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Google's Knol, Expert Wiki, Goes Live

Brian Jordan and other readers sent in word that Google has taken the wraps off Knol, its expert-written challenger to Wikipedia. (We discussed Knol when it was announced last year.) Wired has an in-depth look. Knol's distinctions from Wikipedia are that authors are identified by their real names (and verified), and that they can share in ad revenue if they choose to. The service initially features a lot of medical articles, which is interesting considering that Medipedia also launched today. This medical wiki is backed by Harvard's and Stanford's medical schools.

20 of 263 comments (clear)

  1. Losing Anonymity? by snowgirl · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Part of contributing to Wikipedia is that you're anonymous... would you really want someone to know that despite being a huge football fan, you also knew about My Little Pony?

    I like the "anonymity" on Wikipedia, and I don't think this Knol can measure up, simply because of that reason.

    --
    WARNING! This girl exceeds the MAXIMUM SAFE standards established by the FDA for BRATTINESS
    1. Re:Losing Anonymity? by chris_mahan · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The other thing I think will become a problem is when Expert A writes an article on Subject X, then Expert B says, hey, Subject X is missing information Z, and Export A says no way, and Expert B can't write Subject X, but will write Subject AlmostX, and then you end up with two articles on Subject X. In wikipedia, the two articles would be merged. Knol is gonna have a big synthesis problem.

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      "Piter, too, is dead."

    2. Re:Losing Anonymity? by Sockatume · · Score: 5, Insightful

      On the other hand, this is rather more transparent. When Expert X and Expert Y are putting out mutually contradictory versions of events, then the reader must critically evaluate them both. If it turns out that Y uses shoddy references and mostly cites his own work, while X has a wide-ranging and substantial reference base to build his article on, then it's clear that X is the one to trust, and Google gets to stay out of it.

      By contrast, on Wikipedia, Author X's content will dominate the article while Author Y gets into a massive edit war, is banned, and runs off to spin some yarn to The Register about how he's persecuted by The Cabal. Then Wikipedia's image is tarnished.


      (TINC)

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      No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
    3. Re:Losing Anonymity? by snowgirl · · Score: 4, Insightful

      By contrast, on Wikipedia, Author X's content will dominate the article while Author Y gets into a massive edit war, is banned, and runs off to spin some yarn to The Register about how he's persecuted by The Cabal. Then Wikipedia's image is tarnished.

      At least Wikipedia has good information then. I don't see the problem.

      --
      WARNING! This girl exceeds the MAXIMUM SAFE standards established by the FDA for BRATTINESS
    4. Re:Losing Anonymity? by sick_soul · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I agree, and in addition there is currently
      no context when creating a new article.
      It's maybe just too soon, but the process seems
      to make it more difficult to reach critical mass.

      I wanted to start writing something, but
      desisted, because I found no contextual information.

      On wikipedia I would read some article, see a
      dangling link with no page associated, and create
      one from there. Or read an existing one, and
      just add additional information, or correct
      some detail.

      Otherwise it is hard to just start writing
      general, context-free articles about
      "what I know". Maybe they should have started
      with wikipedia content, applying the new process
      for further edits and new articles, in order
      to already have a lot of context already.

    5. Re:Losing Anonymity? by atari2600 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Excellent point - the reason that Google has Knol out is the reason they have Image Labeler out. Create content (for Google) / test Google's software for free while enjoying Google's "free" offerings.

      I can see Knol as being beneficial from the perspective of selling my own goods (free advertising) but it's not really a replacement for Wikipedia and I don't think Google wants/intends Knol to replace Wikipedia. Knol is about sharing expertise and I don't see a reason why Wikipedia and Knol can co-exist in harmony.

    6. Re:Losing Anonymity? by snowgirl · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I like the "anonymity" on Wikipedia, and I don't think this Knol can measure up, simply because of that reason.

      With Wiki you don't know if the author knows anything about the subject whereas with Knol you can see the author's qualifications.

      Right, but why rely upon ethos for evaluating the correctness of an article? Are we really going to jump into the fallacy of appeal to authority so quickly?

      --
      WARNING! This girl exceeds the MAXIMUM SAFE standards established by the FDA for BRATTINESS
    7. Re:Losing Anonymity? by snowgirl · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Right... that's why Conservapedia got started, because all those people with the religious right-wing nutso axes to grind found Wikipedia such a hospitable environment...

      --
      WARNING! This girl exceeds the MAXIMUM SAFE standards established by the FDA for BRATTINESS
    8. Re:Losing Anonymity? by Serious+Callers+Only · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Part of contributing to Wikipedia is that you're anonymous...

      This is also the biggest problem with wikipedia, and a good reason never to trust anything you find there. There have been several scandals on wikipedia of information being modified by interested parties - I would link to wikipedia, but I don't think they have a page about that.

      In future most knowledge databases will be attributed, like Knol, because that leads to accountability, which leads to accuracy.

    9. Re:Losing Anonymity? by jambox · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I disagree. The synthesis should accommodate both views, if and only if both are supportable by references. There are many areas of academia where different experts have different views on a subject. This is played out through the publishing of peer-reviewed research papers and eventually one is shown to be correct. In the meantime, encyclopaedias can only report the facts of the disagreement. You are correct that Wikipedia shouldn't take sides, but that doesn't prevent synthesis and should never require two articles.

      --
      You thought you could break the laws of physics without paying the PRICE?
  2. Online Resources by Narpak · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I think it is good that there is competition in this field. Perhaps the two services can even come to complement each other, or at least provide a good database of information based on different principles. At the very least it should force both to do their best to provide a good easy interface and information that is as far as is possible; verified.

  3. Wikipedia ^ ~Wikipedia by Metasquares · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It's like Wikipedia but without the open collaboration which made Wikipedia successful.

    1. Re:Wikipedia ^ ~Wikipedia by elgaard · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It is also a Wikipedia without database dumps.

      Even if much of the material will be under a creative-commons, no one but Google can control Knol in the future.
      So no forks.

  4. Not bad, but it's missing something by Reality+Master+201 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Wikipedia definitely suffers from the problem of having a lot of know nothing jackasses writing articles, random defacements, and a lot of useless crap.

    But Knol seems to be missing the best part of wikipedia - extensive internal links. Half the fun of wikipedia is looking up something, then wasting a couple hours wandering through topics till you get someplace you might not have gone otherwise.

    1. Re:Not bad, but it's missing something by pgillan · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And that, of course, is also the fun of looking up something in a dead-tree encyclopedia. As you look up the article you need, you run across other interesting articles and end up learning all sorts of unexpected things.

      In a dead-tree encyclopedia, sure, I might look up information about the Serengeti, and then learn all kinds of interesting things about spiders, shoelaces, and salmonella, but with Wikipedia I can learn about things that start with other letters.

  5. More of a blog than an encyclopedia by aembleton · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I've only really looked at this article, which was the most prominently featured on their front page. Reading the first few paragraphs it comes across as one persons view and experiences as opposed to an encyclopaedia. Some work will need to be done on this if it is to be a serious challenger to Wikipedia.

  6. Typing Equations? by biased_estimator · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I only looked at it briefly, but they don't provide an easy way to type equations? I suppose that might be a lot to ask for... I guess I'll just have to LaTeXiT.

  7. Re:Wikipedia is a large stategic threat to Google by SanityInAnarchy · · Score: 3, Insightful

    With things like the Wikipedia search box in Firefox people can go directly to the Wikipedia page on a subject rather than type it in to Google.

    However, I usually search through Google first, even if the first result might be Wikipedia -- because Google is a broader search.

    Wikipedia may well have a detailed, informative article, which links to decent external sources -- then again, it might have no article, or a biased, poorly maintained article.

    If I search directly on Wikipedia, the lack of a Wikipedia article means I'll have to repeat that search on Google, or elsewhere -- plus, the Wikipedia search is slower. If I search on Google first, if there's a Wikipedia article, great, it's one click away -- and if there isn't, I've still got a page full of useful results.

    Hence Knol. Google's competitor to Wikipedia. But it's too late. Good.

    Why is that good? If Knol can actually do a better job than Wikipedia, what's the problem?

    I'm not entirely sure why I should trust Wikimedia with my personal information any more than Google. The only real advantage here is the possibility of releasing something anonymously -- which I can still do, through Wikipedia, or Wikileaks, or somewhere else.

    Creative Commons means that if someone really has something to add, and I won't let them (or co-author with them), they can always re-publish as their own version -- in this sense, Knol is to Wikipedia as Git is to SVN.

    And it means my work is still out there to read, for free, but I'll be getting paid, which means I'll have an incentive to spend more time on it. Say what you will -- Wikipedia is great for the kind of reference material which is truly a list of indisputable facts -- but commercial books (technical manuals, etc) often have better quality for things like teaching fundamentals, or, occasionally, simply being more comprehensive even than the official online documentation.

    That would be the main reason Knol could work -- capitalism.

    --
    Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
  8. Re:pr0n by SplinterOfChaos · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I LOVE how they use lighting to make the un-"enhanced" women look paler and less healthy. It's good to finally see a place I can go to and know I'm given unbiased, true information.

  9. Re:Citizendium? by wile_e_wonka · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I think the one-author model is problematic. Citizendium's Wikipedia-like collaberative model keeps bias in check. For example, what if Michael Behe, a biochemist, decided to write the article on "Evolution." He controls the content? It seems that it will be very difficult under any sort of one author model to get an unbiased article on just about any sensitive topic. When any approved "expert" can alter any article, however, there will be concessions to satisfy authors disagreeing on what should go in an article, ending up with a largely unbiased and very information piece. Much like many Wikipedia articles have turned out.

    I also have somewhat of a problem with keeping non-experts out altogether. The experts like to write stuff, but they don't necessarily want to punctuate properly, or cite every little detail, or link to new articles as they come up, or format an article just so, etc. There any many non-experts who troll through Wikipedia looking for grammatical errors, places to add better citations, places to add [citation needed], etc. It seems that non-experts should be given some level of control in order to allow them to do what the experts aren't likely to do as much.