Microsoft to Spy on Employees

4T writes "Forget about monitoring your computers with spyware, now they're going to monitor the users as well! 'Microsoft is developing Big Brother-style software capable of remotely monitoring a worker's productivity, physical wellbeing and competence. The Times has seen a patent application filed by the company for a computer system that links workers to their computers via wireless sensors that measure their metabolism. The system would allow managers to monitor employees' performance by measuring their heart rate, body temperature, movement, facial expression and blood pressure. Unions said they fear that employees could be dismissed on the basis of a computer's assessment of their physiological state.'"

Comments

Wait a second

[kellyb9]

Wait a second here... so this is being developed by Microsoft employees... FOR microsoft employees???? It's a wonder anybody still has any desire to work there.

Re:Wait a second

[faloi]

Don't get your hopes up. The title is sort of misleading. It's being developed by Microsoft employees for everybody. You can bet that it would likely sell.

But I like to believe that we might yet hold on to some Constitutional rights that would really put a damper on this thing.

Re:Wait a second

[ajs]

Why does no one stop to think about these things?

So, a patent was filed for a system that could be used to assess the physiological state of employees in order to measure performance. Right. So, who would be the target audience? Financial firms? I don't think so. On the other hand, deep sea divers would benefit from such measures. These are people who get paid an astronomical amount of money to do incredibly dangerous work. If their jobs could be made slightly safer, it would be a huge win, and well worth a large expense.

What about professional athletes? Is player number 73 about to collapse from the strain? Is he too hung over to play? Pay someone six or seven figures for their physical performance and you care about that sort of thing.

Everyone instead leaps to, "my manager is going to be putting my heartrate on my review!"

Sigh.

Re:Wait a second

[Shakrai]

But I like to believe that we might yet hold on to some Constitutional rights that would really put a damper on this thing.

Don't get your hopes up. They'll use the same argument they used for workplace drug testing, i.e: If you don't like it, go work somewhere else.

If they can demand my urine and credit score, why not my heart rate?

Re:Wait a second

[gsn]

RTFA

Technology allowing constant monitoring of workers was previously limited to pilots, firefighters and Nasa astronauts. This is believed to be the first time a company has proposed developing such software for mainstream workplaces (emphasis mine). Of course people are going to overreact and rightly so - it is a privacy nightmare. I don't think it will ever actually be implemented but that never stops a company from patenting something does it.

Re:Wait a second

[Otter]

Maybe you should RTFA? They aren't aiming this at sports figures and deep sea divers.

This is a patent application. (I love how the Times acts like it's some secret document they've obtained!) No patent attorney in his right mind drafts an application that says "This would be useful for X and Y, but we're sure not claiming any applicability to A, B and C!"

Anyway, let's wait five years and see whether Microsoft workers are, in fact, hooked up to heart monitors. You can bet on the evil of M$$$$, I'll bet on journalistic shoddiness from CmdrTaco, and we'll find out.

The idea of monitoring user frustration via keystrokes and responding accordingly, BTW, has been discussed here for years, and it's a great idea if it could be made to work correctly.

re: wait a second

[ed.han]

you're seeing that reaction b/c quite simply, those are all endeavors in which a given person's health and psych state are all monitored quite carefully. considering that employers routinely run a credit check on prospective employees and the fact that all AUPs that i've ever seen say right up front that an employee has no expectation of privacy, i don't think that the reaction is unjustified in the least.

maybe you're right. maybe it's just the usual anti-M$ slashdot reaction + pro-privacy sentiment that are fueling this reaction.

but don't dismiss it out of hand, b/c while it's possible it's innocuous in the way that you say, there's certainly no guarantee of it.

we all know about AUPs. i wanna see an AEPP (acceptable employee privacy policy).

ed

Re:Wait a second

[Shakrai]

The idea of monitoring user frustration via keystrokes and responding accordingly, BTW, has been discussed here for years, and it's a great idea if it could be made to work correctly.

Yes, because the random drug testing, use of credit reports, and monitoring of activities outside of the workplace isn't enough. My boss should get an automated message if some line of code deems that I'm "frustrated" because my keystroke pattern changes.

Re:Wait a second

[Shakrai]

And what's wrong with this?

Because they threaten you into compliance by threatening your livelihood and not everybody has the option of switching jobs?

Hell, short of threats of physical violence, I'm hard pressed to think of a nastier thing to do to someone then threaten their livelihood.

Re:Wait a second

[AeroIllini]

Urine and credit score can be argued to be relevant to employment. It's hard to see how a level of monitoring this invasive could slip by in a non-secure industry, or one that doesn't depend on operator health for safety. Actually, I would argue that it's the other way around.

What I do in my spare time outside the office has absolutely no bearing on my job until it effects the productivity of work. Drug tests are an indirect measure of productivity, using the assumption that "drugs == bad worker". I disagree with that logic, and think that drug tests should only be administered if the worker's performance is clearly impacted. If there's no performance impact, then what the hell does the company care what I do outside work? (I know that's not the attitude many companies have, but it's the attitude I have.)

A credit score is a little more of a stretch, but using the logic "bad credit == deadbeat", it could be a stand-in for proper hiring practices.

However, this software will eliminate both of those indirect methods of measuring productivity because it will be able to directly measure it. And productivity, after all, is what the company ultimately cares about.

I don't agree with using this technology, but that's the rationale companies will use.

Re:Wait a second

[sm62704]

But I like to believe that we might yet hold on to some Constitutional rights that would really put a damper on this thing

That's fine if you work for the government, but the Constitution doesn't apply to corporations. The Constitution sets up the method of government and bestows powers and obligations to government.

The first amendment, for example, says you have freedom of religion. It doesn't say that your employer can't restrict prayer in the workplace.

Re:Wait a second

[Shakrai]

Actualy some companies do install devices that record speed/etc on work cars

All the power to them. But they don't have the right to install such a device on my car. That's the argument I was making. The people that claim "drugs are illegal" as justification for workplace drug testing should consider that speeding is also illegal (hell, in my state a speeding ticket will probably cost you more then a pot possession charge) and if you can justify drug testing then why not installing GPS into employees personal vehicles?

i would quit such a job right away and find a sane place to work at

And if the economy is in the dumps and you can't? That's why I don't buy into "go work somewhere else" as a response. It's just not fair to go after someones livelihood to accomplish what the Government couldn't otherwise do.

Filing a patent doesn't mean a lot these days..

[ironwill96]

I think Microsoft probably has hundreds of patents for things they don't ever intend to actually make, but just in case someone else does they want to be there to make a buck off of licensing. I highly doubt that they actually think this type of software would currently be accepted in today's climate, at least not unless they call it something innovative like "The USA Health-watch Patriot Software". I've found that its important to include the word "Patriot" in all aspects of your life, it really just gets you instant approval to do whatever you want!

Well, i'm off to use my iPatriot computer and drive my Patriot Chevy to the Patriot Meeting this afternoon. Come to think of it, thats probably why New England is winning so much, everyone else just needs to put Patriot in their team name!

Employment lawsuits?

[The Chemical Crow]

If Microsoft (or any other company employing this software) were to fire somebody based only on the data from this software they would be fools of the highest order. The data would be, I would hope, supplementary data to back up more traditional firing criteria - poor reviews, documented reprimands, etc.

BTW, one thing that stood out to me in TFA was:

"The system could also "automatically detect frustration or stress in the user" and "offer and provide assistance accordingly".

Forgive my cynicism, but this seems a bit ... naive.

Taylorism all over again

[irexe]

....as a civillization, didn't we already pass this point more than a century ago?

Re:1984

[Chrisq]

If I hadn't read a book I wouldn't comment on it. Cut and paste reviews are so obvious.

Response from Google and Open Source community

[140Mandak262Jamuna]

Google announced that it is developing a monitoring program that is fully web based that runs on all platforms and claims this patent does not cover the web application. Open Source community cites numerous prior art to argue the patent will be null and void. The cited prior arts are:

1. Dr Chaplin, Charles, Modern Times, 1932. 2. Mr Orwell, George, 1984, 1948.

The difference between Google and Microsoft

[clckwrk]

Google employees build things like gmail and calendar during the 20% time, MS employee decide to build an employee monitoring system. Talk about having to eat your own dog food. These employees are like the kid that always reminded your teacher on Friday to assign homework.

employment != ownership

[Original Replica]

This is s sign that both employers and employees have bought into the hierarchal structure of business a little too much. The employer is hiring you to do a task not purchasing your mind, body, and soul. Yet all to often that's what they are given, so all too often that's what they expect. i.e. How often is a boss who is a complete dick called "sir" or "Mr." and treated with deference? Are Unions the only people left who really understand and act on the fact that the bossman needs the employees more than the employees need him? Yes, "employees" is plural on purpose.
My employer is quite right to monitor and judge the output and quality of my work, and when applicable to monitor how I effect the public image of the company and the work environment for my fellow employees. None of that includes my heart rate or my general state of health. I'm already being forced to contend with a nanny government, I don't need a nanny work environment as well.

Re:I wonder what the employers will think

[aadvancedGIR]

You're too optimistic. No matter how hard you set the threshold, you'll always find people willing to ruin their health just to keep a shitty job. Plus, bad product is always caused by bad employees, never by bad management.

From experience, I'd say the only employee feedback that the HR directors understand well is waiting for them in the parking lot with a mask and a baseball bat, preferably with dozen of coworkers so you benefit from the emulation.

I'd love to see the correlation...

[NotQuiteReal]

Sure, physical attributes like heart rate, blood pressure, etc. might be a good indicator of physical "productivity", but I'd sure like to know how or if it correlates to the overall productivity of someone creating intellectual property.

I am sure you can match biometric data to how many widgets are produced, or even if your driver is likely to be alert (e.g. performing at a higher safety level.) But how can you tell if they are writing good, persuasive prose for that proposal, or cranking out good code or buggy crap that is ultimately negative productivity?

Collect all the data you want, just don't act on that data alone. You will probably find that different people are productive in different ways. One guy might produce 1/5 of his weekly product each day of the week and another might screw around reading Slashdot and watching YouTube, then produce an equal amount of work coding all night a couple of days a week.

I think the utility of such monitoring will depend on the task at hand more than finding "perfectly productive" workers.

No one offers assistance like microsoft

[blanks]

"The system could also "automatically detect frustration or stress in the user" and "offer and provide assistance accordingly"."

I can't believe they actually added that to the patent filing. Just what every coder wants. Every few minutes some big brother style paper clip poping up on the screen asking them if they need assistance.... Or maybe a few streches.

Re:No one offers assistance like microsoft

[Skreems]

Well, the key is, this isn't intended for use in a work environment. It's something the research branch came up with to help streamline product research and focus groups, matching up people who are having difficulty with the same aspect of a test program, or identifying frustration early so they can ask about the cause and help the user move on instead of becoming increasingly angry. Everyone here trying to apply it to a regular 9 to 5 job setting is obviously going to get the wrong idea.