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Fire Your IT Boss

theodp writes "Instead of laying off techies who directly help users, Robert X. Cringely argues that the best place to cut IT organizations is at the top. One of the great problems in IT management, Cringely says, is that the big bosses typically haven't a clue what is happening, what needs to happen, and what it all should cost. He issues the following challenge: 'If you are managing an IT shop and can't write the code to render "hello world" in C, HTML, PHP, and pull "hello world" from a MySQL database using a perl script, then you are in the wrong job.' Even with help from Google, Cringely believes many technical managers would fail this test and should get the boot as a result — you can't manage what you don't understand."

24 of 509 comments (clear)

  1. I don't know if I fully agree with that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I think having the manager understand the technical nature of whats going on is certainly an asset.. but ultimately I don't know if it's a necessity.

    Point is, managers manage people. You are there to code.. not them. The only technical details they need to do their job is: how long it will take, how many people can work on it efficiantly, what tasks are dependant on it, risks, and benifits.. and you are there to provide them with that info.

    Managers are about the big picture, not the fine details. In fact.. a micro-managing manager can be a bad thing.

    I think we've all been there... the guy who is directing the circus has no clue about whats involved in it's component parts and you wonder how he ever got the job...

    When you really look at what he spends the day doing though.. you realize the majority of his job revolves around the non-technical things that you probably don't want to have anything to do with (timing, resource allocation, cost, etc..)

    1. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Except, I'm not there to provide them with that info. Not really. I'm there to provide them with "this is how long it will take me" or "this is how long I think it should take". That's not necessarily the same thing as how long it should take, what it should cost, etc.

      In order to manage me and my fellow employees, as well as the time and money we are spending, they need to have an understanding external to us.

    2. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by kcbanner · · Score: 5, Insightful

      (timing, resource allocation, cost, etc..)

      Yes, but the people who actually see those resources and money at work have a *much* better better idea where they actually go. A manager who has a history lower down will make better choices, instead of just throwing money at something, they might throw it at the project, but aim it a bit better.

      --
      Obligatory blog plug: http://www.caseybanner.ca/
    3. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by Darkon · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Point is, managers manage people. You are there to code.. not them. The only technical details they need to do their job is: how long it will take, how many people can work on it efficiantly, what tasks are dependant on it, risks, and benifits.. and you are there to provide them with that info.

      A manager who does not grasp at least the fundamentals of the job(s) that the people under him/her do may not believe or understand subordinates when they give estimates of time/manpower/risks/benefits/etc.

      Someone who doesn't have a bit of knowledge of coding is more likely to say "yeah yeah, you can do that in half the time or I can hire this guy in India who says he can".

    4. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I prefer a non-technical manager.

      A technical manager often inserts himself as a buffer between me and the users. This makes it harder for me to determine what the users really want.

      He also typically starts to solve the problem before I can, while solving it using his own ideas, which are typically not the ones I am used to. (Everybody seems to write programs their own way.)

      The result is that by the time an assignment comes to me, it has already been "partially digested." It is not so clear what my program is supposed to do, but I am given rigid requirements about how it is supposed to do it. In the worst cases I am simply given a big pile of code and the instruction, "Finish this."

      I much prefer to work for non-technical people. I can work with them to hammer out what the program is supposed to do, and then I am free to use the ideas I know best in order to do it. This allows me to work faster and more accurately.

    5. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by v1 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      While it's certainly helpful to have the management know how things down below work, as the organization or project grows larger this becomes less and less practical, down to downright impossible. The CEO of Ford knows what a carburetor is, but certainly can't identify the parts of one taken apart in front of him. That doesn't make him a bad CEO.

      Each step you take up the management ladder, you lose skills and you gain skills. Every very rare now and then you will run across someone that started at the bottom and is now VP or something, and has a very detailed knowledge of how things worked way down at the bottom, ten years ago. Only does him a marginal bit of good now. More often the knowledge they value is of how the people interact and who is responsible for what. This is what makes a good manager - not knowing how you do your job, but knowing how you are important to the company, where you fit in, etc.

      I repair computers. My manager tries to repair computers, but isn't very good at it, and I don't expect him to be. That's not his job, and I can't do his job any better than he can do mine. HIS manager knows how to USE a computer, but certainly not how to work on one. This is how it works.

      --
      I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
    6. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You are exactly right. I have worked with numerous execs who weren't very technical, but if they are doing their jobs well and respect my opinions then they are perfectly fine in their roles.

      Years ago, at one particular job, I was the corporate network admin. My job was to maintain the network and to a lesser extent, help employees with computer problems. Anyhow, there was a time when the head of our marketing department had an issue that, by my rough estimation, I would be unable to resolve without an hours worth of work. When I told her this, she starting yelling and screaming at me, to which I basically told her to fuck off. She threatened to issue a complaint to the CIO since she had no authority over me. All I had to do was tell the CIO what had happened and he went over and chewed her out. It was a perfect example of two management types who both lacked the technical knowledge to assess the problem, yet one chose to berate me while the other chose to trust me.

    7. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by arth1 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It's not so much about slacking as it is about incompetence. Someone might work really hard but produce far worse results than someone who works half as hard, but has talent and pride.
      A manager without the skills is likely to keep the former and lay off the latter.

      And what does it help if your project completes on time, if it's seriously b0rken? Then there will be months of band-aiding, followed by a declaration that it was a success, no matter how horrible it was. And you end up with five times as many people in the support organization (and managers to oversee them) because you didn't understand enough of the gritty details to ensure that the project got done right. And as a CTO, you'll get a bonus, while the lower level people who have to support the steaming pile of technology get the shaft. Repeatedly, to Ravel's Bolero.

    8. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by Free+the+Cowards · · Score: 5, Interesting

      This simply doesn't work with programmers.

      Take a team with a couple of average programmers, one really excellent programmer, and an incompetent programmer who tries really hard all the time.

      What does the manager see? He sees two average employees doing overage things. He sees the excellent programmer "goofing off" half the time, because he spends more time thinking than coding. And he sees the incompetent programmer putting in long hours and always working furiously.

      What does the manager hear? He hears nothing from the excellent programmer. He hears a lot of moaning about long hours from the incompetent programmer. And he hears a lot of complaining from the average guys about how incompetent the incompetent guy is and a lot of praise for the excellent guy.

      What does the manager think? Well, that depends on what he knows. If he knows programmers, then he'll recognize that the excellent guy's output is fantastic, that the incompetent guy's output per hour is extremely low and is causing havoc, and that the average guys are right to complain.

      If he doesn't know programmers, he sees some guy who spends all his time goofing off, another guy who works really hard, and two average guys. The average guys complain about the hard worker and praise the lazy guy, thus showing that they are not to be trusted. Apparently they are jealous of the hard worker's success, and are trying to convince the management that they should be allowed to spend all of their time goofing off too. After enough time passes, the heaviest bonuses are awarded to the incompetent guy, and the excellent guy gets fired for goofing off.

      It probably doesn't work with a lot of other jobs too, but programming is what I know and it's what we're talking about.

      --
      If you mod me Overrated, you are admitting that you have no penis.
    9. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by calmofthestorm · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Agree agree agree. I've had a good time working at utterly incompetent workplaces because the bosses 2-3 levels up from me shielded me from the idiocy above me. They deserved their perks, believe me.

      --
      93rd rule of Slashdot: No matter how obvious my sarcasm is, my comment will be taken seriously by someone.
    10. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by malchus842 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Exactly. As someone who has moved up through the IT organization and manages a large group, I spend FAR more time managing my boss and his boss than my staff. They get their assignments, with enough authority to get them done and responsibility to get them done. My job is to secure the necessary resources, provide a sounding-board, review technical decisions they make and run LOTS of interference to keep my boss out of their hair so they can actually get the work done.

      I've had very little turnover in my years of managing, and have had people who seek jobs for companies I go to work for to work for me again. Guess I'm doing something right. :-)

    11. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      If you are in the area, send me an email - yes I have 2 positions open right now.

      It's a trap! You don't want to work for a boss that reads /.! They'll know you're jagging off on here calling them a jerk all day!

    12. Re:I don't know if I fully agree with that by Ritchie70 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I can't agree more.

      I'm a bottom-level IT manager. They call me a "team lead," which is code for "you're a manager but we're not giving you any more money."

      I was on vacation for 12 days at the end of August. When I got back, I got two reactions:

      1. From my boss - "I'm so glad you're back, I tried to get the guys to do a build and apparently just managed to confuse them."
      2. From the most senior developer - "I'm so glad you're back, I didn't realize how much you filter out. It was one of the worst weeks I've had in a long time."

      My job is to run interference between my boss and my team, and to translate between boss-speak and developer-speak. Occasionally I get to write some code, too. If there's something that looks fun and is small I selfishly grab it for myself. God knows I don't have time to do anything big.

      --
      The preferred solution is to not have a problem.
  2. How it is by symbolset · · Score: 5, Insightful

    As usual, Cringely is right. The fat floats to the top.

    I'm an IT project manager. If one of my peeps bailed and I couldn't step right in and fill their spot and train their replacement myself I would consider myself a failure. It's all about the customer and if we fail to meet the customer's needs because of this everybody involved has failed.

    I had this conversation recently: "Can you replace X?" Answer: "Of course. If I couldn't, we both need replacing."

    I've got people both under and over me. I fully expect both the unders and the overs to be able to step in and catch the load if I step in front of a bus. I don't want to catch a bus, and I don't want my unders and overs to do so either. But I'm prepared for either event and you should be too because if you can't you're neither responsible nor capable of advancement and that's a sad place to be.

    That said, most days my role is reduced to catering. I let my peeps do their gig and I get stuff out of their way. Only the newbs need direction and they get over it right away.

    As soon as they're oriented:

    • They're qualified to do what the customer needs.
    • They're authorized to do what the customer needs.
    • They're educated on how to replace me at need.

    I'm only an IT project manager until my bosses find someone better. My techs only work for me until I find someone better. That's the way it is and that's the way it should be.

    --
    Help stamp out iliturcy.
    1. Re:How it is by Nerdfest · · Score: 5, Insightful

      By your logic, your boss should be able to step in and replace you. This will never happen across the broad set of roles and responsibilities in any company that does more than one simple thing. You will never get a VP that can replace everyone from an accountant to a programmer or fleet mechanic. TO manage, you need to know how to deal with people and priorities. A knowledge of the business is a huge asset, but a manager does not need to know every detail of the day to day work.

      I do like the Starship Troopers attitude though.

  3. Writing hello world is not a manager job by FR-lopet · · Score: 5, Insightful

    A manager manages PEOPLE and not C/HTML/PHP code.

    --
    I love the smell of lithium in the morning
  4. I totally disagree by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I know we're all colored by our personal experiences - but, based on my own, I think the problem is exactly the opposite. A lot of IT managers think they are technically savvy, because they've managed to get some sort of certification at one point or another in their lives (or maybe they were rather knowledgeable at one point, years ago, but have not kept up simply because of the other demands that come with management). These types of people are the epitome of "know just enough to be dangerous". It then gets exacerbated because they often sell themselves to the rest of the organization as "IT savvy", and feel free to make technical decisions regarding project details when they really have no business doing so.

    I think we need IT managers that are MANAGERS, not IT people. Those managers should then trust us to know how to do the detail work required for our jobs.

    My own manager has been learning this lesson over the last several years, and as such my work situation has steadily improved. He is still the liason with the rest of the organization, but he usually sticks to the broad strokes and lets us underlings sweat the details.

    --
    #DeleteChrome
  5. Oh, great... by IonOtter · · Score: 5, Funny

    How much you wanna bet a bunch of CEOs are going to RTA and fire all the COMPETENT bosses and keep the PHB's?

    --
    [End Of Line]
  6. Yeah... sigh. by mfh · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It's true. They pretty much all fail.

    I had a job where my boss told me to go redo the website using whatever technology and features I thought I needed to make it excellent. He gave me two weeks time to do the first phase of moving the old content over to the new framework and coming up with some cool new ideas.

    It was fun. About six days into the project, a manager came down from another branch had an interview with my boss, sat next to me while I explained the site.

    The two of them had a little meeting and called me in. "We're pulling the plug."

    "What? Why?"

    "You're doing it wrong."

    "What are you saying?"

    "You should be using Dreamweaver. Everyone uses dreamweaver and you're doing hand-coding. What language was that again? PHP or ASP?"

    "PHP and MySQL."

    "Dreamweaver does that automatically."

    Anyway the whole conversation went like that. I was told that I had to change into their idea of what a programmer was -- and that's the big problem. Managers have no idea what a web developer or programmer should be because their idea of the job typically is distorted. They rule based on FUD.

    I left the company, obviously. If you can't manage your people, you won't have any.

    --
    The dangers of knowledge trigger emotional distress in human beings.
  7. Re:Common Sense? by Nerdfest · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Unfortunately, this is frequently bad as well. Being a good programmer does not make you a good manager. As much as I hate to admit it, management is a valuable skill. A good manager will base decisions on the information supplied by the the tech that report to him (or her).

    Of course, many of us have ended up working for those who are neither good programmers or good managers.

  8. IT boss=human filter for stupidity @ higher levels by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Are you kidding me?

    As long as my I.T. boss shields me from the dipshits and the politics at levels above themselves, I don't honestly care what they can or can't program.

    They're worth more to me as a human filter than a fellow developer. Christ. Let me actually fix things - they can go off and interface.

  9. What utter bollocks by obnoxio · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Here's a different technical case: I know someone (let's call her Betty) who is an HR director. She's standing in for someone on maternity leave. The person she's standing in for (let's call her Helen) is "technically" superb, knows the nitty-gritty of HR really well. Helen is fully up to speed with every current aspect of HR. She could not only replace every member of her team, she's probably technically better than every individual member of her team.

    But she's a crap manager. She micromanages everything, everything HR has been tasked with gets delivered late and in too much detail. Why? Because at director level, you don't need the micro-detail and you don't need the HR director's involvement in getting every step of every task done.

    Betty hasn't done the job of HR for a decade, but she knows how to run a tight ship. After six months of having Helen out of the way, the HR staff are happier and more productive, the board is delighted with the stuff that HR is producing and Betty is doing very little indeed.

    You don't get a dog and do the barking yourself, Mr Cringely.

    --
    Ciao, Obnoxio
  10. As an IT manager... by jafo · · Score: 5, Insightful

    As an IT manager who has commit privileges to the core Python repository, and can write hello world in half a dozen languages, I'd like to chime in...

    IT management almost certainly isn't about doing the work. That's why it's management and not technical work. Management is about helping other people do things.

    For example, technical people are notorious for being not very good with people. Having someone helping them interface with the rest of the company, get funding, run interference for projects and decisions, all of this is very important to getting coding done, and does not require an ability to code or even an understanding of what is going on with the people doing the coding.

    Having a die-hard techie in a management position may not be as valuable as having a die-hard manager there. Because if the manager just really wants to be doing the techie work, that's really where his passion is, then he probably is in the wrong job. Just as if the person in the techie job's passion lies elsewhere...

    If you have someone in the organization, management or not, that isn't pulling their own weight, then definitely look at what you can do to remedy the situation. But whether a manager can write main() { printf("hello world\n"); } is almost certainly the wrong test to be using.

    Would you fire the techie who can't come up with $50,000 in funding for new workstations and servers?

    But, I guess the "re-purpose people who aren't pulling their weight" headline isn't as easy to get on slashdot as "fire your IT boss". :-)

    Sean

  11. A similar experience by symbolset · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It's true. They pretty much all fail.

    I once had a similar gig for a major newspaper. They had contracted the usual clueless newb to engineer their online presence. The app had a memory fault that crashed the server. They hired me to fix it so that it worked, and incidentally deny the original guy the pay for the contract. I found that a different method of memory allocation would eliminate the issues. Rather than telling my bosses about it, I called the original programmer and told him how to fix all three lines of code that were at fault. He revised it and it worked.

    I lost my gig but I still feel good about it. Doing the right thing is not always in your immediate best interest. I'd feel bad about stealing the benefits from his work for three lousy lines of code.

    The retarded newspaper editors - not so much. They haven't given up their horse-and-buggy-whip model of business. If they had kept me we would have fixed this issue by now. It's not too late to fix this but I no longer care about their welfare and they neither think I have the answer nor remember where to look for me to find their salvation. Such is the ebb and flow of business.

    --
    Help stamp out iliturcy.