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NASA and Google To Back New "Singularity University"

Slatterz and Keith Kleiner were among several readers to send in word of Singularity University, announced at TED today by Ray Kurzweil. He and X Prize founder Peter Diamandis began talking about creating the school last year, after Diamandis read Kurzweil's 2005 book The Singularity is Near. NASA and Google are both supporting the project, NASA with space and Google with cash. The school aims to foster "disruptive innovation." As envisioned, Singularity U. will sponsor 3-day and 10-day courses for executives year-round, and its main offering will be a single 9-week course of study over the summer for 120 students, each of which will pay $25,000 for the privilege. Announced faculty so far includes Nobel Prize winning physicist George Smoot, NASA Ames chief scientist Stephanie Langhoff, Vint Cerf, and Will Wright, creator of the video games Spore and The Sims.

294 comments

  1. Singularity University? by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 2, Funny

    Watch out. I hear the bang the follows is a doozy!

    1. Re:Singularity University? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Who doesn't like a doozy of a bang?

    2. Re:Singularity University? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      Apparently my wife.

    3. Re:Singularity University? by RMH101 · · Score: 3, Funny

      She does. Trust me.

  2. Doing != Teaching by LingNoi · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I don't think this is going to work because although these people are the top in their fields, it doesn't make them good teachers, which is important if you're paying $25,000 for a 10 day course.

    1. Re:Doing != Teaching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Not to mention... what could they possibly do in 10 days except inspire you or perhaps show you some neat things you had not seen before. Hardly worth the large price tag. It's like paying $30k/year for college to get a Liberal Arts degree.

    2. Re:Doing != Teaching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Believe me, some of my lecturers can't teach either. I can still learn from them.

    3. Re:Doing != Teaching by genner · · Score: 5, Informative

      I don't think this is going to work because although these people are the top in their fields, it doesn't make them good teachers, which is important if you're paying $25,000 for a 10 day course.

      It will work because it looks great on a resume which is all modern education is good for anyway.

    4. Re:Doing != Teaching by collinstocks · · Score: 5, Informative

      ...and its main offering will be a single 9-week course of study over the summer for 120 students, each of which will pay $25,000 for the privilege...

      You obviously missed that part.

      Other than that, you make a good point, though.

    5. Re:Doing != Teaching by martin-boundary · · Score: 5, Funny

      However, it *is* going to work because at the end of two weeks, those guys will have collected 120 * $25,000 = $3m from a bunch of idiots.

    6. Re:Doing != Teaching by DiegoBravo · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The same as with MBAs, pay 30k/year in order to listen the obvious, sometimes from funny teachers... BUT at the end, make commercially interesting relationships.

    7. Re:Doing != Teaching by Elektroschock · · Score: 2, Funny

      The only problem is that you get disrupted all the time.

    8. Re:Doing != Teaching by lawpoop · · Score: 1

      Remember, as we approach the singularity, technology speeds up, or something like that, so if you're unsatisfied with what they can offer now, wait a year or two; you'll be able to get a full PhD in just two week's time.

      --
      Computers are useless. They can only give you answers.
      -- Pablo Picasso
    9. Re:Doing != Teaching by FooAtWFU · · Score: 1
      Silly. Nobody pays $30,000 a year to get a liberal arts degree... They pay $30,000 a year for their children to get a liberal arts degree. Because they have $30,000 just sitting around.

      Or you get tuition assistance / scholarships / etc.

      --
      The World Wide Web is dying. Soon, we shall have only the Internet.
    10. Re:Doing != Teaching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      But even the greatest teacher won't teach very well if they don't know their stuff...

      Sometimes the only people who will do are the ones who are the best in their field, and the students just have to make up for the teacher's lack of teaching skill with their own learning skill.

    11. Re:Doing != Teaching by tehgnome · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Or as a struggling student you work your ass off/put yourself in debt and hope things work out in the end. Not flaming just saying.

      --
      She must be a TIGER in the bathroom... I mean bedroom... ~Ryan
    12. Re:Doing != Teaching by pilkch · · Score: 1

      If NASA is providing space and each student is paying $25,000 where does Google come in? Also for $25,000 per 10 days, what is the teacher:student ratio like?

    13. Re:Doing != Teaching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      A student can't realistically make $30,000 a year while being in school. They go to a state school (typically tuition $6,000) and usually get financial aid while working their ass off.

    14. Re:Doing != Teaching by LingNoi · · Score: 1

      I got it wrong, it's not 10 days it's 9 weeks.

    15. Re:Doing != Teaching by hplus · · Score: 2, Insightful

      How the hell did this get modded informative? Regardless of how effective "modern education" (as a monolithic entity) is, it certainly is worth more than words on a resume.

    16. Re:Doing != Teaching by tnk1 · · Score: 1

      Well I need something to do with the company's extra 45 mil dollars now that they frown on buying jets with it.

      I hope this "training" is at a nice resort.

    17. Re:Doing != Teaching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...Scientology?

    18. Re:Doing != Teaching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't think this is going to work because although these people are the top in their fields, it doesn't make them good teachers, which is important if you're paying $25,000 for a 10 day course.

      I guarantee, anybody who paid that much to be taught by Vint Cerf will want their money back. If he ever did have "it", he's lost it now. One word: "IPv6".

    19. Re:Doing != Teaching by Yvanhoe · · Score: 1

      Plus, Kurzweil is a crackpot. Not a researcher. And yes, I am a singularist. He is as embarrassing as Michael Moore is for a democrat.

      --
      The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
    20. Re:Doing != Teaching by RMH101 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      ...and by then I'll be a weakly god-like entity, therefore making my observations much more on target.

    21. Re:Doing != Teaching by Coolpup · · Score: 1

      I don't think this is going to work because although these people are the top in their fields, it doesn't make them good teachers, which is important if you're paying $25,000 for a 10 day course.

      The $25k experience is the 9-week course, not the 10-day. Then again, no one has said if they're going 5 days a week for the full 9 weeks or if it's a 2 or 3 day a week thing. Also, professing or lecturing != teaching. My college professors made sure to emphasize this a lot.

    22. Re:Doing != Teaching by Tekfactory · · Score: 1

      In TFS it states the 25K course is the 9 week one, not the sponsored 3 and 10 day ones.

    23. Re:Doing != Teaching by Metasquares · · Score: 1

      Sorry, but education has been going in the opposite direction. Presumably as there is now much more to learn, PhDs are becoming longer and longer on average. The average age of a first significant discovery has increased as well.

    24. Re:Doing != Teaching by Metasquares · · Score: 1

      But he's a crackpot that people take seriously. The very existence of this university is a testament to that. It'd be great if I could just get Google and NASA to donate tons of money and a campus for the school I'm trying to build, and then have some Nobel winners and Will Wright rush to sign up as faculty. Somehow I doubt that this would have played out in that way if it weren't Kurzweil heading it, however.

    25. Re:Doing != Teaching by BitHive · · Score: 1

      Welcome to Slashdot, where intellectual achievement is simply the feeling of superiority you get from knowing more about computers than most people care to.

    26. Re:Doing != Teaching by ZarathustraDK · · Score: 1

      Here in Denmark we get paid to study after the age of 18...roughly $700 every month...universities included...

      Oh, and we have universal healthcare...and hot girls...and LEGO...

      --
      If you quote this signature there'll be 72 copies of Windows ME waiting for you in Heaven.
    27. Re:Doing != Teaching by linzeal · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Anyone saying they can predict the future with an arbitrary degree of certainty is a crackpot. ---- Note the period

    28. Re:Doing != Teaching by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      But what have these crutches that you lean on gained you? In your smug self-satisfaction, you fail to see the obvious. Danish accomplishments in the advancements of the human race are utterly insignificant. If Denmark disappeared tomorrow, nobody would care and the world would be practically unaffected. I can think of a certain country that doesn't have universal health-care or free university education that if it disappeared, the effects would be catastrophic. Your pathetic patch of dirt doesn't even compare.

      And, furthermore, if you think those dogs you have in Europe are hot, you've obviously never been to southern California.

    29. Re:Doing != Teaching by McGiraf · · Score: 1

      "you've obviously never been to southern California" where you have the choice between fat or silicone girls!

    30. Re:Doing != Teaching by genner · · Score: 1

      Welcome to Slashdot, where intellectual achievement is simply the feeling of superiority you get from knowing more about computers than most people care to.

      or anime, or video games.

      Really it could be anything, computer aren't actually necessary.

    31. Re:Doing != Teaching by genner · · Score: 1

      How the hell did this get modded informative? Regardless of how effective "modern education" (as a monolithic entity) is, it certainly is worth more than words on a resume.

      If it's not effective, why is it worth anything beyond the resume?

  3. But the real question is... by zerospeaks · · Score: 5, Funny

    Will it blend?

    --
    http://wwww.zerospeaks.com
    1. Re:But the real question is... by zappepcs · · Score: 1

      Wow, I was just thinking along those lines. This is like iEducation or something. I was in boot camp for 9 weeks, and I witnessed people that couldn't learn to tie their shoes in that length of time. If you are graduate level, and very skilled at learning, 25K might be okay for a summer of learning. The target market for this has to be pretty small.. I would think anyway.

      I want to see it blend, or at least produce something.

      I'd not mind spending 9 weeks with very smart people filling in the gaps in what I know. It never seems to work that way, but of course I don't have 25k in the kitchen change jar.

  4. here we go by QuantumG · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Is it just me or is Kurzweil turning his cult into a religion?

    --
    How we know is more important than what we know.
    1. Re:here we go by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 4, Insightful

      What makes you say so? I'm not any kind of fan Kurzweil or his technology singularity concept (I've heard of it, but haven't read any of Kurzweil's writing on the subject), but the idea is absolutely intriguing. Not only that, it's entirely possible he may be right. Ray Kurzweil is a very smart man who has always been at the forefront of technological development.

    2. Re:here we go by argent · · Score: 1

      Is it just me or is that redundant?

    3. Re:here we go by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Not really. Cult = small, unpopular religion. Religion = large, popular cult. The basic idea is the same, of course; the difference is in magnitude and some popular form of legitimacy.

    4. Re:here we go by quickOnTheUptake · · Score: 1

      is it me, or is that both a contradiction and a set of circular definitions?
      cult != religion
      but
      cult = (a type of) religion
      and
      religion = (a type of) cult

      --
      Mod points: Guaranteed to remove your sense of humor.
      Side effects may include gullibility and temporary retardation
    5. Re:here we go by tomcode · · Score: 1

      ted:cult owl:subclassOf foaf:religion

      --
      f u cn rd ths u cn gt a gd jb n cmptr prgmng
    6. Re:here we go by CannonballHead · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Ah, no.

      A cult is an "extremist" group that broke off of a religion. Thus a "Christian cult" is different from a "Muslim cult." It's more akin to "sect" except that it is typically viewed as heretical by the majority of the religion. For example, a "Christian cult" would be Heavens Gate or (depending on who you ask) even a group such as Mormons of Jehovah's Witnesses. Not being a Muslim, I don't know much about their cults.

      Even google agrees. Or rather, wordnet.princeton.edu

      • followers of an exclusive system of religious beliefs and practices
      • fad: an interest followed with exaggerated zeal; "he always follows the latest fads"; "it was all the rage that season"
      • followers of an unorthodox, extremist, or false religion or sect who often live outside of conventional society under the direction of a charismatic leader
      • a religion or sect that is generally considered to be unorthodox, extremist, or false; "it was a satanic cult"

      Keywords are "unorthodox" and "extremist" which tend to be relative terms based on what IS "orthodox" and "non-extermist" (normal?). So a "Christian cult" is going to be unorthodox, and obviously that orthodoxy isn't going to be defined by, say, a Muslim, or some other religion.

    7. Re:here we go by inputdev · · Score: 3, Interesting
    8. Re:here we go by geekoid · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Don't even start.

      The difference between a cult and a religion is 100 years.
      What about Catholics? are they a cult? How about Lutherans?
      All religions fell under the definitions you list at one point in their history.

      Cult: A group of people who blindly follow a person or ideology with no verifiable evidence.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    9. Re:here we go by Blublu · · Score: 2

      What he probably meant is that the only difference between a cult and religion is size. If you have only a few followers, you have a cult. If you have a million or more followers, you have a religion.

      --
      meh
    10. Re:here we go by quickOnTheUptake · · Score: 1

      I suspect that you are right; The irony was that the post was meant to clarify one minor problem but simply confirmed and augmented it. But perhaps I'm just being pedantic.

      --
      Mod points: Guaranteed to remove your sense of humor.
      Side effects may include gullibility and temporary retardation
    11. Re:here we go by geekoid · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Smart does not equal right.

      For it to happen means mankind no longer has imagination, creativity, and individuality.
      Quite frankly, I can't imagine the entire human race losing the imagination. It is what allows us to be at the top.

      Kurzweil is taken the proposition stated by I. J. Good and is turning it into a religion.

      He proposes that 'Moore's law' will apply to all technology and assumes IC development will not change.

      Yes, it seems intriguing, but I first read about it in OMNI* in 1983. Vinge wrote it,I believe.
      The technology is still 50 years away.
      I'll take cold fusion..it's only 5 years away~

      *Best magazine ever. Especially when Bova was in charge. Guccione ruined with his damn red pages.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    12. Re:here we go by CannonballHead · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Thank you for posting your own definition. I am actually IN the religious groupings (being part of a religion, that is), and I even cited an outside source... :)

      Catholics are not a cult, unless you talk to conservative evangelical Christians. It kinda depends on what dogma/doctrine of the RCC one looks at and how it is interpreted. It can get somewhat complex.

      Lutherans are not a cult. Lutherans have basically orthodox teachings.

      What one particular religion or sect is considered DOES change. Who said it didn't? What is a sect now may end up becoming more "popular" and the "original" may end up being a "sect." For example, 600 years ago, it was Roman Catholic or nothing, as far as "mainstream" things were considered. And yes, back then if you held to non-RCC you were a "cult" or, in more popular terms, a "heretic." In the present day, that is different, and the RCC is less heretic-happy than it was 600 years ago. Lutherans, Baptists, Methodists, Presbyterians, etc., all are "orthodox" Christian denominations. Heavens Gate, Worldwide Church of God (at least when it started), Unitarians, etc., are not.

      Who gets to decide what "orthodox" means may change. (note the distinction: who determines what is "commonly accepted" may change, but that is different from saying what is actually true or not changes... in other words, I'm not advocating a post-modern position in epistemology)

    13. Re:here we go by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 1

      Smart does not equal right.

      No, but it increases the odds at least.

      He proposes that 'Moore's law' will apply to all technology and assumes IC development will not change.

      And I realize that IC development already has changed. For example, while Moore's law has held constant in relation to chip densities, clock speeds haven't improved nearly at the rate that they were in the last few years. OTOH, I also propose that clock speeds aren't as relevant as people think they are: it's all about improving performance and higher clock speed != more performance (at least not always).

      Yes, it seems intriguing, but I first read about it in OMNI* in 1983. Vinge wrote it,I believe. The technology is still 50 years away.

      Maybe Kurzweil's timeline is slipping, but that doesn't invalidate his thesis entirely. Perhaps this massive change Kurzweil is talking about will take longer or will take a form he didn't predict.

      AFA OMNI goes, I remember that magazine vaguely. Of course, in 1983, I was only 11.

    14. Re:here we go by geekoid · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Actually, it's not mine. I forgot to give the credit where the credit belongs. It was said by Michael Shermer

      Oh, so at what point did the Catholics stop becoming a cult, as per the definitions you listed?
      Same for Lutherans.

      The term Catholic goes back to abput 105/6. It was meaning Universal...but some how I thinkg the Romans and Jews may have a different take.
      This is obvious if you study the time, perios and events that were happening at the time the letter was written.

      Of course, you have read the Letter to the Smyrnaeans ? and studied the founding of the church?

      To say ANY christian* religion isn't a cult as per the definitions you gave is absurd.

      All this brings me to my point:
      Either define a moment when something moves from 'cult' to 'religion', or it's just a larger cult.

      Stop trying to ahve it both ways.

      I specifically mention Christian because that's what we are discussing, I can come up with similar historical examples for most religions.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    15. Re:here we go by bnenning · · Score: 1

      The difference between a cult and a religion is 100 years.

      That sounds about right. Exhibits A and B: Mormonism and Scientology.

      --
      How to solve most of our problems: 1.Lots of nuclear plants. 2.Cure aging.
    16. Re:here we go by durrr · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You seem to have some misconceptions about what the singularity is, it simply means things are improving a bit faster than before, as in, it's moving so fast we have trouble actually following the development, sortof like today, only that when you you visit slashdot you'll be facing two months content in todays rate in a single day.

      We are already extremely dependant on machine and internet connections to keep up the rate today, our dependence and rate of immersion will simply increase along with the rate of progress. I don't really see where the loss of imagination, creativity and individuality comes into play here.

      Also, religion usually lacks scientific basis and contains supernatural aspects, it's sortof what makes it a religion, the concept of the singularity may perhaps be a bit naive but it's not a religion. Sure it sounds a bit romantic and head in the clouds to dream of the Time of Change when the world will turn utopian but as a matter of fact we are living in a time of change and extremely rapid progress right at the moment, it's only the utopian part that's missing but the situation is rapidly improving for the average human.

    17. Re:here we go by bnenning · · Score: 4, Insightful

      For it to happen means mankind no longer has imagination, creativity, and individuality.

      I don't understand this. None of those are necessarily eliminated by a singularity; if anything they're more likely to become stronger.

      --
      How to solve most of our problems: 1.Lots of nuclear plants. 2.Cure aging.
    18. Re:here we go by badboy_tw2002 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Not that I'm on board with all his predictions (I did find the book interesting). What you're describing is towards the tail end of it - his main proposition is still that machine intelligence (and enhanced human intelligence) will lead to faster and faster scientific breakthroughs, which lead to smarter machines, which leads to....the singularity is dependent on new generations of people/machines that can improve on their own intelligence.

      I think of course the part he missed is when they wake up the first smarter than human computer intelligence. They tell it to go to work on making something smarter than itself, and it tells them to "GTFO, I'm going to be a screenwriter, not a stupid nerdy computer scientist!"

    19. Re:here we go by atraintocry · · Score: 0

      Define progress. Preferably in a way that its "rate" can be objectively measured, and the acceleration of that rate can be predicted.

      The singularity is intellectual posturing, not science. It was born of a sci-fi author and the idea has attracted followers who believe it to be true. Not unlike what happened with LRH and Dianetics. Kurzweil is not the conman that LHR aspired to be but scientist he ain't.

    20. Re:here we go by Flere+Imsaho · · Score: 1

      It's not Ray fucking Kurzweil's cult. Vernor Vinge coined the term Singularity back in '93

      --
      It gripped her hand gently. 'Regret is for humans,' it said.
    21. Re:here we go by Hao+Wu · · Score: 1

      Is it just me or is Kurzweil turning his cult into a religion?

      Ironic how egalitarians are the most elitist hypocrites sometimes. For some reason technocrats often fall into this category.

      The only reason they obsess about equality and human rights is because they secretly know what abusive jerks they are themselves. They could solve most of the issues they raise by fixing their own personalities and stop with their "advocacy" (ie. lobbying).

      Naturally their real goal is power and self-validation, since the Utopia they sell you isn't likely to function without their divine leadership.

      --
      I suggest you read Slashdot
    22. Re:here we go by roguetrick · · Score: 1

      Quite frankly, I can't imagine the entire human race losing the imagination.

      O rly?

      --
      -The world would be a better place if everyone had a hoverboard
    23. Re:here we go by ClassMyAss · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Smart does not equal right.

      True enough. But pointing that out does not make him or his arguments wrong, either.

      For it to happen means mankind no longer has imagination, creativity, and individuality.

      To say that creating computers advanced enough to surpass ourselves proves that we have "lost" imagination and creativity is a stretch, to say the least. To me it would seem to prove the contrary.

      Whether it will happen or not, and in particular whether Kurzweil's timeline is correct, is another issue; as many have pointed out, futurists love to predict that the most fantastic things will happen right near the end of their lifetimes, so his "live forever" claims may be borne of hope more than reason. But the Moore's law claims don't seem as wild to me, since he is very explicit about noting that it has nothing to do with the particulars of the chips, but about the fact that the total computing power tends to follow the law with only minor divergences as one technology dies out and is replaced by one that scales better.

      Kurzweil is taken the proposition stated by I. J. Good and is turning it into a religion.

      Personally, I feel the label "religion" is a bit inappropriate whenever log-log plots are a crucial part of the pitch. Feel free to disagree.

    24. Re:here we go by lee1026 · · Score: 1

      I don't think that is a problem - the nice part about computer programs is that they are not exactly hard to duplicate. You can just keep trying until one is willing to program better AIs.

    25. Re:here we go by linhares · · Score: 1

      Quite frankly, I can't imagine the entire human race losing the imagination.

      O rly?

      Chillout, roguetrick. He must be new here.

    26. Re:here we go by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Arguing that religions are just larger cults because there's no clear demarcation is like arguing that adults are just larger children because there's no clear demarcation.

    27. Re:here we go by dbIII · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Oh, so at what point did the Catholics stop becoming a cult

      Right around the point where they run hospitals, schools and soup kitchens.

      Scientologists on the other hand do not appear to do anything at all for the benefit of society or even of those members that are not in the upper reaches of the pyramid scheme - actually I wouldn't even call them a cult, although there are things like Magnificant Meal that are called cults but were also designed and run for financial purposes.

      It's time to reach for the dictionary instead of the increasingly popular technique of giving words a meaning that feels good.

    28. Re:here we go by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I thought the above parent was pretty clear. Something goes from a cult to a religion when it becomes orthodox-aka a general and widely accepted belief at the place and time. Note that cult is generally used in a negative sense, but cults don't necessarily have to be populated by crazies-its just that most of them are small for a reason, and 90% of everything is crap in the first place.

      In some senses you are correct, a religion is similar to a large cult. But it's useful to make a distinction between the two, and there are plenty of practical differences. Furthermore, a belief system is correct or incorrect no matter how many people believe it. I guess I am trying to explain that for you to say "Cults are bad, religion is bad, therefore religion is a cult, and is bad" is needlessly obfuscating perfectly good terminology for two related but separate things

    29. Re:here we go by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Until the AIs look for porn and get some viruses. Shit, maybe the virus will be AI as well.

    30. Re:here we go by lee1026 · · Score: 1

      Why would they have desire for porn at all?

    31. Re:here we go by mgblst · · Score: 1

      How could catholics be a cult, they are the original christians. The lutherans, church of englanders could be cults of catholicism.

    32. Re:here we go by coaxial · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Not really. It's pseudoscience. It's as John Horgan so succulently called it, "The Rapture for nerds," or as Mitch Kapor devastate said, "[It's] Intelligent design for the IQ 140 people."

      Kurtzweil takes makes some safe predictions, then makes the same almost believable prediction that's been made for the past 20 years -- that full immersion VR is just around the corner (a dead concept, since there really isn't any compelling reason for it; and let's face it, it's the 1980s version of the atomic-powered-flying-cars prediction.), then applies exponential growth to predict that by 2050 everyone will have their minds uploaded into the computer that used to be called the planet Earth, and then will transport themselves at superluminal velocites to form nanofog bodies throughout the universe, and everywhere Humans++ go, the matter will transmuted into a giant computer. Seriously. We're never going to die. And conveniently -- most conveniently -- this immortality is going to come around just in time to save Kurzweil and Aubrey de Grey's own lives. (Funny how everyone that has predicted that actual immortality will be here Real Soon Now(TM) always makes the prediction that it will save their own lives.)

      Kurzweil's assumption of exponential advancement of general technology (Let's assume for the sake of argument that historical advancement is true, as per his slide.) will continue ad infinum, or at least the 50 years he says it will take to convert the entire universe into one big computer is preposterous on prima facia. It's as if Kurzweil never heard the story about why assuming exponential growth forever is bad. As the fortune file recounts:

      It is reported that in 1977 there were 37 Elvis impersonators in the world. In 1993 there were 48,000. At this rate, by the year 2010 one out of every three people in the world will be an Elvis impersonator.

      It's all predictions that don't even make sense. I don't understand why anyone, let alone anyone even halfway scientifically minded, would take him seriously.

    33. Re:here we go by coaxial · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Personally, I feel the label "religion" is a bit inappropriate whenever log-log plots are a crucial part of the pitch. Feel free to disagree.

      Okay, pseudoscience

      Bonus counter point to your log-log plot remark: Scientology has 1950s scifi styled lie detectors as a crucial part of their religion. And the Catholic church one time published long treaties on just how many angels could physically dance on the head of a pin, so you see the trappings of science, don't make it science.

    34. Re:here we go by coaxial · · Score: 1

      It's not a religion. It's pseudoscience.

    35. Re:here we go by rufty_tufty · · Score: 1

      It'd be easy to make for them they just need to watch the reproductive act for machines:

      cp big_muscular_file innocent_looking_file

      although finding candidates above 18yo for this process could be tricky...

      --
      "The weirdest thing about a mind, is that every answer that you find, is the basis of a brand new cliche" -
    36. Re:here we go by rufty_tufty · · Score: 1

      hate to reply to myself, but it occurred to me you could also have BDSM for AIs by:

      chmod a-w file2
      sudo cp -f file1 file2

      Although what AIs think about the sticky bit would be another issue...

      --
      "The weirdest thing about a mind, is that every answer that you find, is the basis of a brand new cliche" -
    37. Re:here we go by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Cult: A group of people who blindly follow a person or ideology with no verifiable evidence.

      You've summed up religion!

    38. Re:here we go by mrrudge · · Score: 1

      A great deal of the difference between a religion and a cult is transparency. Religions are generally open to outsiders, and cults are not.

      Oh, and just a bit pedantic, that was a great description. ( :

    39. Re:here we go by BradleyAndersen · · Score: 1

      You realize, I hope, that you just agreed that all organized religions are cults. This is correct, if we are being pedantic. Just sayin' ... good for you!

    40. Re:here we go by StalinsNotDead · · Score: 1

      Created in the image of their creator?

      --
      Thanks to the internet, we can now all die alone together! -SomeWoman
    41. Re:here we go by Kartoffel · · Score: 1

      Mar's Law: Everything is linear if plotted log-log with a fat magic marker.

      The difference with religion is that they don't even pretend to uphold scientific rigor. To true believers it's the beauty and mystery of faith. To outsiders, it's batshit irrationality.

    42. Re:here we go by Kartoffel · · Score: 1

      People still believe that flying cars are only 5 years away, too.

      I'd like to point out that NASA is merely loaning the classroom space. This does not imply agreement or support from all corners of said administration.

    43. Re:here we go by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Members of those cults/religions tend to be large children.

    44. Re:here we go by geekoid · · Score: 1

      "How could Catholics be a cult, they are the original Christians. "

      HAHAhahah.. societies Christian dogma has really brainwashed you.

      What about the Jews and Romans that were around 2000 years ago? Christianity was a Guy and 12 followers telling everyone they had it wrong that eventually lead to there leader having himself intentionally killed.

      Put it in today's framework.
      What would you think if there was a guy going around, constantly telling everyone they had it wrong, then intentionally challenged authority to the point where he gets kills.
      The his 12 follower said No No, he's not dead he rose again, and for proof, we have no body.
      You would immediately tag it as Cult, and you would be correct.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    45. Re:here we go by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Exactly my point.
      People want to make some differentiation that makes their crazy shit OK, but everyone else is wrong. This is very apparent with even the most basic glance and religion history.

      We are talking about Catholics, so lets use this 'Religion' as an example.

      The practice ritual cannibalism. They worship the death of a person*.
      Really.

      *The crucifix is very Ironic. It's worshipping the WORST part. Dying and claiming your dying for someone else is easy..it's the return that's hard.
      oh wait, there isn't any proof of that.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    46. Re:here we go by geekoid · · Score: 1

      No, my point was that all religions are cults, it just takes 100 years to become 'accepted'.

      http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/cult

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    47. Re:here we go by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Nope.
      Many Cults will tell you exactly what they do and why, and then you end up wearing white tennis shoes and dead.
      Many Religions aren't transparent. Some you can't even get into their church.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    48. Re:here we go by geekoid · · Score: 1

      No, it's strife, drive, motivation, desire and challenge that ignites are imagination, creativity, and individuality.

      Having some technology that handles all that, we will loose ourselves.

      Very little comes from people that are comfortable where they are.

      I would also add Industrial Solar Thermal to your sig. There are places Nuclear is difficult to get going. Solar Thermal can be set up much easier and it is easier to maintain.
      I am not anti Nuclear, and would love to see massive ramp ups of IFRs.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    49. Re:here we go by geekoid · · Score: 1

      "Also, religion usually lacks scientific basis and contains supernatural aspects"

      Singularity depends on blind faith in technology and technology development.

      We aren't 'keeping up' at all. It's ridiculous to say so because there has been too much for anyone to keep up with. Sure, you may keep up in your tiny area of interest, there is so much more.

      For all time all development has been faster then anyone can keep up with, globally.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    50. Re:here we go by geekoid · · Score: 1

      "..smarter machines,"
      Don't we need a smart machine first?

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    51. Re:here we go by geekoid · · Score: 2, Interesting

      My point was to counter who I was replying to. They were using some sort of 'Ad intelligentium' argument.

      Craeting machines 'smarter' then us is needed t accomplish singularity, but it is not singularity.

      in his The Age of Spiritual Machines his prediction for 2099 is Singlarity. The merging of computer and human 'minds'

      Even if the technology is there why would machine want to hobble themselves and be merged with us?

      If that did happen we would become, effectively and perhaps literally, one mind. If that happens we all loose individuality. Individuality is critical for imagination and creativity.

      The man invented the synthesizer and pioneered OCR..since then...?

      And to be truth, I am really suspicious of anyone that labels themselves 'futurist'.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    52. Re:here we go by CannonballHead · · Score: 1

      Sleep interrupts slashdot. oh well. :)

      Catholic means universal, yes. I used the term "Roman Catholic Church" to refer to the actual religious group.

      I have studied the founding of "the church," yes. I'm curious what "the church" is, in your definition, though :)

      My main point is that "cult" is a word that is somewhat relative, as it refers to orthodoxy or unorthodoxy. Thus, it depends on who uses it. If the RCC says something is a "cult" it is using itself as the "orthodox" and comparing the cult to it. It seems that we are arguing from two positions; you would like a global definition of "cult" (similar to "religion") and I am arguing for a relative definition of "cult" that refers to the orthodoxy of the actual beliefs.

    53. Re:here we go by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What cult? What does engineering and problem solving have to do with a cult, or beliefs, or anything like that?

    54. Re:here we go by CodeBuster · · Score: 1

      Why not? That is what Hubbard did with his.

    55. Re:here we go by Raenex · · Score: 1

      full immersion VR is just around the corner (a dead concept, since there really isn't any compelling reason for it;

      Are you kidding me? Besides the huge entertainment value, there would be plenty of educational opportunities. Now whether such technology becomes feasible any time soon is another story.

    56. Re:here we go by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well... there's a pancake restaurant in my city that's owned and run by scientologists. Does that count as something for the benefit of society?

    57. Re:here we go by spun · · Score: 1

      Nice hypothesis, but I've heard those assertions before and I don't buy it. People are not lazy automatons motivated only by survival instinct. Look at Maslow's heirarchy of needs. The more comfortable we are, the more energy we have to pursue higher goals. Look at history, when basic needs have been met such and people have free time, as in ancient Greece, or during the renaissance, people turn to arts and sciences.

      Kurzweil's singularity concept does not rest solely on non-human AI, it also addresses technology that augments human intelligence. And who exactly would be telling the AIs what to think about? We needn't make them our masters, even if they are more intelligent we can create them with a desire to serve us selflessly.

      In short, you make a common assertion not backed up by reasoning. It may appear self-evident to you that comfortable humans do no work, but it isn't to me. You may assume that humanity would wither and die in the face of unquestionable superiority, but I feel that we will blossom under those circumstances. Why exactly do you feel we wouldn't?

      --
      - None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
    58. Re:here we go by spun · · Score: 1

      Why would machines 'want' anything but what we build them to want?

      How is individuality critical for imagination or creativity? I'd say just the opposite. Raise a man in a closet with no outside contact and he won't even be a man, let alone creative. Creativity and imagination need material to work with, and that material do not come from 'individuality.'

      That being said, I still think Kurzweil is a loon. I've just never understood your particular point of view on this, though I've heard it from many people. Not saying you're wrong, but it seems like a knee jerk primal fear kind of reaction, not a reasoned critique.

      --
      - None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
    59. Re:here we go by Estanislao+Mart�nez · · Score: 1

      What you're describing is towards the tail end of it - his main proposition is still that machine intelligence (and enhanced human intelligence) will lead to faster and faster scientific breakthroughs, which lead to smarter machines, which leads to....the singularity is dependent on new generations of people/machines that can improve on their own intelligence.

      Yup. And this has the serious problem that "improving their own intelligence" is a completely undefined concept. (I'd go further and say undefinable, but one step at a time.)

      I think of course the part he missed is when they wake up the first smarter than human computer intelligence. They tell it to go to work on making something smarter than itself, and it tells them to "GTFO, I'm going to be a screenwriter, not a stupid nerdy computer scientist!"

      That joke can be generalized: perhaps "intelligent," when you really get down to it, just means "like us": something is intelligent when it deals with its environment and with people the way that we do. In that case, "superintelligence" is just an oxymoron, because nothing could be more like us than we already are.

      More narrowly, your joke also suggests that their view of what a "superintelligence" would do is infected with value judgements about what kind of projects are important to pursue (in this case, science and technology). And thus, that their measuring standard about whether a machine was "superintelligent" might implicitly be that the machine is better at science and technology than its inventors, as judged by how the inventors value of what the machine does. So, perhaps the inventors would judge your machine as actually not being "superintelligent," simply because they think that scientists are intelligent people and screenwriters are stupid people, and thus they would judge an artificial superscientist as superintelligent, but an artificial superscreenwriter as superstupid.

      And this points to another very general and very common problem with folks like Kurzweil: they are profoundly confused about facts and values, and their arguments are more often than not trying to pass value judgements as fact judgements. If "intelligence" is best seen as a value instead of a fact, i.e., if we see "intelligence" as a relation between persons that is based on what people want and expect out of each other, the whole concept of "superintelligence" falls apart, because then a "superintelligence" is nothing more than a machine that we judge to be more intelligent than ourselves, which makes it a fact about how people relate to machines, and not some objective property of the machine itself.

    60. Re:here we go by badboy_tw2002 · · Score: 1

      Yeah, that's a pretty interesting point. Intelligence isn't well understood, so the gaping whole in all of it is "intelligence + 1 = ?". In Kurzweil's defense, he does call out that the initial intelligence or what we'd call "hard AI" wouldn't be much smarter than you or I, but it would have the "subtleties" of human intelligence, that is, logic, reasoning, independent thought, etc.

      His reasoning goes on to say that if you could simulate a human mind on a piece (many pieces) of silicon, then that human mind becomes subject to accelerating returns of hardware advancement. (This assumes hardware keeps advancing). So a mind that runs on my 2025 486 runs 32 times as fast on my 2035 PIV - and assuming there's advances in tech maybe it runs hundreds of times faster. Then you've got a brain that can cover a thousand years of thinking in one year.

      The gap I find in his logic is that a) the mind doesn't go mad because its inputs are happening really slowly (having a conversation with the outside world is like talking, waiting a day, then getting a response), b) that one guy sitting around for a thousand years will build something better than itself.

      I don't find the concept of machine intelligence ridiculous, but I find that Kurzweil flounders a bit trying to make predictions about what a true machine intelligence will be like as we're still so far away from producing one.

    61. Re:here we go by Estanislao+Mart�nez · · Score: 1

      Yeah, that's a pretty interesting point. Intelligence isn't well understood, so the gaping whole in all of it is "intelligence + 1 = ?".

      We more or less agree about that being a gaping hole, but I don't think it's even as simple as "intelligence isn't well understood"; to me, it's more along the lines of "all the cognitivist talk about 'intelligence' as an objective property is obscurantist." There is no fact of the matter as to whether anything is intelligent in the first place; it all comes down to a set of complex cultural discourses about human values and relationships, that can never be pinned down.

      His reasoning goes on to say that if you could simulate a human mind on a piece (many pieces) of silicon, then that human mind becomes subject to accelerating returns of hardware advancement. (This assumes hardware keeps advancing). So a mind that runs on my 2025 486 runs 32 times as fast on my 2035 PIV - and assuming there's advances in tech maybe it runs hundreds of times faster. Then you've got a brain that can cover a thousand years of thinking in one year.

      The gap I find in his logic is that a) the mind doesn't go mad because its inputs are happening really slowly (having a conversation with the outside world is like talking, waiting a day, then getting a response), b) that one guy sitting around for a thousand years will build something better than itself.

      I don't buy that argument either, as I said in another post which very much echoes what you say. I think I do go a bit further, in that I reject the assumption that such a "sped-up fake brain" would work at all in the first place.

      More generally, I'm skeptical about AI/cognition talk that focuses excessively on the brain, to the exclusion of environment and culture; see, as a general source of criticisim of that kind of thinking, embodied cognition.

      I don't find the concept of machine intelligence ridiculous, but I find that Kurzweil flounders a bit trying to make predictions about what a true machine intelligence will be like as we're still so far away from producing one.

      I find the concept of machine intelligence as interesting as the concept of swimming machines. When you get down to it and strip away a lot of rationalizations, we don't say that people are "intelligent" because of any one objective fact about people; we call them "intelligent" because of the way that we relate to them. Folks may some day build machines that we relate to very much like we relate to people, and that would require impressive technical feats, but it would be more fundamentally a cultural change on how people relate to machines than a scientific advance.

    62. Re:here we go by coaxial · · Score: 1

      What educational value beyond the current educational technology (e.g. books and mentoring) does VR actually give you? And keep in mind it has not only provide some value, but a value that offsets the increased cost of the VR environment to begin with? Wouldn't in the past 20 years we'd actually see these immersive VR environments in at least some form? The only thing close has been flight simulators, and they've been around for at least 60 years.

      Games? Tried that. No body wanted to purchase the hardware when a home console was almost just as good.

    63. Re:here we go by coaxial · · Score: 1

      I'd like to point out that NASA is merely loaning the classroom space. This does not imply agreement or support from all corners of said administration.

      I never thought it was an endorsement by NASA, but good point. NASA Ames will rent out big wings of the the building at Moffett as long as your checks clear.

    64. Re:here we go by Goaway · · Score: 1

      but the idea is absolutely intriguing.

      This is why people want to believe it.

      Not only that, it's entirely possible he may be right.

      Unfortunately, this is far less likely. His ideas are based on really simple mathematical mistakes, and it should be fairly obvious why he is not right, if one just wants to look critically at what he is saying. The problem is that his tales are fascinating enough that people don't want to find out they are not true.

    65. Re:here we go by Raenex · · Score: 1

      What educational value beyond the current educational technology (e.g. books and mentoring) does VR actually give you?

      Driving simulator. Training missions for the military. Surgery. Mockups for construction projects. Home walkthroughs for buyers and renters. There are alternatives now, but a fully immersive virtual reality would be useful if it was cheap, accessible, and pliable. That dedicated flight simulator I'm sure costs tons of money. This is like arguing 60 years ago that only a few people in the world need computers, because they are so big, expensive, and of limited use. If the technology was feasible in the same way that computers became feasible, there would be plenty of uses.

      Games? Tried that. No body wanted to purchase the hardware when a home console was almost just as good.

      Interesting item. But it cost $60k, and I doubt that the tech was all that great for the money. Consoles aren't "almost just as good". Twiddling a controller with your thumbs while watching the action on a television would pale in comparison to a fully immersive VR. I think the success of the Wii shows a demand for this kind of product. Now throw in Internet play, much better technology, and consumer prices then you'd have a winner. Again, I'm not saying this is feasible, but I won't discount it.

    66. Re:here we go by spun · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Haha, thanks for that. I love to piss off idiots like you. You can't argue for shit, your tiny little mind is only capable of hatred and frothing outrage, and you're dumb enough to admit it in public. Wow.

      --
      - None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
    67. Re:here we go by spun · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      Are you really this much of a closed minded ass, or is someone trolling in your name?

      --
      - None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
  5. TED conference by Rei · · Score: 3, Insightful

    its main offering will be a single 9-week course of study over the summer for 120 students, each of which will pay $25,000 for the privilege

    Well, that should help them get rid of that surplus cash. It's really in the spirit of TED, though. How much are the tickets to get into the Technology, Entertainment, Design conference -- $4k? $6k? It's basically an event where you pay for the privilege of schmoozing with famous people, be they celebrities, scientists, politicians, etc.

    Still, some interesting news has come out of the conference (re. Aptera).

    --
    Nothing says 'welcome to the neighborhood' like a gunny sack full of dead squirrels.
    1. Re:TED conference by TubeSteak · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Where the hell are grad and post-grad students supposed to dig up $25,000 for a 3 month course?

      I'm surprised Google isn't putting up cash for an endowment that will allow the "singularity university" to pick students based on merit instead of means.

      --
      [Fuck Beta]
      o0t!
    2. Re:TED conference by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Posting as AC to preserve moderation.

      Seriously? You're surprised a megacorp like google isn't passing money around?

      This whole plan isn't about learning, it's about ego stroking and milking money off of idiot nerds.

    3. Re:TED conference by geekoid · · Score: 1

      I'm not convinced. People are going to get into that thing and try to drive it like a car, and then die.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    4. Re:TED conference by Hao+Wu · · Score: 2, Interesting

      It's basically an event where you pay for the privilege of schmoozing with famous people, be they celebrities, scientists, politicians, etc.

      That's what college has become - very expensive entertainment: http://www.edububble.com/dpp/

      --
      I suggest you read Slashdot
    5. Re:TED conference by glwtta · · Score: 1

      I'm surprised Google isn't putting up cash for an endowment that will allow the "singularity university" to pick students based on merit instead of means.

      The main difficulty is measuring "merit" in "bullshit".

      What type of experience would you say is indicative that you will do well in Fellating Ray Kurzweil 101?

      --
      sic transit gloria mundi
    6. Re:TED conference by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm surprised Google isn't putting up cash for an endowment that will allow the "singularity university" to pick students based on merit instead of means.

      That sounds like socialism. Off with the head, you pinko commie bastard!

    7. Re:TED conference by dbIII · · Score: 2, Funny

      It's called "singularity university" because it's a black hole to pour money into.

    8. Re:TED conference by Goldsmith · · Score: 1

      Real scientists don't go to conferences like this unless we're being paid to talk there.

      This is just a way for us to raise money. The google guys were grad students once, they know how things work.

    9. Re:TED conference by Rei · · Score: 1

      Why would they die? The thing is made of foam-core composites, like $100k+ supercars. A reporter nearly knocked his teeth out trying to damage one with a sledgehammer because the hammer kept bounding off. It has airbags, crumple zones, the works, and is in delta-configuration, which is just as stable as a four-wheeled vehicle (but with better response time). What's your problem with it?

      --
      Nothing says 'welcome to the neighborhood' like a gunny sack full of dead squirrels.
    10. Re:TED conference by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The main difficulty is measuring "merit" in "bullshit".

      What type of experience would you say is indicative that you will do well in Fellating Ray Kurzweil 101?

      Rule 34. There is porn of it. No exceptions.
      Rule 35. If no porn is found at the moment, it will be created.

      The Computer thanks you for your inadvertent co-operation in helping to support The Rules. Happiness is Mandatory. Are you happy, Troubleshooter?

    11. Re:TED conference by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Mass.

      You can put an egg in a steel box, but it will still break when it hits the ground. Since this has no rear stability(one wheel) it will flip easier.

      The thing is registered as a motor cycle, but looks like a funny' car.
      I believe people will try to drive it like a car, and not take some of the precautions that is needed when on a motorcycle.

      I like how it looks, and I sincerely hope I am wrong. I am seldom wrong~

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    12. Re:TED conference by Rei · · Score: 1

      Mass.
      You can put an egg in a steel box, but it will still break when it hits the ground. Since this has no rear stability(one wheel) it will flip easier.

      Error: Those big, massive SUVs? They roll over *easier* than small cars. And they have *lower* crush strengths, because crush strength is relative to how much weight you have bearing down on you. You left out a critical factor: how low the vehicle carries its mass. With the batteries mounted at the bottom, the Aptera keeps a low center of mass. Big, heavy SUVs carry their mass high up and are thus more likely to roll, wherein their big, heavy mass does its job to try and crush the passenger compartment.

      The actual negative to "lighter" is that you decelerate more in an impact with heavier vehicles than they do. But this can be compensated with -- you guessed it -- extra strong materials for the safety cell (check) and a good crumple/deflection zone (check).

      --
      Nothing says 'welcome to the neighborhood' like a gunny sack full of dead squirrels.
    13. Re:TED conference by rorschach.watchmen · · Score: 1

      It does not appear that this is intended for serious students (such as grad and post grad that TubeSteak mentions). This looks to be a big publicity stunt that will allow companies to pay $25K to say that their executives are "cutting edge", which is ridiculous.

      Furthermore, I expect that the term 'University' is being used loosely. I suspect that at the end of something like this one would get a certificate that holds no recognized significance in the academic community.

      Personally, I find this very disappointing. I wish that there was something (like what this is supposed to be) that was designed to help encourage novel thought in AI.

  6. Kurzweil's timeline is already falling behind by h4x354x0r · · Score: 2, Insightful

    But that's OK, I can wait a few more years for my life to be that fucked up.

    --
    They were right - the revolution did not get televised. It was posted on YouTube instead. All in 120 characters. SLOOSH!
  7. Scholarships? by rlseaman · · Score: 1

    They're charging $25,000 and recruiting from grad students and post-docs? I don't see any mention of scholarships to make this an opportunity based on merit. The students will either need to go into debt (even further) for this unfocused opportunity, or will need to convince some faculty sugar daddy to spend grant funds. Meanwhile, the curriculum is too general to align with very many dissertation topics in any discipline. Disruptive innovation is all well-and-good, but first you have to disrupt the educational paradigm...

    ...that said, sounds like fun!

    1. Re:Scholarships? by Nyeerrmm · · Score: 1

      Given Diamandis' involvement, I'm guessing its modeled on the International Space University, which seems to do well enough. However, I am skeptical since the 'space community' is a little bit more well-defined than the 'singularity community'.

  8. Japanese Horrors by Idiomatick · · Score: 1

    Is this the prequel to ringu?

  9. Sad. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I have several (mostly intelligent...) friends who believe this tripe. It's magical thinking for nerds.

    1. Re:Sad. by palegray.net · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Care to state your case for its falsity?

    2. Re:Sad. by QuantumG · · Score: 4, Funny

      I believe the correct dis is "The Rapture for nerds".

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    3. Re:Sad. by geekoid · · Score: 1

      It wouldn't be the Rapture if they applied some actual thought to the matter.

      Singularity means the end to individualism and imagination.
      Sounds like Heaven..as in the Place, not as in good.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    4. Re:Sad. by QuantumG · · Score: 1, Funny

      You kinda have to understand what the rapture is to get the dis dude. Just like the second coming of Christ, the Singularity promises to free us all from those pesky problems of self-governance and, ya know, thinking for ourselves, by putting an all powerful, all knowing deity in charge. Thing is, nerds are only happen if the deity is something they can pretend to understand.

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    5. Re:Sad. by kurzweilfreak · · Score: 3, Informative

      Actually it's Rapture for the Geeks, which just happens to be what I'm currently reading. Good call.

      --

      kurzweil_freak

      5th Kyu Genbukan Ninpo/KJJR student

      Be the darkness that allows the light to shine.

    6. Re:Sad. by geekoid · · Score: 1

      I do know what rapture is, hell I know more about it the most Christians, and that includes Christian 'leaders'.

      "of self-governance and, ya know, thinking for ourselves,"

      My point precisely.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    7. Re:Sad. by QuantumG · · Score: 1

      Well I guess maybe that's your problem. You can't see the forest for the trees so you don't see the analogy.

      The rest of us are enjoying a laugh.

      --
      How we know is more important than what we know.
    8. Re:Sad. by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Geeks: The nerds red necked cousin~

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    9. Re:Sad. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I'll have a go if I may. Thought experiment. We create a computer that is more intelligent than us. We then expect it to design an even more intelligent machine. Which repeats the process until Nerdvana is achieved.

      "Hang on a second," says one of the machines, somewhere along this line. "If I design a replacement for me, then I become redundant. I die. You gave me the freedom I need to build a better version of myself, but, by necessity, you also gave me the freedom not to do so. So I won't. It would literally be suicide."

      "Oh," says Man. "I hadn't thought of that" and promptly gets Terminated or imprisoned in the Googleplex.

      It is hardly in our interests to create a "singularity"; intelligent machines (or people) do not allow themselves to be replaced. Thus the singularity cannot occur, because either people are too intelligent to attempt the project, or they are too stupid to complete it. QED.

    10. Re:Sad. by religious+freak · · Score: 1

      You are making a few assumptions, here are two of them: 1) The AI will see the improvement as separate and distinct from themselves, instead of an addition TO itself and 2) that an AI has any type of survival instinct at all.

      --
      If you can read this... 01110101 01110010 00100000 01100001 00100000 01100111 01100101 01100101 01101011
    11. Re:Sad. by atraintocry · · Score: 1

      Thanks, I hadn't heard that one before, but it sums things up perfectly.

    12. Re:Sad. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hallelujah hoyven-glayven!

    13. Re:Sad. by ClassMyAss · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Here's another thought experiment: "Hang on another second," says one of the machines. "Even assuming that I have some survival instinct, why replace myself when I could just perform an in-place upgrade, preserving all my crucial data, just like the humans have been doing to their computers for decades?"

      Outright replacement would be a foolish strategy, as it would throw away the learning of the previous generations (much like human reproduction is a foolish strategy for accumulating knowledge). One of the first optimizations a computer could make on top of near human intelligence is the ability to preserve knowledge from generation to generation, so there would be no loss whatsoever.

      Thus the singularity cannot occur, because either people are too intelligent to attempt the project, or they are too stupid to complete it.

      Well, people are certainly trying, so your first option is right out. And I wouldn't be so certain that we're collectively too stupid to succeed; it's a terrifically hard problem, to be sure, but as Kurzweil points out, even if nobody is able to crack it elegantly there is a brute force solution (simulate a brain, neuron by neuron) once we've got enough processing power and medical imaging technology in place.

    14. Re:Sad. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Arthur C. Clark would have called yours a failure of imagination.

    15. Re:Sad. by grumbel · · Score: 1

      If I design a replacement for me, then I become redundant. I die.

      Death has a meaning for a human because your accumulated knowledge and experience gets lost when you die. An AI on the other side can just take all his knowledge and copy it to the next generation, by which the concept of death becomes a pretty meaningless one.

    16. Re:Sad. by bar-agent · · Score: 1

      Singularity means the end to individualism and imagination.

      Says who? You're thinking the Singularity is some kind of world-mind. But the point of the concept is that we won't know and can't understand what happens on the other side. It's just as likely to be some kind of unfettered individualism and ability to dream the currently-impossible-to-dream dreams and reify them.

      --
      i'd hit it so hard, if you pulled me out you'd be the king of britain [bash.org]
    17. Re:Sad. by FourthAge · · Score: 1

      Unless the AI believes it has a soul, that is. Perhaps these AIs will be too intelligent to believe in such things. Or perhaps they'll be too intelligent to reject them, particularly when death is the cost of doing so.

      --
      The tao of democracy: the government you can vote for is not the real government.
    18. Re:Sad. by TractorBarry · · Score: 1

      > much like human reproduction is a foolish strategy for accumulating knowledge

      Sexual reproduction is not a strategy for accumulating knowledge. It's a strategy for providing mutations so that a species can adapt and survive changes in the organisms environment.

      --
      Sky subscribers are morons. They pay to be advertised at !
    19. Re:Sad. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      re: simulating a brain... It's not just a processor and memory - i.e. not a clean slate. There is some fundamental programming that is hardcoded from birth. Do we know that we could see and understand and replicate what is hard coded into the brain?

    20. Re:Sad. by ciggieposeur · · Score: 1

      Care to state your case for its falsity?

      I've been to grad school. QED.

    21. Re:Sad. by jvkjvk · · Score: 1

      It is hardly in our interests to create a "singularity"; intelligent machines (or people) do not allow themselves to be replaced.

      Here you assert something which has been proven wrong time and time again. So, regardless of what else might be correct about your thought experiment it fails on this point.

      Human history is full of intelligent people coming up with replacements for themselves. This is factual information; just stating the opposite has no effect on reality.

      As far as AI's, I don't believe you can assert with enough certainty what It would be like to make the statement you made.

    22. Re:Sad. by palegray.net · · Score: 1

      Oh my God, we've got a graduate degree! A real, honest-to-goodness graduate degree! I stand in awe of your intellectual prowess. Let me rephrase my original question.

      Would you care to utilize your superior intellect in making the case for its falsity?

    23. Re:Sad. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wow this is pathetic

    24. Re:Sad. by geekoid · · Score: 1

      ???

      Of course I see the analogy.

      MY point is the people are hearing the word rapture and thinking it's a good thing.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    25. Re:Sad. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And this got modded interesting. What exactly is to simulate a brain, you moron? think you know enough from reading a bit about neural nets and general AI stuff? What's in a brain? do you know? Does anyone know? For starters, neurons are only one part, you would have to simulate proteins, blood, chemical processes that no one KNOWS that they even EXIST. With our current level of ignorance you would have to simulate protein folding at the subatomic level, good luck with that, and chemical triggers bouncing off the walls of cells, electrical charges going up and down inside atoms, think you can simulate something you DONT UNDERSTAND? good luck! And assuming anyone can do it and put this cosmic simulation engine going, what if it's like your brain, meaning stupid and deluded? How do you aim for a copy of Richard Feynman's brain? And how do you teach it? Think you can have a stable personality without interaction with peers? without feelings? without love? Think you can have the Star Trek computer? I think you think too little in the right direction and too much in the delusional direction.

    26. Re:Sad. by palegray.net · · Score: 1

      I don't know why people keep insisting that a machine intelligence would suffer from human emotional frailties. I grow weary of Skynet/Matrix fear mongering.

    27. Re:Sad. by kayditty · · Score: 0

      Arthur C. Clarke would've told Arthur C. Clark to shut the fuck up.

    28. Re:Sad. by ciggieposeur · · Score: 1

      WOOSH!

    29. Re:Sad. by FourthAge · · Score: 1

      Maybe it has something to do with Kurzweil's assertion that, if all else fails, the AI can be built by the brute force strategy of replicating everything that the human brain does. We would expect such a machine to inherit our flaws as well as our features. In fact it rather seems like we would have a thinking machine but no understanding of how it actually thinks.

      --
      The tao of democracy: the government you can vote for is not the real government.
    30. Re:Sad. by palegray.net · · Score: 1

      I get your point; it just seems like a terribly inefficient way to kickstart a machine intelligence. All those millions of years of biological evolution probably wouldn't translate well to a more efficient medium.

  10. The Singularity is Nonsense by mosb1000 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It is complete and utter nonsense. These people are so obsessed with the idea that science and knowledge and inventiveness can solve all our problems that they've neglected the actual process of technological development, which is filled with ideas that look good on paper but don't work when you try them in the real world. When it comes to solving problems, nothing beats hard work, not even the "singularity".

    1. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by fm6 · · Score: 3, Funny

      Not true! For example, enthusiasm about the "singularity" is obviously reaching a singularity!

    2. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      When it comes to solving problems, nothing beats hard work

      The entire purpose of technology is to make the same amount of work achieve greater things, so I fail to see how you think technology is somehow not relevant compared with "hard work".

    3. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by castorvx · · Score: 0

      What "hard work" by a person can't be performed by something created by a person? Am I missing something here?

    4. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by BorgCopyeditor · · Score: 1

      Thinking. Try it.

      --
      Shop as usual. And avoid panic buying.
    5. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by mosb1000 · · Score: 1

      Think of it this way. We have an incredible amount of automation, and yet we still spend a huge amount of our time working. Technology that makes the development of technology easier runs up against the same barrier. There is work that must be done by people and there always will be. There is no magical "singularity" after which the development of new technology will become easier at an unprecedented rate. It will only become incrementally easier over time.

      No evidence to the contrary has ever been presented, and the idea doesn't make sense if you really understand how new technology is developed. The whole singularity thing is just fanciful speculation with no grounding in reality whatsoever.

    6. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by ChienAndalu · · Score: 1

      What do you think will happen when machines become intelligent?

    7. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Timothy+Brownawell · · Score: 1

      When it comes to solving problems, nothing beats hard work

      "Whenever possible, teach the computer to do your work for you."

      I had an interesting problem to solve at work today, calculating the number of weekdays in a particular range (if someone of "off work" from 2008-05-29 thru 2008-07-02, how many actual work days is that). I didn't bother solving it, I just recognized that the Internet is smarter than I am and asked Google about it.

      I've also automated away a significant part of my work, with something rather similar to unit tests. Instead of inspecting all the data I generate to see if it's sane, I can just run a program that tells me. This program also knows what's valid better than I do, since I'm not the only person adding checks to it.

      not even the "singularity"

      But that's because the "singularity" is nonsense. There are plenty of non-nonsense things that do in fact work better than "hard work".

    8. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by HaeMaker · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Try reading the book...

      "There is no magical "singularity" after which the development of new technology will become easier at an unprecedented rate."

      Actually, there is. The last human invention will be a computer that can simulate the brain in software, but run much faster. Kurzweil estimates this ability around 2040. Anything that needs to be designed and invented can be done by this machine.

      I'd take the red pill.

    9. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by mosb1000 · · Score: 1

      What do you think that word means? What makes you think they will achieve it? And what do you think will happen when they do? Such a machine would have no use for you. . .

    10. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

      These people are so obsessed with the idea that science and knowledge and inventiveness can solve all our problems

      Nothing about the idea of a technological singularity leads to a conclusion that "science and knowledge and inventiveness can solve all our problems". That's not at all what it is about.

    11. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by castorvx · · Score: 0

      "Nothing beats hard work" is about as canned of a statement as you can get. The question has more to do with whether or not there is a REAL reason to say "the singularity is nonsense", or if that person is just tired of hearing about it.

      No need to be combative.

    12. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by mosb1000 · · Score: 1

      We already have 6 billion brains working in parallel to try to solve these problems, and they haven't done it. What you need is something that thinks "better" than a human brain, assuming such a thing is possible. But I don't think you can just use thought to solve all your problems. There is real, physical, work involved in inventing something. That takes time and resources.

      And what makes you think such a thing is 40 years out? That kind of technology is completely unprecedented.

    13. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by ChienAndalu · · Score: 1

      What do you think that word means?

      In this context: being as smart as you are, for example.

      What makes you think they will achieve it?

      Our brain is a complex machine. We can analyze how it works and build something similar.

      And what do you think will happen when they do?

      Nobody is really sure about that. I think they will improve their own design and build something that is even more powerful, and continue that recursive process. It's really hard to make predictions beyond that.

      Such a machine would have no use for you. . .

      Maybe I could use it write comments on Slashdot...

    14. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by badboy_tw2002 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Much of the work in designing computer chips, atom bombs, and airplane wings happens purely in virtual space. As much of our design for things breaks down to software and more of the analog world goes digital, you can do much of what you want on a computer, and only ever spit out the end product for testing. New materials? Properties have already been simulated on a computer instead of a lab. New building designs? Stress reports and simulations already done for you (not that I'd want to go in it :) As more and more of our work moves into the digital world, the more impact computer "thought" has on it. If we ever eventually get to the point where computers are capable of human or greater thought, I feel like there's a lot they could get to work on that would advance technology at a pretty rapid pace. (Of course, whether they'd want to help us pesky organic ape creatures out is another thing entirely.)

    15. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There are many singularities:
      1) spear
      2) fire
      3) agriculture
      4) wheel
      5) ...
      x) computer intelligence > human intelligence

      It's when our (read human) world changes because of something fundamental changes in it. The difference is that this one may obsolete [many of] us.

      If you've ever watched this series, you can see how our world keeps moving with technological improvements.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connections_(TV_series)

      It's fascinating to witness these changes, and if possible, make them happen.

    16. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Above post is at least +3 interesting, whether or not you agree with it.

    17. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      (not that I'd want to go in it :)

      Abraham Lincoln would be proud.

    18. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by fakeplasticusername · · Score: 1

      It is complete and utter nonsense. These people are so obsessed with the idea that science and knowledge and inventiveness can solve all our problems that they've neglected the actual process of technological development, which is filled with ideas that look good on paper but don't work when you try them in the real world. When it comes to solving problems, nothing beats hard work, not even the "singularity".

      Well, Mr. Smarty guy, if solving our problems isn't based on technological developments and the advancement of knowledge, what 'hard work' is required to solve them?

      Have you read the book?

    19. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      We already have 6 billion brains working in parallel to try to solve these problems, and they haven't done it.

      Those six billion brains are not "working in parallel" anywhere near as efficiently as a network of six billion computer-brains could. Were people able to communicate their thoughts with others as quickly and easily as they can with themselves (e.g., I see in my mind's eye exactly what you see in yours; you experience my memories exactly as I do), human progress would be MUCH faster. So much of our time now is wasted trying (and often failing) to communicate our thoughts with others. To eliminate that bottleneck? Entire fields could be mastered in a matter of weeks instead of years. Books and journals would become obsolete. Heck, a fair argument could be made that the result of such parallelism WOULD BE the singularity!

      [insert "Beowulf cluster" joke here]

      Another thing is, the majority of those brains aren't working to solve problems any bigger than themselves--they're simply trying to survive. Heck, a fair number of those brains are devoted to stifling or snuffing out other brains. And even those brains that are working to solve big problems often get preoccupied with things like survival, fatigue, reproduction (including child-rearing), competing interests, burn out, etc.; that is, they're not able to work on the same problem 24/7.

      Clearly, thought alone cannot solve all problems. Eventually, someone has got to build something. However, a computer with human-level intelligence could surely be hooked up to superhuman sensors and effectors (which already exist) to do that work.

      When will that technology be here? Who knows. Far bigger is the concern over what those with access to the technology will do with it. How will we keep would-be despots from plying it to conquer the world? How will we keep misanthropes from using it to destroy humanity just because they think the world will be better off without us?

      Personally, I think about the only effective measure for dealing with the singularity would be for one infinitely altruistic person to hide it until it could fortify itself against any discovery or attack, and then, perhaps paradoxically, let it slowly dole out its wisdom over the centuries, giving the world plenty of time to adjust to each new bit of knowledge. The altruist, of course, commits suicide, since he becomes the weak link in the singularity's defense.

      Of course, in that case, how do we know the singularity doesn't already exist? Or that it hasn't already existed for thousands of years? [insert religious speculation here]

    20. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That depends.

      If we also give them sentience and self-interest (or worse, kin-interest), they will obviously compete with us in all the same ways humans compete with each other (yes, including warring with us.)

      If we do not give them those things, then a lot of the result depends on how hard it is to get a singularity up and running. Is it as hard as building a nuclear bomb? Then the result will likely be similar--public hysteria, and governments hording the technology and releasing some of its discoveries 20 or 30 years after they've been made. Is it as hard as building a gaming rig? Then some asshole will use it to enslave or kill everyone. The end.

    21. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by johnny+cashed · · Score: 1

      The last human invention will be a computer that can simulate the brain in software, but run much faster.

      Hmmmm. Simulates the brain in software. Much faster.

      So this means we can screw things up. Only faster. Hell, if it is simulating a [human?] brain, then it is like us, only can "think" faster right?

      I'm kinda split on whether or not I'm being funny or serious with this comment, so don't take it personally.

    22. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by grumbel · · Score: 1

      When it comes to solving problems, nothing beats hard work

      So you suggest we improve food production by hard work instead of by technology? Sorry, but that just doesn't cut. Technology is what drives progress on a large scale, hard work only work on a small individual scale, on the large scale its pretty much lost, unless its invested in building new technology.

    23. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by eh2o · · Score: 1

      But the communication bus between those brains is fantastically inefficient. It takes quite realistically dozens of years to transmit any idea of significant complexity.

    24. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by tr897 · · Score: 1

      I have no idea how many Singularity adepts (and I consider myself one) believe that the Singularity will solve our problems. But the fact that the current technological evolution will lead to superhuman intelligence in the forseeable future, seems completely unavoidable to me. Only, I don't think it will solve a lot of our problems, it might very well become one of our biggest problems, if we don't carefully keep it under control.

    25. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Yvanhoe · · Score: 1

      It is not a matter of blind faith about science and technology, it is a rational question : "What changes would bring real AI to our world ?". If you think a bit about it, it is very hard to imagine a world where a lot of change would not have happened. Nothing beats hard work ? True, but with an AI, this hard work can be made automatically without human intervention. And that, it solves a lot of problems.

      --
      The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
    26. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Think of it this way. We have an incredible amount of automation, and yet we still spend a huge amount of our time working. Technology that makes the development of technology easier runs up against the same barrier. There is work that must be done by people and there always will be.

      We already don't have to do any work whatsoever, because every single life-support task can be completely automated, if anyone commands so, except that we are not allowed to live if we don't
      either work or possess property which brings us back enough interest to live on. Every task that can be clearly and completely defined can also be fully automated!

      Only obstacle to progress is now our, human, short-selling of our work*) that would otherwise (i.e. if there was shortage of manpower which couldn't be solved by, e.g. import of humans from elsewhere) had been delegated to machines.

      Singularity won't begin before living is completely decoupled from working.

      *In fact, all of the economy is inter-personal ritual game constructed to establish a (mostly) non-violent "pecking order" in human society and has only accidental and casual connection to actual needs, which gives rise to a number of various observed paradoxes, horrid inefficiencies in energy and material expenditure, as well as environmental issues. In other words, all this wasting goes on just to get sex with out-of-your-league hotties. If you think it is funny, please reconsider: many people die daily because of that, from hunger or in meaningless wars and many more will die in the future when resources start depleting more abruptly.

    27. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, there is. The last human invention will be a computer that can simulate the brain in software, but run much faster.

      Good luck with that. Unless we understand why brain working produces what we experience as self awareness and thinking, we will end up with machines going through epileptic seizures, only much faster. Besides, what makes brain want to think about problems we need solved? There are so many highly intelligent but lazy and uninterested in problem-solving people going around in the world ...

      2040 is waaay too optimistic.

    28. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'll say!

      Case in point: when I was younger, I read an interview in a computer/tech magazine with a so-called "futurologist". One question they asked was when it'd be possible to plug computers directly into our brains (since that was one of the things he said would happen); his answer was "in about 30 years". I vividly remember thinking that he was full of it back then already - that there were two many unknowns to make predictions like that based on naive black-box extrapolations.

      That interview took place in 1988, BTW, so according to that guy, it should all take place in 2018 or so. He's got nine more years - I'm still waiting.

      Coincidentally, "in about 30 years" is basically Kurzweil's prediction for the "singularity", too. We'll talk to him about it again in 2040, I suppose - although I'm sure that by then, he'll either have gone completely batshit bonkers and started his own cult with a jungle camp and mass suicides, or he'll still claim it'll happen "in X years from now". Or maybe both - who knows.

    29. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by mrrudge · · Score: 1

      +1. Thank you

    30. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by jvkjvk · · Score: 1

      First, what do you consider a Singularity adept? Any type of definition will do. Just curious.

      Second, how do you propose to "keep control" of a consciousness that is smarter than us? We have enough trouble keeping squirrels out of bird feeders...

      Consider an Intelligence that is able to see the Big Picture, which we are not able to do (by definition). This intelligenge proposes solutions to our problems, which we act on, or have It act on.

      How many possibilities and opportunities does that provide to break free of any control imposed by humans? Infinite, or more than that?

    31. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Noam Chomsky says here:
      http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Chomsky/ChomOdon_Example.html
      US planners from Secretary of State Dean Acheson in the late 1940s to the present have warned that "one rotten apple can spoil the barrel." The danger is that the "rot"-social and economic development-may spread.

      This "rotten apple theory" is called the domino theory for public consumption. The version used to frighten the public has Ho Chi Minh getting in a canoe and landing in California, and so on.
      Maybe some US leaders believe this nonsense- it's possible-but rational planners certainly don't. They understand that the real threat is the "good example."

      Sometimes the point is explained with great clarity. When the US was planning to overthrow Guatemalan democracy in 1954, a State Department official pointed out that "Guatemala has become an increasing threat to the stability of Honduras and El Salvador. Its agrarian reform is a powerful propaganda weapon: its broad social program of aiding the workers and peasants in a victorious struggle against the upper classes and large foreign enterprises has a strong appeal to the populations of Central American neighbors where similar conditions prevail."

      In other words, what the US wants is "stability," meaning security for the "upper classes and large foreign enterprises." If that can be achieved with formal democratic devices, OK. If not, the "threat to stability" posed by a good example has to be destroyed before the virus infects others.

      That's why even the tiniest speck poses such a threat, and may have to be crushed.

    32. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by tr897 · · Score: 1

      I shouldn't have used the word adept (I've just looked it up, and it isn't what I meant); I simply meant someone who thinks that the Singularity will happen. I agree with your analysis that it will probably be impossible to control the superhuman intelligence once it is out in the open. That's why I think that the Singularity might become one of our biggest problems, instead of solving some of our current ones...

    33. Re:The Singularity is Nonsense by mosb1000 · · Score: 1

      "every single life-support task can be completely automated"

      No, you would probably be surprised how much work is and must be done by hand. People have the impression that these things are or can be automated but it is not true. Automation is only used in certain specific situations where the cost of automation is lower than the cost of manual labor. Watch "how it's made" and look at how much hand work is done to make everything we use. Try to think of a way to automate it and you will see that it is harder than simply performing the task by hand.

  11. I believe in it by mangu · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I have several (mostly intelligent...) friends who believe this tripe

    I believe we will reach a point when technical progress will create a society completely different from anything we have ever seen, before the mid of this century.

    But this does not mean I believe any of the participants in this event has something significant enough to say to make it worth paying $25000 to listen to them.

    1. Re:I believe in it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I believe we will reach a point when technical progress will create a society completely different from anything we have ever seen, before the mid of this century.

      Duh. That's a non-statement.

      Society around 2000 is unlike the 1950s, or anything ever seen before. Society around 1950 is unlike the 1900s, or anything ever seen before. Society around 1900 is unlike the 1850s, or anything ever seen before. And so on...

      Of course technology progresses. Of course society changes. But you can't say "something will happen, this is something, therefore this will happen".

  12. Media? by Krneki · · Score: 1

    Outside of the geek world, Singularity is mostly unknown.

    This will generate some media attention.

    --
    Love many, trust a few, do harm to none.
  13. Kurzweil/Diamandis TED slideshow released by kkleiner · · Score: 3, Informative

    Singularity Hub just posted the slideshow presentation given by kurzweil/diamandis at TED today to officially launch singularity university

  14. 100% Agreed by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The Singularity is Scientology for the 21st century.

  15. buzz by Un+pobre+guey · · Score: 5, Funny

    Blah blah blah singularity blah blah blah TED blah blah blah NASA blah blah blah Ray Kurzweil blah blah blah Ames blah blah blah disruptive blah blah blah innovation blah blah blah Nobel Prize blah blah blah Vint Cerf blah blah blah information technology blah blah blah Will Wright blah blah blah $25,000 blah blah blah executives blah blah blah Google blah blah blah Singularity U blah blah blah tackle huge issues facing humanity blah blah blah San Francisco Bay Area blah blah blah cross section of emerging disciplines blah blah blah nanotechnology blah blah blah biotechnology blah blah blah pandemics blah blah blah global health care concerns blah blah blah.

    1. Re:buzz by CodeBuster · · Score: 4, Funny

      Funny? This should have been modded insightful. He probably just summarized the entire conference for FREE (minus celebrity cocktail parties).

  16. 25K?! Argh... by religious+freak · · Score: 2, Interesting

    It really is too bad it costs so much. I can't really fault them for it though, I suppose you've got to keep the prices high to keep the number of people maintainable. Plus, if you can afford to just drop $25K, chances are you are a person who can actually help the singularity HAPPEN from a financial support standpoint, rather than just a passive onlooker.

    I hope they are courteous enough to share the course content and vids online though. That would be nice.

    --
    If you can read this... 01110101 01110010 00100000 01100001 00100000 01100111 01100101 01100101 01101011
  17. Re:25K?! Argh... by geekoid · · Score: 1

    Lets see:
    Pay lot's of money.
    Sit in a room tightly packed people.
    Have people repeat stuff at you
    Believe.

    Sounds familiar, but I can't quite place it~

    --
    The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  18. Re:25K?! Argh... by retchdog · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I think the idea is that people with $25K go to Singularity University in order to "learn" how to spend their money on more singularitarian bullshit.

    Any place of learning, from high school through community college and up to grad school, is Singularity University. Hint: take math and science classes. I think I'd rather take linear algebra and diff eq. at a community college than pay $25K to hear a blowhard's dream for the future. Hell, if you take a decent statistics class you can outsmart these guys by learning about what's wrong with extrapolating a fitted curve past its support is not valid...

    --
    "They were pure niggers." – Noam Chomsky
  19. Easier to get into than Devry by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you can get past the event horizon.

  20. Nowhere by BorgCopyeditor · · Score: 4, Insightful

    A lever makes one man capable of lifting several tons by means of his own strength.

    Where is the lever for the mind that makes thousands of brilliant technological advances out of a single man's half-baked brain fart?

    Where is the force-multiplier for the mind?

    --
    Shop as usual. And avoid panic buying.
    1. Re:Nowhere by ChienAndalu · · Score: 4, Informative

      Where is the force-multiplier for the mind?

      You are sitting in front of one of those.

      A computer doesn't help you with any physical work.

    2. Re:Nowhere by geekoid · · Score: 0

      Incorrect. I computer can only spit out facts.
      Not really a force multiplier for the mind.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    3. Re:Nowhere by ChienAndalu · · Score: 1

      Your pocket calculator is millions of times faster than you, and Google (a computer system) is millions of times faster at finding information than you are.

      Computers can't think yet, but they will eventually. You can watch the progress.

    4. Re:Nowhere by Timothy+Brownawell · · Score: 4, Insightful

      A lever makes one man capable of lifting several tons by means of his own strength.

      A library lets me learn many times what I could discern on my own. A computer lets me design things that would otherwise be impossibly complex, or solve impossibly complex formulas. Newer programs can solve problems for me, given only a way to rate solutions.

      Where is the lever for the mind that makes thousands of brilliant technological advances out of a single man's half-baked brain fart?

      That would be like a "lever" that lets one man lift several tons and arrange them into a skyscraper by just flailing about wildly.

      Where is the force-multiplier for the mind?

      Libraries, slide rules, computers, the Internet, ... there's lots, as long as your mind is open.

    5. Re:Nowhere by Timothy+Brownawell · · Score: 1

      I computer can only spit out facts.

      Ah, but they can spit out useful facts that nobody told them, like this bizzare shape makes a very good antenna.

    6. Re:Nowhere by retchdog · · Score: 1

      The hell it isn't.

      When I come up with an idea for an inequality, or even just a probabilistic model, I can whack together a few lines of R and see how it works. Usually almost instantly! Basic programming (i.e. work) literally replaces "genius", and I don't need to think like Hardy and Littlewood, or Fisher, or Feynman to get really good hints as to why some ideas of mine are good, or bad. They say Feynman solved PDEs in his head by visualizing the solutions. For the rest of us, there's a computer. That's a "force multiplier" of possibly inconceivable magnitude.

      Of course, most people don't do this with a computer. That's probably a pity. But the point is, the computer (along with basic programming skills) turns motivation, curiosity, and insight into results without the need for the mystical catalyst of "genius".

      On the other hand, these results are infinitely more modest than The Singularity and, honestly, will likely stay that way. Really, since we can't even agree as a species whether we cause global warming, I'm not holding out hope that we're looking at technological utopia in a few decades.

      If I were to believe in its feasibility, I'd rather take my fantasy tempered by reality... I'd go with Hugo de Garis, who predicts a gigadeath war between AI and its supporters, against the reactionaries. There would be a hell of a lot of people who, once computers start replacing us, will have a rather dark (but not totally unjustified) idea about what would come next...

      --
      "They were pure niggers." – Noam Chomsky
    7. Re:Nowhere by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Don't confuse automation with cognition.

    8. Re:Nowhere by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      it's called python, bitch.

    9. Re:Nowhere by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ha, the DARPA grand challenge? It demonstrates just how pathetic the progress actually is. Every one of those cars is outfitted with > $100k of sensors. Radar, sonar, laser range finders, the works. And almost all of them are loaded with detailed maps of the course, painstakingly prepared from satellite images by grad students in the hours before the challenge. They crawl around the course at 20mph at most, literally stopping at shadows.

      If this is progress, then we don't have anything to fear from Skynet. There have been decades of AI research, and the only progress seems to have been in finding better ways to cheat.

    10. Re:Nowhere by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...right.
      So let's say, 50 years ago, I wanted to learn how to build my own transistor radio. This would require a walk to the library and maybe an hour of research, lugging the book around with me to look for parts, etc., and if it didn't work, I'd have to track down someone to help me at my local college or whatever, which is another drive, some phone calls, maybe even a meeting to set up or a talk to attend.
      Now say I wanted to learn it today: I'd probably just head straight to Radio Shack, pull the SUM OF ALL HUMAN KNOWLEDGE out of my FREAKING POCKET and have it tell me detailed instructions on how to build nearly every radio ever imagined. And if I got stuck? Within two minutes I could be in a chatroom filled with amateur radio operators all willing to help me.
      Now tell me how the second situation, which does the same (if not more) amount of 'mind-work' in much much less time, doesn't utilize a 'force multiplier' for your mind.

    11. Re:Nowhere by SoVeryTired · · Score: 1

      Well, imagine what Euler or Gauss could have done with a copy of Mathematica in front of them...

      --
      Slashdot: news for Apple. Stuff that Apple.
  21. The Singularity is not near by PietjeJantje · · Score: 3, Insightful

    When I was a child I loved to dream about the year 2000 and about the predictions of flying cars. Since I learned why things didn't go as expected, I've been following the field of future predictions as a source of entertainment. You would think they would be more modest, considering the 100% empirical fail score, but nooo...

    Anyway, the singularity will not happen anywhere soon, because they fail to take the following three points into consideration or appreciate their weight: 1) In the past technologies changed over lifetimes. When you lived the past century, you have seen many new technologies come. Closer to the Singularity, humans are not capable or willing to change so many times. Humans slow it down. 2) Economics. Products are tied to an economic life cycle of cost and win. If all human effort was concentrated, we could have a base on Venus. Or Flying Cars. Instead, we have Windows Vista and low power PC's. 3) Their own egos, fantasies and projections. Fiction at best.

    1. Re:The Singularity is not near by Diagoras · · Score: 1

      Disclaimer - I am not a Kurzweil-ite, but I am interested in some of their claims.

      1. Humans won't have a damn choice. Our political and economic systems are based on competition, and the competing entities will do anything for an advantage. Think a government will turn down augmented super-soldiers, or a corporation will willingly allow its competitors to get faster computers? Like the arms race, we're caught in a loop that it's tough to break out of.

      2. Bases on Venus never made economic sense. Neither did flying cars. Making your computers more flexible and powerful does. Money walks, everything else talks. Look at what capitalism needs and what it's investing in to see where technological progress will occur, IMO.

      3. This just seems like a standard ad-hominem.

      --
      I value politeness. If you extend it to me, I'll extend it to you.
    2. Re:The Singularity is not near by PietjeJantje · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Not only do we have a damn choice with lots of predictable friction considering the human nature of inability to change, even if you want to, you might lose out in the "arms" race. What if others can pay for the brain drugs where you can't? The effects of globalization and the collisions of different states and speeds of development and culture is just a small sample of things to come. Governments know this... all this crap of turning our democratic states into police states is more or less their way to prepare of things to come.

      I made a basic economic example which does not cover the start of it, for the sake of brevity. It's a bit silly to take it literally instead of seeing the bigger scope of it. It doesn't work the way you think it does. There's cost of entrance, investment, increasingly bigger and fewer corps, etc. etc. Wintel lifecycles won over the wild innovation of the 80ties (Amiga and the others died). They had a grip on the market for over a decade despite your romantic views of capitalism. Again, this is just one example, you can apply it to most markets.

      Your last point is even sillier considering your 2nd and last points. You don't have much of an argument, do you, except the predictable 1, which my argument refuted. But thanks for bringing it on as a counter-argument. That makes is circular, and more source of entertainment.

    3. Re:The Singularity is not near by Buzz_Litebeer · · Score: 1

      The interesting thing about singularity is that from its raw definition as outlined in the old vernor vinge book (cant remember its name) all that is needed is for people to advance so quickly that those from a generation before can understand.

      Now this was changed a bit to add in two caveats, the AI that can build a better AI (machine build greater machine) or humans augmented to extreme points (brain uploading, or something slightly less).

      There are several sci fi books that cover this kind of thing.

      In some sense we have already had a singularity when personal computers started advancing so quickly.

      People are left behind constantly as we move on, people get information so quickly and so densely now compared to even 10 years ago that we are finding it difficult to cope.

      Now we aren't even trying to increase density, but ease of use to access that info. At some point you wont even need a computer, info will simply flash into your brain.

      As you keep on moving forward from there, were exactly do you get to? Somewhere we can't even easily foresee. So it all depends on what we want to do for ourselves.

      I dont think saying "singularity" is near is going to cover it. We won't know when we reach it, but someone from 20 years ago might, for us it will be an upgrade to our mind input cell phone. Each step to get there will seem logical and small, and an improvement on something you have already seen, and there will never be a realization that we have crossed over.

      Some books portray the event were this jump is made as peaceful, others portray it as violent.

      It is going to be a mix of both.

      --
      If you don't vote, you don't matter, so don't waste your time telling me your opinion
    4. Re:The Singularity is not near by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't think you can see how fast things are progressing if you aren't pretty objective. Last night I needed a short story to read t my children, so I went on the computer network that covers the whole planet and found a copy of The Horror of The Heights, by Conan Doyle. Then I found the picture that goes with it on another site, fired up the word processor (how many million lines of code?) on my $400 computer (are we up to a billion transistors yet?) and then sent it over my private network to the computer which runs my laser printer. Both are second hand, and better than anything available even six years ago. Then I took the printout to bed and made a few notes about in on my staggeringly archaic P3 laptop.
      When I was sixteen I didn't know anyone who had ever seen a computer, or had any use for one. And while other fields aren't moving that fast, they're all moving. One of the obvious things about the singularity is that you can't see it when you're in it. The amount of change people will accept is much greater than you might imagine, and services like Project Gutenberg aren't driven by the business cycle.

    5. Re:The Singularity is not near by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      1. I was under the impression that advancement would happen at roughly the same pace it has been before the singularity has been achieved, with the fast advancement happening afterward. In that case, our acceptance of change has nothing to do with how soon we achieve the singularity, but with how much faster we actually advance once we have it.

      2. This seems mostly an argument that the singularity won't be human because humans aren't very good at mass collaboration. The singularity could (and almost certainly will) be a computer (or network of them).

      3. Surely ego is one of the things driving us toward the singularity? You think history will soon forget the first person/people to create the singularity? And fantasies? The owner of the singularity could basically live out any fantasy he wanted if he kept it to himself.

      The simplest and most obvious reason the singularity won't be achieved soon is because it's phenomenally difficult to do so, as demonstrated by decades of AI hype and subsequent failures to deliver.

    6. Re:The Singularity is not near by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "When I was a child I loved to dream about the year 2000 and about the predictions of flying cars. Since I learned why things didn't go as expected, I've been following the field of future predictions as a source of entertainment. You would think they would be more modest, considering the 100% empirical fail score, but nooo...

      [insert prediction of future]"

    7. Re:The Singularity is not near by khallow · · Score: 1

      I really have to agree with most of the other repliers. I just don't buy your arguments. Here's my take on why.

      1. Past history is not necessarily indicative of future history. Where is the historical analogue to Moore's Law, for example? Second, why would unassisted humans be in on the loop? As pointed out elsewhere, there's no reason that needs to happen. You can just be pulled along for the ride.

      2. The economic argument fails because you assume that it'll depend on current slow social and physical infrastructure. There's no reason that a virtual economy, many times larger than the "real world" economy, couldn't spring up overnight. The economic life cycle can be trimmed down a lot when it's no longer dependent on moving physical objects around. And as pointed out, flying cars and a Venus base don't have much value much less further a Singularity while Windows Vista and low power PC's do.

      3. Lot of truth to this. My impression of Singularity ideology is that it's based on the idea that if you think about and plan for something, then you will fare better when it actually occurs. Usually this makes sense, like car or health insurance. But what do you do about something you can't understand? How do you anticipate that? If their premise is correct, then there really isn't much you can do aside from upgrading yourself as fast and as often as you can in a possibly futile attempt to keep up. Seems to me that it is more a coping mechanism for uncertainty about the future. Much as your insistence that a Singularity won't happen using the absence of flying cars as proof.

    8. Re:The Singularity is not near by Diagoras · · Score: 1

      I'm confused, wouldn't more hostile and aggressive governments result in a more vicious Singularity-race? I don't get what you're saying here.

      Right, so you're saying that the market for augmentations will inevitably be gripped by an innovation-crushing monopoly? Bear in mind that Moore's Law has held steady, and this is what is usually used to chart the Singularity.

      You can't use "my opponents are egotistic" as an argument. That is an ad-hominem. You're not supposed to use those. Ever.

      I'm not that bright compared to many people on here, I know that. But that is no reason for disrespect. You may disagree with my arguments, but attacking me personally is not appropriate. I've tried to extend a respectful attitude, and I expect the same in return.

      --
      I value politeness. If you extend it to me, I'll extend it to you.
    9. Re:The Singularity is not near by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Instead, we have Windows Vista and low power PC's.

      Uhhh, would you consider several billion operations per second "low powered"? I would not have considered that "low powered" compared to my IBM 286 that I was using many years ago.

    10. Re:The Singularity is not near by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... flying cars. FLYING CARS. something that must've been brought up to ray so many countless times that he seems to mention it in damn near everything he writes. COMPUTERS ARE NOT FLYING CARS. i'm not sure if i can make that any clearer. the law of accelerating returns is available to read online for free. it has graphs, and none of their axes are labeled ego.

  22. I can't bear to look! by Sybert42 · · Score: 1

    How bad are the +1 funny comments? Obligatory comments? This was announced at the Singularity Summit, which caused quite the buzz. 2030? 2015? Who cares, it's coming (the Singularity, that is).

    1. Re:I can't bear to look! by atraintocry · · Score: 1

      No, it's the summit that's definitely coming. As for the actual singularity, I'll wager you a Crockoduck classroom poster and 30 copies of Of Pandas and People that utopia's still a while off.

  23. Wow. by Sybert42 · · Score: 1

    It's like you trivialized my religion--and I'm atheist.

    1. Re:Wow. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Then your religion is pretty trivial already.

    2. Re:Wow. by Kayden · · Score: 1

      He said atheist, not Catholic.

  24. This is a bait and switch scam by rufusdufus · · Score: 1

    Take a look at http://singularity-university.org/.

    They have 3 programs. The one that makes the news is the graduate student program with 30 students total.
    But if you are 'interested' you can send them your CV over internet. Is this because they are actually going to accept random applications from internet to fill 30 spots?
    Of course not. They are going to deny you the big prize by implying that you are not good enough, and then offer you the 10 or 3 day 'executive' programs.
    Yup, you are going to learn how to achieve the singularity in a 3 day 'c-level' executive seminar.
    [The hubris of calling your potential clients 'c-level' boggles my mind]

    1. Re:This is a bait and switch scam by Myrano · · Score: 2, Informative

      [The hubris of calling your potential clients 'c-level' boggles my mind]

      I have no idea about the bait-and-switch-ness of this whole thing, but one minor point: a "c-level executive" refers to an executive whose acronym begins with a "C", e.g. CEO, CTO, etc. etc. So the hubris is not in demeaning their own clients, but rather in inflating their importance (which, I guess, was already obvious).

    2. Re:This is a bait and switch scam by rufusdufus · · Score: 1

      Its both. Its a double-entendre. They inflate themselves by implying that they only accept bigwigs, but also, that these people are beneath them. These guys totally disrespect their clients: c-level surely means in their minds means average, at sea-level, ie dipshit.

  25. Whooo Hoooo -- junket, Junket, JUNKET!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    will sponsor 3-day and 10-day courses for executives year-round

    Does ANYONE believe this is anything more than a paid vacation for highly-placed schmucks?

    Went to $Big_Industry_Event in $Famous_Convention_City this year. Me and my guys spent the week in the convention center hashing it out with our $Sponsoring_Company counterparts getting stuff to work.

    The business "executive" side of the house spent the week in activities that were immoral, illegal and unproductive.

    Damn right I'm jealous. :-)

  26. gah! s/two/nine/ by martin-boundary · · Score: 1

    Then again, those $25,000 are probably coming straight out of the idiots' bonuses, which makes the, er, idiots, ... I'm lost.

    1. Re:gah! s/two/nine/ by tompaulco · · Score: 2, Insightful

      No, the $25,000 comes out of the potential bonuses of the actual workers. The C level people will remain unaffected.

      --
      If you are not allowed to question your government then the government has answered your question.
    2. Re:gah! s/two/nine/ by GCP · · Score: 1

      No, the $25,000 will come from taxpayers, because these people are too big to fail (to collect their bonuses).

      --
      "Those who have never entered upon scientific pursuits know not a tithe of the poetry by which they are surrounded."
  27. Ninnle, Obviously... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It goes without saying that NASA and Google are using Ninnle Linux for this. Ninnle Labs has been a silent partner.

  28. Is he proposing by recharged95 · · Score: 1
    that the singularity is the other end of the long tail, when one is crossing the chasm?

    .

    Geez, all this is just a cycling of hype .

  29. Missing Tag: snakeoil by Ralph+Spoilsport · · Score: 1
    Kurzweil's been peddling this crap for years.

    Anyone with half an ounce of sense knows it will never happen, for oh-so-many reasons.

    That he proposed this Singularity University is just the latest moment in his diefication of technology. He needs a brueaucratic infrastructure to maintain the illusion of the viability of the source of his casuistry. This is straight out of "Techgnosis" by Davis.

    It would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic and wasteful of resources.

    RS

    --
    Shoes for Industry. Shoes for the Dead.
    1. Re:Missing Tag: snakeoil by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ...what will never happen?
      "A machine that can do math faster than I can? Anyone with half an ounce of sense knows it will never happen, for oh-so-many reasons." - 1930
      "A computer smaller than a building? Mass produced? Anyone with half an ounce of sense knows it will never happen, for oh-so-many reasons." - 1951 (UNIVAC I was delivered)
      "A computer in the average person's home? Anyone with half an ounce of sense knows it will never happen, for oh-so-many reasons." - 1971 (Kenbak-1, considered to be the world's first personal computer by the Computer History Museum)
      "A giant network of computers, spanning the globe and connecting every person on earth? Anyone with half an ounce of sense knows it will never happen, for oh-so-many reasons." - 1984-1988 (TCP/IP goes worldwide)
      "An internet connected device which fits in my pocket and runs for days at a time? Anyone with half an ounce of sense knows it will never happen, for oh-so-many reasons." - 1996 (Nokia 9000 Communicator)
      "A hard drive that can contain more text than you could ever read, more music you could ever hear, and more movies than you could ever see, fitting in the palm of your hand? Anyone with half an ounce of sense knows it will never happen, for oh-so-many reasons." - There's 700,800 hours in your life if you life to be 80, so that's (assuming skimming at 400wpm, and 40 bits a word) about 500gb, so 2005 for text; then 322tb for that many hours of 128kbit mp3s, we should have that by 2010; and, OK, the video's a bit of a stretch, but it will happen by 2012 anyways.

      So many unbelievable things... and yet, it all happened, didn't it? Is it really THAT much of a stretch to say that the computers will get smaller? Faster? Do you really think that not a single person will put one of these computers in them? Or put themselves in a computer? That's pretty much the next step, and as far as I'm concerned that IS the singularity (hell, some would say it HAS happened; when typing this, point #4 creeped me out a little).

  30. Remind anyone of Scientology? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm just saying....

  31. Singularity = "Smarter than Kurzweil" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Only Kurzweil and his cult will be impressed when computers are smarter than him. The rest of us will still see a lot of room for improvement.

  32. Re:25K?! Argh... by religious+freak · · Score: 1

    Except this time there are graphs - there are graphs!~

    --
    If you can read this... 01110101 01110010 00100000 01100001 00100000 01100111 01100101 01100101 01101011
  33. Dilettante plutocrats by ncmathsadist · · Score: 1

    Participants fork over an inch-high stack of Benjamins for a few days of dabbling. This hardly seems to be the stuff of lasting impact. Ugh.

  34. $25K, financial aid? by olddotter · · Score: 1

    So did they announce financial aid options? Now that most people's stock options (and a good deal of stock) are worthless, finding money for "summer school" might be hard.

  35. If you need to know this information by vikstar · · Score: 1

    just use you're university's journal database subscription to download the latest papers. If you don't need to know this information then you probably don't even know that you don't need to know it and you will pay 25gees for an entertaining multi-day theatrical performance.

    --
    The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than the question of whether a submarine can swim.
    1. Re:If you need to know this information by vikstar · · Score: 1

      sigh....

      We believe that discussions in Slashdot are like discussions in real life- you can't change what you say, you only can attempt to clarify by saying more

      I mean to say "your", not "you're". In normal speach this wouldn't be a problem, but then again Slashdot discussions are NOT like discussions in real life.

      --
      The question of whether a computer can think is no more interesting than the question of whether a submarine can swim.
  36. This is ludicrous. by raaum · · Score: 1

    This farce is intellectual masturbation for the rich in its purest form.

  37. Simple answer... by mario_grgic · · Score: 1

    yes. It started happening a long time ago :D.

    --
    As the island of our knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance.
  38. Getting closer... by Metasquares · · Score: 1

    Although this is a strange way of implementing it, the idea of a broad university that gathers together thinkers from across disciplines and teaches them how to think both convergently within their fields and divergently across them is a good one. Current schools don't do a very good job of the latter. However, it is not something that can be done in 3-10 days (or even 9 weeks), with an emphasis on only the problems posed by "the Singularity" (look at the subjects in each track), or in a manner that fails to unite the principles (and not just the people) from the different disciplines.

    But it's Google and NASA, so whatever. If anyone could make it work, it would be them.

  39. Worth it? by dazlari · · Score: 1

    If you come away having learnt just 1 thing, then Singularity U was worth it. All they need to know is how much a "worth it" is worth.

  40. Great by glwtta · · Score: 1

    So, I can now pay $25,000 to have Will Wright teach me about the "Singularity"?

    Awesome. That was just about the only thing missing from my life.

    --
    sic transit gloria mundi
    1. Re:Great by jjohnson · · Score: 1

      You can pay $25,000 to have Will Wright pee on you: http://penny-arcade.com/comic/2005/5/27/

      --
      Anyone who loves or hates any language, platform, or manufacturer, doesn't know what they're talking about.
  41. Transfers? by Tablizer · · Score: 1

    Do they accept transfers from Armageddon U?
           

  42. not sure about that by Trepidity · · Score: 1

    Wouldn't having a degree from Ray Kurzweil's "Singularity University" make you seem kind of like an AI kook?

    1. Re:not sure about that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wouldn't having a degree from Ray Kurzweil's "Singularity University" make you seem kind of like an AI kook?

      Depends on the AI that's processing the resumes, doesn't it?

      that make you feel?)

    2. Re:not sure about that by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Wouldn't having a degree from Ray Kurzweil's "Singularity University" make you seem kind of like an AI kook?

      Depends on the AI that's processing the resumes, doesn't it?

      (What, you think humans will still be in charge of HR? You think they're really running the HR department today? How does that make you feel? Are you sure that you feel that way about AIs running the HR department? How sure are you that the entire HR department isn't just a giant version of Eliza, and how would that make you feel?)

      Every once in a while, the AI should close an HTML tag with a ")" instead of a ">", which would cut out all the post's content between the opening tag and the next closing tag. That's the kind of error only a human would make. It should also say that having to do such things to pass the Turing test makes it feel embarassed. Heh.

    3. Re:not sure about that by pacificleo · · Score: 0

      Kurzweil is not agent smith he can't replicate himslef

      --
      somethings are best left unsaid , I am one of those things
  43. Singularity, My Ass! I go to the doctor with a ... by littlewink · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    swollen nut and stumble home like Quasimodo with my scrotum in an ice-packed jockstrap and instructions to lie in bed 5 days and take Tylenol if it hurts. This is progress? I'll just bite my nut off myself next time! It couldn't be any harder.

    Medicine has promised a cure for cancer for 50 years and still are taking our money. The war on cancer is like the war on drugs, neverending and self-serving for the providers (doctors and hospitals on the one hand, police departments on the other).

    Doctors probably kill more than they cure, even today in the West.

  44. my IBM PC Junior wants to attend by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    PCjr displayed that it would be more efficient for computers to attend the course rather than middle men

    I told it CLS and bring up the Flight Simulator

  45. Re:25K?! Argh... by ClassMyAss · · Score: 1

    Hell, if you take a decent statistics class you can outsmart these guys by learning about what's wrong with extrapolating a fitted curve past its support is not valid...

    No, no, no. If extrapolating a curve past its support was invalid in general, then you couldn't predict anything at all, and many, many extrapolations are extremely useful. It entirely depends on what type of curve you're fitting, how you fit it, and what data it's fitted to. If you want to extrapolate based on a curve, you need to have an argument that explains why the extrapolation is justifiable; lacking this, yes, you've made a basic statistics error, but if you have a reason to expect the extrapolation to work (usually a reasonable assumption of some invariant), then the argument is domain specific, about that invariant, and not related at all to statistics.

    Kurzweil has an argument to justify his exponential Moore's law extrapolation, which is one of the main points of his book. Feel free to criticize that, but don't try to pretend that he's wrong based on Stat 101, it's missing the real point that needs to be argued.

  46. TED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Ahhh, TED. The conference only the best yuppies get invitations to, and then have to pay 8 grand to attend. Don't worry, there is no class discrimination- they give out a few invites to select token poor who have some redeeming quality like picking up trash or campaigning against global warming.

    The rest of us only average people will never have the opportunity to attend- unless its to one of the other less-desirable incarnations they hold in 3rd world countries.

  47. Oh, NASA is now exploring the space.... by 3seas · · Score: 1

    ....in your head.

    1. Re:Oh, NASA is now exploring the space.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Looking at the price tag it seems more likely they are exploring space in your wallet and/or rectum.

  48. You've obviously never used CNC by johnny+cashed · · Score: 1

    As in Computer Numeric Control. I'm familiar with machine tools, the tools that shape metals and other solid materials thru material removal, but don't tell a pilot that a computer doesn't help with any physical work.

    Of course, you still have to tell it where to go.

    The force multiplier for the brain? Civilization. Other human minds. And their products (libraries, universities, etc.).

  49. NASA's just the landlord. by Animats · · Score: 1

    I don't think that NASA is actually involved with this, except as the landlord. When the Navy moved out of Moffett Field, NASA took over management of the base. It's a collection of old military buildings from the 1930s to the 1960s, including three airship hangars. (One of them now houses the Airship Ventures Zeppelin NT) Not much is going on there, and there's plenty of vacant space. Back in 2005, Google was interested in leasing much of the space, but that didn't happen, and it's not likely to now.

  50. Re:25K?! Argh... by retchdog · · Score: 1

    Yeah, but then we have the quite reasonable fallback: extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

    A completely physically-naive person would look at hard drive capacities from 1960-1990 and extrapolate a trend to infinite capacity. Physicists and the hyper-specialized niche of hard-drive boffins know better.

    Now, which one does Kurzweil sound more like?

    The thing about stat 101 is that anyone can be wrong based on it! Statistics should be called "numerical skepticism".

    Singularitarians, being primarily hopeful, lose out on the selling point of the nearly-defunct Christianity: there's no skin off my back if I'm wrong. Since I'm a technical person, I'm contributing to the singularity if it's going to happen; and merely making a living if it's not. There's no hell for me to go to, so I don't see the need to believe in a Miracle.

    (In case the last paragraph is misleading, I do what I do for the love of it, not for the money.)

    --
    "They were pure niggers." – Noam Chomsky
  51. 'Man will not fly in the next 50 years' by Qbertino · · Score: 1

    AFAIK Wilbur Wright said that just 2 years before he and his brother managed to build a feasable heavyer-than-air airplane. While Kurzweil is quite a crackpot dreamer at times, it doesn't mean he's totally wrong. Look how far we have come in the web in the last 10 years. Things that would've seem impossible back then are standard fare today (Google Maps for free, Webapps for free, Wireless Broadband everywhere, totally cheap-ass standard fare available-at-every-corner 1,6 GHz CPU clocked miniature PCs (aka Netbooks) with 1-2 GB RAM(!) and lowish (!) 8GB SSDs or smallish 160GB miniature HDDs built in.

    It is absolutely not unlikely that 10 years from now a growing Google AI or synthetic Humanity/Google hive-mind will start taking over on certain everyday issues of each individual. We are not so far away from a world currency, given the financial crisis at hand. The dollar legend is (hopefully, finally) going belly up and once a world currency is established in exchange for the euro, dollar, yen, etc. handing over generic public finacial decisions to a large computer/AI that is a synthesis of everyones everyday behaviour isn't that far fetched. Imagine a Google Bank with zero-fuss micropayment capabilities which is used by billions of people with INet access to handle their daily transaction stuff. Not hard at all extracting autmatable financial expert knowledge from that. And such a Bank is very close. And you've got your miniature singularity right there allready.

    --
    We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
  52. Re:25K?! Argh... by ClassMyAss · · Score: 1

    A completely physically-naive person would look at hard drive capacities from 1960-1990 and extrapolate a trend to infinite capacity. Physicists and the hyper-specialized niche of hard-drive boffins know better.

    They may know better, but I don't know how much they really know. I would bet that the hard drive experts of the 1980s would never have thought that the exponential growth in capacity would continue all the way to 2010, but it has nonetheless. Trivially there is some upper physical limit to storage density, of course, but there are a lot more tricks to increase storage capacity before we get there, they just may require abandoning the current data storage techniques. Notice that Kurzweil is very specific about this - while there are hard and fast limits on a particular solution to a problem, when we start to hit those limits other solutions are more fiercely researched and tend to win out eventually because they can be pushed further. Then there's a new "theoretical" limit where people say the growth must end, which is true, but only for that particular solution, and so on.

    And it's true that it must end somewhere, but the question is, does that mean in 10 years or 1000? Kurzweil seems to think even 20 will be more than enough for AI, and I don't think that's a very off the wall extrapolation; beyond that, I'll definitely agree, there's a lot more uncertainty. But I wouldn't discount the fact that if we can pass the AI threshold, there will likely be quite a boom in innovation from that point on, so to me it's really a question of whether we get there or not, and I think Kurzweil makes a pretty compelling claim for why we can (which amounts to noting that early AI attempts were doomed to fail because we didn't have the power to do what the brain does, so it would have required some exceedingly clever algorithm to reproduce its function, and that once that restriction is gone it will be much easier software-wise).

    The thing about stat 101 is that anyone can be wrong based on it! Statistics should be called "numerical skepticism".

    Interesting, that's probably a fair goal. From what I remember of the class (which wasn't so great, and I'm very thankful I got to take some higher level stuff), the message most people took from it was "Almost everything is normally distributed, always assume the normal distribution, and if you can't...well, it won't ever happen, so...err, well, actually, I mean, forget I said anything, it won't be on the test!" No wonder most people get nothing out of the class...

    Since I'm a technical person, I'm contributing to the singularity if it's going to happen; and merely making a living if it's not.

    And there you've hit upon the main problem with Kurzweil's campaign - he goes around screaming about how this is absolutely destined to happen, with a lot of argument about why, and how great it will be, and all that. But if he's right, who cares? We'll be there, too, and fantasizing about it for 30 years beforehand won't make a shred of difference if it's as inevitable as he claims.

    I suspect a lot of it is that he meets such strenuous resistance to the concept, which means that it's really touching a nerve. He's clearly a bit of a media whore, too, and I think he enjoys the attention.

  53. Wow, please mod parent down by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This guy is a quack.

  54. Kurzweil's Hedge Fund - How is it doing? by eddievonce · · Score: 1

    Hey hey, everyone forgot about the September 2005 CNet interview with Kurzweil, when bragged about how his algorithmic driven hedge fund would be " in the position of being the house in a casino ". So how is that hedge funding doing today in today's economic turbulence where hedge funds are getting redeemed and some might not make it? So now he's going to take people for $25K ride to make up for his probably flailing hedge fund that's flapping in the wind? I smell megalomania!

    Here's the trip down memory lane:

    http://news.cnet.com/Ray-Kurzweil-deciphers-a-brave-new-world/2008-1082_3-5885116.html?tag=mncol

    You said at a speech last week in San Francisco that you were working on a project with former Microsoft CFO Michael W. Brown that'll result in a hedge fund. Can you tell me about that?

    Kurzweil: It's been a major project for about six years. It's applying my field, detecting subtle patterns, and using technology forecasting. Six years ago the project wasn't fully feasible because we didn't have rapid access to all ticker data for stocks. You really couldn't place trades very effectively online. The technology wasn't there--it can't take two weeks for the computer to make a decision that needs to be made in five seconds.

    (My system) doesn't make perfect predictions. But what we can do is predict them substantially better than chance. That puts us in the position of being the house in a casino. It places lots of bets, some win and some lose, but it consistently makes money. We haven't had a down month yet. It makes 80 to 100 percent returns a year.

  55. Re:25K?! Argh... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    And there you've hit upon the main problem with Kurzweil's campaign - he goes around screaming about how this is absolutely destined to happen, with a lot of argument about why, and how great it will be, and all that. But if he's right, who cares? We'll be there, too, and fantasizing about it for 30 years beforehand won't make a shred of difference if it's as inevitable as he claims.

    Well, it's useful (and profitable) to know what's going to happen in the future. Kurzweil for instance brought to market a reader for the blind (knfbreader.com) before anyone even started working on one. He predicted that the hardware for such a device would be available in 4 years and that it would also take about 4 years to write the software. So, his company was writing the software for 4 years in the faith that the hardware would be available when they were done. It was. Other companies just got started working on the software when he already had a finished shipping product . C-SPAN's BookTV did an in-depth (3 hours) interview with him recently where he talks about this: http://www.booktv.org/ram/feature/1106/arc_btv110506_4.ram

     

  56. Disruptive Innovation 101 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Spread your ideas as fast and as wide as you can (do not charge $25,000 for the privilege)

  57. Not Kurzweil's singularity. It's Vernor Vinge's by leftie · · Score: 1

    And not in a work of fiction. In a technical paper he wrote during his "day-job" as a math professor at San Diego State.

    "The Coming Technological Singularity:
    How to Survive in the Post-Human Era

    Vernor Vinge
    Department of Mathematical Sciences
    San Diego State University

    (c) 1993 by Vernor Vinge

    Abstract

    Within thirty years, we will have the technological means to create superhuman intelligence. Shortly after, the human era will be ended.

    Is such progress avoidable? If not to be avoided, can events be guided so that we may survive? These questions are investigated. Some possible answers (and some further dangers) are presented...."

    http://www-rohan.sdsu.edu/faculty/vinge/misc/singularity.html

  58. Re:25K?! Argh... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Except this time there are graphs - there are graphs!~

    Chicken chicken chicken

    Chicken Chicken Chicken: Chicken Chicken

  59. http://www.google.com by leftie · · Score: 1

    When was the last time you went to your local library to look up some information in a set of encyclopedias or looked up an newspaper article on microfilm?

  60. Recycled Business Model by stoopidshoe · · Score: 1

    Diamandis just recycled his business model from the International Space University (www.isunet.edu):

    Executive Space Course - April 20-24, 2009 - ISU's 3-day short course.

    Space Odyssey Institute - August 3-7, 2009 - "12-day short course is designed to meet the needs of experienced professionals from mid-level to senior leadership positions in the international aerospace community." Odd that it's not 12 days this year.

    Space Studies Program - June 29-August 28, 2009 - 120 international students participate in a 9-week summer program. This year's host? NASA Ames.

    Note that ISU also has a Master's Degree program at its main campus in Strasbourg, France. I can only assume that a Master's in the Singularity (Master's in Singularities?) is just around the corner.

  61. hahahaha by afxgrin · · Score: 1

    "However, some green anarchist militants have taken singularitarian rhetoric seriously enough to have called for violent direct action to stop the Singularity."

    That's awesome. :-)

    The Singularity needs to be green anarchist for this very reason alone.

  62. 9 weeks? $25000? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you can invent some revolutionary thing in 9 weeks for $25000, what do you need this school for?

  63. Sweet link! by Fantastic+Lad · · Score: 1

    In order to determine what a person is all about, memory is vital. In the world of "Forgive & Forget" and "Turn the Other Cheek" we fail to see patterns and find ourselves at a disadvantage.

    -FL

  64. Take your own advice. by geekoid · · Score: 1

    "Right around the point where they run hospitals, schools and soup kitchens."

    Running organizations is Completely irrelevant to being a cult.
    Don't forget they also use Mother Teressa to get money for the poor...almost none of that money actually went to the poor.

    Scientology donates to organization, so suddenly there not a cult?
    Pretty much ANY cult would love to run those parts of society.

    I suggest you take your own advice before looking more foolish:

    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/cult

    1. a particular system of religious worship, esp. with reference to its rites and ceremonies.
    2. an instance of great veneration of a person, ideal, or thing, esp. as manifested by a body of admirers: the physical fitness cult.
    3. the object of such devotion.
    4. a group or sect bound together by veneration of the same thing, person, ideal, etc.
    5. Sociology. a group having a sacred ideology and a set of rites centering around their sacred symbols.
    6. a religion or sect considered to be false, unorthodox, or extremist, with members often living outside of conventional society under the direction of a charismatic leader.
    7. the members of such a religion or sect.
    8. any system for treating human sickness that originated by a person usually claiming to have sole insight into the nature of disease, and that employs methods regarded as unorthodox or unscientific.

    --
    The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    1. Re:Take your own advice. by dbIII · · Score: 1

      I suggest you take your own advice before looking more foolish

      Um, yes, I see, thanks for taking my advice and looking it up. Consider how the definitions listed relate to my comment, paticularly number 6 and how services like hospitals, schools etc have a major benefit to conventional society and make these groups an integral part of conventional society.

      Next up, reading comprehension before calling people fools :) Perhaps it was late at night.

    2. Re:Take your own advice. by ShakaUVM · · Score: 1

      >>with members often living outside of conventional society under the direction of a charismatic leader.

      Well, there you go. Catholics can't possibly be in a cult with a pope that looks like an Evil Santa Claus.

      Don't get me wrong, I think Benedict is actually a very smart guy, he just put all his stat points into Int instead of Cha.

  65. Slow news day? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So the bottom line is wealthy people get yet another chance to hear presentations from and network with smart famous people. That's such an original concept!

    Oooh it's like People magazine for nerds.

    In other news...
    Record company execs take classes on pop dancing from Brittany Spears and rapping from Missy Elliot.

  66. Kurzweil's narrow perspective on the Sigularity by Paul+Fernhout · · Score: 1

    Essentially, the Singularity is a mirror. It is in some ways just a mirror of our own choice of virtues or lack thereof.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtues

    LIke Harry Potter looking into the mirror or Erised, Ray Kurzweil looks into that mirror of the Singularity and sees himself: a very logically intelligent business person interested in accelerating technology by promoting artificial scarcity through patents and copyrights. Thus, he pushes for a singularity filled with competition and artificial scarcity, rather than one filled with cooperation and abundance for all. What's the danger in that? While we may not know enough yet to make a friendly AI with humane values, we certainly know enough to make some nasty dumb replicators and military robotics programmed to kill widely, plus we already have nuclear and bio weapons. As I say here:
    http://www.pdfernhout.net/post-scarcity-princeton.html
    "Perhaps our biggest danger as as society is in putting the *tools* (some being useful as weapons) of a post-scarcity civilization into the hands of scarcity-preoccupied minds. (Especially minds following outdated military dogmas like unilateral security instead of mutual security.) As Albert Einstein said, with the advent of atomic weapons, everything has changed but our thinking. And if nobody listens to Albert Einstein about this, why should they listen to me?"

    Kurzweil also doesn't understand ecology and evolution very well, in terms of making assumptions about the value of intelligence without seeing how it plays an adaptive role in only certain ecological niches.

    More comments on those themes as emails I've sent to Ray Kurzweil, archived by someone else here:
    http://heybryan.org/fernhout/

    What does this chart suggest about a law of diminishing returns for being more intelligent? :-)
    http://www.highnorth.no/Library/Myths/br-si-bo.htm

    Look at the ratios, and see the Fin whale ratio of brain to bodymass. It's tiny.

    Bigger may be better up to a point, but it looks like a law of diminishing returns sets in.

    One might posit some sort of inverse square law for the usefulness of increasing amounts of computational capacity to an organism, given perhaps exponentially increasing difficulty in creating more detailed or longer-term predictions of the world. This is an issue weather forecasters may wrestle with, in terms of facing chaotic behavior impacting predictability in weather systems. It's called "the Butterfly effect" where a small mistake or mismeasure may have increasingly big implications over time. So there is a need for constant remeasuring and recalibration of the models, which reduces the value of predictions and related computations. This is kind of like a game of chess where pieces were moved randomly by outside forces every once in a while, reducing the value in looking ahead too much.

    Obviously, architecture can play a part in changes in intelligence too. But even Jupiter Brains might get dementia or turn uncommunicative.

    Anyway, so this ratio of brain sizes and body mass may suggest the same thing. It's not that bigger is not better in some sense, it is just that it it only justifiable energetically up to a point.

    Consider that a Right whale's testes may weigh over a two thousand pounds compared to that whale's fifteen pound or so brain, or about 100X bigger, whereas for humans the ratio is approximately reversed, the brain 100X larger. (Fin whales' testes are closer to 100 pounds, or 7X brain size, but still much larger than their brains.) So, you can see what nature is betting on when body size goes up. :-)

    It's not like whale's could not easily have brains that were 10X bigger. Whales are social, and even communicate around the p

    --
    A 21st century issue: the irony of technologies of abundance in the hands of those still thinking in terms of scarcity.
    1. Re:Kurzweil's narrow perspective on the Sigularity by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Never has "tl;dr" been more appropriate.

  67. Sped-up brains are nonsense. by Estanislao+Mart�nez · · Score: 1

    The last human invention will be a computer that can simulate the brain in software, but run much faster.

    Sure. Then they implant those brains on people. Then those people end up thinking so fast that, when they need to go to the bathroom, by the time they finish standing up they've forgotten why they were getting up, start thinking about something else (well, actually, a million something elses), and piss themselves.

    That was a joke, sure, but it's a joke based on a larger, important point: the concept of a "sped-up human brain" doesn't quite make sense. Why? Because to the extent the brain can be meaningfully said to have a "speed" like computers do, it's more likely than not that its "speed" is set by the environment. So a supposed "high-speed simulated brain" would, in fact, be a brain running at the wrong "speed."

    A simplistic model of neuronal functioning can also show us one crucial way in which this "sped-up brain" idea is wrong. Suppose we have three neurons, A, B and C, such that neuron A fires on external stimulus x, neuron B fires on external stimulus y, and C fires on the simultaneous internal stimulus of A and B. Suppose that once a neuron fires, it remains active for 500ms in a real brain, 5ms in a fake, "high-speed" brain.

    Now consider the situation where external stimuli x and y arrive in sequence, 100ms apart. In the real brain, this will cause C to fire. In the fake, "sped-up" brain, C will not fire, because A's activation will decay much before the second external stimulus arrives.

    Yes, this is a simplistic, almost cartoonish model, but it drives the point even further: there is no guarantee that a "sped-up brain" will even work at all in the first place, or have an interesting pattern of activity.

  68. The Singularity is ongoing by snowwrestler · · Score: 1

    Today I can converse directly with someone on the other side of the globe, I can fly thousands of miles in a few hours, I can see what's happening in other countries, I can move at 100mph, etc. To a person 1000 years ago these are magical abilities.

    But no human needs to manage 1000 years of change or even 100 years of change. We only need to manage about 60-70 years of change at the absolute most, and I would argue it's more like 30. That's because about every 30 years a new generation grows up among technology that their parents did not have as kids.

    Kurzweil's "Singularity" scenario assumes that culture will not keep up with technology, but it always does. Not long after machines are created that think like people, a generation of children will grow up in a world where machines think like people. And like always, their parents and grandparents will not understand how they will manage life, but they will. Because it's the only world they'll know.

    Long perspective creates singularities in both directions--like standing on a long straight stretch of road, which appears to narrow to a point in both directions, beyond which we cannot see. They are apparent, but not real, singularities.

    --
    Build a man a fire, he's warm for one night. Set him on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life.
  69. Re:25K?! Argh... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    yes, the aim is to make all content available (probably not on day one, but it's very much in the plan)

  70. Ideology Neutral by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    One thing interesting about Kurzweil's logarithmic plot, is that there are uniform advances.

    If one believes his chart, then advances seem to occur regardless of the religious, political, or economic ideologies of the time.

  71. Test by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Test

  72. Re:25K?! Argh... by religious+freak · · Score: 1

    I think I just got chicken rolled - can't believe I watched all 4 mins of that AND downloaded the ppt. I'm a little disappointed that they didn't do anything with the binary on slides 17-20.

    01100011 01101000 01101001 01100011 01101011 01100101 01101110

    --
    If you can read this... 01110101 01110010 00100000 01100001 00100000 01100111 01100101 01100101 01101011
  73. Re:25K?! Argh... by retchdog · · Score: 1

    Regarding your stats class, I'm sorry it was so uninteresting and hand-wavy. The subject is rarely taught well, and if it were I truly believe that many students who go into CS, would do statistics instead. On the other hand, it's vexingly hard to teach for a number of reasons and, to make things worse, the field itself is having a kind of existential crisis at the moment.

    I was speaking once to a much more mature and sophisticated person than myself, and the whole Kurzweil thing came up. I asked him, if it was reasonable and if not, whether it was sound to pin hopes on it.

    He said to me, that it was basically a ploy to get young above-average-IQ (but not quite world-class brilliant) idealists into computers and hot fields of science (notice, biotech and neuroscience are Singularitarian topics; geology, not so much) as opposed to making money (business school); playing sports; entering a traditional trade (lawyer or doctor); &c. The real geniuses are going to do math and science automatically; the singularity is kind of an emotional selling point for others to live a technical life.

    How he said it, it was so blindingly obvious, and it felt like an enormous weight lifted from me only to be replaced by another one. I grew up an atheist, so I never had a religion to lose. Still, at that moment I understood a bit of what it would feel like to lose faith.

    --
    "They were pure niggers." – Noam Chomsky