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Walmart Caves On DRM Removal

cmunic8r99 writes in with an email he received from walmart.com yesterday evening about the pending shutdown of their DRM services (which we discussed a while back). Walmart has reconsidered and won't be shutting off its DRM servers after all. They are still moving to an all-MP3 store, but won't break all the DRMed music its customers have already downloaded; this because of "feedback from the customers."

32 of 215 comments (clear)

  1. Wal-Mart by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Only did this so that people wouldn't sue them.

    1. Re:Wal-Mart by Gewalt · · Score: 4, Insightful

      this because of "feedback from the customers."

      Only did this so that people wouldn't sue them.

      You say tomato, I say fruit. Whatever.

      --
      Modding Trolls +1 inciteful since 1999
    2. Re:Wal-Mart by Shikaku · · Score: 5, Funny

      Tagged: suddenoutbreakoflawsuits

    3. Re:Wal-Mart by jlarocco · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Only did this so that people wouldn't sue them.

      What's your point? Walmart was looking out for their bottom line? You don't really think Walmart is in business because they get warm fuzzy feelings selling cheap shit to cheap people, do you? A lawsuit would have been an expensive waste of time for everybody involved, and they almost certainly would have lost. It was clearly in Walmart's best interest to avoid it.

      That's the way it's supposed to work.

    4. Re:Wal-Mart by cayenne8 · · Score: 4, Funny
      "You know, I need to start manufacturing things with built-in self destruct switches and simply blow up my customers purchases when I need more sales. =)"

      If these are in the form of a 'vest'....I think you'll find a ready made market over there in the middle east. Heck....make it voice activated:

      LaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLaLa....BOOM!

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    5. Re:Wal-Mart by davmoo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Horse shit. Walmart spends more on toilet paper for their in-store restrooms in a month than a lawsuit over this would have cost them. Plus I'd be willing to bet that there is fine print in the user agreement for all those DRMed tracks somewhere that says words to the effect of "we can turn it off any time with a few days notice and its your problem not ours".

      It probably really was customer feedback and the fact that this was making Walmart look bad. Bad press is far more damaging than some piddly ol' nickel and dime lawsuit.

      --
      I want a new quote. One that won't spill. One that don't cost too much. Or come in a pill.
    6. Re:Wal-Mart by gsgriffin · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Agreed. Those of us in America should live outside America for a while. I got back from living in South Africa for over a year. I wish they had more lawsuits! You heard me right. It because of lawsuit and the threat oif lawsuits that companies take us into consideration and have to build things safer. Ever bought a toaster outside of the US. You'll burn you hand the first time you use it. Not in America. The only toasters you find will be more carefully designed and labeled. Why because of the threat of lawsuits. We still get cheap products. The unsafe products are shipped from China to other parts of the world. Hate the laywer. Like the eventual product.

      --
      jsut athnoer menagiensls ltitle psrhae for you to dcoede. Why do we wtsae our tmie dnoig tihs?
    7. Re:Wal-Mart by MightyYar · · Score: 4, Informative

      Walmart spends more on toilet paper for their in-store restrooms in a month than a lawsuit over this would have cost them.

      No, because they would have likely lost the lawsuit and the judge would have done one of two things:
      1. Forced them to pay compensation to the people who bought the music.
      2. Forced them to escrow money to keep the servers running.

      Add in lawyer fees (plaintiff and defendant), and it is clear that they should just take #2 without the fight.

      Plus I'd be willing to bet that there is fine print in the user agreement for all those DRMed tracks somewhere that says words to the effect of "we can turn it off any time with a few days notice and its your problem not ours".

      I guarantee that is in there somewhere. But that doesn't make it enforceable.

      It probably really was customer feedback and the fact that this was making Walmart look bad.

      It was probably that, too. Not everything is black and white :) The added publicity from a lawsuit would have been detrimental as well.

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    8. Re:Wal-Mart by Mister+Whirly · · Score: 4, Funny

      Modded: $tupid overu$e of dollar $ign$

      --
      "But this one goes to 11!"
    9. Re:Wal-Mart by somersault · · Score: 3, Funny

      Ever bought a toaster outside of the US. You'll burn you hand the first time you use it. Not in America. The only toasters you find will be more carefully designed and labeled

      Would this label say "do not insert hand into toaster while in operation?". Yeesh..

      There is a big difference between "outside of the US" and "South Africa". Please stop making such crazy generalisations. I don't think I've ever burned my hand on a toaster..

      --
      which is totally what she said
  2. Presumably... by Gordonjcp · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ... they have a list of who bought which track. Wouldn't it be simpler to just send them non-DRMed copies of things they've already bought? At the very least, they could offer a discount for people re-buying tracks in a non-DRMed format.

    1. Re:Presumably... by Gewalt · · Score: 4, Interesting

      They do not have the rights to take such actions as you propose. Only Apple/iTunes was smart enough to get that written into their contract.

      --
      Modding Trolls +1 inciteful since 1999
    2. Re:Presumably... by yincrash · · Score: 5, Informative

      The problem with that is that Walmart probably has a contract with record labels that they made when they started the DRM service, and reoffering nonDRMed files would either require breaking the contract which risks a lawsuit, making a new contract with the record labels to allow them to reoffer DRM tracks for free (which would cost walmart tons because there is no way record labels would be interested in letting that happen w/o being paid a second time).

      the cheapest short term solution to keep their customers happy is just to leave the DRM servers up.

    3. Re:Presumably... by Lord+Kano · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Even if walmart has to pay the record companies out of its own pocket, what's the break even point? You pay for a bunch of MP3s once or you pay to maintain servers forever. At some people, the MP3 option becomes cheaper.

      LK

      --
      "Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
    4. Re:Presumably... by yincrash · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I think walmart is gambling that before that point comes, people will have forgotten or given up on their DRMed music and they will be able to shut off their servers.

    5. Re:Presumably... by electrictroy · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Do it anyway. It would be fun watching tiny RIAA try to sue billion-dollar Walmart.

      In my view all Walmart would be doing is simply trading "broken items" with new working items. Just like trading a broken radio for a working radio. That's called good customer service, and Walmart would gain far more money from their happy customers, then they'd lose against a mosquito like RIAA.

      --
      The government is not your daddy. Its purpose is not to raid middle-class neighbors' wallets and give it to you.
    6. Re:Presumably... by Gewalt · · Score: 3, Informative

      Nope, check the EULA. They literally spell out your rights. If for any reason, their DRM system needs to be taken permanently offline, they will provide you with the tools to remove the DRM from your purchased media.

      That said, I would never knowingly purchase any DRM'd content. It just defies all intelligence.

      --
      Modding Trolls +1 inciteful since 1999
  3. Re:Feels like a Scooby-Doo ending. by Jafafa+Hots · · Score: 4, Insightful
    All this means is that they will wait another year or maybe two before shutting down the DRM servers. They will in the end, there is no doubt.

    Do you seriously think the DRM servers will be running in 20 years? No way.

    --
    This space available.
  4. Re:HUH?? by 91degrees · · Score: 5, Funny

    Well, it does. Play a DRMed file. Listen to the quality.

    Turn off the DRM servers, transfer the file to another machine and listen to it again.

    Listen to the windows error message sound.

    Which sounds better?

  5. DMCA exemption by sunderland56 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Wouldn't "Disabling a DRM format that is obsolete" be a good candidate to add to the DMCA exemptions?

    1. Re:DMCA exemption by vrmlguy · · Score: 4, Informative

      I just looked at the legalese from 2006, and came up with the following:

      Sound recordings, and audiovisual works associated with those sound recordings, distributed in formats that have become obsolete and that require access to a central server as a condition of access, when circumvention is accomplished for the purpose of preservation or reproduction of published digital works by the original accessing entity. A format shall be considered obsolete if the machine, system or service necessary to authorize the perceptible of a work stored in that format if a central server is no longer provided to authorize such perceptible./quote

      --
      Nothing for 6-digit uids?
  6. Re:HUH?? by ozphx · · Score: 3, Informative

    Hey I'll have you know the windows error message sound was mastered by King Crimsons Robert Fripp! ;)

    --
    3laws: No freebies, no backsies, GTFO.
  7. The real price of DRM by initialE · · Score: 4, Interesting

    For consumers, living in constant doubt of their content. For providers, servers that they will have to run, like, forever. And the admins who maintain them.

    --
    Starbucks, Harbuckle of Breath.
  8. Re:"feedback from the customers." by TheSpoom · · Score: 5, Informative

    You're missing the point.

    They might not want DRM, but they do want their previous purchased music to not suddenly become worthless.

    --
    It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
    - E. Debs
  9. Re:Rather than a tool by HeavyD14 · · Score: 3, Informative

    Where? I see they are going to stop using DRM, but not that they will remove it from your files you already have.

  10. Re:Feels like a Scooby-Doo ending. by Guido+von+Guido · · Score: 4, Insightful

    All this means is that they will wait another year or maybe two before shutting down the DRM servers. They will in the end, there is no doubt.

    Do you seriously think the DRM servers will be running in 20 years? No way.

    While I'm in agreement, Walmart could certainly use that year or two in order to attempt to convince the labels to allow Walmart to remove the DRM from users' purchases. I think it'd be in their interest: they'd be able to shut down the DRM servers, they wouldn't take a big PR hit, and this episode would be much less likely to affect future music sales. Walmart is certainly willing to use their leverage to squeeze suppliers, and they probably have enough leverage with the labels to at least give it a try.

    Would they get anywhere? Hell if I know.

  11. Re:Feedback ... by wish+bot · · Score: 4, Insightful

    They'll just quietly try it again in a year. Mark my words.

    --
    lemonade was a popular drink and it still is
  12. virtualization hole by mevets · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Apologies for marginally off topic, but couldn't I write an 'audio driver' for Xen, Bochs, .... which took the samples intended for the sound card and store them to a file; un-drming anything? Same for DVDs? Where does this stand with DMCA? I'm not reverse engineering anything....

  13. Now, if we can get off Windows by Trailer+Trash · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Hopefully they can pull their web developers' collective head out of their collective ass and make a web store that works on something other than internet explorer and windows.

    Seriously, is this 1995 or something?

  14. Whoops! by myxiplx · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Now *this* is good news.

    Why? Because you can bet that Wallmart execs are not at all happy about having to pay for and run a bunch of servers that are no longer making them any money. You can bet that just opened their eyes to the downsides of DRM, and that some people at the top are now asking the music labels some tricky questions, namely "how long are we supposed to keep paying to run these damn things now?".

    Wallmart will not want to be left in this position again, and I can see this causing them to put some real pressure on the music labels to drop DRM.

    It also means that Wallmart, Apple and Amazon are all pushing for non DRM music. All together that's some pretty hefty leverage!

  15. Re:"Feedback" as in ... by Hijacked+Public · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The discussion gets circular at some point, they are working for control because they think that will get them more money.

    A buzzphrase that may or may not still be vocalized by executives is 'data driven decisions'. In practice a good many decision are still made according to gut feelings, or very thin data, or totally invented data. In part this is because getting good data is hard to do and even harder to find clear meaning in.

    Here at Slashdot you have a demographic that should be more math oriented than most and yet you have people, this thread is a good example, writing about the financial and legal consequences of the Wal-Mart Corporation running or not running DRM servers. This is without a day's legal education in their lives and with no more financial experience than balancing their own checkbook. And with no clear actual numbers on which to base any of their conclusions.

    So just like the above Slashdotters, music execs went with their gut feelings. They expected digital formats to work like every other format in the entire history of their business model. I don't blame them. All of the non-DRM music stores coming online seems to suggest their minds are changing. If these stores make for the music industry I'm sure DRM for music will be mostly abandoned.

    --
    "Sacrifice for the good of The State" - The State
  16. Walmart isn't judgement-proof... by argent · · Score: 3, Informative

    There's been plenty of people who've sued Walmart, and won, even over smaller issues than beelyuns of imaginary dollars.

    And Walmart's reactions AFTER the lawsuit are often completely disproportionate. Apparently, Walmart employees can get disciplined for working during their breaks now, because someone who had to work through their lunch break a bunch of times sued over it, and won. If you ask a Walmart employee for help and they say they're on break, and they can't, they really mean it.