Electronic Transaction Reporting Slipped Into Senate Bill
StealthyRoid writes "The Senate mortgage bill proposed by Sen. Chris Dodd (who was the recipient of a sweetheart deal on his mortgage from Countrywide, one of the beneficiaries of the bill) includes an attempt to sneak into law a requirement that all electronic payment processors send detailed transaction data to the federal government. The proposed law contains an exception for businesses with fewer than 200 transactions or a total value less than $10,000. Quoting FreedomWorks chairman Dick Armey (former House majority leader) from the article: 'This is a provision with astonishing reach, and it was slipped into the bill just this week. Not only does it affect nearly every credit card transaction in America, such as Visa, MasterCard, Discover, and American Express, but the bill specifically targets payment systems like eBay's PayPal, Amazon, and Google Checkout that are used by many small online businesses. The privacy implications for America's small businesses are breathtaking.'" This is the same bill that contains a controversial provision to fingerprint all mortgage brokers.
There is no danger if you have nothing to hide obviously.
But just to be safe, might want to hold out on that "McCain is evil" book purchase. Just in case, you know?
Note to moderators: this entire post, barring this line, is sarcastic.
If he explores all forms and substances Straight homeward to their symbol-essences; He shall not die.
yes what we need more govt intrusion into our daily lives sure they won't monitor transactions unless they're over $10000 for 200. but how will they cull this out after the fact? Someday we'll enjoy the freedom and privacy the Soviet Union use to have.
... to tax you with, my dear.
There is a war going on for your mind.
The White House is planning on vetoing it.
The summary says that the minimum reporting is under $10K (USD) or under 200 transactions, but the article shows an and.
Aside from that nitpick, how is this supposed to "raise $9.802 billion over ten years"?
I keep hearing this "sweetheart deal" thing about Chris Dodd. You know what the actual deal is? A 30 year AR mortgage intro'd at 4.5%. All that means is the man had good credit and timed his purchase well. It's not like that is out of the range for mortgage rates. When I first heard it, I was thinking a no interest mortgage or something like that. Instead, he's paying almost 5%, like the rest of us.
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Crudely Drawn Games
presumably to avoid tax fraud. if you are sat at home apparently out of work and claiming state benefits, but in practice have a major ebay store that brings in $80,000 a year, then the federal government would like to
1) tax you
and
2) stop paying you benefits.
How is this not fair? Like many companies, I do most of my business on-line, and have no noticeable bricks and mortar premises. If it wasn't for banks reporting to the govt what I earned, I could pretend to be earning nothing, and pay not a penny in a tax.
Am I missing something here? People really expect the govt to not be interested in small online businesses and taxing them?
DRM-free indie games for the PC and Mac: Positech Games
more reported income, so more taxes paid?
Bring back the old version of slashdot.
The real Chris Dodd is a Democrat, but in this case his body has obviously been taken over by those havoc-wreaking Republicans! Invasion of privacy means nothing to them! To think that they have stooped to such base levels of taking over a Democrat's body just to serve their cause!
It is best not to refer to him as a Democrat until it is proved that it is the real Chris Dodd. In fact for the time being it would probably be best to say "A man who claims to be Chris Dodd..."
Now, if it turns out that it is the real Chris Dodd, then of course we have full confidence that his motives are to further, in the best way possible, the social and environmental causes that are vital to this country's continued existence!
You are missing the benefits of running a cash based brick and mortar business...
Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
I'm not American, but I have always been surprised about these riders... Why on earth are riders legal? A bill about picking daisies can have a rider about nuclear weapons... there's no connection, they can be introduced any time, and they always seem to be used to sneak in unfavorable laws... Why are they allowed?
Look kids, it's been a fun free ride and all, but if you think the government isn't gonna tax transactions once it figures out HOW to get at those transactions, well, ha ha ha. Sure. Okay.
They take the money you earn while working for a living and use it for corporate welfare and bailing out rich bastards who gamble and lose, so how long do you think they're gonna watch billions of dollars bouncing around the Interwebz before figuring out a way to dip their collective hand in there too?
As for the "freedom watch" website from TFA - you may wanna check out the rest of the site before you send any large donations.
Efforts to regulate carbon dioxide are an attempt by the global Left to gain control of the U.S. economy. lolwut?That which does not kill us makes us... st
A congressional bill, as it evolves and eventually maybe becomes law, is a living document. In every sphere of the real world where multiple authors work collaboratively on a same document, we use content management systems, that allow versioning, attribution, and history. It makes changes to a document transparent. Businesses use it, non-profits use it. Why not demand our Congress to use it and stop this monkey business of "was slipped into the bill"? Sounds like conversation you'd here in the playground, for gods' sake..
As usual, the summary is pretty wrong. The "detailed transaction data" of the summary consists of "the annual gross amount of reportable transactions" according to the Senate Bill Summary as quoted in the article - the only information which is less detailed is no information whatsoever. So on the face of it this isn't the intrusion that it's being made out to be.
From TFA:
"Payment settlement entities [...] will be required to report the annual gross amount of reportable transactions to the IRS..."
Although I'm a long-time libertarian, I have to say that if they're collecting ONLY an annual gross dollar figure, and not the details of individual transactions, it probably would help them collect taxes and it would probably be a sensible thing to do in the context of existing laws. Income taxes are stupid in principle, but I can't think of a good reason to apply them only to money that's harder to conceal.
It is a concern that this "gimme a ballpark figure" will eventually become "gimme your customer list" but we can burn that bridge when we come to it...
811.29.3.2
Is it just me, or does this just scream "I want to kill this bill by tacking on all sorts of unrelated things that are completely irrelevant so no one will vote for it, because everyone will hate something about it".
Posting with out proof reading since 2001.
According to countrywide he got .5 off his rate because he was a US Senator. He knowingly accepted the VIP designation then tried to claim he thought it meant nothing? He serves and has served on various boards which have some power over this industry? Perhaps his party affiliation is saving him. I bet it is.
Read up on it, http://www.portfolio.com/news-markets/top-5/2008/06/12/Countrywide-Loan-Scandal
By lowering his rate they effectively handed him $60,000. In other words, Congressmen don't play by our rules. Their ability to regulate the industry means they intimidate without having to lift a finger. Considering his role in this bill and the fact he takes money from Countrywide for his reelection makes the whole thing stink.
and people wonder why crap like this little transaction law slips in. These guys are always slipping stuff in and out trying to avoid our knowledge of what they really do.
Dodd is a crook. He is a liar. He was simply caught and now is trying hide from it.
* Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
Not to say it's never happened before. Terrorists, pedophiles, drug abusers... they all welcome tax evaders as the new bogeyman by which the government can shoehorn new bad laws onto the books with overreaching influence.
So am I for tax-dodgers? No: the people not paying taxes on their ebay stores are ALREADY breaking the law and can ALREADY be successfully prosecuted for it. Financial records can be obtained by subpoena and the proper procedure within the justice system. This bill would force all handlers of electronic payment to account and disclose information at THEIR expense (read: our expense because profit margins sure as hell aren't going to take the hit from government compliance costs). Now justice and investigation doesn't need a warrant or a court order because private companies are now compelled to broadcast this data.
More Twoson than Cupertino
Well, sure. The government would like to know about your every activity, from breathing, eating, voiding, spending, reading, listening, talking, pretty much everything. The better to tax you, regulate you, imprison you, coerce you.
That doesn't mean we should willing give up that right, nor does it say in the supreme law of the land where the government has been given that power.
Better to let 1 million people cheat on their taxes than 250 million give up every last vestige of privacy.
You were mistaken. Which is odd, since memory shouldn't be a problem for you
I do commercial tax prep for an unnamed company, and this is spot on. In 2004, the IRS testified before congress about where they thought the most major tax fraud cases were. The IRS's estimates were that a specific group of Small/Home business filers (the ones using schedule C with just a normal private citizen's 1040/1040A, and not using the commercial tax form 1041 and all the quarterly reporting forms they would have to use if they had employees) were responsible for about 100 billion in tax fraud every year.
Second place was false filings for the Earned Income Credit, with about 9 billion a year projected loss.
Congress directed the IRS to focus on the second case first. Some of us saw that cynically - I've heard several fellow tax pros describe it as a Republican dominated congress and executive branch, focusing on the group that doesn't vote or votes Democrat, rather than a larger group that tends to vote and contribute republican. Congress adopted a new set of tax rules that included the "Uniform Definition of a Child (UDC)" rules and told the IRS to go to town.
Other people, perhaps more charitably, noted that going after the smaller group also tended to catch a lot of dead-beat dads, and was much, much easier to implement. Over the last three years, congress and the tax courts clarified the rules on a lot of business related deductions such as de minimus employee benefits, and cleaned up the tax code re. small business filers. Some significant cases made it through the tax courts during this interval, and my own estimate is the IRS is in a much better position to go after their #1 on their top ten list than they were, and maybe it will start happening. Whether there's a connection to which party is in power is at least debatable.
Who is John Cabal?
To be fair to Dodd, _anyone_ could get a sweet deal from Countrywide... that's why they're in so much trouble.
Please... as bad as this sounds, but could we PLEASE stop making laws? Every week I feel like there's 1 more thing I can't do, and 1 more thing that I don't want to do but have to.
Could we please just stop making laws? I'm happy with my already limited lifestyle. I'm tired of having to keep up with the list of new obscure laws. We have no more need for lawmakers, everything that we needed for laws has been pretty well ironed out long ago, and any gray areas that have been solved through courts have been good enough.
Why is it that I can list more bad laws than good laws?
Disclaimer: I am not god.
We may not be created equal
But we can be treated equal.
The mainstream "DID CLINTON GET A SLOPPY BLOWJOB????" media, *favoring* democrats? The mainstream "Let's only mention Bush's failings in passing and never his party" media?
There's a reason Republicans (much like yourself, I suspect) blame the "liberal media bias"; reality has a very well-known liberal bias towards not tolerating disgusting slimeballs.
The reason you don't see as many democrats scandals on tv is there aren't as many freaking pedophiles, perverts and corrupted assholes in the Democratic party.
As a little interesting homework, try and make a list of recent indicted Democrats. Then indicted Republicans. Compare. Ponder the "influence of the media on the judges" or whatever apologist bullshit you want to blame THAT on.
I never spellcheck and I freely admit it. Save your karma for more worthwhile "lol erorrs" replies
Fair enough.
How about CNN and William Jefferson
Or, even better, ABC News' slide show on POLITICAL SCANDALS?
Summation on the ABC Slide show from NewsBusters:
Then there is the case of Detroit Mayor Kwame Kilpatrick (D). The Today Interview completely IGNORED his political affiliation.
Heck, just go to Newsbusters.org, hit the search feature and put in "Republican, Scandal" or "Democrat, Scandal" You will find HUNDREDS of articles and links to media outlets that back me up.
I'm not trying to claim that either Republicans or Democrats are more corrupt, they both are to varying degrees. The point is though, when you have a National Media ACTIVELY covering up for ONE side, it unevenly loads the presentation of the parties and ultimately, skews elections.
Personally, I think that the template for presenting politicians in ANY news story in ANY media outlet should automatically be [title] [name, first, last] [political party affiliation]. Just automatically, without regard to anything else. Not that I expect it will ever happen. That would be too honest.
Official Heretic from the "Church of Global Warming". Proven right thanks to whistle blowers. AGW = Flat Earth Theory