From an Unrelated Career To IT/Programming?

An anonymous reader writes "I hate my career of the past few years. For a long time I've wondered what I'd do after I broke even and could get into something new, and I keep coming back to computers. I'd like to get into software, since I always enjoyed coding. I have some background with C++ so I'm not starting entirely from scratch. My problem is my degrees and past employment have no practical application to the field. Where should I start? I have friends in both IT and software development who might be able to pull some strings and get me an interview or two for entry-level positions, but what can I do to make myself hireable in a short period of time? Is it possible to pick up enough of what I'd need within a couple months? If so, what and how?"

Comments

Be Proactive

[alain94040]

Having been a hiring manager for a couple of years, I got used to scanning resumes and deciding within 10 seconds whether to read further or not. Guess what: the one thing that matters is relevant experience.

How can you get relevant experience in a few months? Contribute to an Open Source project. Join one of the Fair projects listed on my site.

Contribute. Learn. Then put this fresh experience on your resume. Then you'll be hired (at least you would have a year ago - in this new economy, even Bill Gates would be jobless).

Re:Be Proactive

[CannonballHead]

Hm. I'm not a hiring manager, but was recently hired by a hiring manager (and interviewed by several people from the team I now work with). I was hired for a testing role of a product that involved UNIX (e.g., AIX) as well as Linux. I was freshly out of college with two Bachelor degrees - computer science and music. A few commented on the music thing and asked about it. One thought it was fairly related (e.g., creative thinking and programming SHOULD go together, but often don't). I had NO experience AT ALL with UNIX. I had self-taught experience with most computer stuff, including Linux and all programming (my computer science coursework was mostly review for me).

I got hired not because of relevant experience, but because I apparently could show that I was hard working and diligent, fairly intelligent, creative [music], familiar with a lot of programming languages (but only "good" with one or two, since I primarily did scripting stuff in the past few years), and able to teach myself (that was a big resume item for me).

Relevant experience is good, but maybe not for an entry level position? If anything, my manager was more interested in my attitude, willingness to learn, willingness to work hard, etc.

Re:Be Proactive

[fwice]

I'd say the answer is no. I've never looked at a resume and saw that they had no PAID experience and then said, wait, they played around on some open source project, they must be good...

as a part of my department's hiring team, more weight is given to paid positions, definitely.

but the programming skill / quality of some of these paid positions is the same as the programming skill / quality of the fuzzies in my sock -- non-existent.

if you work on an open source project, we can at least look back at the commit tree and see some of the actual codewrites and adds/changes in the tree. in some cases, it gives us more of a knowledge of the applicants skill then someone who is just providing a resume, and using the buzzwords-of-the-{day,month,year}, since we actually have something TANGIBLE to look at. Plus, working on an open source project, the OP may likely start on a low end, handling documentation or tickets, until progressing upwards into the high technical levels -- useful skills to have.

if you filter out all technical people right off the bat, due to past paid experience or college degree, you may lose a great hire. some of our best workers are non-ee/cs (surpisingly, civil engineers make good coders, and one of our best is a former music major, orchestra performer, & music theory professor). additionally, having someone come in without the 'dogma' from a standard ee/cs education & job background may be refreshing -- as they think and will approach problems in different ways.

YMMV, but just my experience that cares more about the people than your standard fortune 500 chairfiller...

Re:Be Proactive

[SatanicPuppy]

Agreed. I had people look at my freelance experience like it was irrelevant:

HR: "I see here you worked for [company] for only 3 months"

Me: "It was contract work. I was on a team that built an inventory system for them that uses RFID to track over 1,000,000 discrete pieces of inventory, do automatic ordering, etc. We completed it on time, and all got bonuses. The floor guys liked it so much they threw us a barbeque."

HR: "So your work wasn't good enough for them to hire you full time?"

Me: "...It was a contract job."

HR: "I'll just put, 'No' how about that?"

Re:Be Proactive

[SpuriousLogic]

I think the original poster will have a very difficult time, if not impossible time, getting into the field in anything other than the lowest, least skilled position (with commensurate pay). Just knowing C++ is not enough to break into the field in a few months. I have been doing development for years, and when I start to look for a new job it takes me a few months just to brush up on all the things I already know that are asked in interviews. He/She would be coming into the field with the same experience and less relevant skills than a new graduate, but most likely expecting a higher salary. That would be a large strike against them in the marketplace. Even if he had great business acumen, his stated desire for a tech job specifically requires a strong tech background, and we all know that learning a companies product is much easier than creating the foundation required for a good technical understanding of the field. If the original poster was willing to spend more than a few months in order to break into the industry, they may have a chance, but I don't see any way to accomplish that goal in just a few months of learning. I also don't think that Open Source contribution would be in any way valuable for the individual. Open Source projects don't just want "anyone who wants to code". The vast majority of these projects are run by very highly skilled people with years of experience. The only way to really get experience is to be hired and work in a business setting developing software. Just writing code is NOT experience. My best advice for the original poster is don't try to do this in a few months. Go take out school loans and get a degree in the area. That would be the absolute fastest way to get a mid level or higher job in programming. Otherwise they will spend way more time "climbing the ranks" out of the helpdesk or other low level job they are most likely to get. There really is no shortcut in gaining knowledge and experience. Both are a product of time and effort. Attempts to circumvent that RARELY work.

Re:Be Proactive

[endikos]

But then how does a person break into the industry?

Freelance. Absolutely work on open source projects in your spare time to hone your skills, but then do some paid work for people that know and trust you. Then you have real-world open source volunteer experience as well as paid experience. Lots of small businesses need small utilities or enhancements to existing products they had custom built.

Re:Be Proactive

[CannonballHead]

I would disagree. My hiring manager has commented several times on my honesty, as well. I knew I was new and didn't know everything. My response, if asked if I knew something, was "No, but I can learn it." Maybe that sounds tongue in cheek but it's true; I was being considered for a position that I was going to have to learn a lot for, may as well be willing to do so. Furthermore, the people interviewing me actually asked for some examples (e.g., one guy asked about the advantages/disadvantages of Perl, one asked me to write a simple code snippet that would print out an array of somethings, etc).

Depending on who you end up working for/with, honesty can make you a great person to work with. Everybody hates it when someone doesn't answer a question. I have found that answering honestly (but positively) works very well. Lying in an interview would be even worse than lying on a resume. Which, by the way, I've had several interviewing people mention to me - most people lie on their resume. I didn't, but they still wanted to talk to me if they were interested, resume isn't enough.

no relevant background, no problem

[mtrachtenberg]

"no practical application to the field"

Try management.

You could just lie and go for it.

[tjstork]

Make it all up.... the worst that could happen is that you would get fired after a few months. But, believe me, there's a lot of shoddy programmers out there, so, you'd be hard pressed to do worse than some of the "pros" that are out there.

Re:You could just lie and go for it.

[SatanicPuppy]

Well, though obviously I can't advocate that approach, it's frankly not a bad idea. Your first hurdle is HR, and HR wants 5 years of this and 6 years of that, and they are going to toss everything that doesn't conform to those standards.

I've seen plenty of incompetent people lie their way through HR, so it definitely works. Now, if you do that, and get hired and it turns out you don't know what you're doing, you can expect your coworkers to turn on you big time. Nothing worse than an incompetent coworker: it's better to have no one at all.

Re:You could just lie and go for it.

[tech10171968]

"I've seen plenty of incompetent people lie their way through HR, so it definitely works."

I blame a lot of this on companies who rely too much on HR to screen the resumes. When you submit a resume in hopes of scoring an interview, the first person to see it is the "Gatekeeper" in HR. Oftentimes that HR drone doesn't know the first damned thing about the industry for which the company is hiring, so they'll often read a resume a little differently from the hiring manager (who would at least have a clue). HR just scans the resumes and relies on bullet points and keywords; as a result a lot of talent can be completely overlooked because someone who otherwise might just have the chops didn't use the right words or format. Many people have found that careers can be affected by some nitpicking secretary so some will "pad" their resumes just to get by the clueless gatekeeper. In fact, I've even heard the argument that a lot of folks aren't necessarily getting their certs for the job itself; instead, they're getting them just to get past HR.

Are you sure you wanna do that?

[drdanny_orig]

Speaking as someone who's been involved in IT for 30+ years, allow me to shout at you...."You're going the wrong way!!!"

Re:Are you sure you wanna do that?

[eln]

Seriously. Unless his previous job involved rendering pork fat or defusing mines, he should probably just stay where he is. Leave IT to those of us who made the mistake of getting in years ago and are now stuck because our minds have warped so much that we're unfit for normal society.

Hard field to transfer into

[SpuriousLogic]

Programming can be very hard to transfer into, given the demand for experience and specific knowledge in the field (the US Dept of Labor sites this as one of the reasons less people enter into the field over others for second jobs). It would be almost impossible for you to get into anything other than an entry level support job (think helpdesk). Getting a job as a full developer will be a very difficult proposition. You might be able to get a job doing some "simple" development in a small shop though (think perl, php, that kind of stuff). Compare yourself to a college grad with a degree in Comp Sci (or similar degree) - graduates in this years class are seeing a very tough job market, even though software engineering is comparably untouched by the ongoing depression. These grads would have a level of experience similar to yours, but most likely be willing to work for less, and have been formally trained in the field. My suggestion would be to spend a significant amount of time learning the field, not just a language syntax. Go to a college website, see the books that are used for the classes, and start in on them. There is MUCH MUCH more to programming that just knowing a language syntax.

try it old school

[larry bagina]

Learn fortran, cobol, mumps, pick, ada, k, and other legacy or non-mainstream languages. Companies that use them generally have a hard time finding people that know them, so you can get in without the experience.

Start. Code Often. Contribute.

[ThatDamnMurphyGuy]

I was a double music major in college: a BA in Music Ed K-12, and a BA in Music Perf. Percussion. I got my teaching certificate, then promptly went into programming. For me, the key seems to be just programming. All you can. All the time.

My last 2 years of school, I started doing HyperCard scripting, then UserLand scripting, then VB and whatever I could get my hands on, doing whatever departmental projects I could do, like test taking apps, etc. Then I worked my way into web pages, html, and doing the department web site.

I've been at it for 14 years now doing .NET, Perl, SQL, Rails, Catalyst, Django...all without a programming degree or background. So, my advice would be:

1. Don't expect someone to hand you a job by pulling strings
2. Program. If you love it, do it all the time. The best job is one where you get paid to do what you would do as a hobby.
3. Keep at it. Be a sponge, and show you can the job by doing as much as you can outside of that job. Contribute to open source. Work on other projects. Start your own projects. Get yourself noticed.

For the "hiring manager" who say they never hire anyone with o experience on their resume, I'd say we all had none when we started. Conversly, I've seen awesome resumes...by people who can't even tell me how to anything more than MS point and click.

Leverage your existing experience

[Faizdog]

One thing you may find is that generic coding jobs may be boring/unexciting for you and also hard to get into. I would advise you leverage your current experience, and see where new software may help in your current field, or what is it about the existing software that you feel is lacking and/or needs improvement.

It will also make it easier for you to get a job that way. "I don't have software experience, but due to x years of experience in this field, I understand the ins and outs and that will be invaluable while I build up software design and implementation experience."

If you were a biologist, look at bioinformatics, if you were in real estate look at companies building better MLS tracking software, if you were a teacher, look at jobs with a company like Blackboard, you get the idea.

Re:Strategy

[microTodd]

Then, some day, if you put in a hero's effort, you might be able to be an entry-level programmer.

Peter, I understand why you are being negative (as with most of the replies here). Programming is not an easy field to succeed in. But neither is any other field. And besides, why are we discouraging someone to do what he loves?

You probably already know more about that domain than most programmers already working in it

This advice you give in the beginning is very good, and something that I tell all wanna-be programmers, whether they are CS grads or something else. There are very few "pure" programming jobs, maybe just Google, Microsoft, and Apple. But in the world today, every field requires software somewhere in it.

You ask the right question...what is it you are doing now? Because its is 99% likely that his current career has some niche need for software.

Car mechanic - Parts inventory and job tracking
Musician - MIDI interfaces
Lawn mower - Job scheduling and business backend (bookkeeping)
Restaurant manager - Server scheduling, inventory, POS, (wireless handheld order entry?)
Truck driver - Log management

and so forth.

I've always thought, its easier to get an expert in some knowledge domain and teach them to program, than it is to take a programmer and try to teach them some knowledge domain.

No kidding I want advice getting OUT of SW Dev.

[guidryp]

Geez.

It is an outsourced jungle these days. Do you really want to justify why you think you are worth 10 times the salary of a coder in China? Or work for a while then train your Chinese replacements, spend EARLY morning and evenings across the timezones on calls with them to make sure everything is finally working out their new team, so they can cut you.

Meanwhile your company is going down the toilet while your execs reward themselves for reducing salary expenses with drastic moves to low cost centers.

Not a career I would recommend unless you are in some high security area that can't be outsourced.

Best of luck.

It can be done. I did it

[cliffski]

On the other hand, I KNOW it can be done. I made a quite insane journey from traditional wooden boatbuilding to computer programmer. It took me a long time, because I got distracted by actually working in IT support (at quite a decent paid level, 3rd line network support), but it could have been done quicker.
I had no degree (a failed attempt at economics), not a single qualification in computing, and a work history as a guitar teacher and a boatbuilder, and yet I managed to shift into IT, and then into coding. This is how I did it:

1) I went to evening classes and got some C and C++ exams under my belt.
2) I coded some ganmes from scratch and started selling them, giving me something visually impressive on my CV
3) I didn't hide my previous jobs. In fact, I think they helped my CV to stand out
4) I acted confident about getting every job I went to. Being an ex-musician helped in this. No interview for a job is as scary as playing a gig to a bunch of drunk Hells Angels on a saturday night.

When I was a boatbuilder, the most hi-tech equipment we had was a telephone. We didn't even have electric screwdrivers, or for that matter, plumbing. The floor was sawdust on concrete. If I can go from that environment to lead programmer, then anyone can do it. That doesn't mean it isn't extremely fucking hard to do so, but I can assure you it is doable.