Slashdot Mirror


Economic Crisis Will Eliminate Open Source

An anonymous reader writes "The economic crisis will ultimately eliminate open source projects and the 'Web 2.0 free economy,' says Andrew Keen, author of The Cult of the Amateur. Along with the economic downturn and record job loss, he says, we will see the elimination of projects including Wikipedia, CNN's iReport, and much of the blogosphere. Instead of users offering their services 'for free,' he says, we're about to see a 'sharp cultural shift in our attitude toward the economic value of our labor' and a rise of online media businesses that reward their contributors with cash. Companies that will survive, he says, include Hulu, iTunes, and Mahalo. 'The hungry and cold unemployed masses aren't going to continue giving away their intellectual labor on the Internet in the speculative hope that they might get some "back end" revenue,' says Keen."

31 of 753 comments (clear)

  1. Yeah right. by Emb3rz · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Advertising + Blogs = continuance of our current model.

    1. Re:Yeah right. by dotancohen · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Advertising + Blogs = continuance of our current model.

      He just doesn't get that some people do things not for the money.

      --
      It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong.
    2. Re:Yeah right. by 0100010001010011 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Some men can't be bought, bullied, reasoned or negotiated with. Some men just want to watch the world burn.

    3. Re:Yeah right. by Hatta · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I don't think that's the main thing wrong with his reasoning. Fact is, a lot of the hard work in OSS is paid for. Most of it is not done for free.

      The main thing wrong with his reasoning is that in rough economic times, companies are going to be looking for a better value. OSS is a better value. Even if you have to pay for developers to get what you need, that's a one time cost and you get to keep the source code.

      Another point worth making is that if unemployment goes up, that just means there's a lot more developers out there with free time, and motivation to put something new on their resumes.

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    4. Re:Yeah right. by theaveng · · Score: 4, Insightful

      No. I'm assuming they ARE employed, and about to get laid-off due to the recession. Therefore they might not be able to pay their bills, and their priority will be survival, not opensource programming.

      --
      FOX NEWS.com should be BANNED from television and internet. Have the Congress take it over and give us Truespeak.
    5. Re:Yeah right. by mattcasters · · Score: 5, Insightful

      An economic crisis is not the same as a total collapse of society. Developers and community members come and go, live and die and even end up in jail all the time and yet the open source movement continues to thrive.
      The article is FUD, a troll. Nothing to see here, move along.

      --
      News about the Kettle Open Source project: on my blog
    6. Re:Yeah right. by 1u3hr · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Therefore they might not be able to pay their bills, and their priority will be survival, not opensource programming.

      "Survival"? Over-dramatising, I think. It's an economic downturn, not Armageddon, plague, pestilence and firestorms.

      And even during the worst disasters and wars, people still create art, literature, do maths, compose poetry. Writing software? Why not? It's a lot cheaper way to spend your evenings than going out to a bar. (Not that bars are in any danger either.)

    7. Re:Yeah right. by Peter+La+Casse · · Score: 5, Insightful

      One of the problems with human beings is that we extrapolate from our own circumstances to make conclusions that we think apply to everyone. "I'm doing great, so lots of people are doing great" is as invalid as "I'm doing poorly, so lots of people are doing poorly". The simple truth is that the plural of "anecdote" is not "data".

  2. I think we should be able to by wud · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Can someone please mod this story as flame bait?

    --
    wud
    1. Re: I think we should be able to by JustKidding · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Indeed, why are some people just completely unable to comprehend that not *everyone* is a greedy bastard?

      Some people do things, like programming, you know, for fun! Contributing to OSS is not about "back-end revenue" for most people, it's about contributing to a community, about pride, and about intellectual challenges.

      I feel sort of sad for him that *his* whole life seems to revolve around money.

    2. Re: I think we should be able to by MyLongNickName · · Score: 5, Insightful

      And why can't people comprehend that folks write this stuff to sell books and make money? And why can't folks comprehend that Slashdot posts it in order to get page views and make money?

      --
      See my journal for slashdot ID's by year. Mine created in 2005. http://slashdot.org/journal/289875/slashdot-ids-by-year
    3. Re: I think we should be able to by garett_spencley · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I'm not saying I disagree, and in true /. spirit I only read the summary ... however it sounds like his whole point is that when people are having a hard time coming across basic necessities they stop caring about 'fun', 'community', 'pride' and 'intellectual challenges' and start caring about how to get food.

      The real question is: is it going to get that bad ? Was the great depression even "that bad" or are the stories of stock traders jumping out of windows greatly exaggerated ?

      Also, being someone who works in internet advertising and runs "free web-sites" that happen to feed my children it's pretty clear that he doesn't understand Internet economics. The Internet, like television, doesn't care about goods and services in exchange for currency (though I'm not saying that model isn't implemented online, just that there's other models that are more popular and work just as well, if not better). I guess next he's going to claim that television networks are going to stop free programming with commercials and instead switch to a strict pay-per-view model :rollseyes:

    4. Re: I think we should be able to by tjstork · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Some people do things, like programming, you know, for fun! Contributing to OSS is not about "back-end revenue" for most people, it's about contributing to a community, about pride, and about intellectual challenges

      I think his point is, that, in a recession, and suddenly, programmers aren't working any more with day jobs, that little blog that gets 50000 hits or that little pile of code they've built suddenly looks like it might be something to help , you know, make a mortgage payment with.

      I mean, sure, if you are independently wealthy, go ahead and give your time away. But if you've got a family to feed and a house to pay for, you probably might want to have some money coming in.

      --
      This is my sig.
    5. Re: I think we should be able to by cowscows · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Your point about OSS is certainly valid, and while I certainly don't think Linux is going to die or anything like that, there will likely be a slow-down in development for certain pieces of software, and specific aspects of the software.

      While there are many people who enjoy the fun and challenge of writing software, it's important that not all steps in the process are the same. The adage that the last 10% of the project is 90% of the work is somewhat true, in that making a really well polished product inevitably requires some grind work at the end. In the software world, that might manifest itself as bug squashing, or user testing, or interface tweaking, etc.

      It's important work, but it's often time consuming, monotonous, and not fun, and it's hard to get people to volunteer to do it. That's a part of the OSS process that can really benefit by having paid labor to help make sure that it gets the attention it deserves (although there's no doubt that even proprietary companies often skip out on this part).

      If the tech economy turns to crap and there are lots of newly unemployed programmers sitting around, I'd actually expect the amount of OSS activity to increase somewhat. All those geeks aren't going to turn off their computers and never code again. But the effort will go towards the sorts of things that are interesting, not towards the dull (but important) drudgery work. If companies stop paying their developers to work on OSS, there are certain types of work that will fall to the wayside.

      --

      One time I threw a brick at a duck.

  3. Just like... by i+kan+reed · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The end of the dot-com bubble killed linux, stifled production of php sites, and made people stop sending non-commercial email. Those things all went away, right?

    1. Re:Just like... by Just+Some+Guy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The latest U.S. News & World Report appears to claim this recession is deeper than the post-dot-com recession.

      And that would raise the demand for expensive, uncustomizable software how?

      --
      Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
  4. This is just wrong by Finallyjoined!!! · · Score: 4, Insightful

    hungry and cold unemployed masses

    They aren't the people contributing. The guy is an 1d.10T

    --
    If I had an Ass, I'd call it Fanny Bottom, then I could slap my Ass; Fanny Bottom, on the Arse.
  5. Money? by qoncept · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Since when is user delivered content driven by hopes of profit? These people are driven by wanting their voices heard and to some extent wanting to be known. If these sites fail, it will be because the site itself isn't profitable, not because their users, who they could care less about, aren't making money off it.

    --
    Whale
  6. *laughs* by RaigetheFury · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This guy is under the assumption everyone who works on open source technology is after financial gain. Very short sighted

  7. Same wrong assumptions, different century by beldon · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Perhaps it could be said that all the money in FOSS development made developers used to a higher standard of living, but that assumes that getting paid necessarily negates non-monetary rewards. That's a flimsy argument and doesn't bear very close scrutiny. It also assumes traditional scarcity rules have taken over the software industry. If anything, artificial scarcity is even harder to maintain during harder financial times.

    This is nothing but a re-hash of Bill Gates' screed against the Homebrew Computer Club about how good software will never be created without paid programmers. It was wrong in then, and it's still wrong.

  8. Suerly the opposite is true by uchian · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Surely with more people sitting at home, unemployed, with nothing to do other than look for a job, and desperate to make their cv stand out more than everyone else in there situation, the amount of speculative work produced may in fact rise?

  9. yeah right by ignatus · · Score: 5, Insightful
    "The hungry and cold unemployed masses aren't going to continue giving away their intellectual labor on the Internet in the speculative hope that they might get some 'back end' revenue," says Keen."

    No, the hungry and cold unemployed IT guys will invest their time into open source projects, because it 's a good way to keep their curriculum in shape. And the hungry and cold unemployed will keep using linkedin and facebook to extend their network inorde to find a job. And ofcourse, businesses in difficulties will stop throwing money away for overrated software when they can get a free and open equivalent.

    I think a crisis will definately have a positive impact on open source and web 2.0

    --
    - Never underestimate the power of human stupidity.
  10. My approach to such idiots is... by JamesP · · Score: 4, Insightful

    LET THEM BE

    Every time an idiot says something that is not going to affect you directly, let it be!

    Trust me, do you really wanna do business with people who believe this?? Do you want to be an employee who believe these things?

    But guess what, you're right and they're wrong!

    If my employer has a stupid idea, I either recommend against (and they usually listen) or I quit or I shut up.

    If my competitor has a stupid idea, I just say "GREAT!!! GO AHEAD!!"

    --
    how long until /. fixes commenting on Chrome?
  11. Economic Down Turns always spawn innovation by olddotter · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Most economic down turns spawn innovation. People no longer have nice cushy jobs soaking up their days. These people no longer have anything to lose (their job) by trying that great idea to build a better mouse trap. Some of them invent things really cool and successful.

    Linux exists because Linus couldn't afford a real unix server, for example.

    If the downturn turns into a depression, then no one will have money to pay anyone for services anyway. So the huddled masses will probably be bartering their services and still contribute to open source, because its the cheapest way for them to get the tools they need.

    Take some money and buy a clue.

  12. A more likely target by MikeRT · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It'll be harder to argue for expensive new Oracle, SAP and similar licenses. Oh sure, that database that's just a large bit bucket will cost your business a few hundred thousand dollars to implement! Just lay off a worker or two to fit it into your budget.

    Bullshit.

    If anything, it'll be easier now to justify using OSS because the ridiculous cost of most enterprise software will become more apparent to the customers. I predict that if this continues, you'll see more companies forced to use OSS out of necessity simply because they cannot justify buying the extremely expensive licenses for proprietary software.

    On a related note, Keen is one of those guys who laments the loss of our "high culture." The dude is a day late and a dollar short in his whole analysis. Western high culture started taking a nose dive 100 years ago with the rise of political populism. If anything will help to bring it back, it'll be putting better, cheaper tools into the hands of content producers so that they can do more work with less effort.

  13. Re:Odd ... by russlar · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It seems we're getting dupes from a parallel SlashDot.

    If that were true, this story would have a goatee.

    --
    Anybody want my mod points?
  14. after reading this guy's book.... by giblfiz · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I can say for sure that he doesn't "get it". While he does make several good points about the advantages of payed work, it seems that he is ignorant about the advantages of free contribution, and the way OSS uses a blend paid and unpaid work to advance projects.

    He also doesn't seem to understand that the large companies that are supporting OSS are not doing it out of the goodness of their hearts, they are doing it to try to disrupt other businesses.

    In short, the man is not a troll, but he has no idea what he is talking about. Move along.

  15. some choice quotes from Benkler by griffjon · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "For all of us, there comes a time on any given day, week, and month,every year and in different degrees over our lifetimes, when we choose to act in some way that is oriented toward fulfilling our social and
    psychological needs, not our market-exchangeable needs. It is that part of our lives and our motivational structure that social production taps, and on which it thrives. There is nothing mysterious about this. It is evident to any of us who rush home to our family or to a restaurant or bar with friends at the end of a workday, rather than staying on for another hour of overtime or to increase our billable hours; or at least
    regret it when we cannot." --Benkler, _Wealth of Networks_

    "Human beings are, and always have been, diversely motivated beings. We act instrumentally, but also noninstrumentally. We act for material gain, but also for psychological well-being and gratification, and for social connectedness. There is nothing new or earth-shattering about this, except perhaps to some economists. " -- Benkler, _Wealth of Networks_

    --
    Returned Peace Corps IT Volunteer
  16. Re:Not Quite. by MindKata · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "Blogs shift power from broadcasters to individuals"... yes thats good, but advertisers are also using misinformation on blogs, to create so called Flogs. So how many popular blogs are really Flogs? ... However many it is, they are definately trying to game the system, to get popular blogs which are really just flogs.

    Advertising + Blogs + advertisers_with_no_ethics = Flogs
    http://adage.com/smallagency/post?article_id=113945
    e.g. "Sony and agency Zipatoni have come under fire for one of their marketing tactics for the Sony PSP. Sony has added its name to a growing list of flogs [fake blogs] including McDonald's, WalMart and Lonely Girl 15, that are being called out by consumers. This isn't the first time Sony has been caught and questioned about the ethics of its marketing practices."

    --
    There are 10 kinds of people in the world... those who understand binary and those who don't.
  17. Re:Blogs != News by Bourbonium · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Well, give /. some credit for attempting to be "fair and balanced." FUD or not, I read this headline as a response to yesterday's article promoting exactly the opposite prediction from Red Hat's CEO http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/10/21/0116221 that the financial crisis will be a major boon for open source software. You may recall that Keen is the same fellow who was pimping his book on The Colbert Report a few months ago claiming that anything given away as free is worth absolutely nothing and that the internet will collapse from all the amateurs who are creating content. Check out his biography and you'll learn that, as an entrepreneur at the turn of the last century, he was a victim of the collapse of the tech bubble in 2000. I taste some very bitter grapes in his opinions about the web.

  18. Re:Blogs != News by cayenne8 · · Score: 5, Insightful
    "It's all anecdotal, partisan, and un-researched crap."

    That statement also describes the CBS Evening News...

    :)

    --
    Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........