Slashdot Mirror
Microsoft Working On Its Own App Store
CWmike writes "Microsoft is working on a software distribution scheme along the lines of Apple's iPhone App Store, CEO Steve Ballmer said yesterday at a developer's conference in Sydney, Australia. 'There's not much money being made, but the general concept of giving developers a way not only to get their code distributed, but to really get visibility for the code, is a good idea,' Ballmer said. Ballmer hinted that something similar would be coming soon from Microsoft. While he said Micrsoft was not ready to detail the works in progress, he said '... fear not, we're hard at work, and you'll see some of the benefits [of that] with some of the concepts, particularly Facebook's.'"
This company is pathetic. Don't they every ever come up with an original idea?
Considering that Apple didn't invent any of the things you listed either, I don't see what your point is.
The money being made is in smaller chunks but the volume could be quite high. This combined could quite profitable for small, independent developers. Also from Apple's standpoint they are not in it to make large amounts of profit for themselves from the app store. Like the music and video divisions, it will probably generate a small profit. The app store is a tool to sell more devices. MS unfortunately only sees that they can't make much money off it because their model relies on OEMs buying their OS software and their mobile software which means they will have to compete in some cases with 3rd party developers.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
No, but Apple legally licensed/bought the tech from PARC. Microsoft simply copied them after they saw how successful it was.
Whether or not Apple did invent these things it has been a fairly consistent paradigm that Apple (or Google, or whoever) comes up with something and makes it successful and then Microsoft tries to get in on the action. I'm sure their app store will do fine. At least as fine as the Zune....
http://www.rootstrikers.org/
'There's not much money being made, but the general concept of giving developers a way not only to get their binaries distributed, but to really get visibility for the binaries, is a good idea'
I'm pretty sure the mouse came from Xerox PARC.
No, Doug Englebart invented it at SRI.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
... fear not, we're hard at work...
Start fearing.
Nuclear engineers build weapons. Civil engineers build targets.
What few realize is that is that the mouse was preceded by the development of cheese as a user input device. If I recall correctly, this was an Al Gore invention which, unfortunately for him, didn't succeed to the same level as his better known invention - the internet.
Sadly, Al could not figure out an appropriate application of a block of cheese to a User Interface. Xerox PARC quickly picked up the ball and drew the obvious conclusion.
I wouldn't go quite that far, but he should shut down his unprofitable ego-trip ventures like the Zune and the Xbox.
MS's problem is that they're fixated on competition, not customers. They got into search because they thought they had to compete with Google. They got into online services in the first place because they thought they had to compete with AOL. Same with Zune and Apple.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
With blackjack? And hookers? Ah screw it, forget the blackjack... And the app store.
You do realize people have been buying music and software from Microsoft Online services for over 7 years right?
Really? MSN Music launched in 2004, a year after the iTunes Music Store (2003), and it is the first online music store from Microsoft that I can find any references to. I'm aware that Microsoft has had an online software store for a few years, although I've yet to encounter anyone who's bought anything from it (and any non-geeks who are even aware of its existence).
I am TheRaven on Soylent News
No, but Apple legally licensed/bought the tech from PARC. Microsoft simply copied them after they saw how successful it was.
Whether or not Apple did invent these things it has been a fairly consistent paradigm that Apple (or Google, or whoever) comes up with something and makes it successful and then Microsoft tries to get in on the action.
On the other hand it took Apple few decades to put second button and wheel (ok.. "orb") on their mouse and they managed to get it wrong still.
Actually, that division is currently making money.
As a game developer, I'd hate to see MS shut down their Xbox division. They basically took some great developers, gave them a real budget, and said "do what you want." So far MS corporate has avoided messing with the console games division, keeping them from becoming another MS Bob.
On consoles, Microsoft is basically responsible for: Digital game sales, digital movie rentals, add-on downloads, HDD's on consoles, cross-title friends lists, and the general concept of a cross-title global experience. While they're also responsible for the most godawfully painful log-in/log-out scenarios of any console manufacturer, they did a lot of things right and really pushed Sony and Nintendo kicking and screaming into an online world.
The ______ Agenda
I think that's an example of something they did better.. They ripped Google off and put better, more detailed satellite photos in the "birds-eye view" on their mapping site. It's a little chunky to use but the photos are amazing. Now when I shop for a house I go to live maps and instantly get a view of it from all sides from about ~50ft away. It puts Google Earth to shame, and although street view is even closer and more detailed, it covers a lot more area than street view.
Sure, MS copies ideas, but it only really HELPS the consumer in the long run. Even if it's not always "better" than the competition, it gives us more choices. I, for one, am looking forward to the new app store on my HTC Kaiser.
It could end up being like a package manager. If you could get all or most of your software through the software store, it could handle updates and dependencies. It might even make re-installing Windows easier. Just save the list of installed programs, wipe and install, then use some scripting magic to re-install all of your programs. That is, if it's not crippled by DRM.
Probably something like Linux package managers, only you have to pay for the privilege of a less functional version.
Actually, that division is currently making money.
Only if you don't count the billions already pissed away. Xbox needs about twenty more HALO-scale hits before it breaks even.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
They are making PLENTY of money off the app store, far more than they expected. Ballmer's comments about "there's not much money being made" is simply his way of discounting Apples success and predicting his own failure.
this could render horrible, spyware-laden free app download sites like the current ones a thing of the past. if Microsoft hosts and vets downloads, it means higher quality apps for users, as well as an extra distribution channel for vendors
I have been a user for about 10 years. This ends Feb 2014. The site's been ruined. I'm off. Dice, FU
Same can be said for nearly every console ever apart from the Wii. The PS3 is still selling at a loss a few years on, and in a recent interview I think it was Kaz Hirai (probably wrong) that said they wouldn't recoup the losses made from the PS3 "in his lifetime"
I'm pretty sure the mouse came from Xerox PARC.
No, Doug Englebart invented it at SRI.
-jcr
I met him once a couple years ago. Really old (he's passed now) but he had a pretty interesting story. The part that really gets me is he never made a penny from inventing the mouse, aside from his salary at the company. He should have been made rich though!
-Taylor
Worldwide Military budgets: $2100 billion. Worldwide Space Exploration budgets: $38 billion. Really, world? Really?
So what is the motivation here. Apple has it's store to control content. I don't think MS wants to do that. Google has it's store to insure that content is available, provide more pages to host ads, and eventually make a little money on the side, when they begin charging, something I thought they were already doing, but I forgot about their always freaky business model. MS business models are always very straight forward.
So as best I can figure this is a case where someone else it making a bit of money in the computer business, MS is not getting it's cut, which is driving MS crazy. So they open a store, even though they have no experience in it and will not pay anyone who has experience, and then use their partnership arrangements to make others use it, maybe even building it into the next version os IE. Probably have to have to have and MSN account to use it as well.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
The way I see it is that someone somewhere innovates. PARC, Linus or whoever, it doesn't matter. It seems to be less and less likely with any big company.
Apple gets hold of the idea and makes something very neat and appealing with it. The only problem I ever have is that it is too expensive. I own an iPod but have never felt able to justify the cost of a 'Mac.
Microsoft takes the idea and makes something much cheaper. It looks cheap as well. It runs on my PC but is no more open than the Apple stuff.
I'll see your Constitution and raise you a Queen.
i actually think some of the Zune's WiFi features are pretty innovative. being able to share music/photos/images directly with other wireless devices is definitely a neat feature (though it'd be neater if more devices supported it). likewise with by able to broadcast a wireless profile to indicate what you're listening to.
frankly, i think the major PMP manufacturers should get together and create a standardized protocol for sharing files across portable media players. Microsoft kinda ruined a great concept by crippling it with DRM. they also missed a great opportunity by not publishing their protocol as an open standard. with the iPod still lacking WiFi capabilities, if Microsoft had made wireless file sharing a popular open standard by working with companies like Sony, Creative, Archos and even SmartPhone manufacturers, they could have made it a huge selling point over the iPod. but the Zune by itself isn't popular enough to make their file sharing feature anything more than a passing novelty. the whole "welcome to the social" campaign is kinda silly when you're the only one in the social.
however, i still look forward to the day when these features become standard on all portable media devices. it'd be cool to sit down on a train and see that there's a person across the room that likes the same music/movies/tv shows/games as you do and be able to swap music/videos/frags/etc. with them.
Linux community: "Windows sucks. They don't even have a decent app repository. In Linux I can find any program from one place!" Microsoft: "We're building an App Store" Linux community: "Zoinks! Theives! Scoundrels! Copycats!" Since when is it wrong for a company to see something it's competitor has done successfully, that was beneficial for both customers and developers, and then decide to do so for their own customers and developers? Seriously, how is this a bad thing that they're doing it? They've even acknowledged that their competitors had a good idea and that they've taken the concept from them. Jeez.
There's nothing in Microsoft land that equates to what Apple has with its application store. Windows shareware developers have to do shareware, first of all, which is pretty bad. In the Apple store, Apple has it set up that consumers have to pay first and then get the application, and that Apple approves the products and lathers its brand on things makes it great. In Windows, you have 2000 web sites all cheesily affiliated with a handful of players, no consistent payment collection mechanism, loads of cracks everywhere, viruses and malware diluting the idea of downloading programs from the internet, all just conspiring to make developing for Windows a very difficult proposition. A Microsoft Store, not just some subcontracted junk from Digital River, but a Microsoft Store fully and genuinely bundled right into damn OS (and incidentally Vista is a step in the right direction), would be a godsend.
This is my sig.
Right, but those billions have already been pissed away. Shutting down what is now a profitable division because in the past it lost money is silly.
Not a Twitter sockpuppet... but I wish I was.
And, on Windows it will probably actually WORK.
I know you're a whiny astroturfing AC troll, but I can't let this pass.
If Microsoft OS software had a feature that worked like GNU/linux's software repositories, that would be a huge benefit for the end user and a major selling point. Install any of many thousands of apps in every category for free just by clicking on it? Free apps so plentiful they require their own search engine? Automatic dependency resolution? Integrated updates for all apps in one system? Slam dunk. There's even a spot for it in their control panel: the forgotten "add programs" part of add/remove programs.
But they won't because they can't. Every commercial software vendor would port to GNU/Linux the very next week, and the game would be over for them before the Justice department even launched the antitrust investigation.
So sad for MS. So good for everybody else. That is the "that was easy" button.
Help stamp out iliturcy.
your point would be...
Originally Microsoft started out selling music store servers and DRM to Walmart, Yahoo, etc. rather than sell music themselves. Then they went thru a few changes in DRM schemes selling multiple types to multiple people. Then Plays for (not) Sure, then because they promised not to compete in the "one music file" market they created a new type ZUNE that works on Live. Only in the last iteration have they actually mattered compared to Apple. Ironically Live ties music to Zune and Xbox 360 even tighter than Apple ties to iPod and Apple TV.
They have had a "product store" tied to windows since at least ME.. and it was a pale attempt to sell you regular software stuff in a retail box and mail it, a few things might be downloadable now. All I remember is that it never had anything interesting and never updated... ever. Microsoft would have made a killing with online buying of small apps integrated into their website that automatically installed into windows in the "preferred" method, but they constantly try to hijack ISV sales so nobody would touch such a store for Windows because they'd block you out.. a la Defender, ForeFront..etc. A store might work for CE devices, but those are so varied and Microsoft allows carriers to lock out various features so the apps wouldn't be "WinMo" apps they'd have to be "AT&T WinMo" and "Verison WinMo" and "TMobile..." Apple's 5 year deal bought them the kind of control over their devices to make the system really shine. Microsoft would be violating anti-trust to even ask for such a thing.
I'm pretty sure Apple invented the iPod.
That was Kane Kramer. http://gizmodo.com/5046463/apple-admits-british-man-invented-ipod-in-1979-uses-him-to-win-patent-lawsuit
http://marriedmansexlife.com/
Shutting down what is now a profitable division because in the past it lost money is silly.
Only if it's more profitable than other things MS could be doing with the capital they have tied up in it.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
I like to bash MS/Ballmer as much as the next slashdotter, but I don't think that's true. He admits that it is a good idea. And his comments about "not much money being made" simply show the difference between his definition and your definition of "much money".
So you'd have them piss away more billions on a potentially unprofitable division, incurring years of loss for a chance to make a profit instead of having done exactly that, except they've finally gotten through to the profitable era of the division? You wouldn't happen to work for WaMu or something, would you?
but he should shut down his unprofitable ego-trip ventures like the Zune and the Xbox
The Xbox division is profitable, and it's been a long time coming. Unlike other parts of Microsoft, the Xbox division truly has an innovative product that is continually being improved in creative ways that benefit the user. The same can't really be said for Windows...
The Zune is also a very impressive piece of technology. Having played with one (and speaking as a loyal Mac user) I have to say it rips the hell out of the iPod classic's UI.
You've listed the two products that MS should not shut down under any circumstances - they're the only mass market items that have demonstrated any sort of creativity or innovation in the last while.
For a change though, I'd like to see MS be first in the game with their OS features - Windows (and to a lesser extent Windows Mobile) has been "me too-ing" their competitors forever now.
And as to "paying dividends", where exactly do you think the money to pay dividends comes from? I'll tell you where it comes from, profitable divisions, that's where.
MS Office and Windows are profitable divisions. The revenues they generate should be paid out as dividends, not spent on ego trips like the Xbox. Ballmer has wasted billions of his shareholders' money on lines of business that will never break even. Going cash-flow positive for a year or so doesn't make it profitable, it makes it potentially profitable if and only if that positive cash flow persists until the investment is recouped. As I mentioned above, MS needs twenty Halo-sized hits to get Xbox out of the red.
In the meantime, it distracts the company from addressing the fundamental flaws in their core business. Longhorn failed to ship. Vista was a two-year rush job that landed in the market with a muffled thud. They've got nothing in the pipeline to make Windows 7 any more interesting to customers than XP was. Apple and the Linux vendors are eroding their market share. These are all symptoms of Microsoft's management having a bad case of "Oooh! Shiny!", and wasting their time, money and attention on ego trips.
What you'll find after thinking about this for more than 10 seconds
Ah, there we go. If you don't know what you're talking about, then go for the ad hominem. Very classy.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
I didn't get where I am today making obscure Reginald Perrin references on Slashdot!
your point would be...
Just what you took time to demonstrate in your post, Microsoft was doing all of this crap before Apple.
Therefore, the comment "Monkey see, Monkey do", would better be suited at an attack at Apple, as they are the 'me too' once again. Of course their fanbois wouldn't know this, and probably still think they invented everything, as long as Apple marketing tries to make people believe it.
And yes Apple INTENTIONALLY tries to create this perception. When they run ads about the first 64bit computer - which the UK made they stop saying (and OS X still isn't even 64bit), and then use their marketing strength of cool to run ads about the iPhone or iPod 'revolutions' and then describe features that have been available for years.
But since the basic consumers and Apple fans didn't realize it existed before, they run to buy it and give Apple all the technology credit for crap they ripped off. Yes even the iPhone is a sad knock off. It looks like a rotary dial phone compared to phones in Japan and is very featureless compared to basic Windows Mobile devices people had been using for years. Can anyone say freaking voice dialing even, who in their right mind would release a bluetooth enabled device without any voice features? (And don't say iPhone=multi-touch, it is even a rip off, google TED multi-touch, let alone the Tablet PCs that were multi-touch enabled years before.)
I am tired of the myth of Microsoft is copying Apple crap, especially when Apple vampires the entire industry, puts a cute logo on it and people think it is the gold standard. Some of us had multi-GB MP3 players in the mid 90s, and phones with touch interfaces, real 3G, and even an OS running our own applications for almost 4 years before the iPhone.
The only thing Apple has done well is offer few choices and lock users into their products further, so people that are dumb as rocks feel 'comfortable' about using the product and don't have to worry about even which store to buy the song from.
So ya, Monkey See, Monkey Do - Apple keep up the rip offs for as long as people are stupid enough to believe your marketing, a time will come when people find out they were duped.