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A Good Reason To Go Full-Time SSL For Gmail
Ashik Ratnani writes with this snippet from Hungry Hackers: "A tool that automatically steals IDs of non-encrypted sessions and breaks into Google Mail accounts has been presented at the Defcon hackers' conference in Las Vegas. Last week, Google introduced a new feature in Gmail that allows users to permanently switch on SSL and use it for every action involving Gmail, not just authentication. Users who did not turn it on now have a serious reason to do so, as Mike Perry, the reverse engineer from San Francisco who developed the tool, is planning to release it in two weeks."
Or else someone could hijack my accBILL GATS SI TEH DEVLI!!!!!!!!!
Is there any reason to not use SSL every time one sends a password?
Unfortunately, the general public still seems entirely uneducated about SSL, figuring that passwords must be secure because they appear as bullets on the screen, right?
Once you're signed into Gmail: Settings -> Always use https -> Save changes
Mike Perry did a great public service by making this tool and making it available.
This attack also works against yahoo mail, hotmail, etc. Just Yahoo, hotmail, etc don't even OFFER SSL, so well, if you use them, your FSCKed.
And Google has known about this problem for a LONG time. EG, see my blog post from last february!.
Google waited for a year before even giving users the OPTION to be protected when SSL is used, and notice that it was only after they found out about Mike Perry's talk that the option was even added.
Also, as I argue, they got it wrong. The checkbox is good, but most users don't know about it. But if a user MANUALLY enters https://mail.google.com/ I argue that google should INFER that the user wants to be SSL-only, at least until they explicitly log out.
Test your net with Netalyzr
I could of died when I saw that.
Unless you SET THE PREFERENCE, you are insecure, even if you MANUALLY type in https://mail.google.com/ always.
Because unless you SET THE PREFERENCE, google does NOT set the session cookie to be SECURE.
This is what Mike Perry's tool does: it takes any of your OTHER connections, redirects it to http://mail.google.com/ so your browser spits out the session cookie anyway, and then can redirect you back (so you don't know what happened).
Google's SSL mode for gmail, UNLESS YOU SET THE PREFERENCE, offers you NO protection against an active adversary. And since someone snooping your traffic at starbucks can just as easily inject packets, IT OFFERS NO PROTECTION EVEN IF YOU MANUALLY TYPE IN HTTPS ALL THE TIME, UNLESS YOU SET THE PREFERENCE!!!!
Test your net with Netalyzr
Its a waist of time to corect peoples gramar and speling. Your simply not going to brake there bad habits irregardless of how you feal.
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Selecting 'Always use https' breaks Gmail Notifier. Luckily Google has released a patch for this. Here is a link: http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=9429
It burns us! Nasty tricksy, little hobbitses.
I can understand that back in the web's "stone age" (mid 1990s), having HTTPS for every web site would have seriously slowed down all the computers due to CPU usage, but nowadays is there any real good reason that the whole web can't be HTTPS?
With all the government and ISP snoopings going on, I'm surprised that at least some sites haven't gone that way.
(or is it that embedded browsers like on cell phones can't do SSL?)
TDz.
Karma: Excellent. 15 moderator points expire sometime.
Everyone knows hotmail is evil and yahoo is irrelevant.
Mike Perry's site might (or might not) be a better source than some random blog post that doesn't even link to it.
I could care less.
The summary (and many, many replies) have it all wrong. The point is not that you need to be encrypting all of your traffic to Gmail (for example) with SSL.
The need for SSL-encrypting your session was known with sidejacking. If you use SSL for credential exchange but not for the whole session, your session cookie is transmitted in the clear, and an attacker can sniff it and use your session (as the cookie acts temporarily as a credential). Encrypting the whole session with SSL prevents this. This is well-known at this point.
The subject of this talk was not sidejacking. If the site (Gmail) does not set the secure bit on the session cookie, then your session cookie can be transmitted in the clear, even if all of your intentional communication with Gmail is over SSL! An attacker need only inject a link to the appropriate domain (e.g., mail.google.com) in some other page you request, and the cookie will be sent with that request over HTTP. Only by marking the cookie as secure will the browser refuse to send it over HTTP.
This is true, except for every wireless access point the attacker can access -- like the ones where people sit in a coffee shop and check their e-mail.
The author of this post seems to be really, really confused. There were multiple presentations on ways to hack your Google accounts and Google security flaws, etc.
There was a presentation on howto exploit Google Gadgets (which have access to your local javascript), a few presentations on Cross-Site Request Forgery (CSRF)(which you can do to send your own HTTP requests as the visitor if you have your own image or iframe on the page), and a presentation on hijacking your sessions if you ever access a site over plain-text (non-SSL), and putting the password page on SSL doesn't help (this requires the attacker to be on your local network!!!!!!!).
The title of the post sounds like they're talking about The Middler, a Ruby-based proxy by Jay Beale for intercepting all user data on a shared network, such as a coffee shop, where you can get users to go through your proxy.
If the author is talking about The Middler ... that attacker has to be on your network!!! This is only an issue on untrusted networks.
Jay Beale's talk was the one the mentioned SSL the most, so I'm gonna guess that the author is talking about that, even tho the article seems to mix everything up.
To see the descriptions of the actual talks and whatnot, visit the DEFCON schedule: https://www.defcon.org/html/defcon-16/dc-16-schedule.html
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