New Science Standards Approved in Florida

anonymous_echidna writes "Florida has voted to accept the new K-12 science curriculum standards amidst a storm of controversy around the teaching of evolution, which had up until now been the scientific concept that dare not speak its name. There was a compromise made at the last minute, which was to call evolution a 'scientific theory', rather than a fact. While some lament that the change displays the woeful ignorance of science and scientific terminology, the good news is that the new curriculum emphasizes teaching the meaning of scientific terms and the scientific method in earlier grades."

Comments

Jesus Fucking Christ

[Protonk]

I'm moving to another country where crazy isn't an approved religion.

Re:Jesus Fucking Christ

[flyingsquid]

For a biting critique of Florida's new standards, and a defense of craziness, see "Our Reputation for Flakiness is at Stake" by Carl Hiaasen [ http://www.miamiherald.com/news/columnists/carl_hiaasen/story/421075.html].

Re:Jesus Fucking Christ

[KublaiKhan]

It's not really a question of religion, if you think about it--it's more a question of politics.

It just happens that the politics involved are largely being used within the framework of religion in order to maintain a certain population within a given power structure, and to resist attempts to overturn said power structure from the outside.

Re:Jesus Fucking Christ

[Anonymous Coward]

Finally, individual teachers have a lot of leeway in what they teach; science teachers will teach evolution with the certainty that they feel it's due, no matter what guidelines have been set down. Not if they want to keep their jobs they won't. With school boards and school administrators unsympathetic to the teaching of evolution, while the teaching of evolution is not banned, parent complaints will give them a reason to find some other convenient excuse to fire the teacher. For example, a Texas science director was canned because of her pro-evolution stance. The official reason: insubordination because she used her work email to forward a federal court judgment on evolution to friends and some online communites. Every teacher has done something similar and having a pro-evolution viewpoint will give the school administrators an excuse to find anything incriminating.

Re:Jesus Fucking Christ

[trongey]

RE: Title of parent post.
I don't think he could do that, even with miraculous powers. I know, the whole one-in-three business makes it kind of confusing, but I still just don't think it could be done.

Re:Jesus Fucking Christ

[Gordonjcp]

If they're going to teach the theory of evolution, they should they should at least teach that it's more than a theory!

Evolution *is* a theory. Perhaps they should also teach what "theory" means.

Re:Jesus Fucking Christ

[mhall119]

Evolution *is* a theory. Perhaps they should also teach what "theory" means. There is a theory of Evolution just like there is a theory of Gravity, each explaining the factual phenomena for which they are named.

Re:Jesus Fucking Christ

[smooth wombat]

but without being able to see the process in nature, it is difficult to justify calling it scientific fact.

Yeah, because without all those fossils showing us the evolution of a horse or human, there would be no way to show the evolutionary process in action. And let's not forget the different shapes of the beaks of the birds that Darwin studied. Those certainly don't show any kind of evolutionary action.

Why do people keep insisting that Evolution, the act itself, isn't a fact? If there were no fact, then there wouldn't be a theory. The only reason theories come about is because of a fact.

Re:Jesus Fucking Christ

[DrLang21]

The only reason theories come about is because of a fact. You mean like string theory?

Re:Jesus Fucking Christ

[Matt Edd]

You mean no one saw this or this or this or this or this

or this paper that shows "allopatric speciation by reproductive isolation in Drosophila pseudoobscura fruit flies after only eight generations" [Dodd, D.M.B. (1989) "Reproductive isolation as a consequence of adaptive divergence in Drosophila pseudoobscura." Evolution 43:1308-1311.]

or a similar paper using other fruit flys [Kirkpatrick, M. and V. Ravigné (2002) "Speciation by Natural and Sexual Selection: Models and Experiments" The American Naturalist 159:S22-S35 DOI]

or any of the genetic evidence for speciation?

Re:Jesus Fucking Christ

[Zerth]

Erm, except there are fish that have both gills and lungs. Lungs are a gas permeable extension of the gut that developed independantly of gills. In some cases, the animals found the shallows to be preferable and those with superior gas transfer developed lungs. In those animals that didn't, the organ developed into the gas bladder, allowing them to absorb gas into and excrete gas from the blood stream to control density.

Pick a harder one, like why the human retina is such a lousy design and that of the octopus is so much better.

The news media is a major part of the problem

[Steeltalon]

There have been too many occasions where the news media has persisted in "dumbing down" the terminology that they use. I even remember watching a "Faith and Values" show on CNN last year where John Edwards (the candidate, not the psychic) was asked his thoughts on Evolution which, in the words of Soledad O'brien, was the belief that man evolved from apes.

We need the news media to take the lead in helping people understand what a theory is vs. a hypothesis. How fact and theory are not opposites. The fact that a "law" is not the opposite of a theory. Too many people are getting away with murder in these debates because the termnology isn't clearly understood and the news media doesn't care to straighten it out.

Re:The news media is a major part of the problem

[Mr. Slippery]

You would never say that unless you wanted to get the "I didn't come from no monkey!" camp riled up, or you were an uneducated buffoon.

Or you were tossing a softball.

"Why, yes, O'Brien, according to our best evidence we did descend from apes - mor precisely, we and modern apes descended from a common, ape-like ancestor. And I'm proud of how far our species has developed, how far up from the muck we've come, how far towards grace we've climbed; and I hope that our umptity-great grandchildren will be as far above us as we are above the Australopithecines. My opponent the Biblical literalist, on the other hand, seems to hold that we're all the fallen result of incestuous inbreeding from a single original pair of idiots dumb enough to be fooled by a talking snake. I've got to say I find the scientific account not only more rational, but orders of magnitude more inspiring."

That's fair

[anotherone]

That's fair, because evolution IS a scientific theory. So is Gravity. Hopefully they'll also teach the kids what it means to be a theory, and that "theory" doesn't mean "wild-ass-guess".

Re:That's fair

[Ed Avis]

Things falling to the ground is a fact; one explanation for it is Newton's theory of gravitation, also called gravity.

woo hoo!

[urcreepyneighbor]

The more dumbasses in the world, the smarter I seem! woo hoo!

Fear me, for I have studied the dark science of natural selection!

Re:woo hoo!

[RingDev]

It's that exact logic that got me a girl friend with small hands.

My junk looks HUGE!

-Rick

Re:woo hoo!

[MightyYar]

Just make sure you get her back to day care before her mommy comes to pick her up.

Christianity

[kryliss]

Don't remember where I found this one but it seems to fit in with this thread.

Christianity

The belief that some cosmic, Jewish zombie can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him that you accept him as your master so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree.
Makes perfect sense.

Re:Man, ALL religion is crazy...

[ericrost]

I have to shout BS.

The equivalency of validity between scientific theory (based on evidence, tested by observation, and refined to match the observe phenomenon) and belief (backed up by nothing more than "I said so") has gone too far in this world. I make the stand, not out of arrogance, but out of outrage. Belief != Search for Truth. Belief != Truth. Belief != Philosophical Introspection. Belief != Model of the Universe.

Unless you have EVIDENCE to offer for your claims, I say shove them. Even a well reasoned argument will suffice. But if your theory requires acoutremant like an omniscient daddy sitting in the sky tossing death rays down at us to make it work with no particular need for him given the observed phenomenon, then it is quite frankly invalid. Now, you can preach to those mistaken fools who are silly enough to swallow your garbage, but quit equating what you do to science and philosophy.