Slashdot Mirror
AVG Backs Down From Flooding the Internet
Simon Wright writes "As a website that is featured heavily in many Google Australia search results, Whirlpool (Australia's largest technology forum) has been particularly affected by AVG's LinkScanner. We've seen a traffic increase as much as 12 hits per second from these bots. So we've actively and loudly campaigned against this move by AVG, encouraging all users of AVG 8.0 to uninstall the product. The discussion starts here. And AVG's backing down is posted here."
From that URL:"'As promised, I am letting you know that the latest update for AVG Free edition has addressed and rectified the issue that [Whirlpool] have brought to our attention. This update has now been released to users and has also been built into the latest installation package for AVG Free.' — Peter Cameron, Managing Director, AVG Australia."
I was looking at alternatives to AVG because of this. Good to know I don't have to keep looking.
I fail to see what Grisoft ever thought LinkScanner would acheive above the scanners that are becoming common in competing products that simply intercept http and pop3 traffic as it comes over the network. To me it seemed unnecessary to actually fetch every single search result. It also would obviously interfere with web analytics, and is potentially a security risk to people using AVG, not in terms of desktop security, but in terms of your real-life personal security. For example, I recall a recent article where the FBI had arrested people merely for clicking links to a porn site they had set up. Are you really safe from such operations and the general tendency of Government agencies to monitor activity these days when your computer is in effect programmed to click links for you?
I don't see information at the links in the summary of what changes were actually made to AVG now. Does anyone have details?
The site complains to AVG that its load has increased, so in response in gets a /.ing. Nice!
Anyway, the statement that "We've seen a traffic increase as much as 12 hits per second" is meaningless without knowing the overall traffic levels - for example, is +12/sec an increase of 100%, or an increase of 1%?. It's referred to as a "significant drain" on resources, but quoting one number without the other is pointless.
See: http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1007329&p=13#r256
The fix has been independently tested.
Cheers WTW
I dunno, I use Avast, it's pretty good and free as well. I like the UI a bit better and it seems to get definition updates pretty frequently. Much less of a resource hog than Norton/McAfee too, although so is AVG.
All your base are belong to Wii.
I second your question. I used AVG Free for a long time and uninstalled it very quickly when I heard the news. But I'm having choosing a replacement cost-free anti-virus program for Windows. Here's are the factors I've been considering...
AVG Free Pro: seems pretty effective and runs inobtrusively (at least locally). Con: has DDoS'd websites in the past and perhaps still shouldn't be trusted.
Avira Pro: no track record of DDoS'ing websites. Con: obnoxious pop-ups "reminding" me about the premium version; apparently got some poor reviews for infection treatment.
Avast Pro: no track record of DDoS'ing websites. Con: requires manual re-registration.
I'm using Avira now but I'm considering switching again because of the pop-ups. Any advice? (And yes, I already run Linux but still need Windows for some things, and no, I'm not interested in paying for anti-virus software, since 99% of virus protection is common sense.)
Here is a secret for you: You do not need AV software.
/. cannot also manage his own security. Not that /. users are at the pinnacle of being-informed-edness, but I should think that you should be informed enough to be able to live without AV software quite easily. Bottom line: run a firewall (preferably a hardware firewall), patch often, be informed, and ditch the AV software.
Actually, let me clarify that statement. You might need AV software if you are a very uninformed user who likes to open email attachments from unknown people or download lots of useless software from questionable sources. However, if that person I described is not you, then you do not need AV software, and it is just taking system (and apparently network) resources.
The reason you don't need AV software is because there are only two ways to get virus on your computer: 1) Network-related software you use is exploited. 2) You willingly (although accidentally) run the bad software yourself. Yes, I'm simplifying things, but it is hardly any more complicated than this. Since you are an informed user, you have learned not to run bad software, so #2 doesn't apply to you; and since you patch your system regularly (right?), #1 is very unlikely.
However, there may be a tiny window between the time that an exploit is found and the patch being made available where you could potentially be vulnerable. Theoretically, AV software can 'protect' you in this scenario since virus definitions are made available sooner than patches. The solution here is, again, to be an informed user. If a piece of software you use becomes vulnerable to a new exploit, you should know about it and take the necessary precautions yourself during the time before a patch is released, in order to protect your system. This will protect you much better than any AV software will, and it's not difficult since there are not many pieces of software which could even be exploited (the main ones are your browser and other internet-related apps).
Now, I'm a user and developer of Mac OS X, Linux, BSD, and Windows. I have been running Vista for almost a year without a hitch by being an informed user. Actually, I also usually install patches long after they are available because I turned off the automatic download/install feature (I like to know what's using my internet connection), and for some reason it doesn't even notify me of the availability of patches so I often forget. Nevertheless, I've never been compromised mainly because I don't run questionable software or read unknown emails, and the security of the software (and patches) has been good enough.
In my opinion, AV software is a scam. It might be useful for grandmas and other clueless users who open email attachments indiscriminately, but I cannot see how anyone informed enough to be on
This author takes full ownership and responsibility for the unpopular opinions outlined above.
I recently gave up on AVG. It was a nice free option until this version 8. Surely, Grisoft knew this was a big problem for a long time. They're not the only people who thought this approach of extra verification would be a good idea. MCAfee did it, Opera (I think) just linked up with one of the Microsoft spawns that tests everything and drags web use to a crawl. It's as poor an idea as "background" disk defragging which does nothing other than work the drives because it's not possible to sort a drive which is in flux.
Avast! is frequently recommended as a free anti-virus. BUT...do some research and you'll see it's not that great at catching known junk. ESET does test very well but you only get 30 days of free use. Avir's free version does seem to offer full integration (in-line scanning, auto updates, etc.) which I don't remember being there a few years ago when freeware scanners only worked on-demand. http://www.free-av.com/ It tests very well, actually, better than AVG and Avast!
In their defense, if I remember correctly, AVG DID offer free fully integrated inline scanning first with a decent catch rate. Why did it take them so long to comprehend version 8 was a hog and would generate so much anger and resentment? Who knows. Maybe their time has past just line PKZip...
The and Update system in AVG 8.0 is vastly improved.
I was using Avast and and installed it for several family members only to have one of them get a HORRID spyware infection.
Interestingly AVAST did not detect it at all, Spybot and Ad-aware could not completely remove it, but after installing AVG 8.0 it cleaned everything up.
After checking several reviews it seems AVG 8.0 has one of the best Virus and Spyware detection rates among current products.
EA David Gardner -"... but the consumers have proven that actually what they want is fun."
You have a point, but I received an infected Word file from a customer just a couple years ago.
When the contract is a few million bucks, you suck it up and run AV and don't tell them how to run their business.
This is about the same amount of protection as pulling out is a form of birth control.
Are you telling me:
1. You never open links in search results to sites you have never been to?
- If you are running windows using Firefox or IE there have been many cases of 0 day exploits
2. Do you not use any USB storage devices?
- Just this Christmas I purchases a digital photo frame for a family member that had built in storage. low and behold when I went to preload it with photos it was already infected with a virus that was set to use auto play to install.
3. You 100% trust EVERY thing your friends or family send you? Document infections are still somewhat common. I suppose using Open office would get you around macro infections but you also might not be able to open company documents then.
I would also imagine that ANYONE who is on slashdot and manages security also believes in the layered approach. Inbound only filtering from your firewall and using your gut to know what is safe or not is an easy one to work around.. Well unless you are a hermit that never gets any email.
Users of Zeus Technology's ZXTM could use the following TrafficScript rule to protect themselves from AVG's DDoS attacks:
if( http.getHeader("Accept-Encoding") == "" &&
http.getHeader("Referer") == "" )
{
$ua = http.getHeader("User-Agent");
if( $ua == "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; SV1)"||
$ua == "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1;1813)"||
$ua == "User-Agent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; SV1)"||
$ua == "User-Agent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1;1813)" )
{
connection.discard();
}
}
... contains some kind of overflow bug? I guess hundreds of thousands of AVG equiped PCs will get infected instantly?
A programm that fetches each and every link it comes across *can't* be a very good idea. Certainly a feature invented by people without a security mindset?
Damnit! That's why I keep having kids.
The problem is no so much the consumer experience... (although consumers experience was changed significantly as web searching became a lot more resource intensive).
The problem is that the link scanning featured caused a great deal of traffic to sites - even sites that consumers did not visit. That's not cool.
Horns are really just a broken halo.
That's a good one, but there's also this suggestion from TFA:
. A company in the business that AVG is in should have seen this coming, what makes you think more of the same "quality" is not in the future?
No, I certainly won't be looking. There are just a handful of companies which *listen* to its customers. There fewer that listen to the users of their product which use it for free.
AVG shown that at least they do listen to their users, and are likely to rectify when they screw up. Similar to what happened with Netflix.
A bad company is not one which makes wrong choices, we all make wrong choices. But when the company is not able to acknowledge their errors and rectify, is when you should start looking for someone else to make business with.
I use AVG Free and recommend it to all the people who come to ask me for an Antivirus. The truth (in my opinion) is that such a thing should be provided with Microsoft Windows for free, after all it is the fault of their crappy Operating System that the computers get all infected.
Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
How about:
"Program Settings"->Sounds->Settings...
Then scroll to the "Automatic VPS Update" event and pick the "(None)" sound.
They weren't an optional part of the install unless you used avg_free_stf_*.exe /REMOVE_FEATURE fea_AVG_SafeSurf /REMOVE_FEATURE fea_AVG_SafeSearch
As far as I could tell even selecting custom installation in the default didn't give you an easy way to disable link scanner. Disabling it from the AVG menu didn't actually stop link scanner from loading and running in the background. It also had the side affect of putting up a warning icon and a messages that said your computer may be unsafe or some such nonsense.
In this case I think a bit of condemnation towards AVG was richly deserved and hardly a knee jerk reaction. And actually they did try to crash the internet. That's what the uproar was all about.
Because the idea itself is flawed. Normally you visit only a minuscle part of the links your browser shows you. LinkScanner follows all of those links even when you never planned to visit them.
As the owner of Whirlpool, please moderate the parent as uninformed.
While I'm not in a position to provide an unbiased opinion of WebCentral, they do cater to a very important market -- people who need a premium quality service. If my experience with the $0 service they provide Whirlpool is any indication, WebCentral are not just technically excellent, their support system is outstanding and reactive. I can only imagine how much better they treat the customers who pay them.
Just because you only want the bargain service, doesn't mean everyone does.
And the only reason Whirlpool isn't blazing fast, is because we're running with a bunch of WebCentral's spare hardware. We're a community service, not a business.
Cheers
Simon Wright
Computers are useless: they can only give you answers. -- Pablo Picasso
It could be a lot more than tenfold.
For example, the first link in Google for "wine" is for a program that lets you run windows software in other operating systems, and no 3 is the wikipedia entry about it. The rest of the links are about alcoholic drinks.
Most people outside of slashdot are going to be interested in the alcoholic drink links, but if they have AVG installed, they will be "visiting" winehq.org as well, even though they probably already have windows and the wine program will be completely useless for them.
Aside from the problem with increased traffic for webmasters to deal with, if someone had found an exploit for AVG, many systems might have been compromised without the user actively visiting the exploiting sites, making it worse in some ways than an iframe-based exploit. If all it effectively takes is for a link to appear in the page, that adds danger to what was just inconsiderate behavior.
You can never go home again... but I guess you can shop there.
Well, yes but.. (you've seen the complaints).
Other decent free ones are:
Avast is popular.
AVira seems good, you get one popup ad per update.
Comodo permits business use.
BitDefender has a free version.
I'm not including ClamAV because it's just a scanner, no realtime protection.
Posting AC because I've moderated,
number11