience in Russia.

    3. Re:what a nonsense by Marcos+Eliziario · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Discussions about the morality of the war aside, there's a crucial difference between these two episodes and nazi contra-insurgency: Let's assume Haditha and Abu Graib is equivalent to past nazy military actions (And it's not, but I disgress), even so, it's clear that if nowadays americans did the same the nazi did on WWII, it's not an acceptable state policy. People has been punished because of those abuses, and it's more or less clear that the Republican will lose the next elections. On Nazy Germany those acts where standard ROE, for the modern US army, the same acts are seen as abuse, and when uncovered by media or by investigators there's punishment and lots of changes.
      Really man, you're insulting the memories of all those civilians who died on Europe because of german's hunt for insurgents. There's a fucking huge difference of scale.

      --
      Your ad could be here!
    4. Re:what a nonsense by an.echte.trilingue · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Ghengis Khan did not build a government that could outlast the absence of his troops. His empire fell apart right after he died. The Khmer Rouge fell apart at the first sign of foreign intervention. The Germans did significant damage to their rear-area security on the Eastern front by terrorizing local populations and creating fertile ground from within which Soviet saboteurs could operate.

      The Romans were mostly successful because they extensively employed the strategy of Pax Romana, which basically the antique equivalent of the modern concept of soft power. You see, for most of the peoples around the Roman Empire, war was endemic (for example, the Germanic tribes raided each other on an annual basis) and they knew that life would be longer, more prosperous, and more peaceful if they joined their larger neighbor.

      There are many kinds of power (power being defined as the ability to influence events to your advantage). The ability to inflict damage is one, the ability to entice others to your position is another, the ability to bring economic factors into the game is another, political will is another, and so on. Also, power is non-fungible, that is, being powerful in one area does not compensate for a great weakness in another area. This is why the EU, which is a great economic power, is not considered a world power as it lacks the political will to act in concert. Similarly, India's large population and military might (they are a nuclear power) do not compensate for its economic weakness.

      Fear works to some degree, but only in concert with other elements of power. You can only build a stable system if the majority of people within that system agree on its fundamental precepts (this is one aspect of political power). So, if we try to build a government in Iraq based on fear, we are going to run into problems that the power we exert in one arena (military might) will not compensate for our failure to exert power in other arenas, such as political will.

      Developing a strategy that will bring several elements of power to bear is doable, but very difficult. That is why, in the future, we should avoid electing uneducated people (an MBA is not an education), or at least elect uneducated people who will appoint educated advisors and then listen to them instead of the veep.

      --
      weirdest thing I ever saw: scientology advertising on slashdot.
    5. Re:what a nonsense by EaglemanBSA · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I'd say it's less clear that the republicans will lose. Again, we have the capacity in these primaries to put forward nominees that will reduce us Americans' choices to deciding between a Giant Douche (tm) and a Turd Sandwich (tm). Again. Honestly, can you represent the opinions and beliefs of 300 million people with the "bichromatic rainbow" (to quote Jon Stewart) presented here?

      --
      Quiz: True or False -- On a scale of 1 to 10, what is your middle name?
    6. Re:what a nonsense by homer_ca · · Score: 2, Insightful

      That's the problem. You can't any more. Populations are higher. Occupations are labor intensive, and the US Army has very high labor costs compared to, say, the Janjaweed militia of Sudan. The ease of global travel and global communications compared to the 1940s means you'll just create a diaspora of pissed off refugees while millions more sympathizers get the video online. Meanwhile, those refugees could easily follow us home and launch terrorist attacks on high value civilian targets. Look at the Russians in Chechnya, a tiny country of barely a million people. They blasted the whole place into rubble and look what it got them.

    7. Re:what a nonsense by Xaositecte · · Score: 2, Interesting

      *Sigh*

      Hi, US Air Force, been to Iraq and Afghanistan. My views do not in any way reflect the viewpoint of the United States Military, nor should anything I say be misinterpreted as an official statement.

      The prospect of three square meals a day in an American prison, where you have a roof over your head, and the "torture" you're subjected to is downright comfortable compared to daily life on the outside is decidedly not terrifying.

      The Enemy is not scared to death. They are simply not suicidal (except for, notably, suicide bombers) - fighting an Asymmetrical warfare they believe they can win. In Afghanistan The system is set up where if a tribal elder or religious leader says something, a member of that tribe does it, regardless of personal feelings on the subject. Most Afghanis are brought up without any sort of education at all beyond obediance to authority and memorized portions of the Koran.

      Much of the insurgent support and leadership in Afghanistan comes from civilians, and are untouchable by Americans. When a military leader is killed, another elder comes in, or a member of the military group gives themself a field promotion. New fighters are constantly recruited or imported, fed and armed by various villages (and Iran) without fear of US reprisal, and set about killing more Americans.

      The only ways to convince insurgents that their war won't last are to:

      1. Methodically sweep through the Country, completely eliminating entire armies of Insurgents, demonstrating that death is not merely likely, but garunteed.
      - A plan we lack the manpower to carry out.
      2. Show individual villages there are consequences for assisting the Insurgency, arresting village elders, slash and burning poppy crops indiscriminately, etc. There isn't even any need for the extreme actions proposed by the GP (essentially systematic genocide).
      - A plan we lack the will to carry out. Apparently someone, somewhere, still believes the poor farmers are selling poppys to buy food, rather than weapons and ammunition.

      Instead of all of these, our glorious leadership still believes Afghanistan can be put back togather and led towards democracy, funding village construction projects, giving away food and money that inevitably ends up right in the hands of the insurgency.

      -------

      Iraq is an even bigger shithole of a country, but the last time I was there was about two years ago, and my job there didn't take me off base, so I can't give firsthand commentary on it.

    8. Re:what a nonsense by mOdQuArK! · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Kill all who? The rest of the world? Do you seriously think the rest of the world would stand by and let a nation who considered genocide a valid form of foreign policy to exist?

    9. Re:what a nonsense by mvdwege · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Are you kidding? Do you still believe that line that the abuses are the work of individuals and not officially sanctioned?

      How does this stack up against e.g. General Abizaid threatening reprisals against the civilian population of Iraq for insurgent actions (as referenced in this Slashdot discussion)? Germans were sentenced to the gallows for that in Nuremberg. What has been done to General Abizaid?

      Mart
      --
      "I know I will be modded down for this": where's the option '-1, Asking for it'?
    10. Re:what a nonsense by blitziod · · Score: 2, Interesting

      not to invoke godwinn's law...but that is nazi strategy also ...read the nazi plans for occupation of the UK. They where even ordered to be polite to local merchants and pay bills timely.

      --
      The only way to bust a doper--is when you yourself become a smoker!
  2. Microsofts marketing by 4play · · Score: 4, Funny

    I can see Microsoft's new marketing campaign now. "PS3's are for terrorists"

  3. You what? by Haeleth · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Need a missile-guidance system? Buy yourself a Sony PlayStation 2. Need more capability? Just upgrade to a PS3.
    Because it's well known that all Sony consoles have missile-guidance software built in to their firmware!

    Seriously, WTF? How does a Playstation have any benefits over other smaller, cheaper, lighter computer hardware for guiding missiles? How does cheap computer hardware have any benefits at all when you don't have the software to run on it? How would hardware and software have any benefits at all when you don't have any guided missiles in the first place, and if some rogue state (or the CIA, depending on whose side you're on) wanted to supply you with them, they could just supply you with guidance systems at the same time?!
    1. Re:You what? by cp.tar · · Score: 2, Funny

      Seriously, WTF? How does a Playstation have any benefits over other smaller, cheaper, lighter computer hardware for guiding missiles? How does cheap computer hardware have any benefits at all when you don't have the software to run on it? How would hardware and software have any benefits at all when you don't have any guided missiles in the first place, and if some rogue state (or the CIA, depending on whose side you're on) wanted to supply you with them, they could just supply you with guidance systems at the same time?!

      You think too much.

      Open Source Warfare is the way hackers can build their own, Linux-powered missile guidance systems, and with Compiz Fusion, you get not only spiffy 3D graphics, but also a Compiz Fusion Warhead.

      And since OpenMoko promotes open hardware, open warheads are just a step away.

      However, there is no chemical weaponry to be assembled in the Open Source world[1] - with all those crippled chemistry sets, we'll just have to settle for biological weaponry.

      [1]oops: I'd initially spelled it Opwn Source... Freudian slip?

      --
      Ignore this signature. By order.
    2. Re:You what? by maxwell+demon · · Score: 2, Funny

      [1]oops: I'd initially spelled it Opwn Source... Freudian slip?

      You mean because your finger went too much to the left?
      Communist! :-)
      --
      The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
    3. Re:You what? by gatkinso · · Score: 2, Funny

      Perhaps a missile would be nice too.

      --
      I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
  4. Oh, I'm sorry... by cp.tar · · Score: 4, Funny

    the cheap, inexpensive, but clever ways that militants are adapting to modern warfare.

    I'd thought guerrilla wasn't exactly a new concept...

    /* BTW inexpensive == cheap */

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    Ignore this signature. By order.
  5. Pitchforks anyone? by martin-boundary · · Score: 2, Insightful
    The premise seems flawed. It's not open source that's enabling militants to intelligently fight armies, it's the militants' own intelligence and adaptability that lets them use whatever happens to be there to fight the occupying forces: centuries ago it was pitchforks, now it's open source, tomorrow it will be flying cars.

    1. Re:Pitchforks anyone? by cp.tar · · Score: 4, Funny

      exactly. It's like my friend (a vet) says, he walks in to a diner and sees weapons everywhere,

      Wow.

      I didn't know veterinarians were so militant.

      Though I can see the rationale... if you're going to spay (or bathe) a cat, you'd better be learned in the arts of war.

      --
      Ignore this signature. By order.
  6. We are in effect training them how to fight us. by F34nor · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The real problem with expending your military might in an endless fight is the same as abusing antibiotics. You train your enemy how to adapt to your attacks and how to generate new ones against you. This is one reason why we had the Powell Doctrine. You attack with a clear goal, a clear exit strategy, and overwhelming force. This is what we learned in Vietnam. Powell & Armitage were the only members of the Bush administration who were in the army and we told to shut up by Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, and Cheney. Now we have trained a new generation of Mugahadin on two fronts how to bleed the US Army. In fact this was Bin laden's stated policy. He said he could run a $100,000 opperation against us and in turn we would spend billioins to fight him. At the time of this post "The War in Iraq Costs $471,396,995,064. Wow Bush et. all could not have done a worse job of responding to asymmetrical warfare. This is how Afghanistan defeated the U.S.S.R. and in some ways Afghanistan was the straw that broke the camel's back. Now we as a country have run up or credit cards only to run up or mortgages on s speculative bubble only to run up of national debt to what end. The dollar plunges, the rate of abortions goes up, and the federal government expands its powers. For what?

    1. Re:We are in effect training them how to fight us. by Loligo · · Score: 2, Interesting

      >This is how Afghanistan defeated the U.S.S.R. ...along with US funding, training, and a steady supply of Stinger missiles...

      The Muj didn't beat the Soviets alone. They could never have done it without our assistance.

        -l

    2. Re:We are in effect training them how to fight us. by jacquesm · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I can't connect all the dots either, but the point about the 100 K vs ungodly sums of money is well made. If that was bin ladens stated goal then he has succeeded beyond his wildest dreams. In many ways Iraq *is* the same for the US as Afghanistan was for the Russians. Including a desire to 'pacify' it.

    3. Re:We are in effect training them how to fight us. by mmacedon · · Score: 2, Informative

      The cost of the war is about $120 Billion a year. Given that the US economy is roughly $13 Trillion a year, that represents less than a %1 percent marginal cost. During the Cold War, total defense spending ranged from 5% (the 1980's) to 14% (the 1950's) of GDP. "At 4 percent of GDP, defense spending is one and a half percentage points of GDP below the 45-year historical average and well below Cold War and Vietnam War levels." http://www.heritage.org/research/features/BudgetChartBook/charts_s/s7.cfm Given that the Surge is working (according to the NYT) and the US is crushing Al Queda in Iraq, its money well worth spent. http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/21/opinion/21friedman.html?bl&ex=1195966800&en=39c89c8e523b54d9&ei=5087%0A

  7. PS3 is too much work for a guidance system by t0qer · · Score: 2, Informative

    I dunno, maybe you could make it run on DC...Prolly could get away with a power inverter. Still though, would you don't really want moving parts and it's a lame way to do it.

    http://www.u-nav.com/picopilot/picopilotn.html

    $500 gets you a solid state autopilot programmable with GPS waypoints. It also already has a interface to servo's.

    Just because you could build a guidance system from a game system, doesn't mean it's really going to have any advantage in the real world.

  8. Bruce Simpson by apodyopsis · · Score: 2, Interesting

    on the subject.. remember Bruce Simpson and his DIY cruise missile that various governments stamped on?

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/3302763.stm

    http://www.interestingprojects.com/cruisemissile/

    He's talented and not afraid of controversy and his part in the infamous "jet carts" episode from Scrapheap Challenge is excellent. I always thought he had a point about this one.

    btw. I always though IE D from the article was a very misleading term - many of these devices are NOT improvised the insurgents pack them out on a factory line and some of them are relatively advanced in the design and detonation system - as far as I can tell from the news reports.

  9. Long article, not much in it by clarkkent09 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    In the piece, entitled Open-Source Warfare, Charette describes the cheap, inexpensive, but clever ways that militants are adapting to modern warfare.

    Such as? I couldn't find much at all in the article except for some vague references to IEDs and cell phones, terrorist manuals found on the internet (most of which, according to TFA are terribly inaccurate) and ridiculous comments such as the one about PS2 being used as a missile guidance system. Sounds like someone came up with a new buzzword "open source warfare" and thought it was so cool that it warranted a 5 page article. People have used guerrilla tactics forever and I don't see anything terribly new here except perhaps detonating bombs remotely using a cellphone.

    --
    Negative moral value of force outweighs the positive value of good intentions.
  10. That's what you get for declaring "War on Terror" by Britz · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Cheap terrorism becomes "global warfare".

    Calling the World Trade Center attacks an "Attack on America" just upgraded a couple of lunatic terrorists to warfaring guys that can attack a nation.

    What a bunch of bullcrap. But good for the security industry. They can sell a bunch of crap on that. The Iraqis are now used to live with a big one every week. America turned into a bunch of pussies because of one lousy (OK, it was pretty good, but it was still just one) attack. I am from Germany and we went through this before. The RAF formed in the 70s and the whole nation went ape shit crazy. Anti-Terrorism-legislation went unanimously through parliament that was against basic rights and the constitution on many accounts.

    I think this makes terror work in the first place. If we don't pass legislation. If we don't go ape shit. Then we win against them. The loosing starts by calling them terrorists. They are a bunch of lunatics that badly need to be put behind bars. Nothing more, nothing less.

    "Modern warfare"? This article marks just another loss.

  11. Re:That's is? by antifoidulus · · Score: 3, Funny

    Hate to break it to you, but you do know that computers were around before 2002, right?

  12. Whee! This article is buzzword compliant! by superdude72 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    "Open Source" is so 1995. Good lord, he even makes reference to "The Cathedral and the Bazaar." Could this article be more hackneyed? Time to update the buzzwords at least. This is Warfare 3.0! (Or is that too 2002?)

    The insurgency has an advantage in that all they really need to do to win is continue to create a lot of chaos. That's a somewhat more modest objective than invading and occupying another country on the other side of the globe, which no number of PS3s and radio shack components will enable any guerilla army to do any time soon. They aren't particularly high tech, unless you were naive enough to think Iraqis didn't have cell phones and the Internet prior to the war. So technology isn't really leveling the playing field at all; it's just the nature of counter insurgency warfare.

    It's a shame we lost a $100,000 robot to disarm a much less expensive IED, but that's why we built the robots. Ideally they'd come back from every mission, but if they don't it's quite an improvement over losing a solider, as we might have done in Vietnam.

  13. That isn't exactly correct by Moraelin · · Score: 5, Interesting

    That isn't exactly correct, and, more importantly, war doesn't boil down to just having the best tanks. What's more important is how you use them.

    1. German tanks _were_ weaker. Yes, everyone knows about Tigers and Panthers later, but in 39 we entered the war with Pz-I and Pz-II. That was the bulk of the German army. The I series was little more than an armoured car with two _medium_ machineguns in a turret. They were intended to be training tanks, but got pressed into the war because of lack of anything better.

    Plus a couple of better ones, half of them captured from the Czechs, but they were anything but the bulk of the army.

    Most German soldiers were equipped with a bolt action rifle until the end of the war.

    Where Germany excelled were the doctrines. I.e., how you use that equipment.

    E.g., tanks were weaker, but that was ok, because they were only supposed to punch through or bypass, take some important position, then let the enemy attack you to take it back. And then you could use the 88mm FLAK gun to kill any better tanks the enemy might have had. That was Blitzkrieg.

    E.g., the soldiers may have had bolt action rifles, but that was ok because the German infantry doctrine had the squad machinegun as the central piece, and the rest of the squad was mostly support for it. (By comparison, the Americans saw it the other way around, so they were saddled with the shitty BAR as a piss-poor substitute for a squad MG.)

    2. The Soviet union was more technologically advanced than you seem to think, grasshopper.

    The T34 was years ahead of anything anyone else had. The 76mm gun could break through any other nation's tanks' armour even with the high explosive round. And the front armour was just short of invulnerable to anything Germany had on a tank.

    The T34 was one of the reasons why Germany rushed to attack the USSR early. Hitler couldn't risk waiting until it's produced in large numbers.

    You know the (in)famous German Panther? Well, that was a shameless copy of the Soviet T34. Really. The initial proposal was to just start manufacturing T34s, but it was seen as a matter of national pride to not be that obvious about it. So they changed the gun on it and a few other details, but otherwise it was still just a modded T34.

    The KV-1 and KV-2 were a nightmare for the German army too. It took quite literally hundreds of hits to disable one. That was _years_ before the Tigers.

    Add other advances, like rocket artillery, early semi-automatic rifles (and mass use of SMGs, far ahead of the numbers the Germans had), etc, and the Russians weren't technologically handicapped at all.

    Heck, even their AT guns, Germany used any they could lay their hands on. There were whole series of vehicles built with captured soviet AT guns. That says something, doesn't it? They wouldn't have used something that's two generations behind.

    3. Don't get me wrong, the USSR did have its own problems and handicaps. But it wasn't as handicapped as most people seem to assume anyway.

    The biggest and foremost problem the USSR had wasn't technological at all. Their army had just gone through Stalin's purges, and was (A) lacking competent officers, (B) paralized with fear of being the next scapegoat if they show any initiative, and (C) put under the control of comissars who were there just for political reasons, not for any military competence. The USSR, including the army, also had a _massive_ morale problem. At least half the people (and almost all the minorities and non-Russian Soviet republics) would have been happier to fight against Stalin than for him.

    _That_ is the main factor that almost doomed the USSR in the early days of Operation Barbarossa.

    A second problem -- again, mostly because of doctrine and political idiocy, rather than technology -- was that the Russians didn't believe in using radios on their tanks. They had them in homeopathic quantities, if at all. So once they were buttoned up in combat, each tank was almost on its own and had

    --
    A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
  14. Re:That's what you get for declaring "War on Terro by QuantumG · · Score: 2, Insightful

    yeah, especially seeing as it has been a success beyond even their most wildest fantasies. A better description would be "super fantastic."

    --
    How we know is more important than what we know.
  15. Re:Those open source terrorists! by 3waygeek · · Score: 5, Funny

    Given their extremist political views, I'd think they'd use Subversion instead of CVS.

  16. What surprises me by phoenixwade · · Score: 2
    I a total lack of reference to The Anarchist Cookbook which seems like a natural for an article that references re-purposing tech for war and making stupid associations with the Open Source Movement.

    "United by that vision, they exchange information and work collaboratively on tasks of mutual interest." I mention the latter because the association is tenuous at best, and could as easily be made with any other information sharing that occurs. In other words, it's not Open Source, it's the connectivity itself. It seems to me that virtually any group sharing situation utilizing the internet would apply, including MMRPG teams, Teacher-to-Teacher networks that develop course ware for some subject or other, and pimp-my-ride or mod-my-box communities.
    --
    A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
  17. RTFA by HangingChad · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It's not talking about open source software, it's open source as a methodology. The author is using the term open source in terms of how knowledge of improvised weapons and tactics are being spread. That technically sophisticated terrorists have managed to shorten the learning curve. It's open source intelligence and the premise is not flawed. They're using the open source model very effectively. It's not that the pitchforks are all that much more advanced, it's the learning environment that's advanced. And it that regard the insurgents are running rings around the Pentagon. Although one could argue that's a pretty low bar.

    But the real boon for terrorists is having a practical lab located conveniently in their own back yard.

    The reason Iraq has proven to be such a rich learning environment for insurgents has more to do with practical, on-the-ground opportunities for learning that the fighting provides."

    --
    That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
  18. Oh, look! Everybody is a terrorist. by Fantastic+Lad · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I realize everybody here is probably well aware of how this game works, but it's still important to call the lies when you see them, cuz they're certainly not going to shut up and hand their heads when you point our their psychotic bullshit.

    And so, here are a few of my favorite quotes from the article. . .

    To understand open-source warfare, it's instructive to revisit Eric S. Raymond's 1997 manifesto, The Cathedral and the Bazaar, in which he describes how a large community of open-source software hackers created the operating system Linux. "Linux is subversive," Raymond wrote.

    Wow. So there it is. Writing software in your spare time for the fun of it is now 'hacking', 'subversive' and linked to terrorism. They've been trying like crazy to connect those synapses for years now, but this is the first time I've read an article which says it with such bald-faced impunity.

    In studying the behaviors of insurgencies in Iraq and elsewhere, as well as organized-crime syndicates and other groups, Robb noticed the many parallels to the open-source model in software. [. . .] members of the group don't report to a central authority; they operate relatively autonomously, and they tend to be well educated, media-savvy, and comfortable operating in a globalized, high-tech world.

    Well, thank-you Robb! You just described everybody living in an industrialized nation with an internet connection. He's not describing the community living in a bombed out Iraq or Afghanistan, where they can't even get running water with any reliability, let alone electricity and an internet service provider. Nope. He's describing you and me.

    But this article isn't just about trying to make every day activities seem suspicious. The whole thing is a giant sell-job. It just takes for granted that terrorists are real, that brown people defending their country against invaders are our natural enemy and that defeating them is merely a technical problem requiring trillions of dollars. Little robots for detecting road-side mines which cost $100,000 each? Jeezuz. Give me a $100,000 and I'll build you a fleet of frickin' radio-controlled Tonka dune buggies with mini-Canada Arms. Those $100,000 robots are the best indication of exactly what this war is really all about. Money. Hoovering up as much cash from the over-taxed citizens as is possible. Money. You are a terrorist if you write your own software instead of buying Microsoft. (--Money, and that loony little Christian-cult-of-apocalypse-Christ-Rising-In-Babylon(Iraq) thing.) But we know all of this! I'm just repeating what has been said a few thousand times already. And guess what? I'll keep on repeating it whenever I see evil sell-jobs like this dumb article.

    Here's a new term: How about, "Closed-Source Propaganda"?

    Somebody is paying this 'counterterrorism expert', John Robb's bills. Now who in the great Homeland could that be?

    Money from the top. He's not writing this shit in his spare time while panning for donations. He's a soldier for the Neocon Pathocracy. Those secretive bastards are as closed-source as you can get.


    -FL

  19. Nah by Moraelin · · Score: 4, Informative

    Nah, most of their tanks came from Tankograd, a city they built pretty much from scratch around some enormous tank factories.

    --
    A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
  20. & /. groupthink says *Christans* are irrationa by anomaly · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Wow. This post is incredible.

    In summary, I think that your points are that Sept 11 was an inside job - a cover up to hide the fact that the government bailed out the rich invested in a hedge fund, and an excuse to cow the masses into believing that threats by outsiders to US national security are real so that the military industrial complex can make more money by waging a war which is actually no threat to our security.

    I can't even begin to address how ridiculous these ideas are.

    Building 7 was not intentionally taken down.
    Implosion specialist's analysis, based on facts and scientific analysis

    With respect to the "Trillion Dollar Bet" - it makes sense to me that if US investors have an enormous number of dollars invested in risky investments overseas when the overseas markets tank, the loss of those holdings could affect the market as a whole, and that could cause significant problems for joe sixpack.

    Take a look at what is happening now due to the subprime mortgages issued to people who could not afford them. Our economy is on the edge of slowdown as a whole because of the significant decrease of transactions in the housing market. The fed needed to take action to protect the public, and it did.

    Ideologues around the world have stated that they want to kill us. According to your view, how should we respond? Let them attack our ships, our embassies, our large cities, while we ignore them because the battle is economically disproportionate?

    Wow.

    *POO* IHBT!

    --
    But Herr Heisenberg, how does the electron know when I'm looking?
  21. The LIE is right there in the article by SmallFurryCreature · · Score: 2, Insightful

    He talks about Improvised Explosive Devices and that they account for half the US casualties. Right, eh so? These things are new? Pretty sure my field manual mentioned them, not just how to spot them and deal with them but including suggestions on how to make your own should the need arise. That was over 2 decades ago.

    The vietnamese used a lot of IED's and even non-explosive traps. So did the Israeli's in their war against Britian (well would be Israeli's) the various occupied nations during WW2 became experts in it.

    In the days of Sword and Bow&Arrow a flail was a dangerous weapon found on any farm. You would need to be very good with your sword to go up against a farmer with a scythe and ask yourselve, who has had the most training with their weapon.

    The LIE is that somehow modern tech has changed this. It hasn't. So they use mobile phones now as remote detonators, is that really that different then a radio or IR detonator, how about a simple wire? A fuse? They all been used and plenty of others.

    He then goes on to claim that you could use a PS3 as a missle guidance system. You probably could. Except missle guidance systems existed long before you had the PS3, so why do you need anything that powerfull?

    It also doesn't explain where you get the rest of the tech, you know like the missle or the detection system. No, the IR sensor is NOT good enough to track a plane. Not by a long shot. What about the software?

    It becomes even more silly when you then ask where these PS3 guided missles ARE? All the incidents involving missles involve regular missles bought on the blackmarket. I seen no story claiming that these SAM's were handmade.

    If this stuff was so advanced you would think that by now Hezbollah could hit a target with it rather then having to fire at civilian centers because they are the only target big enough to have a change of causing damage.

    If you want to see real modern tech you got to look at the propaganda war, every incident, there is a camera right there, recording it and its data gets out to the rest of the world with amazing speed. But the tech used is all of the shelf stuff. Nothing home grown or opensource.

    No, this guy is just trying to use a buzzword to scaremonger. Iraq is nothing new, what is frightening is that the US was incapable avoiding it. That we still don't have any better way to deal with this. No I don't have the answer, except that perhaps they should have done another Gulf War 1, bomb the place back to the stoneage every couple of years but stay the fuck out of it. Really, hasn't history shown us that modern occupations rarely work well?

    --

    MMO Quests are like orgasms:

    You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.

  22. Machiavelli by Nicolas+MONNET · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Indeed. Machiavelli laid this out in The Prince centuries ago. It's a very readable book, I recommend it.
    That's why it's kind of mind-boggling to see the US fail so miserably in its imperialist occupation in Iraq. The part where they disbanded the Iraqi army instead of giving them at least tokens of power is especially laughable in this respect; it shows that Bush, along with his merry band of war criminals, is most certainly as stupid and ignorant as he looks.

    1. Re:Machiavelli by an.echte.trilingue · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That's why it's kind of mind-boggling to see the US fail so miserably in its imperialist occupation in Iraq. Not at all. Great powers have been defeated repeatedly by insurgencies since Machiavelli wrote. Reading a slim tome on inter-state relations in renaissance Italy hardly gives one the understanding necessary to defeat a well-organized, well supplied insurgency in a hostile country. Also, characterizing this as an imperial action is stretching the term a bit... to the point that it seems you are using it for its pejorative value rather than as an actual characterization of the war.

      the part where they disbanded the Iraqi army instead of giving them at least tokens of power is especially laughable in this respect Hindsight is always 20/20 from our comfortable arm chairs. I can give you a dozen historical examples of where this strategy worked. (Germany & Japan in WWII, the South in the civil war, etc). I can also give you a dozen examples of where leaving the enemy's army intact in a token position backfired (Germany after WWI, Caesar after Pharsalus, etc).

      it shows that Bush, along with his merry band of war criminals, is most certainly as stupid and ignorant as he looks. Bush is not a war criminal. Please do not cheapen the term.

      Machiavelli laid this out in The Prince centuries ago. It's a very readable book While it is true that Machiavelli is, along with Hobbes, one of the founding authors of what is known as the "realist" school of thought in international relations as a study, his thought processes are largely obsolete. A number of things have changed since then, including the rise of nation states and the institution of sovereignty, the advent of international institutions, and the increasing importance of trans-frontier relations in the day to day lives of people. Most importantly, in my mind at least, is the fact that he assumes an uncrossable barrier between domestic and public spaces, which experience has shown not to reflect reality. I would really recommend that you read "Anarchy is what states make of it" by Alexander Wendt, "International Institutions: Two Approaches" by Robert Keohane and, of course, "Soft Power" by Joseph Nye if you would like to see a more modern interpretation of power politics.

      --
      weirdest thing I ever saw: scientology advertising on slashdot.
    2. Re:Machiavelli by vux984 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Bush is not a war criminal. Please do not cheapen the term.

      Illegally declaring a war on false premises leading directly to the death of thousands of American soldiers, foreign soldiers, -and- civilians? He's no genocidal madman, but he's certainly no common criminal either.

      Plus if he were the president of any other country (say if Iran were to invade another country to halt its nuclear weapons program, for example) the US administration and media would surely call him a war criminal.

  23. Re:That's what you get for declaring "War on Terro by Gnavpot · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Yes, it is important not to over-react to terrorists. But just ignoring them isn't the right answer either.

    Ignoring them as terrorists is the right answer.

    They should be treated and convicted like any other criminals without acknowledging them as something special. As soon as you label them "terrorists", you give them the credit they want.
  24. Re:Crime against peace by F34nor · · Score: 4, Insightful

    All your points amount to NOTHING because Cheney stated exactly what would happen as well when he supported 41's decision not to invade Baghdad. Even Dick (the heartless devil) Cheney knew what would happen and told us clearly concisly and with conviction. Its not some self-fulfilling prophecy, it was the inevitable result of our actions. Clear to ANYONE who knew anything about Iraq, even some of the Vulcans; Cheney knew, Powell knew, and Armitage knew. Bush didn't even know who the Kurds, Shia, and Shite were when he invaded.

    European opposition was like an adult saying to a teenager "don't drink and drive or you'll smash into a tree or worse kill some poor family who are driving home." Then the kid goes out gets drunk and smashes his Dad's suburban into a minivan full of kids at 95 mph. That's Iraq. That's not 20/20 hindsight. Just because you did not have the ability to model the results of a US invasion of Baghdad does mean other people didn't know what was going to happen.

    If the EU is trying to "assert" themselves against us why is NATO in Afghanistan? Why because it was a legitimate target and one that needed attention. Iraq at the time was just another shit hole ruled by an asshole with limited ability to extend its power beyond its border. What poower it did have still acted as a counter balance to Iran.

  25. The Point of the Article was Missed Here by systemeng · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Firstly, the author was not saying that open source is a form of terrorism. What he was saying is that the rapid and open communication model used by open source is much more efficient than the closed encrypted compartmented model used by the U.S. Military Industrial Complex: Terrorists communicate on open websites in near realtime while the military communicates through channels with huge delays. A single terrorist can read the terrorist literature from anywhere and change tactics appropriately. A single U.S. soldier neither has access to the up-to-the-second information on new tactics nor the authority to act upon it.

    In terms of acquisition, a terrorist can cobble together any sort of armament with any materials available and if it doesn't work, they try again very rapidly. A single U.S. soldier must generally wait for new specially designed equipment to come from the U.S. to combat a given problem. This can take months when lucky and years when not lucky. While the new special equipment likely works very well, the need may have gone away by the time it is delivered. It's not the danger of consumer devices the author was pointing out; it the fact that the enemy has simple cheap and brutally effective weapons based on consumer devices where we have nothing that is either that cheap or nearly as cost effective for the battle at hand. The point about the PS3 was not that the bad guys have PS3 based missiles it's the fact that say a blackberry's processor is just as capable of running a cruise missile as a 1 million dollar circuit card on a cruise missile. That's not to say that the terrorists have the software, it only points up the fact that we ought to question why it takes the U.S. a million dollar control board to do the same thing you could do with a PS3.

    What I think the author was trying to say is that we should have the Industrial portion of the Military Industrial Complex cranking out cheap equipment from off the shelf parts designed to meet the need at hand rather than designing multi-million, multi-billion, or multi-trillion dollar systems that take months, years, or decades to field. Why send in a $100,000 packbot to look for explosives if you can send in a $1000 wheeled vehicle made from R/C car parts. With the availablity of cheap explosives on the part of our adversaries, there is no way we can hope to solve the problem with money when there is a 1:100,000 disparity in the cost to us to take out insurgent weapons.

    I work for a company that develops quick off the shelf systems for the U.S. military. One system I worked on along these lines ran linux and consisted of lightly modified PC's combined with other special gear. I think we spent 6 months just performing the environment tests to show that the equipment would survive multiple trips to 40 below zero, explosive decompression of an aircraft around it, salt spray etc. It took over a year to get this expedited product out the door.

    While the testing was was justified in the case I worked on, I don't see a reason to worry about antarctic applications of tiny cheap and disposable robots for use in the desert. Even if the lifetimes of a lot of this special purpose equipment are short, I think it would be better to put out more cheap equipment faster. A crate of mostly working robots for examining IED's designed as the 90% solution,ON THE GROUND TODAY (with the soldiers), is worth a lot more that a perfectly tested triple checked crate of indestructible robots delivered after the squad they were supposed to protect has perished.