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Leopard as the New Vista?

ninja_assault_kitten writes "There's an interesting rant from Oliver Rist up on the PC Magazine site. He compares the catastrophe that is Vista to the recently released OS X Leopard. While clearly one is a lion and the other a cub, there do appear to be some frustrating similarities. From the article: 'A month of using Leopard with the same software I had under Tiger and the OS has dumped six times. That's six cold reboots for Oliver. Apple isn't even honest enough to admit that Leopard is crashing: The OS just grays out my desktop and pops up a dialog box telling me I've got to reboot. Like the whole thing is my fault. I even snapped a picture of it. After all, I HAD PLENTY OF CHANCES!'"

8 of 734 comments (clear)

  1. Anecdotal evidence is worthless by Solra+Bizna · · Score: 5, Informative

    I have been using Leopard since 12 hours before it was officially released. I have had two kernel panics. Both panics were my fault. (As in I explicitly loaded a kernel extension that caused the crash. Both times.)

    Three or four of my friends have been using Leopard since it came out and have had no crashes at all.

    My whole family's been on Leopard since it came out and has also had no crashes at all.

    Clearly, LEOPARD HATES YOU!

    -:sigma.SB

    --
    WARN
    THERE IS ANOTHER SYSTEM
  2. Is this idiot for real? by atari2600 · · Score: 5, Informative

    I was amused and delighted by the article (given my dislike for fanbois and Mac fanbois in general) but i stopped at the following part in the article:

    XP Pro pre-SP1 crashed all the time, and Microsoft owned up to it--mostly. XP Pro post-SP2 crashed once in a while, and we sighed and kept working while Microsoft looked embarrassed and yelled at someone to work faster on SP3

    Now (at work) i have 4 Linux boxes, 1 Solaris workstation and a windows XP machine that i no longer use actively (keep it around for compatibility tests). However i've used XP since it came out in 2000. It didn't crash always pre-SP1, it didn't crash frequently post XP-SP1 and after XP SP2, i've had the box be up for 180 days before i had to power it down for a memory upgrade and then the box was up for 328 days before i moved offices. I am all for Vista bashing - i am all for Mac bashing and once in a while Linux as a desktop smacking but that section above there makes him lose all credibility.

    All i can tell him is L2UseAComputer, tard. Mod me down but you know there's truth in this post.

  3. Re:What will be interesting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    is whether Apple will fix most of the issues with 10.5.1 and how long it will be until that's released as compared to Vista, and how long it will take MS to "fix" it. http://www.apple.com/support/downloads/macosx1051update.html
  4. Re:Obvious by McFadden · · Score: 5, Informative

    Vista release: Jan. 30, 2007. Vista SP1 release date: ... uh, you can get the beta.
    Leopard (10.5) release: Oct. 26, 2007. Leopard 10.5.1 release date: Nov. 15, 2007.
    but don't compare Apples to ... well, whatever.
    Well at least you're own advice and not comparing apples to whatever...

    Apple incremental 10.5.x updates aren't even in the same ballpark as Microsoft service packs. 10.5.1 is more easily compared to Windows update or patch Tuesday when Microsoft roll out a bunch of changes. And as someone who uses Vista and Leopard (dual boot Mac Pro) I can assure you the Vista updates have been coming just as thick and fast. I have no allegiance to Bill or Steve, and I'm a reasonably satisfied customer of both their products (Vista isn't nearly bad as most people who've never even used it would have you believe), but if you want to mindlessly bash Microsoft, at least make sure you're not basing your argument on a complete fallacy.
  5. Re:Another Perspective by Alexx+K · · Score: 5, Informative

    Well, so did Microsoft. The thing is, to a blind person, it's not all about the sound of the voice.

    These so-called naturall-sounding voices, well, they dont' sound natural to me. They are filled with digital artifacts, and the inflection is all wrong.

    But the biggest disadvantage of these voices is that they break down at high speeds. The more robotic voices, although they don't at all have human intonations, have superior pronounciation, understandability, and I can understand them as high as 400 WPM. You can't do that with the human-sounding voices, if they will even let you go that high (Most have a low speed threshold).

    --
    Don't mind the extra X. Alex
  6. Re:Clearly you're mistaken by Zaurus · · Score: 5, Informative

    - X is hosed. They moved from XFree86 to Xorg. Big change. The x11-users@lists.apple.com has been super-active, though, with Ben Byer from Apple putting out tons of fixes. Most stuff works now or has a workaround. You can get the latest update here: http://www.x.org/wiki/XDarwin
  7. Re:What will be interesting by DECS · · Score: 5, Informative

    Wrong: Windows XP got two free updates Microsoft calls Service Packs. Over the past half decade, the company worked hard to deliver a major consumer update to Windows, but was unable to do so as planned in 2003. It then failed again in 2004, 2005, and 2006. It officially shipped Vista in January as Windows 6.0 for $200-500.

    Apple delivered reference updates to Mac OS X in 2002, 2003, and 2005, along with a transition to Intel processors in 2006 and a port to ARM for the iPhone in 2007 and a new reference release as Leopard for Macs. That's four paid releases, which adds up to less the cost of Vista Ultimate and a de-malware checkup. In between, Apple has released over 35 free minor updates that fix issues and add significant new features (such as IP over Firewire, or file system journaling).

    Ten Myths of Leopard: 2 It's Only a Service Pack!
    Ten Myths of Leopard: 10 Leopard is a Vista Knockoff!

    Vista is the most expensive consumer OS ever, but offers very little to PC users. Leopard, like every OS ever released, has issues. Tiger had issues, and new Macs running Tiger have issues. There will never be a perfect OS, and if there were, third party apps would have issues for it. But Leopard is a solid upgrade over Tiger, and fixes issues in Tiger.

    The fact that Oliver Rist--a complete Microsoft shill who has minimal experience in small business selling Windows software, yet writes a column on "Windows in the Enterprise" for InfoWorld--has written a "Leopard has Vista-like problems that ever Vista doesn't have!!" should be of no surprise. The Windows Enthusiasts have all been trying to associate all of Microsoft's problems upon Apple lately.

    Rist's last flamebait was an article titled "Does OS X Suck!!!?!?" where he tried to suggest the idea that Mac OS X is just FreeBSD with some custom icons painted by Apple, talked about "Apple jihaders," and tied in the hard drive failure of his MacBook as a problem with Mac OS X Tiger. Now suddenly he views Tiger as rock solid, and Leopard as something that suffers regular kernel panics? Rist even won a Zoon Award for his rant.

    The August 2007 Zoon Awards for Technical Ignorance and Incompetence

    Leopard, like Vista, is unlikely to suffer from kernel failure unless bad hardware in involved, or problematic kernel drivers have been installed. The problems with Vista are largely related to an inefficient, version 1.0 graphics compositing engine that assumes the presence of a high power GPU; a new driver model that fails to support a lot of common hardware; a flashy new interface that sacrifices usability to look interesting; and the lack of many practical new features.

    Leopard doesn't have any of those problems (aside from some that don't like the look of the Dock, which is easy to change). Leopard has some minor issues with some apps and some new kinks to work out, problems that Vista also shares. Leopard has a mature graphics compositing engine that has been refined over the last 7 years and can scale down to work on less than stellar hardware; a largely unchanged driver model; and lots of new practical features, from visual backups to virtual desktops to UI refinements, file viewers, et cetera.

    Ten Myths of Leopard: 1 Graphics Must Be Slow!
    Ten Myths of Leopard: 8 No Hidden New Features!

    It is unlikely that Rist has any real understanding of what Leopard even is.

  8. Re:Clearly you're mistaken by Silas+is+back · · Score: 5, Informative

    I act as a moderator of a big german mac-board, and I've not heard of one single Leopard-user switching back to Tiger. In fact, most of the Leo-crashing-problems stem from people using older versions of "hack-the-OS" - apps like application enhancer (APE).

    Leopard is stable for the majority of all its users.

    --
    this sig is useless